Deimos Fishing — A Horrible, Buggy, Mess

[taiiat]

3 hours ago, (XB1)TehChubbyDugan said:

They would do the same thing because the Smeeta wouldn't proc. 

Charm isn't always active, but it's still active sometimes and since 5 and even 6 stacks of Resource Multiplier are possible(that's 32x and 64x Resources respectively), on average it's still quite significant even if it's only active from time to time.
as even if a fair amount of the time it's 0, 1-2 being common enough and spikes to 5 or 6 will shift the average a fair ways above 0.

Oxylus is useful, but massively Multiplying the Resources we get overall is... there is no contest.
whiiiiiich is why Helminth should let us Subsume our Companions so that we can put Charm on anything since it was a mistake to create it but it's too late now so let it be universal after you Craft a Smeeta for the first time.

 

3 hours ago, (XB1)TehChubbyDugan said:

OP literally has video of them throwing Pharoma into a snot river and having it fall through the world.  There is a fish and a hotspot visible in the riven they throw it into, so it is 100% being thrown into a fishable area and still falling through the map.  You can clearly see the dye land, but not the pharoma.

Video is the least efficient form of communication, i read the words - if they were Fishing over snot, then very well.
i only had throwables fail on the 'Water' that wasn't actually Fishable - don't know what i've been doing differently. or i guess technically what they are doing differently.

[(PSN)Elvenbane]

I've encountered plenty of fishing bugs, including frequent times when I can't fish at all because the spear kills the fish.

[Luciole77]

more buggy than fishing is conservation....fishing is cool. Dont need to be ivara...kill enemies and stay there.

[Canach]

I filed a bug report on fishing, me and at least 2 other tenno (who also posted there) have been paralized while fishing - my guess is that it is related to lag/latency and standing in the water. /Unstuck does not help, and getting killed -well- never happened. You have to abort mission.

Another problem I have with fishing is that the bait very clearly makes NO DIFFERENCE here. Spear fish when you see them, then put up and continue what you were doing - ignore the hot spots. I've tried these many times - I've done a lot of fishing on PoE and OV, but on Deimos, bait is ignored.

[Canach]

56 minutes ago, Luciole77 said:

more buggy than fishing is conservation....fishing is cool. Dont need to be ivara...kill enemies and stay there.

Conservation seems buggy to me, but just do it PoE style, tranq them when you see them.

Dragonflys hang out near cave entrances and high spots, and around vome/fass zones. So far, I have been unable to tranq a dragonfly while riding a dragonfly...

Quadrapeds are often fighting the purple fuzzy centepede - I've gotten SO MANY dog/foxes by killing purple centipede then running over and finding a weakend dog/fox laying there. If you have you're tranq equipped and  zoom in on the purple centepede you can sometime see them fighting them - but if they're not hanging from a branch - assume a dog/fox is with them (30%?).

EDIT: hint to everyone - My num-pad 4,5,6 are hot keys for Tranq gun, Mining gun, Fishing Spear. Makes it easy to swap between them whenever you suddenly see a dog/dragonflies, a mineral, or a group of fish...

[(XBOX)TehChubbyDugan]

4 hours ago, taiiat said:

Charm isn't always active, but it's still active sometimes and since 5 and even 6 stacks of Resource Multiplier are possible(that's 32x and 64x Resources respectively), on average it's still quite significant even if it's only active from time to time.
as even if a fair amount of the time it's 0, 1-2 being common enough and spikes to 5 or 6 will shift the average a fair ways above 0.

I've had Charm not proc for over half an hour straight while Mutagen Sample farming.  It almost never procs during siphons/floods.  I don't think I've ever gotten a proc while fishing, considering you can fish for 10 minutes with a booster and have a large amount of fish so I'm normally not sitting there for an hour waiting on my cat to stop being a little S#&$.  I can count on one hand the number of times I've gotten a double proc.  I've never seen anything past a double proc.  When it does proc, the vast majority of the time it's on the way to extraction, or in the middle of a fissure on a planet with super common resources I have millions of.  I could run for an hour with a Smeeta or without and end up with the same amount of resources at the end regardless of which one I took.  It gives me the crit buff more than anything, and if I wanted that, I'd bring my Adarza.

Again, what's happening here is "It doesn't work that way for me so you must be lying."  My cat doesn't reliably proc the doubler buff.  I believe yours does.  I believe it probably works both ways for a lot of people, which means for some people, taking Oxylus is still the better option because the cat isn't going to do anything but run off and make trouble.

 

4 hours ago, taiiat said:

Video is the least efficient form of communication, i read the words

The point I originally made was that video proof was presented and that people were still arguing against it like OP was full of it.  Here you come along doing exactly that and when I point to the video proof that I already pointed to, "Oh, whatever I didn't watch it, I'm still not wrong even though I was wrong."  Is everyone in this thread going to just keep making my point for me about this community?  It could not be more on the nose and it would be hilarious if it wasn't so depressing.

[(XBOX)TehChubbyDugan]

4 hours ago, Fallen77 said:

OP wrongly assumed that the spear was supposed to be silent to the ennemies and based part of his thread on a wrong assumption. It was obviously supposed to be silent toward the fish

Why the #*!% would something be silent for one thing and not another?  Do you know how sound works?  Because that's not even close.

[taiiat]

26 minutes ago, (XB1)TehChubbyDugan said:

Again, what's happening here is "It doesn't work that way for me so you must be lying."  My cat doesn't reliably proc the doubler buff.  I believe yours does.  I believe it probably works both ways for a lot of people

 

The point I originally made was that video proof was presented and that people were still arguing against it like OP was full of it.  Here you come along doing exactly that and when I point to the video proof that I already pointed to, "Oh, whatever I didn't watch it, I'm still not wrong even though I was wrong."  Is everyone in this thread going to just keep making my point for me about this community?  It could not be more on the nose and it would be hilarious if it wasn't so depressing.

it's the same way for everyone. that from time to time you get some extra. it's a major impact over the longterm, like i said. it does effectively nothing for everyone else too, sometimes. Botanist is a neat Ability but it is not a whole lot to offer compared to other things that could be Equipped. since the other two Abilities doesn't offer something you don't already have by default. it's your Equipment choices at the end of the day.

 

generally efficient fast communication versus generally highly inefficient slow communication - it's a Forum after all, describing things is the status quo.
some Threads that just paste a Video link and don't write anything at all, i close the Tab and stop thinking about whatever their problem might have been. less is more but the amount of effort one puts into describing what they want to talk about concisely, is also about what should be expected in kind.
the OP just restarting their game and coming back another day might ""solve"" some of their experiences, who knows. i'd like to determine what was or was not being done that differs from the more 'average' experience, though i'm not sure if i should see that as likely to be determined here.

 

 

off topic:

Spoiler

4 minutes ago, (XB1)TehChubbyDugan said:

All the people that praise this community have obviously never been to the forums

the Forums is quite the usually nice place, compared to like, the Community on Youtube/Twitch or Social Media Platforms where misinformation is spread more rampantly than than Bubonic Plague was in the initial outbreak. or if it isn't that, harassing Employees about how this or that thing should be added or fixed, even if they're making a personal Post or one about a different subject.
or the Community largely as a whole who mainly give a highly positive view of the Community because people give them lots of stuff for free to skip parts of the game (actively sabotaging their Gameplay experience and longevity), or because when some Content Creator or just normal Player says a question out loud that other people will parrot some usually wrong information to them as an answer or even if it isn't wrong, still effectively just reading the Wiki / a Webpage for them.
as neither of those are particularly great - skipping people past major parts of the game doesn't help anyone and is someone really doing a whole lot when they type something into a Search Engine and read off the first thing they find when someone has a Question. 
yes, the Community as a whole is not like how it was in 2013-2014. based on the way Digital Extremes' communication with the Playerbase changed over the years, i think just like me they would like to go back to that point in time Community wise, but oh well.

though some of that leaks into the Forums too.
at worst not any worse than anywhere else, and on something like a Forum atleast if something needs correction it's possible to be made due to both the original statement and any responses or comments are preserved alongside each other. not quite so much elsewhere, though all places do share a similar trait of what's immediately visible is far more likely to be read and taken as information than say, something several pages further.

 

 

[Sanzio]

Wow, this blew up overnight more than I expected. So to reply to some things:

15 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

There is a small cave to the east of the nechralisk , it is just a U shaped pond - fishing there is relatively painless and can net you the gills in 10 minutes.

Peaceful , no enemies spawn , small enough that fish cant run too far thats what i use if i am too tired of ISO vaults.

 

Granted i got most of my main stuff from ISO vaults, but i also got my companions revivified using this method.

Daughter tokens is what i was always skeptical on using, but now that i have gotten most of the stuff built gonna trade in more fish parts.

I'll have to try this, thanks for the tip! Honestly fishing above ground has been very frustrating so far and my luck in ISO vaults has been terrible, so I hope this will get me the resources I need so I can just rank up and be done with fishing until some bug fixes get released.

To respond to this:

11 hours ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

- have you ever tried like, killing the enemies? 

- pheramona is literally not needed, use fass or vome residue instead

- luminous dye does what oxylus does only better so why bring it if you're fishing and want to catch more? Bring a Smeeta

There does that answer the videos better for you? Simply put, he's doing it wrong.

- Yes, however killing the enemies typically causes what fish have spawned to despawn before I can get back to them. This coupled with the endless enemy spawn rates makes it just an additional annoyance.

- Yes, Pharoma is not needed but neither are things like quick melee, gear wheel hot keys, etc. It's purely a Quality of Life things. Some other people have already pointed out that it's not bait so I won't go on about that here.

- Luminous Dye suffers from the draw back of having a smaller range than the Oxylus' scan, as well as being a timed consumable item (which also breaks stealth when used). Additionally, it has either a continuous faction reputation cost (if you don't have the old BP) or continuous resource cost (if you have the old BP), this is the exact problem the Oxylus was designed to solve, thus why I brought its lack of ability to do so up.

 

7 hours ago, Fallen77 said:

1st video : it only shows that OP wrongly assumed that the spear was supposed to be silent to the ennemies and based part of his thread on a wrong assumption. It was obviously supposed to be silent toward the fish. Simple experimentation would have shown that it just doesn't work how he wanted it. That doesn't make this a glitch. You can disagree with how it works, but taking a huge shortcut and flagging it as a bug is plain wrong. Also as someone said, he could have simply killed the couple mobs and be done with it.

2nd video : yeah that's a glitch, got nothing against that. Never used it, never needed, it's so useless it might as well be the game trying to give you à hint. But yeah you can have this one no problem.

3rd video : the dude is litteraly jumping over the fish... Yes of course ! It must be the sentinel ! What else could possibly make the fish bolt away ? Need I say more ?

 

So yeah, except from one very rare and old bug (underground fish) that must be pretty hard to fix by the devs seeing its longevity, but is very easy to fix by the players, and a bug that must have been reported next to never (pharoma) due to the fact that any decent player would know that it's not even worth the time to equip it, yeah... Such a buggy mess right ? Not at all players seeing whatever they want to see out of spite for one of the only occasions the game asks us to vary our 7 years old gameplay.

 

- This bug does actually apply to fish (inconsistently), it is just much less pronounced. From what I can tell it currently doesn't seem to have any mechanical difference in some interactions with fish Spari spear, but it *always* fully alerts enemies despite not breaking stealth.

- If this is an intended mechanic there should be some indication that it doesn't work beyond making the entire model disappear on contact with the water. I'm perfectly fine with the Pharoma being phased out here but we should be given some proper indication that this is the case.

- The 3rd video isn't highlighting the fact that fish react when you move, fish have done this since PoE. The video is highlighting how fast they move in comparison to how little you move. I should've put a video here showing fish movement reactions when the Sentinel isn't equipped for a clearer visual example but I'm saving that for a proper bug report.

 

11 hours ago, Genitive said:

We could have avoided these responses if OP worked on their language and posted in the correct section.

Yes, I need to file a proper bug report. This isn't a proper bug report however, this is just me ****posting about my frustration with it. I need to gather a lot more data still before filing an actually useful report as some of these bugs are really inconsistent for reasons I haven't quite figured out, which makes it kinda hard to document them for a report.

 

6 hours ago, Canach said:

I filed a bug report on fishing, me and at least 2 other tenno (who also posted there) have been paralized while fishing - my guess is that it is related to lag/latency and standing in the water. /Unstuck does not help, and getting killed -well- never happened. You have to abort mission.

Another problem I have with fishing is that the bait very clearly makes NO DIFFERENCE here. Spear fish when you see them, then put up and continue what you were doing - ignore the hot spots. I've tried these many times - I've done a lot of fishing on PoE and OV, but on Deimos, bait is ignored.

The closest I've come to replicating the effects of the stuck bug I've seen reported is attempting to use bait/dye while on Ivara dashwire, which causes a similar stuck animation. 

Finally to the person who asked about the Sentinel precept mods (who I can't find a quote for, sorry). This example has no gun equipped & no attack/defense precepts beyond Primed Regen, however I've tested it with several builds and they all generally have the same result.

[LordBakal]

Just this. Don't even dare to "spear" through one of those buggy bulbs that doesn't explode when they fall to the ground/exocrine. You get stuck forever and need to close the game because you can't move at all. I did this when one was on the path of a fish when the bulb landed onto the exocrine without exploding... After fishing a ton I'm forced to abandon mission and forfeit all that 2h progress... I demand a crate of fish as compensation.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

20 hours ago, Sanzio said:

To respond to this:

- Yes, however killing the enemies typically causes what fish have spawned to despawn before I can get back to them. This coupled with the endless enemy spawn rates makes it just an additional annoyance.

- Yes, Pharoma is not needed but neither are things like quick melee, gear wheel hot keys, etc. It's purely a Quality of Life things. Some other people have already pointed out that it's not bait so I won't go on about that here.

- Luminous Dye suffers from the draw back of having a smaller range than the Oxylus' scan, as well as being a timed consumable item (which also breaks stealth when used). Additionally, it has either a continuous faction reputation cost (if you don't have the old BP) or continuous resource cost (if you have the old BP), this is the exact problem the Oxylus was designed to solve, thus why I brought its lack of ability to do so up.

OK first things first. If you use Ivara, you can spear the fish then kill the enemies silently with a melee or hell, use a sleep arrow. Problem solved.
Luminous dye has a fair range, I've seen highlighted fish at the next hotspot, I'd say it's more than enough. Generally what I've found works for fishing is to stay in prowl and keep moving listening for the sound of a spawn, catch it and move on. Bait doesn't increase spawns in hotspots for Deimos it's only for luring different types. This lack of spawns however is offset by the amount of resources you get per fish if you take a look.

[Izgule]

16 hours ago, (XB1)TehChubbyDugan said:

Why the #*!% would something be silent for one thing and not another?  Do you know how sound works?  Because that's not even close.

Its not even silent towards the fish though... It may even be worse than the standard spear, not sure yet... 

[pantophage]

As someone who avidly fished and still does fish just for fun in the other open worlds, my honest assessment of deimos in general is very bad, but the fishing is ABSOLUTELY worthless and awful. 

Fish spawns are few and far between, you cannot consistently fish an area. I have tested this with several other people as client and as host. An area will have fish when you first arrive but spawns drop to an average of 1 every 30-50 seconds after you start fishing an area. I have tested all over the drift. IDK who had the bright idea to make the fish spawn before you pull out the spear, but I am willing to bet a lot of the spawn issues relate to that.

Fish can get spooked by ANY action. I have had fish flee because of me meleeing an enemy, shooting enemies with silenced weapons, movements down to aiming my spear, and even switching to my fishing spear. I have done this with and without sentinels, with and without attack precepts. Fish in other worlds can get spooked by things as well, but never have they been as touchy as this. The closest other open worlds were to this jumpy was how fortuna fish will occasionally bolt as you throw your spear

Most of the caves are random tiles, meaning I have to use one of the few persistent caves with snot water in them to fish, these caves tend to spawn enemies quite consistently from the observations I and several other people have made while in them. I quite literally had infested spawn inside of me on several occasions. Additionally, from the testing I did with cave fishing, the only good cave tiles were, you guessed it, part of the RNG cave tiles, meaning you cannot consistently go to them to fish. The RNG cave tiles are a useless system, since the only justification I can find for it would be the ISO vaults... but they always use the same 3 cave entrances. So it serves no mechanical purpose. And the RNG caves seem to be a short dead end cave a majority of the time, so they don't hold a mining purpose either. The only thing the RNG cave tiles add to the game is frustration.

baits and other deployables are pointless to use since the the only consistently viable method for spawns seems to be "keep moving". When coupled with the non-silent spear, number of enemy spawns, how easily the fish are spooked, and how most caves don't have the room to "keep moving" 

Overall, fishing on deimos is unacceptable in its current state. 7 hotfixes and the only real fishing changes have been for script errors related to crashes. None of the mechanical complaints have been addressed in any official manner. The bugs have also not been addressed.
It is not a viable method for gaining standing. one fish in either open worlds give much more standing per fish.
It is not a viable method for resource acquisition. Pillars and iso vaults provide the parts faster and give other rewards as well
It is arguably not even viable as a minigame, because of the mechanics deimos fishing has and consistent bugs. 

[Plagha]

Deimos: Arcana: Hotfix 29.5.3 and still the same. More bugs and crappy fishes.

[jovalle81]

Problem infested/Orokin fish no can`t move In Deimos