Help Clem

[CrownOfShadows]

Alright.... listen, let's talk about this - maybe it's time we help out our old buddy Clem.

First of all, what is the reward for this mission? Oh that's right... NOTHING. Haha! What?

Love you Clem, but the no-pay mercenary pyramid is a lose-lose.

Is it the only mission in the entire game with ZERO reward? Yeah, I think that might be right. Okay, fine... you get a clem clone bp... so there's that. That'll come in handy? (to be fair at really low levels this is pretty handy until you can get better warframe specters). The only time I've ever actually played this mission after the first one or two runs way back in the beginning is for NW though, and even that felt like a brutal chore.

So uh, maybe we should change that? How though? I suggest... fix this mission to be interesting by updating the mechanics of...

• The Grustrag Three and the Grustrag Bolt
• The Lynx
• The Juggernaut

These spawn in these missions and, IMO, are all sorely in need of an overhaul. I really actually like the idea of the Grustrag Bolt, a sort of reverse bane mod, and I'd personally be tempted to give a Corpus Bolt to the Lynx and an Infested Boil to the Juggernaut to make it uniform, and make it apply to this mission to turn it into a high-risk, high reward sort of option, make these anti-bane effects a real force to be reckoned with, maybe even remove the blueprint that can cleanse you, so you just have to endure it until it fades out, like a reverse invigoration - a... deinvigoration? Also, make the fight against these mini-bosses a lot more intense - right now, they're less threatening than an eximus, if you even notice that you killed them at all. Put people, as much as possible, in real danger of being bolted. Then, we'd give them interesting drop tables, with rare mods probably, or other goodies, so that there's some reward for victory over them to balance the (pretty severe) punishment for defeat. If we had total love, we'd actually design a new mission for this to really feature these mini-bosses, put the spotlight on them - something other than a long dredging survival... but that's pretty high effort.

Second of all, update this with a SP version. How about making the SP versions the Wolf, Nihil or other more mature versions of the mini-boss theme? (my reasoning here is that the Grustrag 3 key is available in NW and so is the Wolf & Nihil). Or entirely new enemies too. We could use some variety from the now familiar-as-old-friends-who-come-over-every-night-and-eat-pizza acolytes.

Also, personally, I'd update Clem a bit too, he's more than a rank-and-file grub, he's kinda like the OG version of Kahl, ain't he? And he's been at the center of an arms trade for over a decade. The dude's gotta be kitted by now.

What do you think - is this an ancient and meaningless option. Is it fine. Should it be overhauled. Should it be left alone. Should it be removed.

[(PSN)IdoThea]

Yeah I feel same way about Clem mission. I only do it if there's NW challenge telling me to do it. 

Would be neat if Grustrag three etc. dropped their rewards in these missions. Maybe make it so either Grustrag or Zanuka would spawn so it would give one more chance to get drops from these enemies rather than doing invasion to get them spawn. 

[(PSN)IndianChiefJeff]

Gotta do something with old content, right? There's absolutely no incentive to run it, and it's far too easy. We need new, shiny rewards. The question is, what?

Since he's a weapon dealer, perhaps we could get Syndicate weapon skins, he is a Steel Meridian associate after all. A Vaykor Grakata skin sounds nice. Or maybe new Arcanes & Mods, but that'd be too similar to Arbitrations. Honestly, no clue on rewards.

It would be nice to fight tougher field bosses like the Wolf & maybe some newer faces for a change. Throw in a Saturn Six tile & that'd really make things interesting.

[Rantear]

I wish they could at least cut timer by half, 10 minutes is waay to long for a mission that even a brand new player has no issues completing.

[CrownOfShadows]

7 hours ago, (PSN)IndianChiefJeff said:

Gotta do something with old content, right? There's absolutely no incentive to run it, and it's far too easy. We need new, shiny rewards. The question is, what?

Since he's a weapon dealer, perhaps we could get Syndicate weapon skins, he is a Steel Meridian associate after all. A Vaykor Grakata skin sounds nice. Or maybe new Arcanes & Mods, but that'd be too similar to Arbitrations. Honestly, no clue on rewards.

It would be nice to fight tougher field bosses like the Wolf & maybe some newer faces for a change. Throw in a Saturn Six tile & that'd really make things interesting.

Hmm yeah weapons skins would fit well. Maybe holo keys here too, since that kinda fits the weapons dealer theme.

Maybe Clem has his own weapons dealer side hustle, and you can use holo keys in the 'Clem Shop' to buy rotating weapons skins from him, kinda like a mini-NW shop.

[Famecans]

up

[CrownOfShadows]

Since this is in our NW this week, and I just cleared it, it's back on my mind.

I think this is especially worthy of attention because NW is forcing players of the entire MR spectrum to play this (at least those who can endure it for the NW credit), when really the only ones who should probably be playing it are people who just started WF and like still haven't cleared Earth or something.

If we can't dedicate resources to upgrade it, please at least cut the duration in half, it's such a needless, unrewarding, uneventful brain drain.

[Venus-Venera]

and i want to play it in group.
but with every NW I was always alone .... no desire for this nonsense.

[Hobie-wan]

19 hours ago, CrownOfShadows said:

forcing

Blink once if you're unable to reach level 30 in nightwave without doing this challenge.

Blink twice if someone is holding a gun to your head.

[Drasiel]

meanwhile I'm sitting here running it every week because I love the clem specter. It scales with enemy level and I can drop a clem + ancient healer, and a tenno spectre and happily play interception by myself.

[CrownOfShadows]

3 hours ago, Hobie-wan said:

Blink once if you're unable to reach level 30 in nightwave without doing this challenge.

Blink twice if someone is holding a gun to your head.

Blink thrice if you're so bored that you clear NW way after the end because you have nothing else in the game to do.

Blink in the quadruple if you think the Clem mission needs no updating at all. Actually, instead of blinking that much, just type that out.

[Hobie-wan]

I never said it couldn't use a touch up. But there's no forcing going on anywhere.

[CrownOfShadows]

3 hours ago, Hobie-wan said:

I never said it couldn't use a touch up. But there's no forcing going on anywhere.

Well 'forcing' was said with context. If you return to the post and read further, you'll notice that I said 'for those who can endure it for the credit' in parenthesis. What do you suppose those words mean?

[_COY_]

On 2022-08-29 at 10:42 AM, CrownOfShadows said:

First of all, what is the reward for this mission? Oh that's right... NOTHING. Haha! What?

As far as I know you receive a Clem clone BP reward for the mission... or am I mistaken?

-c0y

[(NSW)BenHiraga]

On 2022-08-29 at 5:59 AM, (PSN)IndianChiefJeff said:

There's absolutely no incentive to run it, and it's far too easy

I'm relatively early-game (MR12) and the hardest thing about this mission is getting enemies to spawn at a high enough rate to drop life support. I spend most of the time running around trying to find life support towers, because there aren't enough enemies to keep the oxygen level up.

[Hobie-wan]

5 minutes ago, (NSW)BenHiraga said:

I'm relatively early-game (MR12) and the hardest thing about this mission is getting enemies to spawn at a high enough rate to drop life support. I spend most of the time running around trying to find life support towers, because there aren't enough enemies to keep the oxygen level up.

Yes, you're supposed to use the towers. That's the idea and the reason they get waypoints. If you have a lootframe or you stay longer so the enemy density thickens, then yes you can start ignoring towers.

[(NSW)BenHiraga]

8 minutes ago, Hobie-wan said:

Yes, you're supposed to use the towers. That's the idea and the reason they get waypoints. If you have a lootframe or you stay longer so the enemy density thickens, then yes you can start ignoring towers.

I apologize, I must not have explained correctly or you missed my point. I understand what the towers are there for, and how to run Survival.

My gist is, in other Survival missions, there are usually enough enemies to allow them to group up and drop life support without using towers. Most non-Clem missions, I seldom find myself activating a life support tower prior to the 10-minute mark. Typically, I can find a junction and hack away for 15 minutes, surviving only on the packs dropped by dead enemies. With Clem, however, I find myself running out of enemies more quickly.

[Hobie-wan]

3 minutes ago, (NSW)BenHiraga said:

I apologize, I must not have explained correctly or you missed my point. I understand what the towers are there for, and how to run Survival.

My gist is, in other Survival missions, there are usually enough enemies to allow them to group up and drop life support without using towers. Most non-Clem missions, I seldom find myself activating a life support tower prior to the 10-minute mark. Typically, I can find a junction and hack away for 15 minutes, surviving only on the packs dropped by dead enemies. With Clem, however, I find myself running out of enemies more quickly.

The Clem mission is the intoduction to survival. It is designed with the towers to complete the mission while using them so you know how that type of mission functions. I'm sure they designed it so that you need to prioritize getting to the towers and making sure you use them under 70% so you can finish the mission with headroom, but not at 100% the first time you run it. The air dropped by enemies is bonus so that once you have the equipment and know what you're doing, you can be more efficient at it.

But the reality is that Clem was born from a meme. Either you enjoy him and like dropping his clones in missions or you don't. If the blueprint and/or NW progress isn't enough reason for someone to run the mission, then don't.

[(NSW)BenHiraga]

1 minute ago, Hobie-wan said:

The Clem mission is the intoduction to survival. It is designed with the towers to complete the mission while using them so you know how that type of mission functions.

Interesting. I recall running into several Survival nodes before I unlocked Clem, but perhaps I'm misremembering.

2 minutes ago, Hobie-wan said:

Either you enjoy him and like dropping his clones in missions or you don't. If the blueprint and/or NW progress isn't enough reason for someone to run the mission, then don't.

I think you might have mistaken my position. (Again, if that's my fault, I apologize.) I'm not the OP. I don't have any issue with the Clem mission in its current state. Just stating that the hardest part of this mission -- in my opinion -- is finding enemies to fight. That's not a value judgment, just an observation based on my personal experience, nobody else's.

[Hobie-wan]

30 minutes ago, (NSW)BenHiraga said:

I think you might have mistaken my position. (Again, if that's my fault, I apologize.) I'm not the OP.

I meant that part at the OP, not you. You're good.