Limbo and the players who use him are the absolute worst.

[AegidiusF]

Le 13/02/2023 à 22:55, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

TL;DR: Limbo sucks and people who play him are generally awful to be around.

Le 13/02/2023 à 23:03, gamingchair1121 a dit :

since when

Limbo is AMAZING !

Some players can be a problem, and this is not only a Limbo problem : Frost players casting Snow Globe mindlessy, Wisp players with those Reservoirs,, Volt players with Speed (at least we can get rid of it... till the next cast), Slow Nova on Defense Missions (making it last much longer), Styanax players recharging shields when you want to benefit from the Augur set mods...

If Limbo needs a rework because some players don't know how to play it well, so almost every single frame also need a rework.

[A-Flying-Brick]

46 minutes ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said:

Limbo is AMAZING !

Some players can be a problem, and this is not only a Limbo problem : Frost players casting Snow Globe mindlessy, Wisp players with those Reservoirs,, Volt players with Speed (at least we can get rid of it... till the next cast), Slow Nova on Defense Missions (making it last much longer), Styanax players recharging shields when you want to benefit from the Augur set mods...

If Limbo needs a rework because some players don't know how to play it well, so almost every single frame also need a rework.

Quote

"Hey Limbo, that ability is stopping me from using x/interfears with x, can you use it elsewhere/use it less?"

Yes those are problems too but they do not stop you from playing, just makes it more difficult if that player doesn't want to be reasonable. Snow globe can be shot out of and doesn't move. Personally I find it more disruptive if someone has a Hound with Null Audit because it moves constantly and can't be shot through. Wisp Reservoirs are always a sore point, people want the healing but don't like when -gasp- Wisp dares to do anything besides healing. If you don't want Motes and Wisp is reasonable it's a non issue. Volts can be annoying but most will quit it with the speed boosts if asked nicely, same with Styanax. Nova players often have both Slow and Fast builds, unless they're malicious, they probably won't spam slow on a defence.

If I'm joining a public game I'll see what frames are there and know what to expect. It all depends on the players and how reasonable they are. There's always going to be comprimises due to conflicting abilities and/or mods. Personally I couldn't care less as long as we can work together to compete the mission. Sadly it seems many Limbo players don't want to be reasonable and know their abilities can be used to grief. 

[AegidiusF]

il y a 1 minute, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Yes those are problems too but they do not stop you from playing, just makes it more difficult if that player doesn't want to be reasonable

But there is no Limbo ability that stops you from playing, at least not in a different manner than the other abilities I've mentioned. 

il y a 3 minutes, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Snow globe can be shot out of and doesn't move

Limbo's Rift can be dispelled and doesn't move neither. And you can't shot through Snow Globe if you're outside. 

il y a 6 minutes, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Wisp Reservoirs are always a sore point, people want the healing but don't like when -gasp- Wisp dares to do anything besides healing. If you don't want Motes and Wisp is reasonable it's a non issue.

I agree, but it's as disruptive as any player that doesn't know how to play correctly a warframe, Limbo included. 

Before Garuda's passive changes, even the healing mote was a pain and prevented Garuda to get her passive damage buff. 

il y a 8 minutes, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Volts can be annoying but most will quit it with the speed boosts if asked nicely,

The same is true for Limbo players : most will stop using his abilities mindlessy if we ask and explain them how Limbo works. 

il y a 10 minutes, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Nova players often have both Slow and Fast builds, unless they're malicious, they probably won't spam slow on a defence.

It can happend (I had it many times). It's not by any Malice, but because some players want to learn how some abilities work in the field, testing them. 

il y a 12 minutes, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

If I'm joining a public game I'll see what frames are there and know what to expect. It all depends on the players and how reasonable they are. There's always going to be comprimises due to conflicting abilities and/or mods. Personally I couldn't care less as long as we can work together to compete the mission. Sadly it seems many Limbo players don't want to be reasonable and know their abilities can be used to grief. 

I agree with you, but most of the time the few Limbos I see are much less disruptives than most of the Wukongs, Saryns, Mesas, Volts... I cross on some missions. And I'm not asking to nerf or to change these warframes : I just would like people to let my kind poor Limbo in peace 😇.

The warframes are nice, but some players can be disruptive. 

[Mazifet]

As long as you know how to play with a limbo, even players intentionally trolling aren't much of a problem. They put you in the rift? Dodge. They have a cataclysm over the mobile defense target before you put in the Datamass? Use your operator.

Speaking of trolling, what really annoys me is when someone steals your pilot seat in railjack even though you are the railjack owner. Just give me the option to force them out of the seat.

[Scroll_of_Wisdom]

3 hours ago, sunderthefirmament said:

This wouldn’t be enough for Limbo. It’s not typically his effects on the other players’ frames that matter. It’s his effect on enemies. The way he divides the map into zones of finger-wagging “no, no, no, your weapons can’t work there” is in desperate need of changing. 
 

Also, this is the first time I’ve encountered someone defending Limbo’s 3rd ability by claiming “everything makes sense.”  It’s the most needlessly convoluted ability in the game, stacked on top of the most needlessly convoluted kit. 
 

Limbo needs a complete rework, even more dramatic than Wukong’s (that gave him the clone) or Ember’s (that removed and replaced half of her kit). And in this rework, the rift as it currently exists needs to go. 

Toggling off the ally ability would obviously work on banished enemies too. I dont know why you thought that wasnt the case.

Limbo 3 is the corner stone of the active playstyle god-mode build. It's the way limbo can pull more enemies into the rift without leaving it. 

I'll gladly die on this hill. But I also dont feel the need to try and convince anybody. I know it's good.  

[A-Flying-Brick]

2 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said:

But there is no Limbo ability that stops you from playing, at least not in a different manner than the other abilities I've mentioned. 

Limbo's Rift can be dispelled and doesn't move neither. And you can't shot through Snow Globe if you're outside. 

I agree, but it's as disruptive as any player that doesn't know how to play correctly a warframe, Limbo included. 

Before Garuda's passive changes, even the healing mote was a pain and prevented Garuda to get her passive damage buff. 

The same is true for Limbo players : most will stop using his abilities mindlessy if we ask and explain them how Limbo works. 

It can happend (I had it many times). It's not by any Malice, but because some players want to learn how some abilities work in the field, testing them. 

I agree with you, but most of the time the few Limbos I see are much less disruptives than most of the Wukongs, Saryns, Mesas, Volts... I cross on some missions. And I'm not asking to nerf or to change these warframes : I just would like people to let my kind poor Limbo in peace 😇.

The warframes are nice, but some players can be disruptive. 

That is less about Rifts and all about Cataclysm. Cataclysm is highly disruptive as I've mention earlier. I'm glad you mentioned Garuda, because her passive was creating tension between players and was easy to accidently rendered useless. That's the exact thing I'm saying is the problem with Limbo. In addition, his kit is being used to grief other players.

Most of his kit relies on sectioning off enemies, causing a laundry list of what does and doesn't affect them. I'm sorry but that's some of the most selfish design I've seen for a while. Wukong, Saryn, Mesa and Volt dream of that. You can at least contribute when they're in the squad. Also can we stop shaming frames who can do large range/multi-target AoE damage? "I can't get highest number because someone else is using a frame that can get big number". It's really sad that that's what so many many people think in this game. If anything I'm glad to have those frames around, expecially in endless missions so we can stay longer and get more loot or Sanctuary Onslaught where you're rewarded for a ton of kills. Worse case the mission's over faster and you can just leave squad. 

Testing abilities is one thing, you see it's disruptive and stop or you take it to a solo mission and try it there. Most people do, the problem is many Limbo players know it's disruptive and don't care. I've pretty much covered all points of why it's disruptive. I'm asking for some simple changes to stop griefing and to stop rewarding disruptive behavour. It's not all Limbo players either, but it's a lot of them. That's why Limbo mains need to stop acting like he's their perfect little golden child who can do no wrong and pitch ways to improve him.

[0Midas0]

As someone who plays limbo a lot, I wouldn't mind a rework. If nothing else, there needs to be more obvious tells what is or isn't in the void. Invulnerable health bars, if you're in the wrong state, or something. 

Would be nice if he had an ability that exempted allies, or something. Maybe change his 3 into something where allies in the void can freely interact with stuff in and outside of the void. Though that might make him too powerful as well. Maybe also make the cata bubble fixed in size at something not too large, so it's working more like Gara or Frost's defensive mechanics. 

[Legeno]

Le 15/02/2023 à 07:07, Scroll_of_Wisdom a dit :

My solution: Change nothing to Limbo's kit. It's such a nice kit that if used well everything makes sense. 

Well, no, Limbo's kit is not nice at all. That's his problem right now, way more than the griefing potential which was mitigated over the years (not enough IMO though). Limbo's kit doesn't allow him to do much for the team, most of the time banishing enemies with the 1 is a pain in the ass for your mates and banishing with this doesn't have any interest, the Rift Surge augment bonus apply only to himself. The 4+2 famous combo has great defensive and CC potential of course, but at the cost of being an annoyance even to himself because of the idiotic shrinking of the Cataclysm that makes attacking enemies on the edge of it really, really painfull sometimes.

Limbo is a Warframe designed mainly to play solo, but in a cooperative game. He works great by himself, but in a team he brings no real advantage in the game right now. With his basic kit he can only CC, but with a lot of disturbance, and that's about it. No, don't talk about the energy regeneration that is a complete joke for teammates.

Though he also have his 1 augment to heal people, but I never played it so I don't know how viable it really can be.

[AegidiusF]

Le 15/02/2023 à 18:40, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

That is less about Rifts and all about Cataclysm. Cataclysm is highly disruptive as I've mention earlier. I'm glad you mentioned Garuda, because her passive was creating tension between players and was easy to accidently rendered useless. That's the exact thing I'm saying is the problem with Limbo. In addition, his kit is being used to grief other players.

I understand your position, but Cataclysm is as disruptive as Frost Snow Globe.

Cataclysm has not the potential to prevent the squad members to continue playing. It has a duration, it's range decreases over time and everybody can move inside and outside of it.

Perhaps if you mention a specific situation in which Cataclysm was used to grief you, I will be able to undrestand.

Le 15/02/2023 à 18:40, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Most of his kit relies on sectioning off enemies, causing a laundry list of what does and doesn't affect them. I'm sorry but that's some of the most selfish design I've seen for a while.

I don't really agree : his kit is focused in protecting his allies : preventing them from taking damage, regenerating their energy, making enemies be easilly killed by them. Not sellfish at all.

Le 15/02/2023 à 18:40, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Also can we stop shaming frames who can do large range/multi-target AoE damage? "I can't get highest number because someone else is using a frame that can get big number".

I totally agree with you. But that's also includes Limbo.

Le 15/02/2023 à 18:40, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

It's really sad that that's what so many many people think in this game. If anything I'm glad to have those frames around, expecially in endless missions so we can stay longer and get more loot or Sanctuary Onslaught where you're rewarded for a ton of kills.

I also agree, and I can also say that about Limbo : nothing better than having a Limbo on your squad for a defensive mission : Archon Hunts Defenses are a piece of cake with a Limbo on your squad (boring, I know, but easy).

Le 15/02/2023 à 18:40, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Testing abilities is one thing, you see it's disruptive and stop or you take it to a solo mission and try it there.

You're right.

Le 15/02/2023 à 18:40, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Most people do, the problem is many Limbo players know it's disruptive and don't care.

Well, sometimes it's not the Limbo that is disruptive, but the other players. Last year, it was on December I think, I was on a Syndicate Grinner Mobile Defense Missions : I took my Limbo and I went on an open squad. I was protecting the Defense targets while another squad member was searching for medallions, but the two other players, Vauban and Nekros, were there to farm resources by grouping enemies with Vauban's 4th and getting the bonus drop from Nekros 3rd. You can imagine what happened : they insulted me for using Cataclysm to protect the Defense target. The problem is that I was playing Limbo in a legit way, and they were playing Nekros and Vauban in a legit way (the problem was the insult, not heir gameplay). The mission goal was to protect the Defense targets : if they wanted to farm, going on an open squad, where you take what comes, is not the best idea. Of course, I didn't stop to cast Cataclysm to protect the target : nobody has to change a legit gameplay because it doesn't synergizes with other players secondary goals. And they could perfectly go outside Cataclysm to make their personal farm (but they didn't).

Le 15/02/2023 à 18:40, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

That's why Limbo mains need to stop acting like he's their perfect little golden child who can do no wrong and pitch ways to improve him.

I don't think any Limbo main can do this kind of disruptive gameplay (not more than any Saryn, Wukong, Ember, Banshee, Mirage, Volt, Vauban, Frost, Wisp mains).

Most of the time, it's just some players that want to troll and they pick Limbo, but Loki can also be used to troll, and Valkyr too. when people choose to troll, they will, no matter how.

(By the way, a bit of-topic :  I have no main frame : my most used frame is at 4%, I think - I need to check).

[gamingchair1121]

5 hours ago, Legeno said:

Though he also have his 1 augment to heal people, but I never played it so I don't know how viable it really can be.

the only place you should ever use it is defection or any operative defense (as they can't be healed by magus repair), anywhere else magus repair is infinitely better because its an aoe heal and doesn't send people to the rift. it also doesn't use energy because all you need to do is go into void mode.

[A-Flying-Brick]

9 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said:

I understand your position, but Cataclysm is as disruptive as Frost Snow Globe.

Cataclysm has not the potential to prevent the squad members to continue playing. It has a duration, it's range decreases over time and everybody can move inside and outside of it.

Perhaps if you mention a specific situation in which Cataclysm was used to grief you, I will be able to undrestand.

I've adressed this before, the constant movement of it and the inability to shoot out combined with Limbos constantly using it is why its do disruptive. Seen it used to grief via spamming it and/or placing it in a way that others are unable to shoot enemies. Unlike Snow Globe it moves and has rather flashy swirly effects and sounds. SG isn't as bad on darker energy, plus you can shoot out of a SG. It actually helps with defence rather than obstructing the rest of the squad. It's why I suggested to make Cataclysm a toggle ability like Mend & Maim with a fixed size.

9 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said:

I don't really agree : his kit is focused in protecting his allies : preventing them from taking damage, regenerating their energy, making enemies be easilly killed by them. Not sellfish at all.

I totally agree with you. But that's also includes Limbo.

I also agree, and I can also say that about Limbo : nothing better than having a Limbo on your squad for a defensive mission : Archon Hunts Defenses are a piece of cake with a Limbo on your squad (boring, I know, but easy).

I have never had a Limbo actually protect an ally. Had a couple actually help by Banishing a moving defence target but they were really one-trick ponies would just hide in the Rift Plane rather than try and fight. Also I've never seen a support Limbo that was nothing more than Overextended + Continutity who calls spamming max range Cataclysm "support". Sure it gives energy but so does running Energy Siphon. As for damage, they'd always bring whatever the meta is and use that for big numbers. Could be a regional or timezone thing but that's pretty much every Limbo I've encounted in my almost 3k hours of playing.

As for Defence, I prefer Gara. You can shoot throught the wall from either side with no issues, it's high enough that drones are blocked. Not as great on moving defence but you just detonate the wall and place it back near the target when they move out of it. I can see Limbo have some use on moving defence but they're easily beaten out by a good Khora or Vauban. Most Limbos are ok at best. There's synergies I want to test, since someone mentioned Sentients having a weird interaction with the Rift Plane, but Limbo is still too much of a wild card for me to recommend his use on such a difficult mission.

9 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said:

Well, sometimes it's not the Limbo that is disruptive, but the other players. Last year, it was on December I think, I was on a Syndicate Grinner Mobile Defense Missions : I took my Limbo and I went on an open squad. I was protecting the Defense targets while another squad member was searching for medallions, but the two other players, Vauban and Nekros, were there to farm resources by grouping enemies with Vauban's 4th and getting the bonus drop from Nekros 3rd. You can imagine what happened : they insulted me for using Cataclysm to protect the Defense target. The problem is that I was playing Limbo in a legit way, and they were playing Nekros and Vauban in a legit way (the problem was the insult, not heir gameplay). The mission goal was to protect the Defense targets : if they wanted to farm, going on an open squad, where you take what comes, is not the best idea. Of course, I didn't stop to cast Cataclysm to protect the target : nobody has to change a legit gameplay because it doesn't synergizes with other players secondary goals. And they could perfectly go outside Cataclysm to make their personal farm (but they didn't).

I don't think any Limbo main can do this kind of disruptive gameplay (not more than any Saryn, Wukong, Ember, Banshee, Mirage, Volt, Vauban, Frost, Wisp mains).

That does sound awful, idk why tf they'd be farming on such a mission either.

There's always going to be that problem but it doesn't change what I'm saying about Limbo's problems. His problems are different kind of disruptive from the other listed frames (except maybe Frost, as mentioned above). Any frame can be used to grief, all you have to do is stand in the way. Also it's not griefing to get kills or out damage someone else. The issue here is Limbo takes it to the next level by literally being able to press a button that cuts you off from everything else or worse lock you in with something strong. Also he can place Rifts in the way, forcing others into the Rift Plane at no cost. The icing on the cake: a moving swirling zone that can't be shot through.

It is disruptive and to the layman it just looks like any other frame's abilities. That's why it's such an effective grief. Anyone can point out other frames attempting to grief but Limbo's are not as visable to outsiders. Oh he's just using his abilities, no issue there. Having it so tied to the core of his kit makes it too easy and causes such push back when asked to be considerate. It's why Limbo needs some kind of rework.

Limbo is actually my 15th most used frame, actually above my Khora and Gara. I've tried to find ways to make him not awful to use but these days I just use him for Dragon Vaults, since I'd rather use Khora, Gara or Oberon for support. My top 3 being Titania, Wukong and Nekros btw. On paper I like Limbo but in practice he's just too disruptive and causes so many problems for the rest of the squad for me to want to use him. Every possible role for him is filled by a frame I enjoy more and has better synergy with every other frame. 

[vixenpixel]

AT BEST A SLOW!? It literally paralyses enemies completely. It also is the only ez way of protecting defense targets during radiation sortie missions. For that, and for his ability to protect excavators extremely well, he has a spot in some lineups. But yeah, his trolling potential is pretty high, indeed. You could report limbo trollers doing it clearly on purpose to disrupt gameplay for you or your squad.

[--Leyenda-yight6]

hace 7 horas, vixenpixel dijo:

AT BEST A SLOW!? It literally paralyses enemies completely. It also is the only ez way of protecting defense targets during radiation sortie missions. For that, and for his ability to protect excavators extremely well, he has a spot in some lineups. But yeah, his trolling potential is pretty high, indeed. You could report limbo trollers doing it clearly on purpose to disrupt gameplay for you or your squad.

not so much, in mobile defense with radiation it only prevents weapons from damaging the console, but any warframe with damage abilities or eximus can destroy it since the abilities are not limited by the rift, it has happened to me several times, that's why I do them in lonely.

[Scroll_of_Wisdom]

23 hours ago, Legeno said:

Well, no, Limbo's kit is not nice at all. That's his problem right now, way more than the griefing potential which was mitigated over the years (not enough IMO though). Limbo's kit doesn't allow him to do much for the team, most of the time banishing enemies with the 1 is a pain in the ass for your mates and banishing with this doesn't have any interest, the Rift Surge augment bonus apply only to himself. The 4+2 famous combo has great defensive and CC potential of course, but at the cost of being an annoyance even to himself because of the idiotic shrinking of the Cataclysm that makes attacking enemies on the edge of it really, really painfull sometimes.

Limbo is a Warframe designed mainly to play solo, but in a cooperative game. He works great by himself, but in a team he brings no real advantage in the game right now. With his basic kit he can only CC, but with a lot of disturbance, and that's about it. No, don't talk about the energy regeneration that is a complete joke for teammates.

Though he also have his 1 augment to heal people, but I never played it so I don't know how viable it really can be.

Just because you are getting griefed by other players doesnt mean the kit isnt nice. It means they are bad players or they are intentionally doing it to you.

Dont tell me you dont feel great when a low aoe limbo places cataclysm on mobile defense target and uses no other abiliities.

Banish the rescue target. 

Does your Lua Spy for you.

But the place where his WHOLE kit comes into play is in solo survival mode. This is where he is truly amazing. Where cataclysm is a temporary mass banish tool and the focus is on 3 and 1 and 2.

Asking for a change in his kit is uncalled for. And would be a great loss of very good frame design.

Thats why I'll go back to my "team mate skill toggle" option.

Because it will never stop with you people. You will complain about anything. When it eventually gets changed, something else needs to be changed. And it never stops. 

 

[Crash-Override]

On 15/02/2023 at 03:26, (PSN)Ragology said:

Tudo o que eles precisam fazer é fazer com que possamos interagir com consoles e chaves de defesa móveis enquanto estivermos no rift.

If I'm not mistaken this was possible in the old days using the operator

[AegidiusF]

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

I've adressed this before, the constant movement of it and the inability to shoot out combined with Limbos constantly using it is why its do disruptive.

If by constant movement you mean he fact that it's range diminishes over time, I can't see how it's disruptive, as it's a limitation to balance Cataclysm.

The inability to shoot through it only just forces you to move a bit (inside, outside) just like when you're outside Frost SnowGlobe (that prevents all your shot to go through).

Constantly, I don't know, but as many times as needed to protect a target, yes, but this is nice. I really can't see how can it be more disruptive as many other warframe's abilities.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

plus you can shoot out of a SG.

yes, but you can't shoot in, and this is very dangerous on Defense missions.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

I suggested to make Cataclysm a toggle ability like Mend & Maim with a fixed size.

The problem is that, if Cataclysm range is no more balanced by duration it will be even more powerful, too powerful in my opinion.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

I have never had a Limbo actually protect an ally.

That's because we never played together.😇

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Sure it gives energy but so does running Energy Siphon.

Energy Siphon : 0.6/s

Limbo's Rift : 2/s

[ In addition, with the Augment mod (somebody already said this before) 25% max HP restored : extremely nice in Arbitrations and Archon Hunt Defense mission - and he is also one of the best frames to perfectly do the Lua's Spy mission.]

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

Also I've never seen a support Limbo that was nothing more than Overextended + Continutity who calls spamming max range Cataclysm "support"

Cataclysm spammers like that almost never use Overextended+Continuity, but Range mods + Power Strength mods : they are spamming to kill with an AoE ability, nothing more than an Ember, a Banshee, a Volt or a Saryn would do. As I said, even these spammers are not more disruptive than many other warframes.

Cataclysm can be used in an offensive manner, or in a defensive manner to CC, just as Banshee's Sound Quake.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

As for Defence, I prefer Gara. You can shoot throught the wall from either side with no issues

And Gara's glass can also be easily broken if you don't know how to use it. (and the FX can be as bad as Cataclysm).

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

it's high enough that drones are blocked.

There is something that many players don't know : Gara's Glass has 15m height (3 above the cast point and 12 under the cast point) : you can casit it in the air to benefit from the 12m that are under the cast point. To do it, you just need to bullet jump straight up, aim glide and cast : you glass wall will have the 15m above the ground by just doing this. This can prevent some enemies jumping inside the glass area from high platforms nearby.

[There is a bug since the last update - it will be fixed soon - that cancels aim glide while casting two hand abilities]

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

. I can see Limbo have some use on moving defence but they're easily beaten out by a good Khora or Vauban.

Yes, you're right, but it's not always that you can bet a Khora or a Vauban on your squad. And Limbo+Ember or any other frame with AoE or pulling abilities is awesome : most warframe abilities work from inside the Rift, so you can cast them with no problems and kill enemies that are inside and outside.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

There's synergies I want to test, since someone mentioned Sentients having a weird interaction with the Rift Plane, but Limbo is still too much of a wild card for me to recommend his use on such a difficult mission.

I hope one day you will also become a Limbo lover. Excellent for many hard missions. His only weakness are Corpus Nullifiers (and you can deal with their bubble from inside the Rift by using your operator). If you're playing a Corpus mission and there is a Limbo that bothers you, I recommend picking Nekros, as the summoned Nullifiers by Nekros 4th will dispell Limbo's Cataclysm as soon as he castes it.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

The issue here is Limbo takes it to the next level by literally being able to press a button that cuts you off from everything else or worse lock you in with something strong. Also he can place Rifts in the way, forcing others into the Rift Plane at no cost.

What comes with no cost, goes away with no cost : just roll to quit the Rift. It's much sipmle than to backflip to get rid of Volt's Speed.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

The icing on the cake: a moving swirling zone that can't be shot through.

But that let's your abilities pass through, that let's you pass through to kill with you weapons outside and inside. The Rift doesn't prevents you from moving.

Il y a 20 heures, A-Flying-Brick a dit :

My top 3 being Titania, Wukong and Nekros btw

You see : Nekros : the great fear of so many Limbos on Corpus missions. I've taught you how to take your revenge (at least at some missions).

[My top 3 is : Trinity, Banshee and Nyx - about 4% use rate each, and my less used frame is Wukong : only 0.5%, I think.]

Il y a 18 heures, vixenpixel a dit :

It also is the only ez way of protecting defense targets during radiation sortie missions.

Il y a 10 heures, --Leyenda-yight6 a dit :

not so much, in mobile defense with radiation it only prevents weapons from damaging the console, but any warframe with damage abilities or eximus can destroy it since the abilities are not limited by the rift, it has happened to me several times, that's why I do them in lonely.

What you said is true, but the most easy way to prevent friend-fire on Radiation Sorties is to protect the whole squad from Status effects. I usually do this with a high duration and range Hydroid, but Titania, Nezha, Hyldrin (and now Revenant) are excellent too.

[(PSN)Frost_Nephilim]

On 2023-02-13 at 5:08 PM, Pakaku said:

Problem with immature players, not with Limbo himself, and chances are I'll never see them again in future matches

Begs the question, should DE make more hard player disrupting warframes for immature players to use, cause if you know anything about games or simply spent a few moments in region chat, its about the dumbest thing expecting there to be no immature players.

Myself included, i think im part of the reason they removed Vaubans bounce pads outside of them being useless. My immature behind found the upmost entertaimment once every few months, to choose a small defense mission and turn the map into a complete bounce house driving allies and enemies mad 😂 idc what no one says, watching 4 players helplessly bounce up and down, side to side, at like 100m per second, then stand still 30 seconds later to type out "wow O_O" as there eyes move in circles from their dizziness and confusion on what in the world i had just done to them. IS the most hilarious thing 😂😂😂

Someone got mad at me once, turned mic on and just yelled to top of their lungs. Caught me by so much surprise because no one usually cares THAT much. I couldnt inhale for so long, was laughing so hard, tried to turn my mic on and say sorry, but he kept going off and wouldnt let me xD

Yea.... some game trolls make me so evil lol

[Legeno]

Il y a 7 heures, Scroll_of_Wisdom a dit :

Just because you are getting griefed by other players doesnt mean the kit isnt nice. It means they are bad players or they are intentionally doing it to you.

Dont tell me you dont feel great when a low aoe limbo places cataclysm on mobile defense target and uses no other abiliities.

Banish the rescue target. 

Does your Lua Spy for you.

But the place where his WHOLE kit comes into play is in solo survival mode. This is where he is truly amazing. Where cataclysm is a temporary mass banish tool and the focus is on 3 and 1 and 2.

Asking for a change in his kit is uncalled for. And would be a great loss of very good frame design.

Thats why I'll go back to my "team mate skill toggle" option.

Because it will never stop with you people. You will complain about anything. When it eventually gets changed, something else needs to be changed. And it never stops. 

 

You miss the point. Limbo's kit doesn't suck because of the disruptivity (although it is definitly a problme for Limbo more than almost any other Warframe in the game). Limbo's kit suck because he does almost nothing valuable with 4 abilities. Limbo is bad design, and a real waste of the "interdimensionnal wizard" concept.

Augments aside, all Limbo can do is for the team is CC enemies with one of his abilities. The other 3 have for only purpose to do the exact same thing : send some sh*t in the Rift. Three abilities which, all in all, has the exact same purpose, how is this "very good frame design" ? The Rift intrusivity in others players comfort is just not worth it much of the time because this intrusivity doesn't come with any advantage for them, Stasis aside there is no purpose sending enemies in the Rift, and Limbo's lacking kit is I think the biggest part of the problem.

If Limbo had a better kit with more helpful utility provided to the team, his reputation would already greatly improve, AND he would probably also be better than what he is currently.

[A-Flying-Brick]

7 hours ago, Legeno said:

You miss the point. Limbo's kit doesn't suck because of the disruptivity (although it is definitly a problme for Limbo more than almost any other Warframe in the game). Limbo's kit suck because he does almost nothing valuable with 4 abilities. Limbo is bad design, and a real waste of the "interdimensionnal wizard" concept.

Augments aside, all Limbo can do is for the team is CC enemies with one of his abilities. The other 3 have for only purpose to do the exact same thing : send some sh*t in the Rift. Three abilities which, all in all, has the exact same purpose, how is this "very good frame design" ? The Rift intrusivity in others players comfort is just not worth it much of the time because this intrusivity doesn't come with any advantage for them, Stasis aside there is no purpose sending enemies in the Rift, and Limbo's lacking kit is I think the biggest part of the problem.

If Limbo had a better kit with more helpful utility provided to the team, his reputation would already greatly improve, AND he would probably also be better than what he is currently.

Well said.

Limbo is very lackluster compaired to other frames. Yes the Rift Plane is a great passive but it's let down by every other ability being so reliant on targets being in the Rift. Limbo can heal and restore energy, but only in the Rift. You know who can do both those things? Trinity can and she doesn't need to put you in the Rift to do it.

As I've pointed out, there's pretty much nothing I use Limbo for these days. Even in the very particular conditions where Limbo might be good, he's still worse than multiple other frames such as Gara, Khora, Wisp, Equinox, Trinity or Oberon. Sure folks have pointed out how easy Limbo makes certain missions, that's at the cost of making it more difficult for the rest of the squad. At best, Limbo is taking up a slot that could be a much better frame, at worse Limbo is an annoying obstruction. Limbo needs a rework. 

[gamingchair1121]

8 minutes ago, A-Flying-Brick said:

Sure folks have pointed out how easy Limbo makes certain missions, that's at the cost of making it more difficult for the rest of the squad

only if you don't know how the rift works

[A-Flying-Brick]

5 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

only if you don't know how the rift works

I think it's a little unreasonable to expect every player to be expected to know all the particulars of an effect that has to have its own wiki page because it was too long to be on Limbo's main page. Seriously it's over 1500 words. While its a pretty short short story, it's still a couple of pages of various conditions and particulars. Half of those conditions have multiple exceptions, some of which are not very obvious.

I wouldn't expect the majority of players to even know half of the convoluted mess that it is the Rift Plane, Limbo players or not.

[ImWithDerp]

Could a rework in this general direction be helpful?

• Limbo can still move in and out the Rift freely, but no longer sends allies into it
• Sending an enemy into the Rift instantly kills and disintegrates them (only Limbo and those under his protection can survive inside the Rift), but only enemies under a health threshold can be sent there
• With the above in mind, each of his abilities now perform one or more of the following functions:
  • Protecting allies by sending enemy projectiles that would hit them into the Rift
  • Instakilling lower health enemies by pulling them into the Rift
  • Converting projectiles/enemies pulled into the rift into something useful (e.g. ammo or energy orbs)
  • Exposing higher health enemies to damage from Limbo while he's in the Rift and they are not
  • Cause some kind of chain reaction between allies protected by the Rift and/or enemies exposed to the Rift (e.g. strip defenses of any enemies near them)
  • Nuking, slowing, etc. as long as it does not impede Limbo's allies

[gamingchair1121]

5 hours ago, A-Flying-Brick said:

I think it's a little unreasonable to expect every player to be expected to know all the particulars of an effect that has to have its own wiki page because it was too long to be on Limbo's main page. Seriously it's over 1500 words.

basically all the important stuff to know:

• While in the rift, you can roll to exit. Rolling inside a cataclysm will send you back in.
• Warframes generate two energy per second (Channeled abilities cancel this).
• Weapons do not bypass the rift.
• Abilities, warframe and eximus, bypass the rift.
• Consoles and anything that use the action key (default X) cannot be interacted with (Except teammate doors).
• Loot is unable to be picked up, but is still vacuumed in by companions and sentinels. Loot inside a cataclysm range picked up.
• Scanning items (Like cephalon fragments or somachord tones) works across planes, but to scan an enemy you will need to be in the same plane.
• Operators completely ignore the rift, letting them interact with things even inside a cataclysm, though they are unable to damage rifted enemies because of this. However, their abilities and certain arcanes are able to affect rifted enemies, like caustic strike or magus anomaly.

the important stuff to know isn't really too much, especially considering a lot of that 1500 words is mostly things the average non-limbo main could care less about, like enemies take 300 impact damage on plane transition

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

On 2023-02-18 at 8:48 PM, gamingchair1121 said:

only if you don't know how the rift works

This is every limbo players excuse for stopping all players from using their guns with cataclysm. Even frost allows others to shoot through his bubble. If people play limbo, do everyone a favor and play solo because his only job is to troll.

[sunderthefirmament]

On 2023-02-18 at 9:48 PM, gamingchair1121 said:

only if you don't know how the rift works

I know how it works and a Limbo can still make my experience more complicated when playing a typical mission.  Whenever there’s a Limbo around, I suddenly have to be extremely aware of my positioning if I want to get any kills.  Let’s take a steel path defense incursion for this mental exercise, and assume that the Limbo is making a passable attempt at being polite (using Narrow Minded). Normally I just hop around the map nuking with AOE weapons or whatever damaging abilities I have on my frames, and I can easily clear the point from across the map.  With our polite Limbo shielding the defense objective, now I can’t clear the point from a distance because of the rift.  Sure, my abilities will go through, but my abilities are only one part of my arsenal. Limbo has effectively limited the rest. 
 

Even played politely or “well,” Limbo is disruptive to the rest of the team. In an organized setting, sure, go wild. But I think it’s griefing to bring him to public matchmaking.