Please fix Vauban's vortex!

[Zilacon]

Enemies being pulled in to vortex need to have their collisions removed, and be allowed to noclip through objects to the vortex.
Vauban's vortex is completely useless on every defense map as your just running around finding enemies stuck to ceilings or walls, making the rounds last forever.
Using it on survivals is the same problem, they get stuck under paths, on walls, on floors, ceilings, everywhere. And because there are enemies stuck all over the place that arent being killed, it stops the generation of new enemies to kill until all of those stuck enemies are killed.

Just something needs to be done about this, either fix it to where the enemies wont stop being dragged until it reaches the vortex so they dont get stuck anywhere, or make them noclip.

Another issue is with the orbs, when you throw the orbs in an area with Repelling Bastille it will create a 2nd, 3rd, etc vortex at the location a vortex already exists instead of fusing into it to extend its duration. Vortex and bastille balls also collide with enemies, causing them to bounce off and have the same issue. If i wanted to go a full range build and ignore efficiency and duration, its bad enough keeping up with the energy costs... But when your precious energy is being wasted on making multiple vortex's when you just want to extend the duration of 1 of them, it pretty much kills the build.

With that being said vortex is not the only one with this issue, protea, gauss, and others also have similar issues with enemies being pulled into the abilities.
I just wish this would be addressed so it makes Vauban more viable for different mission types. I had a defense last 18 mins for 1 round because of this issue, we were just running around finding enemies stuck to everything, and we had no defensive frames so i was the only option to protect the objective.

[Spectre-8]

Sure sure yeah but ofc do the exact same for Larva and also Ensnare while you're at it  , oh yeah and also remove LoS ( Pillage stripping the entire map oh yes )  requirement for every ability in the game .

Totally not a meme .

 

Edited May 31, 2023 by Spectre-8

[Frendh]

No, vortex does not need a buff. If the enemies get stuck then consider your placement more carefully, lower your range or move around and kill the stuck enemies.

[Famecans]

I agree, it's totally unworkable to have enemies trapped in inaccessible places for example, below the islands in Circuit defence mode.

Vauban and a very stationary frame but DE insists on putting all of his abilities time-triggered. I still wonder why Vauban skill 1 and 2(abc) doesn't work as a Wisp mote?!?!?!

11 hours ago, Frendh said:

No, vortex does not need a buff. If the enemies get stuck then consider your placement more carefully, lower your range or move around and kill the stuck enemies.

12 hours ago, Spectre-8 said:

Sure sure yeah but ofc do the exact same for Larva and also Ensnare while you're at it  , oh yeah and also remove LoS ( Pillage stripping the entire map oh yes )  requirement for every ability in the game .

Totally not a meme .

💮Larva; Ensnare; Airburst... does not hide enemies within wall for minutes💮

Edited May 31, 2023 by Famecans

[Frendh]

6 hours ago, Famecans said:

I still wonder why Vauban skill 1 and 2(abc) doesn't work as a Wisp mote?!?!?!

I do not understand why they should work like Wisp mote. Only one of those five abilities is a Warframe buff.

[Spectre-8]

7 hours ago, Famecans said:

I agree, it's totally unworkable to have enemies trapped in inaccessible places for example, below the islands in Circuit defence mode.

Vauban and a very stationary frame but DE insists on putting all of his abilities time-triggered. I still wonder why Vauban skill 1 and 2(abc) doesn't work as a Wisp mote?!?!?!

💮Larva; Ensnare; Airburst... DO not hide enemies within wall for minutes💮

There fixed it for you .

[Famecans]

2 hours ago, Spectre-8 said:

There fixed it for you .

wut?!?!

[sunderthefirmament]

23 hours ago, Frendh said:

No, vortex does not need a buff. If the enemies get stuck then consider your placement more carefully, lower your range or move around and kill the stuck enemies.

Vortex is strong, but it's situational.  There are some tiles where it's just not practical.  As CC frames are already devalued, I don't think there's anything wrong with some QOL changes to Vortex.  That said, allowing enemies to no-clip might be a bit much.  I think I'd prefer a line-of-sight check on Vortex.  Only let it pull enemies if they're actually going to reach it.  Sadly, DE doesn't have a great track record with line-of-sight checks, so this might be a monkey's paw situation.

[NinjaZeku]

As long as AoE damage that hits through walls exists (like Booben's 3 not least), I don't see a need to nerf the ability into needing LoS.

If a Vauban prolongs missions by getting enemies stuck without doing anything about it, then that's in no small part
the fault of the player for bad ability use and not being prepared (Loadout-wise) to handle such instances.

Please don't ruin a fun / effective Frame by trying to idiot-proof him, that is an ultimately futile pursuit.

[Pakaku]

Easy fix: steal the Argonak's ability to highlight enemies, and use that to mark all affected enemies through walls, making it easier to locate them without changing anything fundamentally functional about the ability.

[Frendh]

4 hours ago, Pakaku said:

Easy fix: steal the Argonak's ability to highlight enemies, and use that to mark all affected enemies through walls, making it easier to locate them without changing anything fundamentally functional about the ability.

Argonak can do this? I was only aware of Zenith being able to do that.

[Famecans]

13 hours ago, Pakaku said:

Easy fix: steal the Argonak's ability to highlight enemies, and use that to mark all affected enemies through walls, making it easier to locate them without changing anything fundamentally functional about the ability.

up up up👍

[CosmicHermitCrab]

Time to min-max my Argonak!

[Pakaku]

I meant give Vauban's vortex (and any pulling ability I suppose) the ability to mark enemies that are behind walls, but hey, the Argonak itself could always use more love

[XaoGarrent]

I feel like adding line of sight to vortex would be a buff.

[NinjaZeku]

13 hours ago, XaoGarrent said:

I feel like adding line of sight to vortex would be a buff.

Please explain in what way.

A mass CC ability being changed to suddenly affect enemies to a much smaller degree / in less situations
rather than fully covering an area regardless of obstacles etc, where is the "buff" there?

Plus not least, Warframe's LoS detection is FAR from perfect, there are other abilities / weapons / whatnot
relying on LoS that are frustrating to use, ignoring enemies that certainly seem like they should be affected
(e.g. Inaros' Sandstorm comes to mind, that thing has severe problems hitting stuff within range).

[XaoGarrent]

8 hours ago, NinjaZeku said:

Please explain in what way.

I actually avoid using vortex against anything with armor, because it can actually impede teammates and drag rounds out. Sadly, because Bastille collapses into vortex, I'm forced to use it anyway, if briefly.

Of course, I can only control my character, so there's nothing I can do about the noob Vauban players who insist on using Vortex over Bastille, on layered Steel Path Grineer maps. In which case, one teammate with a max range infa-vortex build can create a situation where three other people have to deal with tons of fully armored, ragdolled enemies pinned to walls, dragging everything out unless they have a Saryn or something that can ignore LoS.

It would be a buff for EVERYONE if that stopped being a thing. At least with Slowva most people have learned not to bring her to defense, and she has other obvious ways you can build her that don't have this problem (or in the case of speedva actually speed things up).

In the vast majority of mission objectives, enemies either approach a static objective, or they approach you.

Putting line of sight on vortex would limit the number of situations where enemies can be pulled by it, but not pulled to somewhere useful, I. E. the center of the vortex.

Line of sight detection be damned, enemies being sucked against and even into a wall and in a glitchy, hard to hit, hard to headshot, ragdolled state is not good. By the way, you should know exactly what I'm talking about if you actually play Vauban. I main him, and I hate this.

[NinjaZeku]

42 minutes ago, XaoGarrent said:

It would be a buff for EVERYONE if that stopped being a thing. At least with Slowva most people have learned not to bring her to defense

So, same solution here, tell the bad Vauban players to stop doing that.

44 minutes ago, XaoGarrent said:

you should know exactly what I'm talking about if you actually play Vauban

I've played Booben quite a bit over the years, thank you very much.

As I mentioned, AoE weapons can help when enemies get stuck
(not that they would be stuck for long anyway if you don't use the manual collapse)
and should be made part of your Loadout if you - as Vauban - do decide to CC with Vortex rather than Bastille.

[XaoGarrent]

29 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

So, same solution here, tell the bad Vauban players to stop doing that.

I generally don't bother doing things with a success rate lower than 15%

29 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

I've played Booben quite a bit over the years, thank you very much.

You're not doing a good job of convincing me that this is true.

29 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

As I mentioned, AoE weapons can help when enemies get stuck
(not that they would be stuck for long anyway if you don't use the manual collapse)
and should be made part of your Loadout if you - as Vauban - do decide to CC with Vortex rather than Bastille.

AoE weapons are probably the only reason playing Vauban isn't considered griefing by most of the Warframe community.

They'd synergize with Vauban much better, too, if enemies were allowed to walk into a clear path before vortex starts pulling them, so they get sucked together in a ball.

Edited June 5, 2023 by XaoGarrent
Better order

[Famecans]

On 2023-06-01 at 4:43 AM, Pakaku said:

Easy fix: steal the Argonak's ability to highlight enemies, and use that to mark all affected enemies through walls, making it easier to locate them without changing anything fundamentally functional about the ability.

Please developers, this is the best idea ever☝️ this can make Vauban extremely friendly on missions.

• Every enemy affected by Vortex area has a glowing marker shown through walls.
• Every player within Vortex area see the markers and receive infinite punch through on all weapons, companions, melee...

[xcrimsonlegendx]

As someone who plays a lot of Vauban I have to say that you just need to put thought into where you throw your vortex and how large you mod your range for. Don't throw it in areas where there are enemies that spawn below you or else they'll get stuck to the ceiling. Or throw the vortex up toward the top of the room so they're drawn to the ceiling so the ones below you aren't affected by the pull. There are ways to use vortex in its current state without it being a hindrance to the team.

That being said, having them noclip through walls is not a great option. I'd honestly like to see them make vortex have some kind of line-of-sight functionality, where it doesn't pull in enemies that are behind walls and are only drawn to the vortex if they're within its view so they don't get stuck. It wouldn't really cause much of a change in the viability of the vortex, it'd just pull them once they get out from behind cover.

[NinjaZeku]

22 hours ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

having them noclip through walls is not a great option

Wait, when was that suggested?

22 hours ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

It wouldn't really cause much of a change in the viability of the vortex

It would severely change the Squad protection aspect of the ability, non-LoS CC is TONS more potent than those that do require it.

(Also I don't quite understand, you spend the first half of your post saying current Vortex is fine if used properly,
then you suddenly do a 180 and say you want to nerf "improve" Vortex by limiting it to LoS.)

[xcrimsonlegendx]

25 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

It would severely change the Squad protection aspect of the ability, non-LoS CC is TONS more potent than those that do require it.

(Also I don't quite understand, you spend the first half of your post saying current Vortex is fine if used properly,
then you suddenly do a 180 and say you want to nerf "improve" Vortex by limiting it to LoS.)

I didn't say its fine as it is, sorry if my wording wasn't more clear. I was just trying to share ways I've found to manage the somewhat frustrating way it works now while also making suggestions to improve it. Honestly I'd prefer LoS on Vortex because you'd be able to use it in more areas without fear of slowing down the mission. As soon as the enemy rounds the corner they'd be drawn into the vortex. You wouldn't have cases of enemies stuck behind doors or walls, or floors that you have to run around to kill because your AoE's aren't reaching that far. As for the "squad protection" aspect, that's what Bastille is for.

26 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

Wait, when was that suggested?

My mistake.

Edited June 13, 2023 by xcrimsonlegendx