Dante Floaty walking animation.

[quxier]

4 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

On 2024-03-15 at 6:21 PM, quxier said:

I would be ok with that statement if they haven't wasted time on breaking things.

 

Look at Styanax/4. Casting abilities during 4th worked. Was it so OP to be removed? No. They just didn't liked it. It didn't fit their vision of that ability.

Look at Exodia contagion. Does it need double/bullet jump? No. You already can do it only once. You cannot increase number of shoot via Aerial ace mod.

No idea what that has to do with the subject at hand.

I'm just saying that they wasting time already on stuff we don't want. Let them waste time on stuff that we want.

4 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

On 2024-03-15 at 6:21 PM, quxier said:

I wonder if we are so small.

Then you are in denial and delussional.

The two current unique walk-animation frames had a combined usage of roughly 8%. That is a minority, since it is 8% out of 100%. Then out of those 8% you and a some others want a change to the animation options. And if we look at the frames, it would be a change that would cater to less than 4% of the total roster.

Your data is just random numbers pushed to fit your agenda.

Yes, walking/rolling* animation is just part of reasons why we use or not use certain frames.

* rolling would be even better with sticky-corner update (if implemented "correctly")

 

For example I rarely use Caliban. His 1st is too weak and it drain too much. 3rd used to not give shield most of the time. 2nd is weak at low strength + lifted status. I don't use Caliban because I don't like his kit. His walking animation has nothing to do with it.

[Hexerin]

If you don't like a frame's animations, there's already a solution for that:

Spoiler

 

[0_The_F00l]

4 hours ago, Hexerin said:

If you don't like a frame's animations, there's already a solution for that:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

That only works when idle not in motion.

[Circle_of_Psi]

On 2024-03-15 at 11:34 PM, Qorvex99 said:

Pardon my exaggeration, but I think about him a lot because I've been wanting a mage/scholar type Warframe with spell casting and magic...that's why I think he represents me, not me personally but what I want in a Warframe, again this could turn out to be completely false and Dante is just another one of those filler frames...but we'll see.

Oh lol

Yeah, I feel you, I've been hoping for a mage/scholar-type Warframe with spell casting and magic ever since we got that tome weapon from the recent update (Even if it's trash MR Fodder).

Given what we've seen on both paper and in-game demo, I have no doubts that Dante will NOT be "just another one of those filler frames" since I've already mentioned how he can control Slash Porcs, Overgaurd and Health all in 2 casts (no pun intended lol), that alone is strong on its own.

[CephalonCarnage]

On 2024-03-15 at 11:24 AM, Circle_of_Psi said:

DE want to keep frames with their own uniqueness

If that was the case, why did they make Helminth to swap abilities from one to another.

[quxier]

1 hour ago, CephalonCarnage said:

On 2024-03-15 at 12:24 PM, Circle_of_Psi said:

DE want to keep frames with their own uniqueness

If that was the case, why did they make Helminth to swap abilities from one to another.

Dey don't allow abilities that are "defining" of frame. So we have bunch of similar abilities like stun or sleep.

[SneakyErvin]

19 hours ago, quxier said:

I'm just saying that they wasting time already on stuff we don't want. Let them waste time on stuff that we want.

Who are the "we"? I didnt mind the changes to either of what you mention, since one fixed several bugs and the other an OP mechanic. That you also bring up double/bullet jump is odd, since that interaction has always been part of that item. So in that regard they didnt waste any time changing anything in that case that you might not have wanted. Changing the interaction to something you personally want might have been a waste though since others were already used to it no matter what.

19 hours ago, quxier said:

Your data is just random numbers pushed to fit your agenda.

Yes, walking/rolling* animation is just part of reasons why we use or not use certain frames.

* rolling would be even better with sticky-corner update (if implemented "correctly")

 

For example I rarely use Caliban. His 1st is too weak and it drain too much. 3rd used to not give shield most of the time. 2nd is weak at low strength + lifted status. I don't use Caliban because I don't like his kit. His walking animation has nothing to do with it.

Heh, it's the official stats. So there is less than 8% of the playerbase playing those 2 current specific frame with unique walk-animations. And those are also 2 frames out of a roster of well above 50, so uhm they make up for less than 4% of the roster. That's not random numbers, that is how wide a change would impact the game.

No idea why you ramble about Caliban and his kit. How is that relevant? Did this thread suddenly turn into frame rework needs? Uhm... nope.

[quxier]

53 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

20 hours ago, quxier said:

I'm just saying that they wasting time already on stuff we don't want. Let them waste time on stuff that we want.

Who are the "we"? I didnt mind the changes to either of what you mention, since one fixed several bugs and the other an OP mechanic.

What bugs and OP mechanic you are talking about? I had no issue using Exodia contagion with single jumps. Styanax/4 wasn't more overpowered compared to other abilities.

56 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

hat you also bring up double/bullet jump is odd, since that interaction has always been part of that item. So in that regard they didnt waste any time changing anything in that case that you might not have wanted.

No, requirement of Exodia contagion were only (any) jump + aimglide attack. You could even attack many times. It was changed A LOT. Only description probably mentioned bullet/double jump (at least according to wiki, I don't remember old text).

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

Changing the interaction to something you personally want might have been a waste though since others were already used to it no matter what.

Yes, that's example of Exodia contagion with "any jump" requirement. Same for Amalgam barrel diffusion that used to shorten (a little) rolls - they could make another mod or item.

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

20 hours ago, quxier said:

Your data is just random numbers pushed to fit your agenda.

Yes, walking/rolling* animation is just part of reasons why we use or not use certain frames.

* rolling would be even better with sticky-corner update (if implemented "correctly")

 

For example I rarely use Caliban. His 1st is too weak and it drain too much. 3rd used to not give shield most of the time. 2nd is weak at low strength + lifted status. I don't use Caliban because I don't like his kit. His walking animation has nothing to do with it.

Expand  

Heh, it's the official stats. So there is less than 8% of the playerbase playing those 2 current specific frame with unique walk-animations. And those are also 2 frames out of a roster of well above 50, so uhm they make up for less than 4% of the roster. That's not random numbers, that is how wide a change would impact the game.

No idea why you ramble about Caliban and his kit. How is that relevant? Did this thread suddenly turn into frame rework needs? Uhm... nope.

Those are stats that just show % of usage of certain frame or weapon. It doesn't tell you WHY we are using it. Is it unique walking animation? Or is it unique roll animation? Or is it OP ability(ies)? Or is it some... assets. Or is it cute persona? No such information is shown.

[SneakyErvin]

57 minutes ago, quxier said:

What bugs and OP mechanic you are talking about? I had no issue using Exodia contagion with single jumps. Styanax/4 wasn't more overpowered compared to other abilities.

Bugs as in Styanax interaction with skills during 4. OP mechanic = chain launched contagions. And no lol, you've certainly never had "no issues" using contagion with single jumps. It has always been a double/bullet jump interaction. The only thing that changed on it regarding triggering mechanics is when they added the "aim" interaction. Which was added due to the whole melee rework at the time.

1 hour ago, quxier said:

No, requirement of Exodia contagion were only (any) jump + aimglide attack. You could even attack many times. It was changed A LOT. Only description probably mentioned bullet/double jump (at least according to wiki, I don't remember old text).

Old text didnt include "aim" for a while after the update arrived. Double jump has always been there both before and after aim glide was added.

1 hour ago, quxier said:

Yes, that's example of Exodia contagion with "any jump" requirement.

But that was never a thing. Maybe uhm, read patch notes before claiming things.

1 hour ago, quxier said:

Those are stats that just show % of usage of certain frame or weapon. It doesn't tell you WHY we are using it. Is it unique walking animation? Or is it unique roll animation? Or is it OP ability(ies)? Or is it some... assets. Or is it cute persona? No such information is shown.

But they do tell us why, since the trend of the popular frames is "power", we know that since those frames are powerful in comparison to those seeing less use. So changing something like the walk-animation to an option for those 2 (soon 3) frames would do little to increase their use, and would justify such a change just as poorly.

[quxier]

29 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

1 hour ago, quxier said:

Those are stats that just show % of usage of certain frame or weapon. It doesn't tell you WHY we are using it. Is it unique walking animation? Or is it unique roll animation? Or is it OP ability(ies)? Or is it some... assets. Or is it cute persona? No such information is shown.

So changing something like the walk-animation to an option for those 2 (soon 3) frames would do little to increase their use, and would justify such a change just as poorly.

What about changing walking and rolling animations of 50+ frames?

29 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

1 hour ago, quxier said:

What bugs and OP mechanic you are talking about? I had no issue using Exodia contagion with single jumps. Styanax/4 wasn't more overpowered compared to other abilities.

Bugs as in Styanax interaction with skills during 4. OP mechanic = chain launched contagions. And no lol, you've certainly never had "no issues" using contagion with single jumps. It has always been a double/bullet jump interaction. The only thing that changed on it regarding triggering mechanics is when they added the "aim" interaction. Which was added due to the whole melee rework at the time.

1 hour ago, quxier said:

No, requirement of Exodia contagion were only (any) jump + aimglide attack. You could even attack many times. It was changed A LOT. Only description probably mentioned bullet/double jump (at least according to wiki, I don't remember old text).

Old text didnt include "aim" for a while after the update arrived. Double jump has always been there both before and after aim glide was added.

1 hour ago, quxier said:

Yes, that's example of Exodia contagion with "any jump" requirement.

But that was never a thing. Maybe uhm, read patch notes before claiming things.

I was going to answer to all of those points but that would end when one of us get tired. So I won't do this.

My point is that they sometimes waste time on something that doesn't need to be changed. I bet you can find something like this. Like "why they bother changing X, no one use it or it's worse" kind of thing. So if there are stuff like this then they can use it on something that at least few people want. Would they do this? It's their choice based on their "pros & cons" of that.

Edited March 17 by quxier

[Circle_of_Psi]

7 hours ago, CephalonCarnage said:

If that was the case, why did they make Helminth to swap abilities from one to another.

That's cuz they don't allow powers that are not unique to the frame or their theme, that's why.

[SneakyErvin]

21 hours ago, quxier said:

What about changing walking and rolling animations of 50+ frames?

Why should they? Like I said I really do not support killing the uniqueness of the current 2 and soon 3 frames by bringing their animations to the whole roster.

21 hours ago, quxier said:

I was going to answer to all of those points but that would end when one of us get tired. So I won't do this.

My point is that they sometimes waste time on something that doesn't need to be changed. I bet you can find something like this. Like "why they bother changing X, no one use it or it's worse" kind of thing. So if there are stuff like this then they can use it on something that at least few people want. Would they do this? It's their choice based on their "pros & cons" of that.

No need to argue when there are readily available patch notes that state exactly what has changed. And regarding Styanax, you have all the right in the world to not like that a bug was fixed, but that doesnt make it less of a bug in the first place.

DE decides if something needs a change, and I honestly cant find anything that has been a waste of time in that regard. There is also a difference between trying to maintain some small form of balance and adding something like requested here. I dont think people really grasp the work needed to make walk animations universal and interchangable. While currently things line up for floaty Wisp it might not be the case for a walking Wisp, or if floaty Wisp walking becomes available to every other frame. They'd need to go through each and every one of them to catch all potential clipping issues, not only for the frame, but for every single attachment and syandana etc. aswell since they suddenly fit a whole new movement pattern on that individual frame. And every frame currently has seperate rigging to fit them specifically to avoid clipping issues for attachments and syandanas etc.

[quxier]

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

23 hours ago, quxier said:

What about changing walking and rolling animations of 50+ frames?

Why should they? Like I said I really do not support killing the uniqueness of the current 2 and soon 3 frames by bringing their animations to the whole roster.

I was not talking about uniqueness. I meant that it would be worth the effort if we could change those animations (and more) for 50+ frames. It might not be huge usage but it would be more than 2-3 frames. Well, at lest it would be more worth than doing it for 2-3 frames.

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

I dont think people really grasp the work needed to make walk animations universal and interchangable. While currently things line up for floaty Wisp it might not be the case for a walking Wisp, or if floaty Wisp walking becomes available to every other frame. They'd need to go through each and every one of them to catch all potential clipping issues, not only for the frame, but for every single attachment and syandana etc. aswell since they suddenly fit a whole new movement pattern on that individual frame. And every frame currently has seperate rigging to fit them specifically to avoid clipping issues for attachments and syandanas etc.

That's valid but different issue. We may think it's hard but it may be easy or vice versa.

[SneakyErvin]

21 hours ago, quxier said:

I was not talking about uniqueness. I meant that it would be worth the effort if we could change those animations (and more) for 50+ frames. It might not be huge usage but it would be more than 2-3 frames. Well, at lest it would be more worth than doing it for 2-3 frames.

No but I am, which is the biggest reason why I say no to the idea. Spending time on 50+ frame instead of 2 is not an improvement to change my opinion on that. I also dont see how you think it would be more worth it than 2-3 frames since it is about each frame changed compared to how many play it.

21 hours ago, quxier said:

That's valid but different issue. We may think it's hard but it may be easy or vice versa.

How is it a different issue when it is part of the process for what you want to see? Also, it isnt about thinking it is hard, it is about looking at the game and seeing how often new frames and skins end up with clipping and placement issues for a multitude of attachments. A tigh on a frame or skin might be slightly thicker than an earlier one, resulting in an older attachment suddenly clipping through since they didnt really check for that specific interaction. That's a while lot of attachments to go through one more time for each and every frame just to open up different running animations for them.

Also, how should they treat Wisp that has no feet? It would look like animation amateur hour to allow her running regularly. I can also see the utter mess in having to rework any frame with a skirt/kilt/coat/tabard to work with Wisp's movement. And if they cant bother to make skill animations for Yareli while on Merulina so she can properly use Helminth I see zero justification to add custom movement animations elsewhere. On a list of 1000 priorities those animations would end up at spot 23467.

[quxier]

47 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

22 hours ago, quxier said:

I was not talking about uniqueness. I meant that it would be worth the effort if we could change those animations (and more) for 50+ frames. It might not be huge usage but it would be more than 2-3 frames. Well, at lest it would be more worth than doing it for 2-3 frames.

 Spending time on 50+ frame instead of 2 is not an improvement to change my opinion on that. I also dont see how you think it would be more worth it than 2-3 frames since it is about each frame changed compared to how many play it.

Maybe you don't need spend time on most frames but just subset. Let's say you spend time 20% of frames (~10) while getting all frames work. Comparing it to changing just 2-3 frames and working on those 2-3 frames, it makes big difference.

54 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

And if they cant bother to make skill animations for Yareli while on Merulina so she can properly use Helminth I see zero justification to add custom movement animations elsewhere. On a list of 1000 priorities those animations would end up at spot 23467.

Yareli is just one frame. It makes sense that they don't want to spend too much time on one frame.

Animations, on other hand, would be usable for all frames (or most). You can even monetize them. They are already doing that with idle animations.

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

Also, how should they treat Wisp that has no feet? It would look like animation amateur hour to allow her running regularly. I can also see the utter mess in having to rework any frame with a skirt/kilt/coat/tabard to work with Wisp's movement.

Wisp having no feet? Pfft! Zariman has an answer. Shoes. Everyone can get 1 shoe (not pair!) when leveling up.

If it takes 1 hour of amateur then it can take much less time for pros. And not everything has to be perfect. I would rather have not perfect (bug good enough) stuff than not have them at all.

[SneakyErvin]

20 minutes ago, quxier said:

Maybe you don't need spend time on most frames but just subset. Let's say you spend time 20% of frames (~10) while getting all frames work. Comparing it to changing just 2-3 frames and working on those 2-3 frames, it makes big difference.

They'd still have to make sure every frame is checked so they actually do work properly. They wouldnt know which 20% to change without checking them all first. There are just too many specific quirks between the frames and skins.

20 minutes ago, quxier said:

Yareli is just one frame. It makes sense that they don't want to spend too much time on one frame.

Animations, on other hand, would be usable for all frames (or most). You can even monetize them. They are already doing that with idle animations.

Yareli changes would have actual gameplay impact, while custom animations would be nothing but fluff while also removing uniqueness from a very few select portion of the roster.

20 minutes ago, quxier said:

Wisp having no feet? Pfft! Zariman has an answer. Shoes. Everyone can get 1 shoe (not pair!) when leveling up.

If it takes 1 hour of amateur then it can take much less time for pros. And not everything has to be perfect. I would rather have not perfect (bug good enough) stuff than not have them at all.

That would then involve even more work, since they'd now also need to create a whole new Wisp skin variant of every Wisp skin.

No... that isnt what that means. It means it would look like S#&$. Things being done sloppy just reflect poorly on those that do it, so if they should do it, they should aim for perfection as much as they can, meaning they'd have to go through all the roster and all attachments. Otherwise it would just be amateur hour and reflect poorly on DE as designers, while likely also not living up to the pride of the actual designers that do it if they are gonna do it half assed.

edit: For instance I would personally not do it if the option was half assed or not at all. Since if I am to do something, I will do it well, otherwise I might just aswell not bother. Since the end result reflects on me. And what kind of message is it to send others when you settle with a half assed outcome?

 

Edited March 19 by SneakyErvin

[Circle_of_Psi]

3 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

Also, how should they treat Wisp that has no feet? 

Wisp does have feet, at least..her Prime does

 

The one thing that does bug me about floaty people like Wisp and Titna is that they don't float during the use of meele, but I can porb understand why. porb be a headache to try and animate 

[(XBOX)DragonMan 2700]

On 2024-03-14 at 11:40 PM, Qorvex99 said:

even Wisp's movement animation feels over the top and exaggerated.

Bite thy tongue! sir or madame, we do not speak of the booty queen in such a manner  hmp. -_- 

 

Also, there's nothing wrong with Dante have swig-Gitty swagger. 

[PublikDomain]

It always amazes me the lengths some people will go through just so they can say "no" to everything anyone that isn't them suggests.

Being able to choose custom movement animation sets is a widely-requested feature that has been widely-requested since there have been custom movement animation sets. And it's such an obvious addition that would be a win for everyone involved: not only could people match their chosen custom idle animation sets that we've had for 10 #*!%in' years to the many custom movement animation sets that have already been made, DE can sell them just like they've sold custom idle animation sets for 10 #*!%in' years. And yet certain dingleberries will still get all grumpy at the mere thought of continuing a type of customization we've had for 10 #*!%in' years.

Don't like other people expressing themselves how they like? Too bad.

[CephalonCarnage]

On 2024-03-17 at 6:16 PM, Circle_of_Psi said:

That's cuz they don't allow powers that are not unique to the frame or their theme, that's why.

Gloom is pretty unique, and themed to the original frame and yet can be used on others. Fire walker is pretty unique and themed too. 2 off the top of my head for you.

[Circle_of_Psi]

34 minutes ago, CephalonCarnage said:

Gloom is pretty unique, and themed to the original frame and yet can be used on others. Fire walker is pretty unique and themed too. 2 off the top of my head for you.

Some powers are a bit questionable as to why they were granted the helminth slot, but I think powers like Gloom still fall under common/similar abilities like stun, sleep, healing or some form of high damage.

 

But eh 🤷‍♂️

[SneakyErvin]

18 hours ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

Wisp does have feet, at least..her Prime does

 

The one thing that does bug me about floaty people like Wisp and Titna is that they don't float during the use of meele, but I can porb understand why. porb be a headache to try and animate 

I guess those could be considered feet to some degree. The problem still remains for her normal skin and every other, which would need to be remade to have things she could actually walk on and not just stumps.

And yeah melee on those frames also bug me, though less with Titania since she has real feet feet. With Wisp I think of the Vikings interpretation of Ivar the Boneless, just with bewbs and assets.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

In the end it doesn't matter, this is not going to happen.  If in year 1 of the game when the developers followed almost everything players asked for and they didn't make these changes at that time, don't expect them to make them now.

[Aruquae]

10 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

It always amazes me the lengths some people will go through just so they can say "no" to everything anyone that isn't them suggests.

Being able to choose custom movement animation sets is a widely-requested feature that has been widely-requested since there have been custom movement animation sets. And it's such an obvious addition that would be a win for everyone involved: not only could people match their chosen custom idle animation sets that we've had for 10 #*!%in' years to the many custom movement animation sets that have already been made, DE can sell them just like they've sold custom idle animation sets for 10 #*!%in' years. And yet certain dingleberries will still get all grumpy at the mere thought of continuing a type of customization we've had for 10 #*!%in' years.

Don't like other people expressing themselves how they like? Too bad.

This seems targeted to certain tenno’s in this thread

Not exposing you guys, you know who you are

[PublikDomain]

3 hours ago, Aruquae said:

This seems targeted to certain tenno’s in this thread

Not exposing you guys, you know who you are

There's the usual crowd, sure, but unfortunately it's a shockingly common mindset around here.

4 hours ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

In the end it doesn't matter, this is not going to happen.  If in year 1 of the game when the developers followed almost everything players asked for and they didn't make these changes at that time, don't expect them to make them now.

He says, about a developer who constantly says they "never say never". I'm sure at one point in time separate Syandana and armor colors was never going to happen. Custom melee holster positions were never going to happen. Separate material channels was never going to happen. Many of these kinds of things were never going to happen. And guess what we have anyways? If you asked just a few weeks ago about customizable invisibility effects I'm sure many of you would say the exact same "it doesn't matter, this is not going to happen" too. And guess what's coming next week?

This "never gonna happen" mindset is just historically wrong. Players request features all the time, and DE adds these features all the time. Here, here's a great video (that none of you will watch) about the many ways DE has made these kinds of requested changes:

Quote

Ain't any different here.