Jade is making me and a lot of other people uncomfortable

[Digital_Malz]

14 hours ago, _Anise_ said:

It's a slippery slope. Hypothetically, if they were to introduce a non-pregnant Jade, I'd also like to see a slender Grendel and Hildryn, maybe even a female Ash, Umbra, Nezha, Nekros, and Wukong. But as you've mentioned yourself (or someone did) there's a need to draw a line somewhere. should that line really be based on personal dislikes or phobias, rather than being left to DE's digression?

To be honest, I might be more receptive to the idea of a "gene masking" kit for Warframes. it could address all phobias by masking any theme to be something else, preserving the core essence of each frame. it's different to changing how the core of a frame looks. though I don't think that would be a popular suggestion among players either.

  

I don't want other people having a toggle to change how I look! which is what I take away from the Hogwarts arachnophobia bit

You’re so small and selfish in your comment. 
How many times have you seen a frame causing such discomfort?

Solutions arise from necessity. If the forum were flooded by players admitting how bad they feel about Grendel’s body, it would be expected that DE addressed the topic somehow.

Now it’s the first time a significant number of active forum members express discomfort. But you think they’re just overreacting and being childish, because you’re too arrogant and selfish to put yourself into somebody else’s shoes. And just because you don’t care, you minimize their pain. How would a toggle on/off would affect you? Guess what, big boy? I play with Gore OFF. Does it offend you? Does it affect your gameplay?

I AM NOT DISTURBED BY JADES CONDITION. But I have seen a significant amount of players not only here that feel uncomfortable. A significant number of people that make me put aside my “I don’t mind about it point of view” and consider: “would a toggle on/off button ruin my game”?

I just feel sad for the absolute lack of humanity of some.

Edited Wednesday at 11:24 AM by Digital_Malz

[Slayer-.]

On 2024-07-02 at 1:18 AM, Akuarius said:

Dude, don't ever play Wolfenstein 2 then.

Or Borderlands, or Soldier of Fortune many more I can't think of presently.

 

 

[etherealwing]

5 hours ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

Well, it doesn't matter if people find it uncomfortable or not, this is something that DE will not change since it is an artistic design that they decided to give to one of their Warframes, if you find it uncomfortable it is not something they should fix since this is A subjective opinion, I don't like warframes that are too "sexy" but that doesn't mean they have to change Wisp's ass.

I don't care whether they change it or not, and you and others don't need to reply to a "this is weird" comment with "WELL THEY AREN'T CHANGING IT". I don't care. And the other thing isn't remotely related to the concept of pregnancy. You may remain ignorant on why this is weird. On the UNRELATED topic, sex sells, always has, and this has been a rating of M, which indicates that kind of content or violence, and let's be real, the team wanted both.On the first topic though, even in R rated films, having ally or enemy moving around while pregnant is weird, and not a good kind of weird. Your second half of comment is irrelevant to the topic, and I don't care for people that dodge the point with "well this". That isn't the point, and whether they change it or not is irrelevant, this was a weird move on their part, and not a good weird.

[Thanatos9t]

2 hours ago, Slayer-. said:

Or Borderlands, or Soldier of Fortune many more I can't think of presently.

 

 

Survival horror game 'Amnesia: Rebirth' also has a pregnant player character.

[RichardKam]

6小时前 , Digital_Malz 说:

You’re so small and selfish in your comment. 
How many times have you seen a frame causing such discomfort?

Solutions arise from necessity. If the forum were flooded by players admitting how bad they feel about Grendel’s body, it would be expected that DE addressed the topic somehow.

Now it’s the first time a significant number of active forum members express discomfort. But you think they’re just overreacting and being childish, because you’re too arrogant and selfish to put yourself into somebody else’s shoes. And just because you don’t care, you minimize their pain. How would a toggle on/off would affect you? Guess what, big boy? I play with Gore OFF. Does it offend you? Does it affect your gameplay?

I AM NOT DISTURBED BY JADES CONDITION. But I have seen a significant amount of players not only here that feel uncomfortable. A significant number of people that make me out aside my “I don’t mind about it point of view” and consider: “would a toggle on/off button ruin my game”?

I just feel sad for the absolute lack of humanity of some.

"Personal feeling" was seldom a sufficient justification for change.

This game is not democracy, and mob tactics never work.

Ammo and AoE change/nerf caused a much more widespread discomfort and made people very uncomfortable. We even had steam negative review bomb. What happened then? Absolutely nothing.

It is OK to make demand. No one cares anyway. I can also demand Ridley Scott to release an alternative version of Alien Romulus because xenomorph made me uncomfortable so why not replace every one of them with grizzly bear so I can enjoy it to the fullest? Same thing.

[Digital_Malz]

2 hours ago, RichardKam said:

"Personal feeling" was seldom a sufficient justification for change.

This game is not democracy, and mob tactics never work.

Ammo and AoE change/nerf caused a much more widespread discomfort and made people very uncomfortable. We even had steam negative review bomb. What happened then? Absolutely nothing.

It is OK to make demand. No one cares anyway. I can also demand Ridley Scott to release an alternative version of Alien Romulus because xenomorph made me uncomfortable so why not replace every one of them with grizzly bear so I can enjoy it to the fullest? Same thing.

You really don’t understand the concept of empathy. And what you said just proves that you’re an uncaring and selfish person.

Compare the feeling caused by a delicate topic which was subject to a disclaimer before the beginning of a mission to changes in Ammo and AoE. 

To mistake dissatisfaction for discomfort. I felt dissatisfied with nerfs to Dante. But it has never caused me discomfort. If you can’t differentiate one thing from another. It’s not even healthy to continue debating with you.

Maybe you should really send Ridley Scott some mails.

Edited Wednesday at 12:41 PM by Digital_Malz

[_Anise_]

7 hours ago, Digital_Malz said:

.

you need to slow down breath and read what you quoted,

I suggested an alternative skin option instead of a toggle

I suggested this skin work on all warframes to cover other phobias not just this one.

I added that I think DE likely won't do it (because I have doubts this is a big enough issue for them to care)

I finished by saying I believe a toggle shouldn't effect other players because personally choices shouldn't be overridden by others.

 

[Slayer-.]

4 hours ago, Thanatos9t said:

Survival horror game 'Amnesia: Rebirth' also has a pregnant player character.

Wouldn't know I never played it, it gets around must be something in the water. 

[Ikishoten]

How will a toggle even help when players with certain phobias will still encounter other players playing those frames without the toggle on?

[Digital_Malz]

14 minutes ago, Ikishoten said:

How will a toggle even help when players with certain phobias will still encounter other players playing those frames without the toggle on?

When I toggle off GORE in my options, it’s not just my Warframe’s attacks that are affected. 🤔

[Ikishoten]

2 minutes ago, Digital_Malz said:

When I toggle off GORE in my options, it’s not just my Warframe’s attacks that are affected. 🤔

Sure, but how many different toggles will they have to create? For every phobia there is?

[RichardKam]

15分钟前 , Digital_Malz 说:

You really don’t understand the concept of empathy. And what you said just proves that you’re an uncaring and selfish people.

Compare the feeling caused by a delicate topic which was subject to a disclaimer before the beginning of a mission to changes in Ammo and AoE. 

To mistake dissatisfaction for discomfort. I felt dissatisfied with nerfs to Dante. But it has never caused me discomfort. If you can’t differentiate one thing from another. It’s not even healthy to continue debating with you.

Maybe you should really send Ridley Scott some mails.

That is the problem. You expect people with empathy will side with you. And when they don't, they must be selfish and uncaring.

No. Everyone has empathy, but most of the time it is limited. I sympathise with a lot of people. "Uncomfortable with a fictional character" is just not one of them.

My advise to you is that not everyone in this world care about your feeling. I am merely stating the fact that asking for things like toggle will almost never work. If it does work, great, congrat. If it does not, well, anyway.

[Digital_Malz]

1 minute ago, Ikishoten said:

Sure, but how many different toggles will they have to create? For every phobia there is?

My friend, solutions are found for problems that have arised.

Have you ever seen such a commotion before?

If THIS case has caused all this commotion, let’s debate and find a solution for THIS case, right?

If in the future another particular case triggers another particular reaction, then that case will be addressed.

It’s way counter productive arguments like: “Ohh, but Grendel is obese!”. Yeah, and it seems his design has not caused enough distress to be addressed. The same for others.

[_Anise_]

4 minutes ago, Digital_Malz said:

It’s way counter productive arguments like: “Ohh, but Grendel is obese!”. Yeah, and it seems his design has not caused enough distress to be addressed. The same for others.

has not caused enough distress to you, just like jade has caused no distress to me, like what kam says about empathy you expect it, but it seems like you don't have the same inclination to give it?

  

4 minutes ago, Digital_Malz said:

Have you ever seen such a commotion before?

yes, bigger concerns have been ignored, it's always a vocal minority

Edited Wednesday at 12:07 PM by _Anise_

[Xylena_Lazarow]

9 hours ago, (XBOX)Omega399 said:

I mean, since she was announced they were pushing that her themes would be focusing heavily on the dichotomy of life and death in everything from her design to her relationship with The Stalker; the Biblically Accurate Angel stuff was always really just an extension of that, not really the focus of it.

Yeah I know what they were going for. I'm confused why they thought it was a good idea.

[Digital_Malz]

32 minutes ago, _Anise_ said:

has not caused enough distress to you, just like jade has caused no distress to me, like what kam says about empathy you expect it, but it seems like you don't have the same inclination to give it?

  

yes, bigger concerns have been ignored, it's always a vocal minority

You know, Jade has caused to distress on me. I really don't feel any discomfort about her design. But when I see so many players expressing discomfort about something that is not a simple mechanic, I feel that something is really not going well. And, in fact, it saddens me that we are all here arguing and sometimes even losing temper (I know I can be very hot headed sometimes), while those cowards at DE have been monitoring this forum for two weeks, have seen the psychological distress and schism they have created while they just sat their ***** down and pretend it's not their business.

TWO weeks is enough time for them to come public and say: WE HAVE SEEN HOW MUCH DISTRESS JADE'S CONDITION HAVE CAUSED, AND WE WON'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT. MOVE ON WITH YOUr LIVES.

Yes. I totally agree with you. Big concerns have been ignored. We have Dante as our last controversial point which was totally ignored. All that commotion created because of LoS implementation. But do you agree that discussing dissatisfaction with mechanics is not the same as discussing psychological distress caused by one very delicate topic such as pregnancy and parenthood?

Yes, when someone up there compares this to the commotion around AoE and Ammo nerf, it is, for me, a total lack of empathy. Empathy can be defined as the ability to understand and share the feelings of another. It seems a good number of players have already manifested how uncomfortable they feel. It's such a "minority" as you mentioned, that you bother being here arguing back. And when this "vocal minority" as you minimized express their opinion and ask for something that won't in ANYWAY affect your or my gameplay. Why don't you just side with them and say: ˜Hey, DE, it doesn't affect me, but I see it has affected a lot of players. What can we do about it?"

 

Edited Wednesday at 12:37 PM by Digital_Malz
corrections

[Digital_Malz]

43 minutes ago, RichardKam said:

That is the problem. You expect people with empathy will side with you. And when they don't, they must be selfish and uncaring.

No. Everyone has empathy, but most of the time it is limited. I sympathise with a lot of people. "Uncomfortable with a fictional character" is just not one of them.

My advise to you is that not everyone in this world care about your feeling. I am merely stating the fact that asking for things like toggle will almost never work. If it does work, great, congrat. If it does not, well, anyway.

If you don't care. Why do you bother being here showing how much you don't care? If you don't care, great. But why working against a genuine request? You don't need to be here showing how much you don't care about other peoples feelings. You won't see me in topics that I do not care about. People are asking for a solution that won't affect YOUR gameplay in anyway. A dang toggle on/off button. I play with GORE OFF and you will never know that, and it will never affect your gameplay. So why do you bother? If you don't, and you're not willing to side with these people, at least don't work against them. 

[(PSN)Frost_Nephilim]

On 2024-06-21 at 6:04 AM, (XBOX)Shodian said:

My brain doesn't do this because it knows it's a game.

Nah tho, most people do connect it to reality. I remember a call of duty game having a mission where you killed innocent people for the sake of the story, and a lot of people didnt like it. Game's and Movies have potential to appeal to peoples real life emotions and feelings making people cry, laugh, and even feel disgust. Its a well known effect

Its abnormal to be able to disconnect your emotions from it, no matter if it is just a game or movie. Unless said movie or game is just that bad at story telling and visual art.

[SneakyErvin]

20 hours ago, SirKeksalot said:

Said it before, I'll say it again: where are people talking about those phobias? Jade has gotten people to say something here and now. We know, for a fact, that people exist who have that reaction to Jade because they've said as much. That's why we're having this discussion. Your hypotheticals don't matter because nobody's said anything. We can't talk about what to do with criticisms nobody has openly made.

What does it matter if those phobias are talked about or not? It just means this minority is louder, nothing more. Since the other phobias are just as "widespread" as this one, or more.

19 hours ago, Sirihitti said:

Am I understanding correctly, there is no such topic where you can say “hmm, perhaps we have gone too far, and it would be worth drawing a line here”?
Of all the creepiest things for me in WF over 5 years of playing, I remember only two cases - holes in Wisp’s legs (I just tried not to look at it) and the dizzying animation of invisibility on Ivar Prime, which caused physical motion sickness.
Jade's concept surpassed everything. Many write that in teasers and the general presentation she was imagined as an angel, a beautiful epic feminine character. The result is a character with a painful experience to whom we cannot be indifferent. You can sympathize with her lore and tragedy, and the players going through this quest experienced everything together with the Stalker. But by leaving Jade in this permanent state, it’s as if we didn’t complete something, didn’t resolve the global storyline.
Telling players that they don’t like it means they themselves are to blame and this is their problem - this is a little tyranny.
You don’t argue solely for the love of arguing, do you?

No, of course there is a "too far". But if that line to you and others is a pregnant looking (not actually pregnant) frame, then we were well beyond that line the moment the tenno were introduced into the picture. Because well, if you think seeing a pregnant look is more worrying than controlling child soldiers in control of subdued living WMDs I'm not sure what goes on in your "moral" mind. Her teasers have always also shown a more morbid angel (not the guys from the band) than some run of the mill modern christian crap. Also a big "lol" regarding that comment, since does that mean you dont find pregnant women feminine or beautiful? 

And she is not "in this permanent state". She is not pregnant, her belly is not a result of a pregnancy to begin with, her belly, or well her jade light mote chamber, gave her the possibility to carry a fetus for thousands of years before finally having it drain her and kill her as it was born. There is no child at all in her belly post quest (we can visually see that), it is just the chamber it was intended to be, just as those things you escort through the mission that are larger versions of her chamber. If she was pregnant with that size of her "belly" post quest the child would have been visible aswell. But all there is inside is the jade light energy and motes.

Her being pregnant as you play her is nothing but headcanon and not actual canon.

17 hours ago, WanderingJoe said:

Just had this interaction on the Warframe Discord. there are plenty of people who dont use the forums who are having the same issues.

That is just another player that didnt get the quest. Since the person claims they play AS a pregnant Jade. When she isnt at the point we actually play her. Her belly isnt some odd thing there due to the baby, the baby is there due to her belly allowing her to carry it over all those years. It's as if people run through ascension with blind folds if they cant see the similarities between Jade's chamber and those that they escort. Her's is a miniature version of those we escort.

Kinda hilarious that people make up headcanon that triggers their own phobias when the actual canon is pretty clear.

 

[(PSN)Frost_Nephilim]

9 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Kinda hilarious that people make up headcanon that triggers their own phobias when the actual canon is pretty clear.

 

I dont understand what the actual defense/objective is here, are you saying that you like playing as frame with a weird belly, so much so that it would pain you to see it removed?

Or are you just venting about the fact that people have potential to be bothered by similarities between 2 things? Its not that abnormal or weird, it affects humans just as it does animals. Its just how most people's minds are wired up... 

Kudos to you for not experiencing the same discomfort, must be pleasant truly, but most others do. So why do you fight to keep said feature?

[Slayer-.]

31 minutes ago, (PSN)Frost_Nephilim said:

Nah tho, most people do connect it to reality. I remember a call of duty game having a mission where you killed innocent people for the sake of the story, and a lot of people didnt like it. Game's and Movies have potential to appeal to peoples real life emotions and feelings making people cry, laugh, and even feel disgust. Its a well known effect

Its abnormal to be able to disconnect your emotions from it, no matter if it is just a game or movie. Unless said movie or game is just that bad at story telling and visual art.

That was the airport mission that you had to blend in with the Russians doing the airport massacre. 

[Venus-Venera]

vor 20 Minuten schrieb (PSN)Frost_Nephilim:

I dont understand what the actual defense/objective is here, are you saying that you like playing as frame with a weird belly, so much so that it would pain you to see it removed?

Or are you just venting about the fact that people have potential to be bothered by similarities between 2 things? Its not that abnormal or weird, it affects humans just as it does animals. Its just how most people's minds are wired up... 

Kudos to you for not experiencing the same discomfort, must be pleasant truly, but most others do. So why do you fight to keep said feature?

not every author is a gamer, so in theory it could also be a chat gpt bot or a company employee. In theory, of course.
and nothing was done since the update release. there is also no official feedback, although it is obvious that a lot of people are unhappy with it and have very terrible emotions when playing...
so I assume that public opinion is being manipulated intentionally with lying and reprehensible measures.

Edited Wednesday at 02:13 PM by Venus-Venera

[(XBOX)Omega399]

26 minutes ago, Xylena_Lazarow said:

Yeah I know what they were going for. I'm confused why they thought it was a good idea.

Well, the first thing that comes to mind is how an angel of death itself being a bringer of life is a poetic irony, as well as a unique idea thats not really seen in media often, giving her an extra dash of originality you just don't see in other angel-themed characters.

[SneakyErvin]

27 minutes ago, (PSN)Frost_Nephilim said:

I dont understand what the actual defense/objective is here, are you saying that you like playing as frame with a weird belly, so much so that it would pain you to see it removed?

Or are you just venting about the fact that people have potential to be bothered by similarities between 2 things? Its not that abnormal or weird, it affects humans just as it does animals. Its just how most people's minds are wired up... 

Kudos to you for not experiencing the same discomfort, must be pleasant truly, but most others do. So why do you fight to keep said feature?

Read what you quoted again.

People are complaining about playing as a pregnant frame. That is what I mean by headcanon. They make up the issue that they have with the frame all on their own, since the thing they claim isnt part of the game. She isnt pregnant at any point when we play her. Yet people try to claim it to support their opinion. The visuals of her are never seen as you play her either. You never visually see her belly unless you specifically want to customize it in the arsenal to begin with. And when you do that, you also see there is no baby at all inside it.

Then while playing her, you never ever see it, since when you are in her 4th form you cannot turn the camera to look at here, because she is in a combat state, so only viewable from behind. And outside of that form and the Glory arsenal she looks like she is wearing some renaissance court dress.

[(XBOX)Spiderwick3666]

2 hours ago, Digital_Malz said:

My friend, solutions are found for problems that have arised.

Have you ever seen such a commotion before?

If THIS case has caused all this commotion, let’s debate and find a solution for THIS case, right?

If in the future another particular case triggers another particular reaction, then that case will be addressed.

It’s way counter productive arguments like: “Ohh, but Grendel is obese!”. Yeah, and it seems his design has not caused enough distress to be addressed. The same for others.

Hey! Grendel isn't obese he's big boned. Not cool dude