vaugahn Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Toxicity exists in all things, as does kindness. The more popular something is, the larger variety of people that something will have. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 The conclaves feedback forum is just as respectful as any other on here, and you get jerks in every game mode. That's both true and not saying much all at once. Saying that every person who plays PvP is rude... Since I didn't say that... Why are you addressing me with it? ...or that just putting PvP into your game will "attract" immature players is ridiculous. You seriously need to improve your reading comprehension... Can you say that the community it will attract will be entirely respectful and mature? No? Me neither... Which is, literally, what I said. Any game where people interact anonymously is going to have rude people. Just go look at region and trading. I completely agree with you. But I never said PvP players, as a whole, are rude... I'd be lumping myself in to that pile then. I said PvE players might have cause to suspect the types of players PvP will attract as a source of complaint in response to potential worries. Given the communities of many F2P competitive shooters, that's not unfounded. Given what I have observed in our own conclave community, I would say I'm on the right track. You folks are asking about why the pushback from PvE players, I'm giving you a potential reason. Take it into consideration or dismiss the notion altogether... I don't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoGicMoTion Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 You want PVP k well here is what you will need DEFAULT LOADOUTS: Loadout 1: Braton Lato Skana Loadout 2: Burston Lex scindo Loadout 3: grataka aklata amphis These loadouts will have no mods or anything which will cause pvp to be skill entirely. P.S im totally against PVP in this game it should have never been added in the first place. Should have stayed in the dojo dueling arena where it belonged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaugahn Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 I said PvE players might have cause to suspect the types of players PvP will attract as a source of complaint in response to potential worries. Given the communities of many F2P competitive shooters, that's not unfounded. Given what I have observed in our own conclave community, I would say I'm on the right track. Even if it did attract rude players, I don't think a one-off mode in a primarily PvE game would attract PvP players in a sufficient amount to cause any sort of demographic change in the warframe community, which judging from your responses is already quite rude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion-Shields Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 This intelligent, enterprising community makes me proud to be a part of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion-Shields Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 (edited) . Edited July 1, 2014 by Legion-Shields Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion-Shields Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Your use of that meme is bad and you should feel bad.quick, somebody point out how ironic it is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noabettiet Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 I don't care. If this will make PVP lovers mad then it's a good thing They are part of the community though, soon enough you'd expect for any kind attitude to downgrade even further, from both pvp and pve sides of the communities. Forums filled with nerf topics and overall trash-talking. It is really an bad idea like the OP said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSpite Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Possible outcomes: PvP is Awesome: Everyone plays it PvP starts unbalanced: DE keep trying to balance it, with helpful feedback from players willing to keep testing it. PvP is incredibly broken: Everyone goes back to just PvE, and we forget it ever happened. To all the "only PvE or death!" people, please explain which particular outcome above will end up upsetting your ability to play PvE in exactly the same way you do now, because I don't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble_Cactus Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 (edited) I don't care. If this will make PVP lovers mad then it's a good thing What a horrible attitude. "Oh, I want to upset a portion of the people who support and possibly pay for the game that I like to play as well" Buzz off with that crap. This is what the OP is trying to avoid. If the PvE isn't affected in any way by reworking PvP then you have no reason to fart in your corner and waft it towards the rest of us. I am all for retooling certain mods and abilities to work certain ways only in PvP contexts. Other games with popular PvP like WoW have abilities operate differently in PvP situations; Frame skills already work this way but weapons and mods do not. Stuff like Ogris and Penta AoE nullifying cover is what turns me away from Conclave, but if DE sat down with these aspects of the game and worked through them like RexSol did, then I would definitely spend more time in PvP. Edited July 2, 2014 by Noble_Cactus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Redwire Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 It continues to amaze me the amount of people there are who are all "PvP is only good as long as it doesn't affect PvE..." when that is already the case. Rest assured that any and all stats/mechanics/etc changes to PvP WILL NOT AFFECT PVE IN ANY WAY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegetableBasket Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 (edited) Threads like these make me wish DE would nuke the forums. So much toxicity. This post included, I guess. OP, you are completely in the right here. They need to fix things. A lot of them. They are well documented things, they have proposed fixes, but they need to be digested and executed by DE. It's hard to say if anyone at DE cares, or reads the forums, or is aware of these issues. We don't get any feedback when we make suggestions or propose solutions. I've heard rumors that Scott or Glen has spoken with a few players about these issues but that's about it. I doubt PvP will drop balanced, and I doubt we will see anything besides the broken @$$ valkyr builds after a few days. There will not be honor in the dark sectors, and if DE doesn't heed your warning, there won't be any fun, either. Edited July 2, 2014 by VegetableBasket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade343 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I doubt PvP will drop balanced, and I doubt we will see anything besides the broken @$$ valkyr builds after a few days. There will not be honor in the dark sectors, and if DE doesn't heed your warning, there won't be any fun, either. So much for Tenno honour... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Talia. Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 (edited) Tenno Honor have no place on dominating the Dark Sectors... Get ready for Hysteria Valkyrs, Invisible Lokis and Ashs, with Ogris and Pentas, Quick Thinking, Reflex Guard, Reflection, Ability Spammers... etc. No, it's not impossible to have a balanced and fun (YES I SAID IT!) PvP on Warframe. It's actually pretty simple to fix most of the broken stuff. My fear is that DE are not gonna do anything, they will say its fine and release the Dark Sectors PvP anyway. "Forever labeling PVP as doomed which so many players already claim it to be." Like the OP said. >>>> Balance before release and not after and you might just convince people that PVP is a great thing. <<< I wonder if some DE reads the Conclave Feedbacks forums. These problems on PvP have been pointed out so many times, they are all well known issues. Edited July 2, 2014 by RexSol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade343 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Tenno Honor have no place on dominating the Dark Sectors... Get ready for Hysteria Valkyrs, Invisible Lokis and Ashs, with Ogris and Pentas, Quick Thinking, Reflex Guard, Reflection, Ability Spammers... etc. That is probably one of the reasons I gave up on dealing with Dark Sectors... backstabbing, political fights, etc.. Most of us are becoming like the Corpus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Even if it did attract rude players, I don't think a one-off mode in a primarily PvE game would attract PvP players in a sufficient amount to cause any sort of demographic change in the warframe community, which judging from your responses is already quite rude. I'm inclined to agree with you actually. I think the inclusion of this mode will be a really good addition. It's the reception that seems to be the prevalent question. I also think that the PvP Community could take a couple of steps to ease that transition. Get some of the Larger PvP clans and alliance to come together and put on clinics and invitationals. Put some brackets in, offer some reasonable awards, and hype it up. This is one of the few game types where a PvE player stands to lose nothing by trying it out. No ammo, repair or death penalties of any sort exist. Nothing gets dropped on death. The only thing to worry about is dying... Which, funnily enough, is the one thing PvE players aren't really used to doing in mass quantities. In the process you get to dispel some myths, clear up some false rumors, and indoctrinate new opponents. All good things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaugahn Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I also think that the PvP Community could take a couple of steps to ease that transition. Get some of the Larger PvP clans and alliance to come together and put on clinics and invitationals. This. What I'd like from PvP is something completely separate from the main game, something that you could play when you were bored or burnt out. Essentially a minigame, albeit one that LOTS of players seem to have misconceptions about. This would work really well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otaiken Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 (edited) PvP won't work. There's too many possible broken combinations of mods, frames, weapons, etc. You fix one and players will find new one within minutes. This game stands on content.. checking everything against everything and whenever new stuff is released... ugh, not gonna happen. That leveling system they shown during the livestream ain't gonna fix it either. Only way PvP will work is with set classes and loadouts. Not that I care about PvP, but DE is very slow when it comes to balance changes. Too slow for PvP to be even slightly viable.. and if they manage to speed it up enough, well.. in that case they better speed it up for PvE as well. That said.. the drama surrounding Dark Sectors is ridiculous enough already... can't wait to add PvP in the mix. Fun times ahead folks. Edited July 2, 2014 by LocoWithGun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)friedricetheman Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 An alternative would be Solar Rail PvP without any Warframe powers. Strictly weapons only. It would be so much easier to balance it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlchemistMute Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 (edited) Frames also start modless. 1 shot from a slash gun + slash proc = dead warframe If the guns also start modless, a shot from a slash gun + proc would deal.. say, 20 damage total, less than half of that being dealt straight to health. Maybe the stronger guns like.. the Latron could deal more damage with a proc, but only guns like the Ogris and snipers could one-shot unmodded. Edited July 2, 2014 by AlchemistMute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Redwire Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 An alternative would be Solar Rail PvP without any Warframe powers. Strictly weapons only. It would be so much easier to balance it that way. That would basically just make DS PvP a run-of-the-mill 3rd person shooter with flashy costumes. There's no need to water it down so unilaterally. Secondly, guns are just as big of offenders of poor balance as abilities are. The list of broken builds has been said countless time already so I won't even bother reiterating them. You can have functionality AND balance at the same time without immense sacrifices to gameplay. Just because it isn't 'easy' doesn't mean it isn't worth the time and effort to cultivate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sev7n Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 My question is if when ds pvp is realeased and a lot of ppl start flocking to it or think it decides whos "good" at warframe or not; are we gonna start seeing a lot of hackers. Because there hasnt been 1 game i've played that contains pvp without hackers. Cause if this does happen then warframe is gonna be damaged pretty good unless the dev's are gonna be on top of it when it comes to banning and preventing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulzscha Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Moved to the proper section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurpadurpusRex Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 This is a good warning. It is not possible to balance a game that produces 8x its content in a year, however there should be special attention paid balance here as i believe OP has valid base concerns. Upvote. I am for both PVP and PVE. I am thankful to DE ever day that they don't force me to choose just one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatpig84 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 (edited) Actually I prefer DE not to further mess with PVP balance. If players can 1 shot you, so be it. Hell I say leave in 1 shot kills. This actually favour skill because hate it or love it, twitch shooting IS a skill. Even then a bulk of weapons still need to 2 to 3 rounds to kill you, like the Soma. Kinda like good ol CS AK47s. Edited July 2, 2014 by fatpig84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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