Warframe Has Much To Learn From The Original Mass Effect

[DivisionByZero]

Disclaimer: This is a constructive criticism discussion, not a "Mass Effect roxors and Warframe suxxorz" discussion.

If you haven't played the original Mass Effect, please read up on it before posting in this discussion. Mass Effect 2 and 3 are mostly excluded from the comparison (with a few exceptions) because they are vastly different from the original.

This discussion is about how Mass Effect is properly balanced in many ways where Warframe just completely falls flat on its face... and how to fix them.

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Items, Gear, Upgrades, and Scaling.

Mass Effect:

Choose one of every weapon type and one armor. Depending on your character, you can also get items that amplify abilities (one type decreases ability cooldown/healing cooldown while increasing shields, the other type decreases ability cooldown while increasing ability duration and power).

One important factor: Ability amplifiers are a separate gear slot from armor upgrades, which means that you aren't required to sacrifice a health regenerator for reduced ability cooldowns, for example.

Weapons have 2 upgrade slots (one utility upgrade and one ammo upgrade) and armor has only one upgrade slot. Later on, higher-level weapons and armor have one additional upgrade slot.

Upgrades and gear have no rarity tiers, instead, all tiers are separated by character level (1-20 is low tier, 21-40 is mid tier, 41-60 is upper tier). All upgrades in a tier are roughly equal, while some weapons/armor within a tier are superior to others in the same tier.

Gear scaling is also well-balanced, with a max level character and max gear doing perhaps 5-6 times the damage of a level 1 character with noob gear.

There is no leveling of gear or farming for upgrades - instead, gear and upgrades come as you play the game (and at the higher levels you will be flooded with so much gear and upgrades that you might have to toss some of them out).

Warframe:

You get a frame, 2 ranged weapons, 1 melee weapon, plus a Sentinel/Kubrow. Frames require farming (at best) or ridiculously difficult quests (at worst) and require several days to build.

Lower-tier weapons require resources that you likely will not be able to find at lower-level zones. Mid-tier weapons tend to be clan tech (if you have no clan, you're out of luck). Clan tech requires much resources and long waiting times to finish, in addition to the time it takes to build the clan tech gear.

Higher-level gear is either exclusive/semi-exclusive (Baro Ki'Teer or Vandal/Wraith limited editions) or requires massive amounts of farming (Prime gear).

A maximized weapon can do 50-60 times its base damage. This forces the game balance to be fundamentally broken.

While Mass Effect gives you 3 upgrade slots for a weapon and 2 for armor, Warframe gives you 8 upgrade slots (and aura/stance slots). However, Mass Effect does more with a few upgrade slots than Warframe could do with 8 (or 9).

In Warframe, frame durability upgrades are forced to fight with ability amplifier equivalents for space. You're almost required to have some type of defensive upgrade (+shields/health), and if you are relying on shields, you will also need a shield regeneration upgrade. Some ability upgrades (+strength/duration/range) have no effect on some abilities, resulting in fractured, imbalanced, and gimmicky builds. Many rare upgrades are near mandatory due to ever-increasing power creep.

Weapon upgrades suffer from the same "mandatory upgrades" problem. Damage + maxed multishot is a must, taking away 2-3 upgrade slots. The endgame is all about maximum damage per ammo because the ammo system in Warframe is persistently broken and never gets fixed. Ammo upgrades have to fight with utility upgrades for space, and all too often it isn't worth taking more than 2 utility upgrades.

Solution: The gear upgrade system in Warframe is fundamentally broken and imbalanced. Get rid of the limited ammo system or at least overhaul ammo drops. Make non-damage upgrades viable again. Remove or rework underused upgrades. Update frame and weapon crafting and farming so that there is a clear progression from noob tier to top tier instead of the broken mess that currently exists.

--------------

Combat balance and design:

Ammo:

-Warframe: Max damage per ammo, or you just run out of it late-game.

-Mass Effect: No ammo limits. Instead, a meter on the left side of the screen increases with use (and decreases over time). If the meter reaches 100%, the weapon becomes unusable for a few seconds. This means that upgrading for something that isn't max damage per ammo is actually viable.

-Solution: Fix the ammo system. Either scale ammo drops per ammo efficiency, have regenerating ammo reserves, or something. Almost anything would be an improvement over the current ammo system.

Carpal Tunnel Syndrome:

-Warframe: Semi-auto means semi-auto - bind primary fire to the mouse wheel if you want to avoid getting carpal tunnel/repetitive strain injury.

-Mass Effect: Everything continuously fires while you hold down the left mouse button, even if the animations are clearly semi-auto, pump action, or single-action. No carpal tunnel or repetitive strain injury.

-Solution: Add a "continuous fire while mouse button is held down" option. Most normal FPS/TPS games have this already. If Warframe wants to be treated like a normal TPS, let it behave like a normal civilized TPS.

Sprinting:

-Warframe: Sprinting mostly sucks. If you want to move quickly, you have to equip Rush and wall-fling/zorencopter/slide. Sprinting also depletes the green energy bar so you can't sprint after melee fighting.

-Mass Effect: Sprinting has a dedicated energy bar and makes you move perhaps 4 times faster than normal.

-Solution: Increase base Warframe movement speed and make sprinting move at triple/quadruple of normal movement speed.

Health Regeneration and shield-ignoring damage:

-Warframe: Consumables, Life strike, the vast minority of frames, a Syndicate-specific upgrade, Rejuvenation aura, random health orb drops. Shield-ignoring damage is almost everywhere. Also, bleed procs.

-Mass Effect: No bleed procs or other nonsense. Shield-ignoring damage is uncommon and usually occurs as a percent of total damage. One character class has built-in health regeneration, also, there are armor upgrades that regenerate health. Finally, there's always a healing ability that can be used any time that it isn't on cooldown - it consumes items that are readily found in-game and can be restocked at the end of every mission.

-Solution: Have more ways to regenerate health or remove shield-ignoring damage.

Vehicular combat:

-Warframe: Archwing is completely separate from normal mission types. It uses the standard Warframe camera controls, making it difficult to aim at anything above or below. Archwings are also subject to the same horrible upgrade system that frames/weapons are. The right mouse button (aim down sight) doesn't scale to the larger distances in space

-Mass Effect: You get an all-terrain tank. No upgrades or farming, just heavy-duty shields and weapons all ready when it's dropped down from low orbit. Full integration with normal combat - you can freely enter/exit the tank and fight on foot. The all-terrain tank also comes with a larger radar map and 2 aim-down sight settings, making it effective at almost any range.

-Solution: Scale the zooming in based on the nearest enemy in sight.

Accuracy/Projectile Spread:

-Warframe: Fixed sight with no indication of projectile spread whatsoever.

-Mass Effect (and almost every normal FPS/TPS): Center of screen sight indicates projectile spread.

-Solution: Fix it already.

Abilities:

-Warframe: Damage abilities are overpowered at low levels and ineffective at higher levels. -75% cost reduction means that ability costs must be overinflated to avoid imbalances with maxed cost reduction. No normal energy regeneration, you have to find energy orbs (RNG dependent), use consumables, or use your aura upgrade slot for energy siphon.

-Mass Effect: Damage abilities scale up with level and ability amplifiers, keeping them relevant at all time. Most of them also stun or disable enemies in one way or another. No need to minmax cooldown reduction - cooldowns also decrease as you level/gear up. No consumables for abilities (except first aid), no required upgrades to make abilities useful.

-Solution: Just use a regenerating energy or cooldown implementation like in normal games.

Rewards from missions:

-Warframe: Vast majority of rewards are at the end of the mission, encouraging people to just rush through the mission. To add insult to injury, some lockers can't be opened except if you have a specific upgrade that costs 13 energy and takes up a valuable upgrade slot.

-Mass Effect: Most rewards drop from enemies and lockers. You can rush if you want, however you're just missing out on gear and items. There are no unopenable containers - if you are unable to unlock a container, you can always use omni-gel to unlock them.

-Solution: Buff drops from lockers and containers. Get rid of red lockers.

-----------------

Squad and character choices:

Mass Effect: 6 character classes and squad members. You have up to 2 squad members following your character at any time. No farming for character classes, however finishing the game with different character classes unlocks bonus skills that can be applied in the future.

Squad members always equip the gear that you give them and listen to you. They are almost always somewhat competent.

Warframe: Around 20 frames, requiring anything from farming for parts and resources to unreasonable quests or RNG inside RNG inside more RNG. Have up to 4 in a squad, however most of the time they will not listen to you. All too often you could get grouped with undergeared or noob players (or even worse, leechers/griefers). There is no difficulty scaling down for solo.

Solution: Either scale difficulty with number of players or add an option for squadmate NPCs that isn't a consumable.

[ikitclaw]

Prepare for flame. 

 

Also it isnt very good to compare two games that have only the genre in common.

[egregiousRac]

Mostly good points. There are only two that I disagree with:

 

Sprinting:
-Warframe: Sprinting mostly sucks. If you want to move quickly, you have to equip Rush and wall-fling/zorencopter/slide. Sprinting also depletes the green energy bar so you can't sprint after melee fighting.
-Mass Effect: Sprinting has a dedicated energy bar and makes you move perhaps 4 times faster than normal.
-Solution: Increase base Warframe movement speed and make sprinting move at triple/quadruple of normal movement speed.

 

The base move speed of Warframe is already far faster than Mass Effect, and the speed multiplier from sprinting is also higher. The only reason that the speed multiplier seems high in ME is because it changes FOV significantly to give a greater impression of speed.

 

Sprinting in WF wouldn't feel so slow if coptering, flipping, and the like didn't exist. It is only slow in comparison to bugs that have been embraced as features.

 

 

Carpal Tunnel Syndrome:
-Warframe: Semi-auto means semi-auto - bind primary fire to the mouse wheel if you want to avoid getting carpal tunnel/repetitive strain injury.
-Mass Effect: Everything continuously fires while you hold down the left mouse button, even if the animations are clearly semi-auto, pump action, or single-action. No carpal tunnel or repetitive strain injury.
-Solution: Add a "continuous fire while mouse button is held down" option. Most normal FPS/TPS games have this already. If Warframe wants to be treated like a normal TPS, let it behave like a normal civilized TPS.

 

The issue with this is that it excludes weapons that fire as fast as you can pull the trigger from being able to exist. This would be a massive nerf to weapons such as the Detron and Boltos, and would make every semi-auto feel like the Attica used to (which felt awful because it was an automatic with a stupidly low firing rate).

Edited April 15, 2015 by egregiousRac

[DivisionByZero]

Prepare for flame.

Unconstructive.

Also it isnt very good to compare two games that have only the genre in common.

Actually it is and it happens all the time. Games in the same genre SHOULD be compared to each other. What are you expecting, that games should be compared to games in other genres or never be compared at all?

tl;dr; I should go. All of the points I mentioned are valid, yet the Citadel Council, oops, I meant the Warframe community is prejudiced and refuses to listen.

[egregiousRac]

-snip-

 

Whoops, broke a post.

 

Edited April 15, 2015 by egregiousRac

[CY13ERPUNK]

+9999 OP

 

i continuously fail to understand how the DEvs can be professionals in their field and not see how their product fails in so many aspects compared to others/their competition in the genre =[

[taiiat]

i assumed you'd be talking about world and story building.

instead, you're suggesting that the overall combat systems in Mass Effect are a golden beacon.

which i can't really agree with on the basis that combat in Mass Effect felt pretty awful and some Weapon Archetypes were completely worthless.

Mass Effect is a good example for Story - not so much for gameplay. the Gameplay was not well recieved, but the Story was heralded.

subsequent titles rethought everything related to Combat Gameplay entirely, throwing it all out and starting over from scratch.

Edit:

some of the good and useful features for gameplay that Mass Effect has - many other games have. but could still be beneficial regardless where you source example from i guess.

Edited April 15, 2015 by taiiat

[Bobtm]

I came in here expecting Mass disappointment and horribleness, then again I despise Mass Effect, so good ol' bias there.  Honestly though that was a very interesting read and I agree with a majority of your points made here.  Luckily there wasn't anything along the lines of "make the game have a boring and cliche polarized morality bar based story" or something, so that's always a plus too.

 

Only things I have an issue with are the following;  Sprinting, Carpal Tunnel Syndrome, along with Squad and Character Choices.  The first two, well I basically would end up typing exactly what egregiousRac typed, so I'll just ^ and be done with that part.  As for the final, that one is more of an issue of me wondering "what are you getting at?" as opposed to a direct disagreement.

 

The one thing I did catch from the last part is AI allies;  I'm not on board with the allowable option to let folks slap on AI allies, I've actually always hated this trend in games and feel like it's only served to further and further dumb down many games.  Especially compounded on games which let allies revive one another, as it can lead to some pretty laughable situations.  Some even where you can purposefully try to die on hard difficulty and fail to do so repeatedly due to easymode allies rezing your over, and over, and over, and over again ad nauseum.

 

Aside those three discrepencies for me personally, this is generally good stuff.

 

Edit;  Forgot somehow about Shield ignore damage.  I'm totally okay with this existing and don't want to see it go the way of the dinosaur.  It's not uncounterable even in the current system we've got, and I actually like its existence in Warframe.  So tack on one other disagree, still overall good stuff though.

Edited April 15, 2015 by Bobtm

[ikitclaw]

Unconstructive.

Actually it is and it happens all the time. Games in the same genre SHOULD be compared to each other. What are you expecting, that games should be compared to games in other genres or never be compared at all?

tl;dr; I should go. All of the points I mentioned are valid, yet the Citadel Council, oops, I meant the Warframe community is prejudiced and refuses to listen.

 

What I meant was that mass effect and warframe are vastly different games, the chosen mechanics in warframe help its tone as a fast paced shooter, whereas mass effect, people play mass effect for the story as far as I know, not the gunplay, as it isnt its strongest part. Also many believe the gunplay in the first mass effect to be the weakest of the series.

 

The rewards, well I agree and disagree with your analysis, I agree that not enough loot is obtainable from the containers and such, but you merely disregard the endless gamemodes, survival, defense, and interception, many do these gamemodes for the rewards throughout the mission, not the rewards at the end. And even then there are stance mods and other rare mods that drop from mobs. The problem between the mass effect style and warframe style is that the number of missions there are are incredibly different, with mass effect you have a story to follow, but with warframe the story is quite sparse, it isnt the main focus, the main focus is the gameplay. To give an overview, its the freedom that warframe gives to the player about what mission to do, players can do any node on a planet an infinite amount of times, in mass effect you only do that mission once, meaning warframe has to balance mission length, and the rewards to a certain degree. (although the dilution of rewards and the rarity of some mods is ridiculous)

 

The squadmates, you list having the difficulty scale with the number of people in your squad, id like a more indepth explanation of this, is it scaling of level, number of enemies etc... You also say that AI squadmates should be implemented, well I think this is a terrible idea, the very idea of an AI squadmate displeases many people, because of the reasons stated by bobtm, and the coding needed for an appropriate squadmate would be insane, and we already know how good DE is as AI (not good at all, just watch any unaware enemy for an extended period of time).

 

Sprinting, as stated above, your thoughts on sprinting arent exactly accurate. Also increasing the base sprint multiplier is a terrible idea, it would unbalance every warframe's speed, with what you're suggesting a frost would be as fast as a loki, while a loki would be so fast, he'd probably be able to glitch through the geometry! The only way your idea would work is by halving your suggested figures, and removing all movement based mods.

 

Vehicle combat, it is not a thing in warframe, archwing is just a gamemode, I do not consider it a vehicle, atleast until they implement a transition option from normal gameplay to archwing gameplay, which is an incredible amount of work.

 

Ammo from mass effect make sense because all weapons are energy based, where as a huge portion in warframe are slug based, also warframe's ammo systsem is meant to balance certain weapons, such as the penta, which only takes sniper ammo (a small lore inconsistency, a new ammo type named explosives would fix this) meaning you cant fire randomly and always have full ammo, the system as it is, is fine, it could use a few tweaks here and there. Also there are many other systems that would be worse than the one currently in warframe.

 

Items gear, leveling and scaling! boy what a huge thing to tackle. Ok the mod system in warframe is meant to allow people to choose how they want to customize a weapon or warframe, which playstyle they want to adhere to, for frames, right now its good in this department, the system allows someone to mod maybe a mesa for duration, and focus on her 2nd and 3rd abilities, or mod her for power and efficiency for her ult, the only problem with it in relation to frames, is that there are many useless mods, such as most of the stamina based mods, the solution would be to simply buff or change them so then they would actually be included. A utility slot, would help with this, giving players extra options. Something else that would help the system is if the mods in relation to power strength had the ability to scale with enemy level. (but scale is a vast and hard to tackle problem) The mod system in relation to weapons, now that, really the only difference between builds for people would be the elemental combinations, and maybe the build on a few weapons, depending on if people have the mods, or they dont want to lose accuracy. Now leveling, with the current star chart there is almost no path to see or follow, its only until new players fight vor, and get the navs that they then realize how the system works, yes it needs an overall, the previous once was quite good, it had connections between every planet, it gave a sense of progress, but also gave players freedom of choice, as one planet could branch to two others, the solution to this is actually in the works, DE have said that they want to go back to something similar to the previous star chart. Ok now scaling, oh god, now scaling, theres right now theres three different types, theres linear scaling, used in defense, survival and interception mission, where as time and waves progress the enemies get harder. Theres conclave scaling, which ive only seen on some of the bosses and assassins, (even then Im not 100% sure the assassins use it) all this scaling does is increase the damage and hp of the boss, which is bad, since all it does is if the player is a veteran, it just lengthens the fight, probably by a few seconds. The third kind of scaling is the star chart scaling, having the enemies at higher levels on certain planets, (really got to fix that star chart DE) the level range is told to the player, so they can make their own choice of whether or not to tackle the high leveled enemies or go back and grind a bit more. Its this type of scaling that gives warframe, some very different difficulty levels. from a veteran's perspective  the early levels are where you go to test newly crafted weapons, because it gives an idea of how it will perform in general, this level range would span mercury, earth, venus, mars and saturn, and later phobos. then there's the middle ground, where if the weapon is high tier it will destroy the mobs, this level range is to see if weapons will either be able to go well into a T4 void endless mission, or if its just not enough, the planets for this range are neptune early on, pluto, ceres, the derelicts, and ultimately void T4. Now the high ground, this is usually either well into a T3 or 4 endless mission, or the raid, this range is incredibly stupid, it requires god like weapons to maybe kill something, and the main way people get through it are through extreme CC from warframe abilities. I dont have a good idea of how to properly fix the scaling in warframe, for the most part it is fine, but the "end game" is quite crazy.

 

 

 

Also do not throw away my first comment, it was to simply tell you that others will most likely reply without first taking your points into consideration.

Edited April 15, 2015 by ikitclaw

[Severuslanskerr]

So you are basically telling me that we should compare games to the same genre ??? ok how about deus ex VS Call of Duty LOL let the war begin !!!

[OvAeons]

from my point of view: got bored of Mass effect in a staggering 3 hours. Still playing warframe.

 

oh and TL;DR 

Edited April 15, 2015 by OvAeons

[DivisionByZero]

So you are basically telling me that we should compare games to the same genre ??? ok how about deus ex VS Call of Duty LOL let the war begin !!!

Lousy straw man argument there. Call of Duty is an online team arena FPS. Deus Ex is more of a sci-fi adventure FPS and should be compared to games like the original Unreal (not Unreal Tournament).

[Vadrigos]

Personally I think they could learn a thing or two from Darksiders 2 in terms of melee. The melee here is clunky and under-powered in compared with the gunplay. However, DS2, despite being a console game, had a control scheme and combat design that was quite easy to master, even on a keyboard. It's directional dodging would fit right in with the ninja atmosphere too. I realize DE wants their melee to feel unique, but right now it only feels unique in terms of its uselessness. They don't need to reinvent the wheel on this issue...

[xRufus7x]

You are comparing two completely different games. For one thing it is just as easy to break the balance of Mass Effect as it is Warframe. Certain classes can make themselves pretty much immortal. Weapons can become essentially antiartillery weapons with the right ammo type, being able to descimate the biggest enemies the game can throw at you. You could spam powers at a rate that would make Excalibur's head spin, oh and lift + throw allowed you to destroy even the heaviest enemies in the game. Yah, you started off weak, but as you leveled, Shepard basically becomes a god of the battlefield, not unlike the tenno. This is made even worse with + playthroughs.

 

Warframe is a fast paced third person coop shooter with RPG elements

Mass Effect is a third person cover based RPG with shooter elements

Warframe is based around fighting hoards of enemies

Mass Effect funnels a handfull at you at a time

Warframe exists for the grind(you know it's true)

Mass Effect was story driven
Warframe scales enemies dependent upon location with the exception of bosses

Mass Effect scaled enemies to you all of the time, which a single player game can do a lot more effectively than a coop game.

 

Basically you have walked up to us and said, hey you see these two apples, the one in my right hand is better, but in actuality the apple in your left hand is a pomegranate.

[Temp0ralfool]

gonna put my two cents in: Warframe is not Mass Effect.

 

no, I don't feel the need to expand on this to explain away your points.

 

Captain Obvious AWAY!

[Wolfstorm18]

Mass Effect (the first one): played two times and throwed it away. Dont known how many hours, but I guess it was some 60 hours maybe. 

 

Warframe: 1000+ hours of gameplay. 

 

So no, I think that Warframe is better at gameplay. Maybe not so much at the graphical quality of textures (if we compare to Mass Effect 3) but the action is much more addictive. I would like the devs to increase sprinting speed, but it seems that sprinting speed is somewhat linked to melee speed so it would not tackle the issue of coptering. If it was possible to do separate speeds then it would work. 

[letir]

Mass Effect 1 wasn't so good to compare. ME 2-3, honestly, was better with combat, abilities and upgrade system.

Edited April 15, 2015 by letir

[Bobtm]

gonna put my two cents in: Warframe is not Mass Effect.

 

from my point of view: got bored of Mass effect in a staggering 3 hours. Still playing warframe.

 

Don't get me wrong here, considering I loathe Mass Effect completely and totally, but I didn't pick out anything atrocious about what the op was pointing out here.  Maybe I missed something, but in the post I didn't pick out things that would infer turning Warframe into a homogenously boring, simple, and dreadfully dull and slow cover based slog of terribleness that is ME.

 

For the most part it was stuff along the lines of reigning in scaling and adding build diversity at the outset stuff, with some tail end changes looking at other areas, like QoL shifts on how zooming and controls work in Archwing.  Even with my absurd bias against ME, seriously I think it's pretty much an abomination of a game and I'm shocked at how popular it was, I don't look at this thread and see outlandish horribleness.

[xRufus7x]

Don't get me wrong here, considering I loathe Mass Effect completely and totally, but I didn't pick out anything atrocious about what the op was pointing out here.  Maybe I missed something, but in the post I didn't pick out things that would infer turning Warframe into a homogenously boring, simple, and dreadfully dull and slow cover based slog of terribleness that is ME.

 

For the most part it was stuff along the lines of reigning in scaling and adding build diversity at the outset stuff, with some tail end changes looking at other areas, like QoL shifts on how zooming and controls work in Archwing.  Even with my absurd bias against ME, seriously I think it's pretty much an abomination of a game and I'm shocked at how popular it was, I don't look at this thread and see outlandish horribleness.

The message wasn't horrible. Some of this stuff is just common sense, others not so bad, and there are some I don't agree with, but the comparisons used to get those points across were ridiculous.

[Bobtm]

The message wasn't horrible. Some of this stuff is just common sense, others not so bad, and there are some I don't agree with, but the comparisons used to get those points across were ridiculous.

Yeah, I definitely agree there if that wasn't obvious enough.  I really do hate Mass Effect more than I should... or maybe it's an appropriate amount of hate.

[vomder]

If only warframe could get on the same level as Mass Effect, except of course of that full retard ending.

[ikitclaw]

Lousy straw man argument there. Call of Duty is an online team arena FPS. Deus Ex is more of a sci-fi adventure FPS and should be compared to games like the original Unreal (not Unreal Tournament).

 

Deus Ex, in the words of TB, is more of an RPG with FPS elements.

[xFrostKnightx]

Do not make this like Mass effect. <---

Warframe should BE the game people use as a comparison NOT. The target of it.

I want warframe to be unique on its own without copying so people can one day say;

"This game compared to WF sucks."

Edited April 15, 2015 by xFrostKnightx

[DSpite]

Unconstructive.

Actually it is and it happens all the time. Games in the same genre SHOULD be compared to each other. What are you expecting, that games should be compared to games in other genres or never be compared at all?

tl;dr; I should go. All of the points I mentioned are valid, yet the Citadel Council, oops, I meant the Warframe community is prejudiced and refuses to listen.

 

I have one word for you, "Cover Mechanics".

 

You like Mass Effect so much, then play Mass Effect. These two games are totally different. ME is a linearly driven storyline game, WF is not. It allows Save Points, it has arbitrarily set bottlenecks to stop players getting gear until the game determines they should have such gear with artificial prices. The list goes on.

 

Do not try and turn WF into ME because YOU think ME is better. Just play ME.

 

Your points? Are valid for an ME sequel, not a Warframe "update".

Edited April 15, 2015 by DSpite

[Evanescent]

I have one word for you, "Cover Mechanics".

 

You like Mass Effect so much, then play Mass Effect. These two games are totally different. ME is a linearly driven storyline game, WF is not. It allows Save Points, it has arbitrarily set bottlenecks to stop players getting gear until the game determines they should have such gear with artificial prices. The list goes on.

 

Do not try and turn WF into ME because YOU think ME is better. Just play ME.

 

Your points? Are valid for an ME sequel, not a Warframe "update".

^

 

 

 

Also I like how 2 comments disagreeing sets OP on fire lol.