Gordon9106 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 600 armor for a beserk frame,it is still too high. At least reduce it by 50 or a hundred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightdragon64 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) i think she is just fine as is... considering that you can easily die when not in hysteria mode. (at least during higher level missions) Edited March 13, 2016 by lightdragon64 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellmaker2004 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 NOOOooooooOOOOooooooooo Her base stats is not the problem move on to something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taiiat Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) absolutely not. do you have any numerical backing on this? it sounds like you do not. do you know how Armor works? clearly do not. why is 600 Armor too high? is that actually high in the game? how much extra EHP does Valkyr have over other Health based Warframes with the way her stats are weighted? you don't sound like you know the answers to any of those questions. the Armor accompanies the normal sized Health Pool - to supplement the very low Shield count. not to mention that Chroma, Inaros, Rhino can increase their Armor to significantly higher than Valkyr in Gameplay. not to mention that several Warframes have acess to significant Damage Reduction, which is more effective than Armor. refer to the Armor Wiki Article to learn how these systems work and how they scale with Mods. Edited March 13, 2016 by taiiat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shut Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) If Valkyr's survivability is considered problematic in this game, then trust me when I say it's not because of her armor. Edited March 13, 2016 by SortaRandom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-BM-Mitz Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 It's not high, it provides a decent damage metigation with warcry and some buffs. It's absolutely NEEDED for a melee centered frame. She is MEANT to be tanky to offset her lack of ranged powers. The problem is Hysteria doesn't do a good job making it harder for you to sustain it the more damage you soak up with it giving you cheap god mode. A nice suggestion would be to make hysteria cost more the more damage it soaks and for valkyr to get a higher base HP. That's just my opinion though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldnacpeek Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) You're not even providing a reason why, you're just saying "It's high, nerf it". What exactly is your reasoning? Do you think Valkyr isn't balanced? If so, how exactly is she unbalanced? If not, what elaborate reasons do you have to justify nerfing her armor value? I'm not going to back this idea at all considering the fact I think she's perfectly fine. The armor value is still not enough to save her outside of Hysteria in many situations, but I'll let someone who mains her and knows her very well speak about that more. Right now, it just seems you're looking at her armor value comparitvely and immediately snapped to the "Much higher than every other frame, aka too high, so nerf it" ideology. I'm not entirely sure you've taken the time to play as Valkyr for a dedicated period in many high level missions to reach this conclusion. If you have, I ask you please post much more detail than this current thread, but I'll still find myself not supporting the idea at all. Edited March 13, 2016 by LazerSkink Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calwon5 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Instead of putting the word nerf out there like it would solve anything. Why not instead, put suggestions or at least an actual reason why armor in valkyr's case is even a problem. FYI: Armor is not the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trichouette Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Imo inaros' and valkyr's armor should be swapped... Valkyr has an immortalitah key (and lifesteal) while inaros just has... health point & heal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leqesai Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 1 minute ago, Trichouette said: Imo inaros' and valkyr's armor should be swapped... Valkyr has an immortalitah key (and lifesteal) while inaros just has... health point & heal. Inaros with Valkyr's armor would be obscene. He is already able to buff his armor quite high with his ult. Not to mention his crazy health pool. He has way more overall health than any other frame, as is, and is near immortal if you're smart (always run with lifestrike on his melee to refill health when his frame abilities can't do it better). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobtm Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) Her armor used to be much, much lower. It proved to be insufficient for one's ability to survive as a rough & tumble berserker in the thickest of thick fights when playing recklessly (without relying on the crutch that is Hysteria). Thus her armor values were raised up incrementally till her survivability was found to be in a place which was deemed "agreeable" overall. On what grounds precisely do you have for suggesting this reduction? Have you done any research or math upon how armor functions? As a point of reference, her previous armor values were as follows; 200 as of her initial release in U11 300 as of U11.2.0, this same patch also brought an across the board armor buff to all frames 600 as of U12, this has been her armor since that time Also a point of note; Valkyr's release was around the time when the game's balancing curve was being shifted about due to Damage 2.0's implementation. In U11.5 enemy offensive and defensive value curves were shifted so that their offensive power would scale up faster, while their defensive power would scale up slower. Resulting in foes which deal more damage at the time. Short version; Her current armor value is fine for what she is and does. Unless you can provide some form of evidence to the contrary, don't bank on seeing what you've suggested ever happen in the game. Edited March 13, 2016 by Bobtm Made a silly mistake during editing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plushy Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 I think her armor should go UP more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeMeritus Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 If anything, her armor and/or HP pool needs a buff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meneliki Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 armor nerfed? err... no thanks. If you think her survivability is an issue, have a look at chroma/wukong/inaros. they're just as tanky. Every frame has a situation where it's like 'omg this frame is OP'.. so when every frame is "OP", no frame is actually "OP". God Mode situations are apparently by design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmptyDevil Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) Her armor is fine, but the invulnerability on Hysteria needs to go. For the individuals that my posted has triggered: I'm not interested in having a debate on Valkyr's Hysteria. Don't waste your time. I got sucked into the debate anyway. Please keep it civil and snark free. Edited March 13, 2016 by EmptyDevil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felixsylvaris Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Her Shields are minimal. And Shield restore on their own (unlike health). Her health pool is normal. All her kit around hugging enemies. Hysteria is great, but sometimes will turn off (nullifiers). To Valkyr be playable she need "something" when hysteria goes off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kliuqard Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 It's basically a requirement on a melee-based frame, having to tank any danger in front of her. You also have the fact that the armor means nothing when you're in Hysteria forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotvrna Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 People that say Hysteria is OP just don't play Valkyr, do they? First off, it limits what you can do to basically melee damage (and we all know how damage-based abilites fall-off at higher levels unless coupled with others). It's not "unlimited invulnerability", you need to have a constant supply of energy and between nullifiers, energy leeches, disruptors and magnetic procs there are plenty of ways to lose Hysteria in a blink. In the end, as someone who mains Valkyr, I find myself using hysteria mostly to either revive an ally, pop a life support capsule or on those "Oh s****" moments. Having it up 24/7 is a common mistake to those new to the frame as it really limits your teamplay. And more on-topic, please don't touch her armor it's fine as it is. ^-^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcatraz Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Gordon9106 said: 600 armor for a beserk frame,it is still too high. At least reduce it by 50 or a hundred. Before posting asking for a nerf. Actually take out whatever it is you think needs a nerf and go play high level missions. Stop playing on Mercury and Earth, go to Ceres, and fight Grineer. Try a survival on Ceres, go till 40 minutes without using hysteria the whole time. When you're finished there, if you even make it past 20 minutes, rethink about what you're asking, because clearly you haven't been very far. I mean see you joined on Feb 29th, so you're very new and have no idea what anything is like in high level missions. So think before you post next time. Edited March 13, 2016 by AIcatraz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meneliki Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 11 minutes ago, EmptyDevil said: Her armor is fine, but the invulnerability on Hysteria needs to go. If a number of other frames weren't capable of god mode, i'd agree. But valkyr is not unique in her invul-ness which leads me to beleive that invicibility is intended design for this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesiga Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 I see people die so easily with her from lv 40 enemies. So nah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Mr.Meeseeks- Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 All these people saying that Inaros has comparable armor to Valkyr aren't being truthful. Either that or are mislead. Inaros starts with 200. With Maxed steel fiber, it's 420. With his ultimate fully charged + steel fiber, it only sits at 620. Valkyr starts at 600. So in order to match a baseline Valkyr, he has to be equipped a maxed Steel Fiber and have his ultimate fully charged. That's not to say he doesn't have incredible survivability; his massive health pool more than makes up for his lower armor; but to say that he can attain a similar armor value is pretty much false. Unless you know a single person who runs Valkyr without Steel Fiber on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trichouette Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 28 minutes ago, Leqesai said: Inaros with Valkyr's armor would be obscene. He is already able to buff his armor quite high with his ult. Not to mention his crazy health pool. He has way more overall health than any other frame, as is, and is near immortal if you're smart (always run with lifestrike on his melee to refill health when his frame abilities can't do it better). "quite high" You can reach 400. That's very high indeed. 620 if you've steel fiber. It's nice to have 5k hp, but with 620 armor it's like having 15k shield. It gets depleted pretty fast on high level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratego89 Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 "Too much for a berserk" While it's nice to see someone recognize that she's meant to be a berserker and not a tank for a change- her armor is not even a problem. She'll still be absolutely shredded at any decently high level unless she's really doing some work on those enemies. Her main (but by no means only- I have a thread somewhere explaining all her flaws and how to improve them) issue is the invincibility her hysteria gives her. No skill in this game should allow you to sit there forever and not die- period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meneliki Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 I feel the need to weigh in on the whole Inaros vs. Valkyr situation. Valkyr - straight up invul, until she runs out of energy or gets hit by nullifier. (God Mode) Inaros - near invul until.... oh, right. End of mission. Inaros + Rage + Life Strike = basically broken. I've been playing Inaros for the last few days... recently been messing around with Life Strike.. wow. Any time he dips below 4k HP i activate life strike and top up. Inaros CANNOT die. and that's not on a timer. It also lets him use whatever weapon he wants, unlike valkyr who is reliant on her hysteria damage which falls off after a while. Conclusion - Inaros' "demigod" survivability scales better than valkyr's "God" survivability. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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