Oberon Feedback 20.3.1 and beyond

[tnccs215]

13 hours ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Growing power is actually a pretty legit option to CP/ES...I'm even considering using it over intensify and replacing that spot with Vitality so i have both, just to make power management a tad easyer on low energy levels but ya know, that's work for another day. Preferably on his prime.

The extra strength and QT are definitly worth it. Especially with how savage the life reg becomes in this strength range...it's able to counter incommimg damage as you recieve it, thus creating a scenario where you replentish both energy and health while you're beeing damaged, which are both your active health ...it's ridiculous. This tankiness lets you fight in the frontlines then, what more or less guarantees you a filled energy pool (if the enemys don't choose to ignore you for minutes), what compensates the range with the possibility to cast Hallowed ground more often...It's still enough for Reckoning to interrupt heavy fire when the enemys manage to hit trough to your energy pool, that's what's essencial.

I personally use Growing Power on my build -  which is maximized,  as most builds are,  towards renewal (because of course it is). It is very useful: quite easy to maintain active if you run any weapon with more than negligible status chance -  and since I constantly run a slash/viral proc melee build,  it's very easy for me to have the buff up pretty much permanently. My build is as follows (will update with an image when I get home):

Aura: Growing Power

Exilus: Power Drift

Row 1: Rank 9 Blind Rage; Rank 10 Transient Fortitude; Energy Conversion; Rage;

Row 2: Vitality; Primed Continuity; Primed Flow; Streamline. 

Final stats are:

Ability Duration: 123.5% (I think) 

Ability Efficiency: 80%

Ability Range: 100%

Ability Strength: 260% - 335%

All in all,  I sacrifice a bit more...  Convenience for raw power strength. I tried the Rage/Renewal/QuickThinking combo,  and I frankly loved it -  however it could not hold up to sustained damage (though I suppose that's when Reckoning becomes truly useful),  and higher power strength benefits teammates more than anything. 

Energy Conversion is a nice boost over Intensify,  but God,  it complicates the activation of Renewal beyond tolerable levels: see an energy orb,  cast HG,  catch orb,  find an enemy,  proc status,  return to HG,  and cast Renewal.

I'll probably review the build once the Prime comes.  If the leaked stats are correct,  Quick Thinking will be an even better idea,  and maybe even Steel Fiber might an alternative. 

[LokiTheCondom]

6 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

As of now, Oberon Prime is the fugliest Prime hands down.

 

Beats Rhino Prime being a Rhino that got on roids and faceplanted himself onto a void key or Mag Prime being a Mag with oversized braces.

I can tolerate the evil dark bull look.

[MirageKnight]

I agree that Rhino and Mag P's helmets are visually challenged...but at least Rhino Prime's body isn't studded with gaudy spikes and parapets growing out of various places like architectural mushrooms. That and at least you can look at Rhino P's body and immediately think "Rhino with Bling". Oberon P is more like Baphomet P in terms of appearance.

[KnightCole]

11 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

As of now, Oberon Prime is the fugliest Prime hands down.

 

what I think makes him ugly is his disproportionately fat cross section and skinny, little spindly legs, along with the really tall helm made taller with the Horns. 

I think, sweep the horns back, thin out his cross section of the torso, and/or beef up his legs/arms a little, he'd be fine. 

[MortalMercenary]

Whenever you are using Oberon and his 3 Renewal if you enter a Nullifier's Bubble the buff goes off of you but stays on any allies that are not in a nully bubble unless you deactivate the ability. Also it would be nice if Oberon's Renewal either didnt drain when applied to non player allies or just only applied to warframes sentinels and kubrows/kavats as easily shown when running with a Shield of Shadows Nekros Oberon is unable to sustain the drain.

Also there appears to be quite the graphical glitch involving ramparts in which an after image of the rampart is on an ally as shown with Mesa in one of the below images.

 

[Chipputer]

The graphical glitch is another story, but your buff staying active on allies isn't necessarily, "not working as intended." Beyond that, the heal applying to NPCs and such and draining is annoying, but it's the price we pay for finally being able to heal things that aren't allied warframes. They simply copy and pasted the way Trinity and Equinox heal and didn't think about what 4 frames, 7 shadows, a molt, two rumblers and a defense operative would do to your energy pool.

[MortalMercenary]

Just now, Chipputer said:

The graphical glitch is another story, but your buff staying active on allies isn't necessarily, "not working as intended." Beyond that, the heal applying to NPCs and such and draining is annoying, but it's the price we pay for finally being able to heal things that aren't allied warframes. They simply copy and pasted the way Trinity and Equinox heal and didn't think about what 4 frames, 7 shadows, a molt, two rumblers and a defense operative would do to your energy pool.

Seeing as they all dealt with his renewal i felt like giving them all attention now. Hopefully they decide to give us a flat energy cost rather than a per ally energy cost with Oberon Prime coming in 10 days. 

[Tizodd]

Renewal should have a flat energy drain regardless of how many pc's/npc's are being healed.  Not only Nekros screws his energy up, but so do Nidus's maggots, and Saryn's Molt as you pointed out...maybe Loki's Decoy and Titiana's Razorflies too?  A flat energy drain would be so much more manageable.

Besides...Trinity's Blessing doesn't cost more to cast if it affects more people; neither does Equinox's Mend or Nezha's Chakram.

Why is Oberon the only one with that detrimental mechanic?

[KX297]

1 minute ago, Tizodd said:

Renewal should have a flat energy drain regardless of how many pc's/npc's are being healed.  Not only Nekros screws his energy up, but so do Nidus's maggots, and Saryn's Molt as you pointed out...maybe Loki's Decoy and Titiana's Razorflies too?  A flat energy drain would be so much more manageable.

Besides...Trinity's Blessing doesn't cost more to cast if it affects more people; neither does Equinox's Mend or Nezha's Chakram.

Why is Oberon the only one with that detrimental mechanic?

This... is actually a really good point.
It's not like his buff is anymore powerful. They are situational in terms of which would be better, so with that being said nobody could necessarily argue that Oberon's is too powerful to be a flat-line drain.

Something needs to be done though, that much is true. Renewal needs some tweaking, along with some minor things to other abilities. 

[Chipputer]

2 minutes ago, Tizodd said:

Why is Oberon the only one with that detrimental mechanic?

Copy and paste issues.

They copied his old healing mechanics, where you could heal from literally anywhere and you paid more to heal more allies, but it cut off at a certain point directly into his new one where they also just slapped on other healing mechanics of healing non players.

That's literally the only issue. They didn't think about it and just said, "that should be fine, give it what they have." They probably just don't really play test with larger groups.

[MortalMercenary]

Just now, Chipputer said:

Copy and paste issues.

They copied his old healing mechanics, where you could heal from literally anywhere and you paid more to heal more allies, but it cut off at a certain point directly into his new one where they also just slapped on other healing mechanics of healing non players.

That's literally the only issue. They didn't think about it and just said, "that should be fine, give it what they have." They probably just don't really play test with larger groups.

Yeah, that is a downside of DE, they have the best of intentions at heart but are unable to think of every single possibility in every mission that comes up which is, thankfully, where the community comes in and points these things out. It's just up to DE to pay attention to what we are saying and hopefully do something about it.

[Blakrana]

21 minutes ago, Tizodd said:

Not only Nekros screws his energy up, but so do Nidus's maggots, and Saryn's Molt as you pointed out...maybe Loki's Decoy and Titiana's Razorflies too?

At present Renewal seems to affect the following.

• Nekros' Shadows
• Decoy
• Atlas' Rumblers
• Inaros' Sand Shadows
• Nidus' Maggots
• Titania's Razorflies
• Nyx's Mind Control target

Didn't think to check it worked on Saryn's Molt, forgetting it had a Health score _{I am a moron}. One more for the list, all the same.

[Asphyxxia]

Rampart issue was reported, it's only a matter of time before it's fixed

[Vivian]

Hello, 

I have been using oberon quite a lot after the rework. Especially after making renewal a toggle. I ran Sorties, Mot and all kinds of missions with him which kinda made me fall in love with the kit. However, he isn't perfect yet; here's why :

1. He's too squishy and can't heal where Heals are needed. I had to use naramon to survive past 20 mins in Mot and my Heals were only useful to others due to phoenix renewal and corrupted iron renewal. 

2. To have 1 useful ability to use past star chart missions, you have to sacrifice the rest. Modding for HG means you have to lose efficiency and duration. Modding in a balanced way got my renewal Heals to 58 at base. 

3. Phoenix renewal has a way too long cool down. I agree that changing it will make him into a pseudo Wukong and less vivid. A simple fix will be presented below.

4. Now. Oberon isn't a jack of all trades nor a master. He's just a farm mule. Cross bred between two different species but kinda okayish at what he's supposed to do. 

 

Possible bug(s) :

This happened to me twice on different occasions. When using QT and with phoenix renewal on cool down, if oberon dies he can't be revived by the squad mates. He'll just die. It was in a Corpus mission. 

When walking into a Nullifier bubble with naramon, the toggle on renewal doesn't get turned off. His ability tray looks normal when the actual abilities are turned off. I died a couple of times due to this as in trying to understand why my Heals stopped. 

Reckoning sometimes perma stuns the targets, levitating them in mid air. Zenurik/Trinity style. 

Suggested improvements :

1. Added speed. He's a fairy king, he shouldn't be a slugger. I was using fire walker because doing a mission with him felt slooooow

2. Better HG visuals. Ewwww it looks horrid. 

3. Phoenix renewal can have the same cool down but recasting it should refresh the timer. So if someone dies /you die and PR gets triggered. You can jump to a safe space and recast it. It will be a tactical choice because you die when enemies are Stronk, losing Heals for a second is a live or die situation.  The gamble will be intense. 

4. I know this is a wild request but better sound FX? Why do his abilities sound like a gargling alien? If that's how fairies are, I'm never ever going to tell fairy tales to kids.

5. If 4 isn't possible, can he haz more armour please :3

 

Overall, he became quite good post rework. Minor tweaks can make him perfect. At least for me to never use any other frame ever again. 

 

Cheers! 

 

 

Edited May 21, 2017 by VBNXS

[BigPapiPimp]

11 hours ago, KnightCole said:

what I think makes him ugly is his disproportionately fat cross section and skinny, little spindly legs, along with the really tall helm made taller with the Horns. 

I think, sweep the horns back, thin out his cross section of the torso, and/or beef up his legs/arms a little, he'd be fine. 

I think they went with the big body skinny and short limbed goat or bull look. It's not really my thing either, if they made his limbs longer and more sinewy like an alien i would have liked it it better. He's more creepy in a brony way right now, rather then an otherwordly way. Too soft or dull imo. Will still farm.

Edited May 21, 2017 by BigPapiPimp

[Doomsknightmare]

Let's hope DE knows what they're doing and fix him with his PA coming.

[rumq]

What do you think to add % Chance to drop orbs on deth (energy on robotic , health on non robotic) to 2nd ability ?

In my opinion all togle abilities not receive energy from consumable (blue pizza) and energy vampire is wrong idea - against teamplay (and logic).

Propbly everybody know oberon 2nd ab. range scaling is little weirdo, and not fit to his 4th ab.

Oberon 2nd ab. i framerate killer.

[KnightCole]

5 hours ago, BigPapiPimp said:

I think they went with the big body skinny and short limbed goat or bull look. It's not really my thing either, if they made his limbs longer and more sinewy like an alien i would have liked it it better. He's more creepy in a brony way right now, rather then an otherwordly way. Too soft or dull imo. Will still farm.

They could achieve the "bull" look and still make him proportionately sized.....

Kinda how they nailed the AK-47 look on the Soma and the M-16 look on the Karak, without copying them exactly and still making some of the better looking weapons in the game.

Edited May 21, 2017 by KnightCole

[KX297]

Honestly, I think DE is just going to leave him. 
I would be surprised if they changed anything at this point, which is really sad.

He still needs work, and he probably won't receive any help.
They will probably just leave him behind and move onto other things like they so frequently do.

He feels clunky and unfinished. 

[Zookes]

It is currently very difficult to play with any frames having summons and allies with renewal having a cost like this. Nekros especially.

[Zookes]

Think maybe the Renewal and Hallowed Ground combo is fun to have for long survival mishes. Problem tho is Renewal heals also summons and this is costing very very much energy.

Try to play Oberon with a Nekros? It is not fun.

[Kinperor]

Hello all,

 

After toying around with the Oberon rework, I felt like chiming in on the discussion around the balance of this frame that I have owned and played for three days after its release.

 

Abilities feedback

Oberon pre-rework

 

As someone who thought of himself as an Oberon main, I would like to start by stating what turned me off Oberon for a small amount of time:

 

1. Smite: I have no complaint on this skill whatsoever. If I were to change anything, it would be to add a SFX particle with weight and girth on the knockdown, and I would replace the fairy balls for an AOE knockdown around the target instead.

2. Hallowed Ground: The previous iteration offered way too little survivability in exchange of the trademark Tenno mobility. The damage output was negligible, the armour buff was too weak to notice and the status immunity didn’t feel relevant.

3. Renewal: The skill required a very specific balance of power strength and duration to be relevant, and this balance varied based on the enemy level. Without the proper balance of these stats, you either healed way too fast and turned off the skill immediately, or you healed too little to actually be helpful.

4. Reckoning: The only thing I could reproach to Reckoning is that, as with most AOE nuke ultimate abilities, clicking one button to incapacitate/wipe the enemy horde is not very interactive. That by itself isn’t necessarily bad, after all it is reliable CC and damage.

• Passive: I liked the previous passive. It wasn’t amazingly good, but it created better moments than a mere stat increase. If I were to nitpick, I would say that the timer on them was superfluous, the beasts were short-lived enough that it didn’t add anything to the game to have them turn back on Oberon a couple of seconds later only to be re-converted. Second nitpick, the conversion wasn’t always reliable, but that was a technical issue.

 

Overall, 1 and 4 were pretty much the best aspect of Oberon. However, these two abilities did not have enough value to compensate for the negative value of 2 on the kit, and the 3 and passive were very situational.

Oberon Post-Rework

Above I outlined why I stopped using Oberon. Now I will address whether the rework did anything for my personal grievance with the frame.

1.      Smite: Virtually the same, a bit more damage. I don’t use Smite for the damage. However, the ability feels more involved since it rewards the choice of a proper target with extra damage. As it happens, these tank units will probably draw a lot of fire on top of contributing to your damage output, so it’s a win-win.

2.      Hallowed Ground: The damage wasn’t the main attraction of Hallowed Ground. However, the radiation proc made the ability much more interesting. The new shape has one unexpected drawback: it makes it much harder to cast away from Nullifier, especially during a defence alert that is crawling with them, where all you want is to activate Iron Renewal. Another drawback of Hallowed Ground: It has been rebalanced as a pivotal ability with the same energy cost as a “stand alone” ability. It is my opinion that the energy cost should reflect the fact that this ability will almost never be cast alone.

2.1.Renewal Interaction: I enjoy the build up a moment from prepping Iron Renewal, especially with the use of an allied Nidus and/or Growing Power. It gives the mobile buff that Hallowed Ground so desperately needed, and it feels more meaningful to “affix” the buff to allies with a spell rather than simply have allies walk over a patch of Hallowed Ground you forgot somewhere.

2.2.Reckoning Interaction: It feels to me that Iron Renewal is the real attraction of Hallowed Ground, whereas empowered Reckoning drains a lot of energy for its damage output. Considering that Warframe’s spawn rates are slated to prevent spawn-camping, expecting the same Hallowed Ground to be used through out its uptime is an optimistic assumption, so using 150 energy to wipe out a few units isn’t necessarily worth it.

3.      Renewal: The current Renewal is nearly everything I could want it to be, in its current iteration. The one drawback from the ability is the energy cost scaling per unit healed. Considering that allied NPC, spectres, pets and minions count as units, the current mechanism feels too prohibitive in large teams or otherwise large crowd.

4.      Reckoning: Functionally the same. Balance is fickle with “damage oriented” abilities, since they are held to the same standards as our weaponry, but with less damage mods and more constraints than firearms. In the end, the radiation bonus is a nice boost to increase Oberon’s killing output.

·         Passive: I’m not a huge fan. By and far, the passive is more practical since the buff is applied to pets regardless of enemy units (unlike the previous passive that required animal enemies). However, stats bombs like that don’t add that much to a Warframe’s identity. Practically, what does this mean? This means that when I turned animals against my enemies, I could nudge my teammate and go, “Ha! Look at this S#&$!” and we’d have a good laugh at our enemy’s misfortune, maybe we’d even build a personality or character around the Warframe based on this. We can’t work that “character-building” magic out of a stat-bomb like the pet stat boost, unless it’s utterly broken. TL; DR: Traded game-changing thematic passive for a practical passive.

Abilities conclusion

Overall, Oberon has been made more practical to use, since Renewal is now easier to manage.

The way that Hallowed Ground now gives a buff outside its bound (with the use of Renewal) is satisfying for me.

Smite and Reckoning virtually hasn’t changed.

As far as the passive is concerned, I think it is much more practical, like Renewal.

Overall, Oberon still does what he used to do, but the frame is more enjoyable to use, now that his 2 and 3 bring more to the table. Based on these observations, it feels to me that Oberon still have room in his “power budget” to warrant a couple more buffs. In the next section, I have compiled a few of these suggestions, which I think can improve Oberon in a balanced fashion. These are not vital to Oberon. However, they are tweaks that I wish were part of his kit whenever I bring him out for a spin.

Changes Suggestions

Include armour mods in the calculation for the Iron Renewal buff. As a modified Paladin-type Warframe, I think Oberon ought to receive some more scaling from using defensive mods like Steel Fibre, or the Focus buff from Unairu. Seeing how Frost’s Snowglobe received a similar treatment and that both abilities are meant to safeguard allies, I think it would be a fair buff to give Oberon. There would be many ways to implement this, but I think the most sensible one would be to apply the armor percentage of Oberon to the base value of Iron Renewal, independently of Power Strength’s increase on the buff. Think Vitality or Physique:

·         Total armor = [Base value * Power Strength] + [Base value * armor modifiers]

 

Reduce energy costs on Hallowed Ground. As I mentioned above, Hallowed Ground has gone from a stand-alone spell to a synergy spell, but its energy cost was unchanged. Lowering the cost by 10 or 15 energy would increase the viability of spell-casting builds and making a pivotal ability in his kit more accessible.

Enabling a combo with Hallowed Reckoning and Hallowed Eruption augments. I think that, of all the augments in the game, HR and HE are the only two augment that could have a viable combination together. As is, HR is considered distinctly of Hallowed Ground, and thus won’t erupt upon being prompted. Implementing such an interaction would increase the burst potential of Oberon, at the cost of two mod slots.

Cap or reduce the scaling energy drain of Renewal. As many before me have stated, Oberon’s renewal can turn from a reasonable energy drain to an energy siphon if Oberon ever uses his skill in proximity to Spectres, Nekros’ shadows or Nidus’ maggots, since they will all count toward the energy expenditure. In my opinion, the drain should be capped to two “stacks” of energy drain:

·         Total energy cost = [base energy drain] + [Oberon Self-Heal] + [Heal for one or more ally]

This would also be consistent with other healing abilities whose cost does not scale with the number of beneficiaries.

 

Have a chance to spawn health orbs from Reckoning, even if the enemy did not die. Realistically, Reckoning’s health orb relevance relies on Health Conversion (for end-game players). 50% chance of receiving 25 health will never compete with Renewal’s sustained or burst heal, and the best it can hope to do is to mitigate small damage from enemies that accumulates over time. As the game is currently, there is a good chance that if enemies deal enough damage to warrant the use of Health Conversion, they might very well resist Reckoning as well. Making the orbs drop from health enemies would open build variety by making Health Conversion a viable choice.

[Vivian]

4 hours ago, Zookes said:

Think maybe the Renewal and Hallowed Ground combo is fun to have for long survival mishes. Problem tho is Renewal heals also summons and this is costing very very much energy.

Try to play Oberon with a Nekros? It is not fun.

I do not know about the normal missions but currently, the only way to keep my power up is [Rage]. Guardian derision would work really well with Oberon as he can take hits when needed and cast reckoning to proc radiation when done.

[Runeglyph]

6 minutes ago, tnccs215 said:

I understand your sentiment, but that's just petty. 

Sorry  i was dealing with 3 other Conversations.

That was suppose to at the bottom of my Reply like a tag.

[Runeglyph]

What i was going to say is i think the Armor Buff should be a Status Pick up when you stand on Hallowed Ground but stays with you when you Leave.

 

 

Edited May 22, 2017 by Letter13
Removed soliciting link