[Update 21.4.0] Hydroid Revisited Feedback

[FoxFX]

35 minutes ago, ADF01Falken said:

The point is to balance his survivability with CC. The idea of blast procs is more interesting because: cannon shots. But the main focus should be in making him viable at Raids and sorties. How can he contribute for the success of a mission? that's the question. He needs a role. CC warframe would be the most close aproach. But if those CCs save enemies, the he can become useles for missions with eximus.
On the other side if he become a damage warframe and increase the damage of undertow or tentacle swarm to make it viable to kill eximus, it'll become a overkill for other mobs. That's why i think it's wise to set a nice damage that can scale to high level missions removing the enemy helping side.

Very well, I'll keep the Blast Proc suggestion for the Salvo-Tempest Barrage idea you presented.

[13QZXXTTX]

On 8/10/2017 at 11:26 AM, [DE]Megan said:

Feedback appreciated here: 

 

[TRRAMSEY]

I really, really love this revisit, I used to play Hydroid a lot, but then stopped when he became a little - difficult at higher levels... I really love that Hydroid is still Hydroid and not some totally different warframe!

There are really only two things about him that I would currently take a look at, one his passive, its kind of wonky for what he does, maybe instead of a slam attack it could trigger during ground finishers or something? Also, I think it'd be super cool if when you deactivated undertow that the enemies took more time to get up, or if >>>>maybe<<<< an undertow stayed there for a few seconds and you could damage enemies inside by shooting or something? Really some way to get them dead without them trying to kill you for a little bit, just for higher levels and stuff. 

Or... just me, heh, I think it'd be super cool if allies could just shoot into your undertow in general, just so enemies can die faster, maybe it would add more DPS to the puddle, or just a burst, or whatever, because you're probably not really ever going to drown the enemies you collect at high levels, and barrage doesn't do THAT much damage, which it shouldn't.

All right, again, I really love the revisit, I think I'm taking Hydroid up as my favorite frame again now, even if you don't do any of this stuff ^ Thanks for reading this if you did though!

 

[-CM-NineFingers]

Just a couple things to make this actually look like a rework isntead of a stats change:

Tempest barrage should home on enemies, and deal finisher damage to match the rest of hydroid's kit. Another option could be turning it into a kind of watery version of ember's WoF (still turning it to finisher damage, to compensate for the fire procs) and ocasionally proc electricity on enemies, as if a storm was following Hydroid.

Undertow 's damage should be multiplicative, not additive. If the squad virtually loses one member that also keeps enemies for himself while being immortal, that benefits nobody. If the damage would multiply by x1.5 (x2 at 150%str) at each tic, making the ability dmg be worth using it. Hell, if I'm giving up weapons for it, might as well be useful. Also, loot dropped over the puddle should float to the center and be absorbed by hydroid. That makes Pilfering Swarm spawning on the puddle actually something useful, since it will make most of the drops flow to hydroid.

Tentacle Swarm could be changed to 8 tentacles protruding from hyd's new pet, and have that kraken thing follow hydroid around. If there's no path to where hydroid went, it could submerge and reemerge at hydroid's feet. Alternatively, the charge casting could make it wander by itself, grabbing enemies and throwing them around instead of keeping them for itself. As for the augment, It should make all enemies damaged by the kraken drop extra loot regardless of who kills it.

 

I have a strong feeling this could solve most problems with the rework.

[Myrkek]

I'm enjoying the Hydroid changes so far, and other than the fact that he still feels a bit too squishy, I think he's in a good place mechanically. My only real complaints are about some of the visuals, which isn't to say they look bad, they're quite good actually, and props especially to whoever did the undertow effect... but, well there's no good way to say this than to say it, I had my energy color set to gold for a reason, and I'm disappointed it didn't carry over. Disgracing my enemies and all that.

On a more practical subject, I still have no idea when tempest barrage is charging, or how much. I've yet to see any kind of indicator for it. Maybe it's there and I'm just not seeing it, but it's still an issue.

And finally, tentacle swarm. The description I read before playing the update made me thing the tentacles themselves were going to be textured like kraken arms. IDK why, but it did. Don't get me wrong, the head popping up is nifty, but with the tentacles just being uncolored water, it doesn't really add anything to the ability. I'd really love for them to either take on my energy color again, or be textured to look like they're attached to the same body the head is, and again, some energy color indication would be nice.

Oh, before I forget, I do have two purely mechanic issues to mention. Undertow does 0 damage to noxes, whether their helmet is broken or not. I understand they have massive damage reduction, but they do still need to breathe, yes? And when using tidal surge while in undertow any still living enemies aren't carried along with you. Is that as intended? I can understand if it's a balance thing, but it seems odd since it normally drags people along as you pass through them, but not when they're already inside you?

[ShadyFlames]

I wish when you casted Tentacle Swarm in your puddle you could drag the tentacles along with you until you get out of the puddle or when you cast tentacle swarm and go over the kraken head with your puddle, it would be as if you casted the swarm inside your puddle and follow you

[PsiWarp]

1 minute ago, ShadyFlames said:

I wish when you casted Tentacle Swarm in your puddle you could drag the tentacles along with you until you get out of the puddle or when you cast tentacle swarm and go over the kraken head with your puddle, it would be as if you casted the swarm inside your puddle and follow you

Right? It would be very thematic and fun to actually BE the kraken for once. Undertow is Hydroid's exalted form, add a peeking kraken in the pool and we have space lake monster frame.

[DeathTheLegendary1]

So my previous post was taken down because i didn't post in this thread (my bad DE) but here is my idea on the Hydroid rework.

 

Hydroid Rework

 

1st ability: No changes needed for mechanics but a base increase in dmg and duration

 

2nd ability: here is where things get fun. Hydroid loses dmg immunity but gains a 75 percent dmg reduction that can scale up to 95 percent dmg reduction with mods, tidal surge becomes a channel ability and he gains increase movement speed instead of travelling a set distance (esentially turning the lower half of his body into water) but still works the same as before where if he runs into enemies he knocks them down. In this mode he can still shoot, aim, melee, swap weapons, but can't bullet jump, roll, or aim glide. If used in the air he will crash down on the ground and knockback all enemies in the area and suffer a cold proc. When he ends the ability he launches himself in the air.

 

3rd ability: Hydroid no longer becomes becomes a puddle but instead lays down a puddle at where ever he is pointing at, still functions the same as before but enemies that are hit by barrage take triple dmg from it and enemies that are hit by tentacle swarm take quadruple dmg.

 

4th ability: Functions the same way but can now be picked up and moved around if u r using your second ability but reduces the range by half. If cast on Undertow it will pull enemies in and start thrashing them underneath the water dealing the quadruple dmg plus the increase dmg ticks it would normaly take if it was affected by undertow.

 

I feel as though the hydroid rework is a bit mediocre. It improved the fluidity of his abilities(pun intended) which is good, but I still feel like its not quite there yet. I bet someone in DE had a very similar idea to my rework idea but either due too time constraints or performance issues they couldn't implement it.

[(PSN)Scaler3]

1st: I love that DE has always had an open mind for listening to the players opinions and ideas. No matter what changes or tweaks our water warframe goes through, im excited for his final outcome. 

I have a few ideas that could be interesting tweaks or even inspiration for his abilities. I love direction of the revamp for him so far, but in my best attempt to not sound greedy; it doesnt seem like enough to want to play him other than for messing around.

 

I think a passive that has both synergy with his abilities, and extrinsic synergy (with Weapons and other teammates abilities) would really bump up the frames playability. 

 

{ Passive }

Something that involves debuffing enemies that have been affected by Hydroids abilities. Wether they take more damage, are slowed down, deal less damage, or any new creative way of debuffing enemies by hitting them with our splashes of water could go a long way.

 

{{{ Tempest Barrage }}}

- Apply a range stat to each individual barrage?

- Apply a 'puddle' or an area that remains for a moment after a barrage lands. The area could cause another knockdown, a impact proc, DoT of some sort. Or any new creative AoE!

- Affect enemies for the passive, causing them to be debuffed in some way after being hit.

 

{{{ Tidal Surge }}}

(Personally, i wouldve like to see this be castable, rather than a movement ability. But i do enjoy the unique-ness and synergy with undertow.)~ It needs more of a reason to be used other than while in Undertow.

 

- Able to move constantly while in undertow, at a drain over time cost of energy.

- Easy escape from the wave, such as jumping, rolling/sliding. Having to cast Undertow just to stop our Surge costs energy.

- Stopping the wave short causes it to keep going, while you stay behind?

- Make it castable, unless in undertow it stays as is for movement.

 

There should be a reason to want to enemies with Tidal surge, such as;

- [The current option: Drag in Undertow or ragdoll them for funnsies]

- Affect enemies for the passive, causing them to be debuffed in some way after being hit.

- Other ideas??? Id love to see this ability improved, i think it fits his theme very well.

 

{{{ Undertow }}}

I love it. I like the improvement to this ability a lot. I wanted it to be castable as well, but since the revamp its become unique and remains loved by those who enjoyed it before his tweaking.

Of course, i still have my own ideas~

 

- Enemies can be damage by other warframe abilities while submerged (Not sure if this is already?)

- A 'choking' or 'gasping for air' animation after they come back to the surface, rather just being knocked down. It would allow for a longer CC, possibly affected by how long they were submerged.

- Make this ability chargable as well? Charging it would instead make it castable, rather than submerging yourself; as a simple activation of the ability would remain functionally the same.

- Affect enemies for the passive, causing them to be debuffed in some way after being drowned.

 

{{{ Tentacle Swarm }}}

- Lets see that new awesome Kraken do something!

- Have the tentacles stop flailing once they grab an enemy. Hold them in a position to take them out effectively. (Assuming other tentacles wont grab the enemy that another tentacle is already holding)

- Since Tentacle Swarm is an Area based ability, if a new enemy walks within the area, an existing tentacle would submerge, and pop up on the new enemy. (I do see the flaws with this idea)

 

These are a few ideas of mine. Please elaborate and come up with even better ideas of your own! If not for Hydroid, it definitely gives ideas to potentially furture warframes! 

(Over everything, i think changing the passive to something more supportive would make Hydroid unique and loved by many)

~ Scaler3

[ziggiey]

Hydroids 3rd ability undertow is really bland and boring to use in a fast paced game like warframe. I have an idea or change it instead of a puddle you could be a ball of water that can roll around on walls. It would also change some abilitys hydroids 1st ability would be a lunge at an enemy and trap them in the ball suffocating them and gaining energy from them however, you can only do this to one person at a time clicking would shoot out a bit of your water ball at an enemy that would  form a water ball at there head suffocating them aswell but this dosent give any energy it also decreased your size and if you use to much all the water will go back into you and you'll turn into normal. Lastly ant bullets shot at you will get stored inside the water and when you revert back to normal they will burst out damgeing enemys. That's about it just an idea I had even tho it's prob pretty S#&amp;&#036; at best

[FoxFX]

Overall, we are in agreement that there needs to be some way to remove the "AFK" style of Undertow. Any thoughts of adding in some sort of Melee Damage component in Undertow?

• Each Melee input in Undertow strikes the trapped enemies increasing their depth at the cost of more energy

[(XBOX)N7ShadowedSoul]

Ok so 1st off, let me say that I am actually a Hydroid MAIN...I'm not a tenno that occasionally plays Hydroid or uses him sometimes for Pilfering Swarm. I MAIN him, I LOVE him & I will try to take him on every mission if possible if I think he will work. Secondly I've been playing Hydroid since endurance bars were in the game. Yes I remember at that point he had the highest endurance stat of all Warframes. So with my being a veteran at playing Hydroid. I'm going to give some insight to some CONSTRUCTIVE  thoughts.

STATS: 

Shields: 345 to 375 - ehh not bad, but with the way damage & status procs work, this boost should have gone to HEALTH instead

Armor: 65 to 200 -   VERY good choice make him a bit more survivable. But is it too much to ask for 225? Like Oberon, Excal, Wukong etc.. That would be great if not that's fine.

PASSIVE: Every Melee slam attack has a 50% chance to lure a Tentacle that lasts for 15 seconds.

Considering the pre mentioned stamina bar, from what I could assume Hydroid was supposed to be a melee caster frame. Hit hard & fast getting in to do damage. Cast Tempest Barrage from a distance, rush in with Tidal Surge melee the crap outta enemies. This is how I played & still play him not an issue. But triggering this on slam attacks is a bit awkward for most people. Most melee stances don't have a good amount of slam attacks in their combos. NOW I am big user of the Sancti Magistar with Hydroid. So I know that Crushing Ruin is very good with slam attacks to be able to proc this quite often. But as I said other melee weapon stances don't have that same efficiency. So the way this passive procs is forcing to play in a very specific way. So finding a more available way to proc this would be of greater benefit to players. Here's a suggestion, how about making it this?

Every melee attack that procs a Critical Hit or Status Effect has a 50% chance to lure a Tentacle that last for 5 seconds. Max of 5 at a time.

So that way all melee weapons can now cause this to happen. Also with a shorter duration of 5 seconds instead of 15, this will be a more quick burst disrupt that is not to overpowered or lasts too long. Furthermore with this having a limit of 5 out at once, it will not again be too powerful or cause any performance issues. Now with all 5 out, if there is another proc that triggers this again, the oldest spawned tentacle will be replaced with a new one. Also to make this more effective allow it to scale with POWER STRENGTH ONLY. That way it rewards melee players, for being high risk going in close with Hydroid.

Tempest Barrage:

The RNG of this ability has ALWAYS been my biggest gripe & frustration with Hydroid. Now I remember when you guys had Power Range effect the cluster size of this ability. So using Narrow Minded made this a wonderful CC ability because you could concentrate CC & damage really well. But I see how & know how that had complications with Tentacle Swarm so you guys changed it, that's fine understandable. What it got changed to however is highly frustrating. Now it has a set range of 10 meters, where the power range affects the explosion radius. Fine, but the complete randomness of where these bombs are dropping make it HIGHLY ineffective. So to fix this, have the bombs drop in a designated pattern to where the base bomb radius will hit the entire INSIDE area of the circle more accurately. In example you have a 10 meter circle, make the bombs drop at the 4 cardinal points in a circle of say like 7 meters INSIDE that 10 meter circle. Let the radius of each bombs explosion coupled with Power Range take care of the rest with filling in that 10 meter range & then with more range exceeding it. This way it is a CONSISTENT hitting ability in the same pattern EVERYTIME. Also it still adheres to your 4 bombs drop every second form. On top of this, to allow it a slightly higher effieciency to be able to damage more effectively, have POWER STRENGTH scale how many bombs are dropped per second. At 100% power strength, the base 4 drops are fine. At 150% power strength, add 2 more bombs per second for a total of 6. At 200% power strength, add 4 bombs essentially doubling the original amount. Also have them drop in the same cardinal points mentioned above. These changes would significantly increase the effectiveness & efficiency of Tempest Barrage with out having to do any core changes as to how the ability works.

TIDAL SURGE:

The changes I would suggest are very minor quality of life changes for this. First the speed of how fast he travels is a bit too fast to do much with it. So with that said take off the Power Duration scaling & make it a flat base speed at all ranks. Secondly, allow your aiming reticle to determine where you go & how FAR you go with this. So with that said allow POWER RANGE to not only affect striking distance but the total distance that can be allowed to travel. So for example say you have a range of I don't know 50 meters, allow your aiming reticle to give you the ability to choose WHERE in that allowed 50 meters where to wave dash to. What if you just need to cross through a laser door or like electrocuted water? It would be more efficient to put your aiming reticle just right past those hazards, hit the ability & that's where you go instead of quickly charging a set full 50 meters completely going way past it. Also a combo window counter would be nice a bit like Atlas's Landslide. What I mean is when you cast Tidal Surge & you cast it again within a certain window, the consecutive casts give a slight reduction to the casting cost. He is already water so why charge a lot more energy for him to continue as water? The changes you guys made with being able to go into Undertow from Tidal Surge is perfectly fine.

UNDERTOW:

The dreaded puddle move lol. Overall I am fine with the changes you guys have made to this ability. Good job on this. A lot of people complain, moan & groan about these changes on how it needs to do more damage, move faster etc....It is fine, they want more damage but you are pretty much completely IMMUNE to damage. You cant have too much with this because then it could be completely overpowered. Maybe just a slight buff to scaling damage would be fine. Now I do agree it should move just a wee bit faster, not super fast but just slightly faster. The ability to grab people is nice as well. The ONE thing I would like to see changed is for you guys to incorporate the Augment mod Curative Undertow into the base ability. Water has always been know as the healing element, allow Hydroid by default to be able to help his team mates as well. With this you could really secure Hydroid as a good support frame for teams. When someone is in danger or down, Hydroid goes over drops into Undertow starts healing that person while they are doing their thing. Or he can cover a team mate who is reviving someone keeping them healed. On both of these situations now Hydroid can also grab priority targets into Undertow to cover his team mates like heavy gunners or bombards that can potentially cause trouble. With this you could change the augment mod to allow Undertow to status proc. Every certain amount of seconds it can proc like an impact proc or something in case a player wanted a different style of damage options. These changes are minor but would go a LONG way to helping Hydroid fit into a team composition. As a last note, while Hydroid is in Undertow, allow him a slightly higher efficiency or cost reduction to casting abilities while in the water. In this move he is in his natural elemental plane, so he should not have to spend more energy to use what is around him or what's inside of him. Doesn't have to be a big reduction, maybe just like another 15% or so.

TENTACLE SWARM:

I think the changes you made to this a good as well. A good step in the right direction. The changes I am suggesting are also minor changes that will just improve the use of this ability. Continue to polish the RNG of this ability. Have the tentacles actively seek out targets better & when done with their current target actually move & seek out a new target. Animation issue, you added a kraken head but it really doesn't do anything? Ever thought of having one tentacle at a time randomly feed the kraken its target? While the others are flinging around, have one tentacle do a little bit extra damage by feeding the enemy to the Kraken? That would be amazing! As far as scaling towards higher levels go, the Kraken falls off very quickly. I have a unique idea...Treat Tentacle Swarm as you do an Exalted ability. Exalted Blade, Primal Fury & Hysteria are all melee weapons right? So Hydroid summons a Kraken, the head appears & the tentacles attack enemies right? Well its the kraken attacking enemies & the tentacles are it's ARMS/LEGS. So in essence the Kraken is punching, slapping, kicking & slamming enemies, that is melee combat for the Kraken! So with this said, allow the damage to scale off of POWER STRENGTH & the melee mods Hydroid has equipped on his melee weapon! The kraken right now in the game causes chaos yes, but in mythology the Kraken was also capable of insane destruction. Let us emulate that in the game too! There is a reason for the name the "Terror in the Deep". By allowing this scaling, it will also give Hydroid more versatility in being able to deal with multiple threats in multiple factions & be able to survive & contribute at higher levels. This change of damage type will also allow him to better secure bonuses for his Augment mod Pilfering Swarm by doing better damage.

DE, these are my constructive thoughts on how to improve Hydroid without you guys having to change the core of what Hydroid is. I really hope as one of the few true Hydroid mains out there, you guys actually read this & see how I am offering positive feedback with no bashing, insulting or being greedy in any way. I would just like some help from you on how to build upon my favorite Warframe in the game. Please take these ideas into consideration, Hydroid really deserves the attention.

A Hydroid main,

N7ShadowedSoul

 

[Nazrel]

9 hours ago, Sajochi said:

For the first time ever, I can honestly say I'm very disapointed in a frames changes. This revisit didn't solve a single thing about hydroid except make him a little tankier. This honestly feels rushed and not very well thought out. Let's go over it piece by piece.

Passive:  Still lackluster, relies on rng, and is still unreliable. I thought this would be the first thing changed since it always felt like a placeholder. The tentacle that spawns doesn't even attempt to hit an enemy, and just lamely flops around. Some consistency could have been added at the very minimum. Or a complete change. There are dozens of ideas scattered around these forums that are leagues better than what this passive does. 

First ability: can't rely on it to kill, can't rely on it to CC. The damage is too low no matter how long you charge it, and explosion damage is resisted by a good amount of enemies. Second, the projectiles can be blocked by any terrain, making this ability completely useless in cluttered areas. Third, it has a very slow start up, which means most of time, enemies have already walked out of the range. Again, some consistency could have been added, like making the launch point from hydroid, and it's a huge arcing watery ball that knocks away enemies. Holding it down means you can Barrage them. And that's if we stick with the original idea of the ability. 

Second ability:  just another rhino charge. It's CC is highly situational, and is only good for the mobility. This could have been much more interesting, but it isn't. 

Third ability: Now here is where I feel more than disappointed. You know the real reason I wanted to play hydroid? Apparently it's to cosplay as a damn puddle. So much "synergy" was tossed into an ability that struggles to kill level 20 Eximus Units. But hey, you can use a highly inconsistent first ability to hit enemies you drown, and use a flat 50% reduced rhino charge while you play a puddle. Really? This is the defining move of hydroid, the one reason the players pick him up?  And the grab mechanic is so precise that it's frustrating to use. At least the ability is as useful as a real puddle, so A for effort. 

Finally, the fourth. You made a model, and made the tentacles actually try to hit enemies, and yet the ability is the same with a sad looking slug just sitting there. It's the same. Yes, you can use it with the perfection that is "result of a leaky roof" but for what reason? It's the same damn ability. It looks pretty though. 

I honestly expected more from you DE. Every frame that has been reworked or revisited has had some kind of backlash, but those turned out to be good in the end when players got used to them. This is just a fresh coat of paint, and a new windshield when we needed a new engine too. This is more of the same.

If you're going to add synergy, don't force it, and don't put it in areas where it will not help. Abilities should work well on their own and amazingly together. When you force synergy, you actually design frustrating and bad game play. Especially since all the synergy is in "I can look like pee" puddle. Here's something a buddy of mine thought up of hydroid. I urge anyone at DE to give it a read and maybe consider something from it. 

Hydroid - ocean king (excal size+ rework)

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/6c13bg/hydroid_ocean_king_excal_size_rework/

This. Also check the link, very good ideas in there.

[Malcadonus]

<moved over to correct location>

So I'm really happy to see Hydroid finally get some attention and I think the re-work is a step in the right direction. Here are some thoughts on maybe a different direction for him....

Changes to Undertow:

Using the ability at a location (while not on a puddle) creates a puddle at that location.
If on a puddle you can submerge as you do now. Holding the ability would allow you to unsubmerge from a puddle.
Limit of up to 4 puddles out at one time.
Puddles that touch merge together, but would count to puddles + 1 towards the 4 limit.
Maybe even remove the energy cost of puddles? I know crazy.
Puddles still drown enemies, should have energy drain for each one.
Puddles can be put on any surface.

Hydroid can move around inside a puddle while submerged and all other interactions with his powers remain. Tentacle swarm can now be targeted at a puddle to sprout tentacles.

Changes to Tidal Surge:

If you are not submerged same mechanics as before.
If you are submerged you can use the Tidal Surge to target a puddle and surge to it.
Enemies caught between the two puddles would be dragged into the new one upon reaching it.

 

This would allow you take over an area and use your puddles to really control movements. Also, the mobility granted would only be after setting up, but allow for some very interesting gameplay. It would feel very much like you were in a boss fight room, except you get to play the boss. Energy drain is still an issue, which is why the puddles would probably have to be free until they start trapping enemies. Maybe submerging / reappearing costs energy as well.

[Zyno]

The revisit makes Hydroid somewhat better, but I must say It's a bit underwhelming. I had some fun with Tidal Surge around when in Undertow (splatoon?) but enemies getting out of your puddle when you use it is a bit of a bummer. Revisit aside, I had hoped for a complete rework of Hydroid. It's the frame that caught my eye when I first started playing and really wanted to main it. 

Personally I think Hydroid lacks the abilities to really make him interesting or cool. The kraken that gets summoned while casting Tentacle Swarm is cool and got me thinking; why not let Hydroid become the kraken?

For an example: give his 4th ability an exalted form like Valkyr or Excalibur. Let him change appereance (lovecraftian horrorish) and equip him with tentacles that use the whip stance. Boost his health and armor in this form to make him tanky (A bit like Demon Hunters (metamorphosis) in WoW). Instead of draining energy the player must kill enemies to maintain the form (like jedi heros in battlefront) maybe give him something like a devour mechanic in which it needs to eat enemies to keep the ability timer up.

I know this will probably never happen but I think Hydroid deserves more then a revisit. 

[O.O_]

Man, I'd love to be a Hydroid main... nice _{(purely visual)} rework btw, DE.

[Synpai]

Your passive change is great.

• I wish tentacle functionality was changed such that they knocked down on spawn then slammed into enemies that got close (knock down and damage) rather than picking them up and slamming them (more of a hindrance than help).
• Heck I'm fine with them being grappled by the tentacles if they didnt flail around so much.
• I'd even prefer if Hydroid had tentacles sprawling from himself that knocked down enemies near him. This could produce some crazy interesting gameplay.

Tempest Barrage:

Should be a target ability of some kind:

Either area target, so you're focusing an area.

Or Enemy target, so that the cluster is centered around the enemy.

Tidal Surge:

Wish it clustered the enemies it gathered/ragdolled to a focal point.

Undertow:

This should function similarly to Ivara arrows: Tap to place a puddle, hold to turn into.

Tentacle Swarm:

I WANT A KRAKEN!

Somehow merge the current functionality with Chroma's pelt.

Or make it an ability combo:

I.e: Cast Tentacle Swarm, Cast Undertow, Cast Tentacle Swarm.

-Tentacle Swam picks enemies up

-Undertow causes grabbed enemies to be dragged under (Regardless of location)

-Second cast summons Kraken

[C.4.W]

April Fool's isn't quite yet...

[theMongoose]

Ideally for me:

In my opinion tentacle swarm should have just been turned into the kraken. A shark/squid hybrid that swims around the range of hydroid and leaps up to grab enemies and pull them under like undertow/tidal surge doing damage the whole time. Maybe even made into channeling.

Tempest barrage should have been changed to be a projectile like fire blast that explodes. On impact and creates cluster bombs like the zarr that would blind enemies that aren't killed by the blast. As it is, it's just too random to be counted on and the damage is too low for higher levels.

The changes to his 2 and 3 are fine. Nothing to complain about there.

Overall, hydroid is spinning his wheels. Sure, he has a little more survivability now but his only viable builds require augments. He is not good on his own. This was an unfortunate baby step where he needed something more. He got some love for now and hopefully they can patch  in a bit more in the next week so he can really shine when his prime drops.

[(PSN)Shaun-T-Wilson]

Since his first ability damages in undertow, wouldn't it make even more sense to allow his tentacles to damage the enemy in undertow as well.

[FoxFX]

Just now, (PS4)Shaun-T-Wilson said:

Since his first ability damages in undertow, wouldn't it make even more sense to allow his tentacles to damage the enemy in undertow as well.

Apparently, this revisit did not do that for Hydroid's Undertow. A suggestion was made for having Tentacle Swarm increase the Damage over Time of Undertow for the duration of Tentacle Swarm.

[13QZXXTTX]

On 8/10/2017 at 11:26 AM, [DE]Megan said:

Feedback appreciated here: 

 

[Cytobel]

First, flavor fail on the charged ability mechanic here rather than on Volt.  I NEEDED to mention that, as the mechanic was (afaik) first mentioned in Volt's Rework Megathread.

Alright, so I'm using Hydroid right now.  I'm not impressed with all of it, but it's not as bad as it's been.  Recall, there have been a fair few problems for Hydroid to overcome:  RNGesus worship at it's highly-ineffective finest, poor AI on a CC ultimate, bad game interactiveness on the puddle (I know that's not really a term, but I'm brewing coffee now, so I may fix that), and no survvivability mechanics on a squish 'Frame.

Hydroid is much better now IN SOME WAYS.  The way his abilities FLOW together is WONDERFUL, the fact that they overlap a bit better is appreciated, and the fact that the puddle doesn't flat-out remove you from playing the game temporarily is a BIG change for the better.

Alright, so I've gotta say it:  Hydroid is still in trouble.  The Water/Pirate theme leaves him in a schizoprenic design space, where focusing on the Water aspect might not (I'm more likely to accept a Water 'Frame than anything pirate, because personal BS reasons).  The wave still forces him to move (great in the puddle, terrible out of it).  Tempest Barrage and Tentacle Swarm both still suffer from RNG issues, with TB being the one worst hit by this (felt like better AI on the Tentacles meant something when I was playing Captain Hentai, so kudos there).

A major difficulty I have here is that I want something Hydroid ISN'T.  He's the Water 'Frame, but goddamn "pirate" is tagged to that NEEDLESSLY.

Worse, the pirate is purposeless.  It brings visual theme and NOTHING ELSE OF VALUE to the 'Frame.  It doesn't add any sort of loot detection and it does nothing to make him more elusive when he's running away (that one made me smirk when I read it months back).  He doesn't do anything amusing with this thematic choice.  Unfortunately, somehow many of us have tied the lack of reliability in his kit to the lack of reliability in pirates (usually in Hollywood).  We wind up with core facets of his skills being objectionable, limiting our ability to use said abilities (I really hate Tidal Surge MOVING ME when I'm not puddled).

As things are right now, I'm happy Hydroid is finally up to snuff for his FIRST RELEASE (it's only a bit more than 3 years late, but better than nothing).  Had this been how he dropped back in 2014, I'd have been happier with him.  That said, he's now in need of a PROPER rework to the MODERN GAME ENVIRONMENT.  MANY thing have changed since he was first introduced, and much can be said about how different the game now is.  I DO support the thoughts and direction of this rework thus far, but he isn't a 'Frame I see being played in this state.

I doubt this is enough to make me even vaguely consider the upcomming Prime Access, ESPECIALLY when the weapons choices are so, shall we say, unpopular.  I'm concerned this won't sell the Prime, and that renders all the hard work on Hydroid irrelevant.

Edited August 11, 2017 by Cytobel

[13QZXXTTX]

On 8/10/2017 at 11:26 AM, [DE]Megan said:

Feedback appreciated here: 

 

[Trentiel]

Another good one.

for synergy for the 3 & 4.

What if Tentacle Swarm was more mobile, and acted like summoned allies.

Then when Undertow was active, they would start feeding enemies to the Kraken head emerging from your puddle?

Just a thought.