My Clan Was Stolen!!! - A cautionary tale

[Spafbi]

I am a long-time player of Warframe (since 2013), have nearly 2000 hours of accumulated in-game mission time, and was the founder of a very small clan of players. I lost my clan. If you are a clan officer of any clan, please read the exchange below and don't let it happen to you. The following exchange with DE/Warframe support is presented in its entirety (except the removal of a player name) to help players be aware of an obscure and very little known policy.

 

My clan is missing!

• 

  SpafbiYesterday at 12:33

  The small clan of which I am the founder and leader is missing! I logged in after a hiatus only to find I can no longer view my clan or join my dojo. Was it wiped? Is there any way to get it back?

  The clan name was Sneaky Old Bastards.

• 

  SpafbiYesterday at 19:05

  This is on the PC platform, BTW

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  Support Yesterday at 19:45

  Hello Spafbi,

  After checking, the clan still exists and it seems you were once part of it but got kicked/removed from it.

  Support

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  SpafbiYesterday at 20:04

  I was the founder. How am I kicked? Nobody had permissions to kick me. I would like this restored as I put both time and money (plat for emblem).

• 

  SpafbiYesterday at 20:08

  Shoot... I couldn't even remove a player from the clan which I had elevated to founder status alongside myself... It doesn't make sense I could be removed.

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  Support Yesterday at 20:10

  Hello again Spafbi,

  A clanmate of yours filed a ticket regarding your inactivity and the clan creator/founder tag was transferred to another player.

  As per: https://digitalextremes.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/200049929-Clan-Alliance-and-Dojo-Guide

  *A note to Founders/Warlords and the DE Policy on Dealing With Internal Clan Matters:
  Keep in mind that once a player has been promoted to Warlord, they can no longer be demoted or kicked from the clan, so be very careful as a Clan founder when choosing other clan members to promote to this rank. The exception to this scenario is for clans created post Update 13 as these clans creators will be able to demote or kick other Warlords from their clan.

  If the Warlord(s) or Creator of a clan has been inactive for 30 days or longer they can be replaced by submitting a ticket to our support desk (we want to ensure that all clans are able to function correctly, which is not possible without at least one active Warlord). Digital Extremes makes it our policy not to get involved with internal clan matters and any other difficulties that may arise with a Warlord or other players in a clan will generally need to be resolved internally by the clan members involved.

  Thank you for your patience regarding this matter and have a nice day.

  Support

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  SpafbiYesterday at 20:15

  Can you please let me know the player's name so I may contact them?

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  Support Yesterday at 21:29

  Hello Spafbi,

  You may contact its current creator/founder <redacted>.

  Support

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  SpafbiYesterday at 21:41

  Great... Unfortunately, that player hasn't been on in 44 days. Any chance my ownership of the clan could be restored?

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  SpafbiYesterday at 21:43

  They guy was just a low ranking member of my tiny clan... he was never a founder. This is so disappointing.

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  SpafbiYesterday at 22:09

  Please pass the following to the appropriate DE personnel.

  I do feel the need to let DE know that I feel cheated by an obscure policy buried on a support website. Since 2013 I have spent almost two thousand hours playing Warframe and supporting Digital Extremes. I brought a good number of players to the game, participated in dev streams (I even won a plat prize!), streamed Warframe on Twitch and YouTube, bought platinum on several occasions, and participated in the Keystone alpha. After spending a considerable amount of time and money on the Warframe product, I find it extremely inconsiderate of DE to not even have the courtesy to at least notify me by email that a request had been made to transfer ownership of my clan. Had I been made aware of such a policy and that such a request had been made (to transfer ownership of my clan), I would have taken action to ensure retention of my clan rights.

  Life circumstances reduced my available game time, so I chose to spend what little time I had to play games of which my long-time gaming buddies we're then playing. During that time I still closely followed the progression of the game and excitement had built to where I knew I'd be returning. However, returning to Warframe only to find my account robbed of a clan because a non-privileged member of my clan requested ownership be transferred to him during my absence, it’s needless to say my excitement in returning has been deflated and severely soured. I prefer small clans, don't wish to join another clan, and have little desire to form another clan and replay the sheer amount of time needed to obtain the game resources I have already spent in building out my clan dojo and researching blueprints. On top of that, even if I did create a new clan, I don’t wish to again pay platinum to resubmit my clan emblem (which I love!) only to have it likely rejected as it already exists in the game.

  I certainly hope I can be restored as warlord/founder of my clan, but if not I believe I'll just call it quits (as all the other founders of my clan have already done). As I previously mentioned, I'm simply not up to the task of re-obtaining the in-game resources to replicate my prior efforts in creating a clan dojo+blueprints, only to take another break from the game (which is likely as variety is good!), and risk having to do it all over yet again.

  If restoration of my position in the clan cannot be secured, my Sneaky Old Bastards clan (we’re at clansob.com) will likely forever R.I.P. in Warframe, but we will live on in other games.

• 

  Support Yesterday at 23:17

  Hello Spafbi,

  For the most part, the reason why it's stated (as far as inactivity is concerned) at the very least, 30 days or longer. Leaving a clan behind without a clan creator/founder or Active warlord would leave the other clanmates that are still active looking for one (should they need that particular member's capabilities ie joining an Alliance, setting up an alliance etc etc).

  To be honest, 30d is quite long for a break. We understand that players still have lives to live and real life concerns to deal with that's why it's set at that minimum amount (in this case, we find it justified to pass it on the next most highest and active member of the clan). That being said, I understand where you're coming from but we'd like you to also understand why we entertain such requests.

  We cannot just outright give the ownership back to you (as you were removed by the new clan creator/founder). However, I did check the clan and its current creator/founder and found out that he/she was inactive for quite some time already. What you can opt to do is to ask to be invited back to the clan (as you're not even currently a member of it) and have the current creator/founder file a ticket to us requesting to pass the creator/founder tag to be passed on to you (or for this instance, since he/she seems to be inactive long enough for us to step in already) a member of the clan can file a ticket regarding passing it to another.

  Hope you'd understand and thank you for your cooperation.

  Support

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  SpafbiToday at 00:06

  I wholeheartedly disagree that 30 days is a lengthy time to step away from any game. But as it is, given the in-game clan was so small to start, the new owner wasted no time before throwing all previous officers and members onto the curb - it appears all of the original members and founders have been removed. I don't know a single person who might still be in the clan and active. Nobody on our clan website, Facebook group, TeamSpeak, or Discord knows of anyone still in the in-game clan. Needless to say, I am extremely disappointed. I will publicly repeat my previous message of which I still have hope is making it's way up through the chain, as well as make public DE's response. This will not be done in malice. It is a warning to others of a little known and practically hidden policy (unless you purposely go out of your way to find out about it - but then why would you even think to do such a thing?) which does not allow for notification that in game assets, both earned and/or paid for, will be lost, as well as to share the response others might expect should they discover themselves in a similar situation.

  This Tenno has fought his last Warframe battle.

[Legion-Shields]

idk

[UltimateGrr]

...So you were inactive longer than 30 days, and your second in command was a jerk (since the most senior officer after you was awarded Warlord status), and now you're butt hurt about your poor officer choices.

Working as intended I suppose.

 

[Spafbi]

Just now, UltimateGrr said:

...So you were inactive longer than 30 days, and your second in command was a jerk (since the most senior officer after you was awarded Warlord status), and now you're butt hurt about your poor officer choices.

Working as intended I suppose.

 

No, the player who took control had no clan rank or privileges other than membership.

[DaftMeat]

While I feel bad for your situation, I also feel bad for all the players who were left behind in your clan without any active leadership. The policy DE has in place may have not been ideal for you, but it is put in place for people like the active players in your clan so that they can continue to play together and progress with clan activities and continue to build the clan even when the founder leaves for an indeterminate length of time.

That being said, maybe you can get back in touch with any players who remember you and and see if get your clan status back via the current leaders. Best of luck.

[o.0-]

I think its best to remove the name of the inactive who filed that request in the past, as it likely falls under the name and shame guidelines.

 

A shame this happened, nonetheless it could have been handled better in more ways than one from the various involved parties.

[Chipputer]

You might not feel like 30 days is a long time but it's... an entire month. That's quite a while for a simple, "break." Not only that, nobody knows how long you're going to be gone when you leave.

I notice no mention of how long you were gone. You make a point to say they were gone for 44 days but make no effort to tell how long your obscure, "hiatus," was.

 

[ImpyMidna]

25 minutes ago, Spafbi said:

 

I wholeheartedly disagree that 30 days is a lengthy time to step away from any game.

Shoutout to @daftMeat.

You can't be what you thought was a "leader" by taking some 30 days off or more and not expect someone to overthrow your position. Also; lmao at the wholeheartedly part. That was funny.

[Suncake]

Alright, I understand passing the clan ownership to someone else if the warlord was inactive for a long time, but here the support refuses to give you back your clan in which you put a lot of time and effort, and that's actually unfair! What if I get injured and unable to log in for a couple of months?

[Spafbi]

I formed the clan simply for my own benefit and enjoyment, as well as to help out a small handful of close friends. The loss of the clan was opened up as a possibility when a single outsider was let in with no officer permissions - a clan officer was just trying to help that player get started. I was one of the last truly active players, and as far as I know, there were no other active players in the clan until the one player returned during my absence (and 30 days is a blink of the eye at my age) and made a claim for the clan.

While I am disappointed, I'm not salty. I truly consider the issue closed. I simply don't have the luxury of time, nor the desire, to repeat my actions of the past to recreate lost glory. I will be leaving Warframe.

I do want to make it clear that the original post was not made in an effort to get the clan back. While I understand DE's policy, I do think they should at least modify it a bit to notify a clan warlord of a possible loss of assets to other players (after all, there's real money invested in some of these dojos!) . My purpose for the post was to let warlords of other clans know of this obscure policy. The original post is a PSA and that's all.

[NanoFox006]

You can ask your clanmates to made a ticket for leadership transfer. But if none of your friends stayed, i'm not sure the "hi, you don't know me, but i'm your new leader" thing will work.

[Spafbi]

6 minutes ago, Suncake said:

Alright, I understand passing the clan ownership to someone else if the warlord was inactive for a long time, but here the support refuses to give you back your clan in which you put a lot of time and effort, and that's actually unfair! What if I get injured and unable to log in for a couple of months?

It certainly could happen to you in that situation. For me, I've been working on my start-up company - that is a huge time sink.

[Spafbi]

Just now, NanoFox006 said:

You can ask your clanmates to made a ticket for leadership transfer.

I know who made the transfer, and I remember playing with him the few times he came around. He was memorable as one of the only outsiders we let in. Keep in mind that he also hasn't been active for 44 days. As far as I know, as he cleaned house, it's likely the clan exists now with only that one player, and he's not around.

[Spartan336]

I believe you should have gotten you Clan back. It's very true that people have good reasons for being away for 30 days, and that's no reason to loose ownership of a Clan. Especially if you have other Warlords that can look after the Clan while you're away. 

[(XBOX)Deadly Moves]

im fairly new to warframe, and i have created a clan which until the other day i was the only member. I have built and researched a lot of the weapons etc by myself. So why do you need to have an active clan leader?  How are the other clan members limited by the leaders absence?

[nickelshark]

This is why if you are the head or founder of a clan you should do your best to keep in contact with the rest of the clan. Especially if you are taking extended leave from the game.

[SilvaDreams]

Well your clan wasn't stolen, if all your friends left leaving a lack of leadership and he was the next in line than it is both your and your friends fault. He merely did what made sense and took over.

Edited October 6, 2017 by SilvaDreams

[AbhijitSM]

To be fair whatever policy DE adopts there will always be a grey area left which will raise these kind of issues. But i do certainly agree that the clan leader should be notified on his registered email id of his removal of leadership due to inactivity. If there is no reply/action within say 14 days then the clan ownership can be transferred to the next in line. In our clan there are 3 warlords. I was inactive for 8 months due to serious burnout but as my other 2 friends were there it didn't result into any issue. Right now another of our warlords is inactive but me & the other one are there so there will be no issues whatsoever.   

Edited October 6, 2017 by AbhijitSM

[fatpig84]

My clan makes it a 3 months rule.
Honestly 30 days is too short to start booting folks.

Yet alone change the Warlord.

Edited October 6, 2017 by fatpig84

[TheBrsrkr]

2 hours ago, ImpyMidna said:

Shoutout to @daftMeat.

You can't be what you thought was a "leader" by taking some 30 days off or more and not expect someone to overthrow your position. Also; lmao at the wholeheartedly part. That was funny.

Sorry to tell you man, but real life happens sometimes. A month off of  playing a game  that takes 20 minutes at a time to finish one mission isn't really that long. Warframe isn't my job, my job is my job. Things could happen to your  kid and wives. You could enter crunch time at your job. Your ISP could be acting up. You could have port problems. You out be one of those people who can only play on Saturday or something and have something to do on those days that isn't Warframe. 

[Sziklamester]

This is the reason for why I make friendships in the game and when I make a clan I choose wisely my members. Also I promote at least 5 warlord to my clans because I know the consequences if I am far from the activity timeline. Also the more leader could coordinate better the clan things and in a larger clans the more leader is necessary. In ghost clans I also promote 2-3 person to warlord for this reasons because the clans needs leaders. There were many issues with warlord inactivities and many thread made to point out the system is bad and there were clans where the leaders were inactive for a year or more so.

Also I made so many clans from the smallest to the biggest tier so I know some metholds but always keep in mind only give leadership if you trust enough to your mates if you cannot then don't make a clan because if you go far away and long time not check then it could rot. Be more active.

Edited October 6, 2017 by Sziklamester

[Sziklamester]

1 hour ago, (Xbox One)Deadly Moves said:

im fairly new to warframe, and i have created a clan which until the other day i was the only member. I have built and researched a lot of the weapons etc by myself. So why do you need to have an active clan leader?  How are the other clan members limited by the leaders absence?

The leader gives the titles and the rights to do something. If you are one man clan it is not problematic because you are the warlord of your clan and you can do whatever you want. If the clan grows and more peoples come then you need to give them permission to do a certain action otherwise noone can do research, make rail, invite-promote-demote members.

[(XBOX)Deadly Moves]

6 minutes ago, Sziklamester said:

The leader gives the titles and the rights to do something. If you are one man clan it is not problematic because you are the warlord of your clan and you can do whatever you want. If the clan grows and more peoples come then you need to give them permission to do a certain action otherwise noone can do research, make rail, invite-promote-demote members.

yeah im not scared of losing my clan/progress. i would only allow close trusted friends into the clan. I just wondered what impact an inactive leader would have.

i only created a clan for the gear you can only get through the Dojo.

Edited October 6, 2017 by (XB1)Deadly Moves

[Sziklamester]

Just now, (Xbox One)Deadly Moves said:

yeah im not scared of losing my clan/progress. i would only allow close trusted friends into the clan. I just wondered what impact an inactive leader would have.

Only this. If you give permission to other members to do your job exactly then it is fine. If you not promote any of your members in the clan and not give permission then they can afford those actions.

[o0Despair0o]

A whole month, buddy. You should be be happy that the "leader" of your clan isn't like the leader of my old clan before I and some friends decided to go our own way and create a new clan, because he kicked everyone who hasn't been online for just 2 weeks.

Like literally, you went on vacation or something for 2 weeks, and you're kicked.

 

That's the good thing about most smaller clans that big ones - you're less likely to get kicked for some nonsense like this.