Banshee gets top damage in Hydron and no one blinks an eye

[Thundervision]

Just a coincidence, because the keyword is «Hydron». Frames that aren't RQ Banshee or WoF Ember have very little to do with such behavior on Hydron.

 

Public mode for Hydron and Berehynia (pick any other specific node which is popular for something specific) is ruined by a bit too «friendly» community that did (and still does) itself a big disservice thinking that it's helping the other players when mindlessly pointing out such nodes to rank up on.

Why?

Because nobody thinks of the consequences. And why should they? They think they're helping. But, later, when they come back to the place they widely suggested before all they will see is the results of their help aka «people used to do 20 waves before, now they leave at 5th/10th wave! People are stupid!». Of course, I'm exaggerating it a bit, but you get the picture. Almost everything controversal that has happened in WF started exactly the same way. From Draco to current MemeSlides4Life. The other issue which partly fuels situations like this is a herd behavior and echo chamber (dare to say something against meta/abused/popular here on the forums or the holy /r/warframe, none of your proofs or examples will help you).

When it becomes a well-known thing you can forget about doing anything but that one specific thing which made it popular in the first place, and it doesn't matter if you want or don't want to.  Right to the point that to play the way it was initially designed/intended you have to search for a group in the recruiting. Sooner or later, but things like this attract dev's attention.

And this is, folks, how abusive stuff rises and falls in the game (and there's no need to feel yourself smarter than devs or to whine about «nerf this, nerf that» threads when there's the data developers have access to)

 

 

[Terrornaut]

7 hours ago, lordpie said:

The funny thing about all of this is that a sound quake banshee is hardly viable past level 50, while a good mag with a mediocre team can easily go into the 300s.  The community as a whole is fairly ignorant in terms of using creative and effective teams.  The community tends to pick a  meta build or setup and beat it to death until something else is found, and somehow, people enjoy that.

 

If you can't tell I like to play mag.

Gamers are often (mentally) super lazy. Its always like this.  Many want to go with the easiest, safest options that guarantee them success.

 

6 hours ago, schilds said:

SQ Banshee is worse than Limbo in terms of trolling. She kills things SLOWLY. What's that, you say, you get the top score? Well of course you do, because now all the enemies are stuck in their spawn points and if anyone else wants to kill them they have to chase them down across opposite ends of the map.

Never a fan of SQ Banshee, even on Hydron, because I'm standing around doing nothing gaining focus and XP at a rate a couple seconds faster than if I was killing mobs myself as a few frames...and...have to check all the spawn rooms for loot constantly when she's up, instead of letting things come.  Speedva+anything is much better for Hydron and plenty of places (speedva+loki is favorite combo for defense, and my frame and then a defense/support frame).

1 hour ago, (PS4)Valfrekr said:

I might be the only one who doesn't care about my kill count/damage % at the end of a mission. I tend to do a lot of farming for resources or use Hydron to power level new weapons or Frames. If Banshee, Mesa, Ember, etc. toss on their 4th, and take out the mobs quicker, it doesn't matter to me. What I don't like is being on a defense mission, having folks queue up for another wave, and at the last second, queue out, leaving me to deal with 5 wave solo. It's a jerk move, but what can you do?

 

I do.  I don't really care so much about other people's counts and everything though, because some people legit aren't putting in any effort so what would you bother measuring yourself against that for?  For me, its a way to keep track of how efficient I've been over several matches.  And well, sometimes it does feel a little cool when you've outdone the rest of your time by 3x or more in kills and damage and have taken less damage than most.  It doesn't really matter, sure, although, kills matters more than damage, keep in mind.  Obliterating a mob for 2,000,000 damage every 5 seconds is not going to get you any more loot or closer to the objective in most cases as opposed to killing 5-10 enemies every 5 seconds.  More kills = more loot dropped, more farm for people.

[YoDoge]

Well I don't know what's up with people in these cases. True by some part and by some part not.

Personally I play a lot of Banshee and Mesa and I never see people behave too much different. I didn't pick up to Mag for some odd reason though I like to see Mag every once in a while.

In my perspective Banshee can do a favor for those who want to upgrade their gear fast. Of course Banshee player like myself should keep in mind that not every unit will just simply die. But it also should ring other people's bells if wave isn't ending quickly like it should. I played with a friend and clan member to rank up gear. My sound quake couldn't finnish off tougher enemies like Nox. So my friend and me too, went to kill off that last enemy. Sound quake is extremely useful ability, but of course people must realize break point between useful and useless. Though I like to play savage Banshee when I am not in defense mission and I do play other than Banshee in defense.

As for Mag crisis, people just heavily dislike Mag. Why? I don't know, she is a great frame in my opinion.

[kgabor]

Not sure what you all are talking about when you say Banshee falls off around lvl. 40, it can deal with lvl. 70-s or so with Sonar+Resonating Quake easily and Mag-s Polarize scales worse actually.

You're also contributing a lot with the cc effect on tougher enemies on higher levels in endless scaled up content and marking them on the radar if you're playing Banshee right.

I never leave because of Mag or Saryn, for me they are some of the least annoying frames but ye, some do even in xp farm maps out of salt just to troll their team or something.

There are many less popular nodes to farm xp where teammates usually stay for longer, Stöfler comes to mind and Mot can also give good xp but there are way less good teams there.

[saltygr33n]

I usually always leave sortie, because it's kind of rare running into a group that is patient enough to wait for you to change loadouts. I don't want to deal with people who just click ready and start when everyone isn't ready. There are also times I spend 1 minute doing something else so I don't want to hold the team back for that 1 minute; I don't like it when others do it, so I don't do it.

I don't and have not farmed hydron, at least I don't remember ever farming in hydron with anyone, so I have no opinion there.

I play banshee quite often these days, and I really don't understand why the quake build, it's super boring; I love using max efficiency banshee's sonar, silence, and sonic boom, with only stretch as only range mod.

Edited January 3, 2018 by saltygr33n

[-Temp0-]

8 часов назад, Varacal сказал:

or maybe, people are actually maxed at wave 5 already, i mean everytime i level up a weapon, everyone leaves at wave 15, so my weapon's exp from 0 is now at 27 or 28 [and no, i dont just leech, i use chroma so my weapon still does a ton]. so, i go join a new group and its maxed out at 5

i mean, do people really care who the top damage in the team is? 

They don't. Op is overthinking a lot of things.

The only reason why people would care is if x kills a ton if there's a difference with that x doing it with their weapon or a frame. It is more beneficial to them if it's a frame kills' that's why someone might "prefer banshee" for example over a Mag on hydron on their team.

Цитата

im just venting a bit. Nobody cares if Mesa carries the team. Same with Mirage, Valkyr, Excalibur, etc. but the instant Mag gets near the top people always have to leave the group as fast as they can. When you main a frame for hundreds of hours as I have, it becomes harder and harder to ignore these kinds of things. It gets really old.

Maybe stop thinking in league terms then you will stop seeing things that aren't there.

Edited January 3, 2018 by -Temp0-

[(PSN)Chel-El]

7 hours ago, crimsoNIOX said:

well I guess you can say they are "framist".

that makes Mag defenders “framinists”

[FashionFrame]

8 hours ago, saradonin said:

Am I the only one thinking the other way around about this?

Whenever I see soundquake Banshee in anything higher than ~40, I facepalm and usually leave. It isn't any better than Limbo trolls, her locking all enemies 40-50 meters away and ticking these eximus and disruptors for 50-200 damage at 20 stacks is not only boring for everyone else, but it significantly slows the mission progress.

Mag on the other hand is a quite rare view lately, a good Mag even more. I can't see any reason why would I mind someone else stripping armor and shields.

This is why whenever I use quake banshee in an interception or mobile defense, I always have radar mods equipped, so people can still go out and get their kills. Very easy boredom fix, but people using banshee never seem to ever do it. 

[grrmisfit]

every node has its issues, but i do agree if 2+ are leaving at last second its probably to be an arse. unless 1 person already clicked extract and other 2 havent.. then in my case i always extract if 1 person does just cause i prefer the spawn rate of 4 players but also to prevent what your saying. honestly tho, check recruit channel I always see groups for xp farm in hydron

[(PSN)Chel-El]

OP don’t take it so personally 

On sorties I leave every single tier not because of the squad, BUT because I would like to update my arsenal accordingly.

The enemies or conditions may require another set so my frame/weapon builds on that tier may not meet the mission requirements.

Yes even the team I assume will want to swap their stuff. Why would a spy team go straight to defense if you catch my meaning.

As for Hydron i don’t know people’s goals- xp farm, relic farm, component farm etc. So it’s hard to assume what they intend to do 

Edited January 3, 2018 by (PS4)Chel-El

[Cloud]

9 hours ago, Legion-Shields said:

Mag gets top damage and everyone leaves at wave 5.

 

Every. Single. Time.

 

Seriously, I could practically afk and we'll go to wave 15 no problem, but if I'm mindlessly spamming Polarize just like everyone else is spamming Meme Strike then suddenly it's "oh, my weapons are maxed" at wave 5, then they leave the instant they get to orbit so nobody can check. This has happened far too many times with too many unique players to be mere coincidence.

 

I see this same behavior in Sorties too. If I underperform but someone else got their ego fed in the Tab screen then the squad will stick together for all three missions, but if I outperform the rest of the team (or someone else is playing Mag and they score the highest) then I have to find a new squad for each individual Sortie tier. If I use a different frame and perform "alright"  I'll typically get the same thing that happens when I underperform on Mag. 

 

Even better, sometimes I'll do poorly on Tier 1, and nobody will leave the squad. I'll get the top score in tier 2 and everybody will leave, even if the mission went perfectly smoothly with few or no deaths (which is MOST Sorties). Same thing happens with defense and survival missions. I've had many cases where someone or a duo were bragging about some weapon or synergy they discovered and how they wanted to stick around until Wave 30 or "an hour", but once the enemies reach the point where it takes more than a stare to kill them, and I start playing seriously, and it's only Wave 14 and I'm clearly gaining on the guy in the number one spot, they'll stop talking and suddenly decide they need to leave as soon as possible. This ONLY happens if I'm playing Mag. If I'm playing any other frame they never care. Ever.

 

so what's the meaning of this? People in-game love to perpetuate the myth that Mag is a weak frame, but when they see what happens when she's played by someone that knows how to use her do they just interpret it as them (and everyone else in the squad who isn't the Mag) playing like garbage?

 

im just venting a bit. Nobody cares if Mesa carries the team. Same with Mirage, Valkyr, Excalibur, etc. but the instant Mag gets near the top people always have to leave the group as fast as they can. When you main a frame for hundreds of hours as I have, it becomes harder and harder to ignore these kinds of things. It gets really old. 

 

Edit: I'm totally open to the possibility that I'm just seeing things that aren't there. I know I can be pretty sensitive. But some questions just need to be answered...

Or maybe people play for actually... play? 

If someone who wants to enjoy himself goes in a mission where he can't touch enemies or try a certain build because someone else is annihilating everything, he will leave, it does not concern at all tab stats. And this happen for Banshee as well any frame used as a nuke.

For me it just depends on my mood, if I'm lazy, it does not bother me at all. If I'm in the mood for actually play the game and enjoy myself with a certain frame or build, I'll leave and probably solo.

You cannot pretend people to do what you want or rest in a game they find boring, and nobody force you to stay in banshee games, you're free to go anytime.

Play as you want and let people do it as well.

[OoKeNnEtHoO]

I think those players don't know that affinity is shared additively.

Can't really blame new people for thinking that the game is like other games where experience is given mostly to the one who makes the kill.

I don't think the game actually explains affinity.

[DrBorris]

The reason people stick with Banshee is because she can do Hydron, especially the first 15 waves, faster than any other frame.

Sure, you may have most damage, but that does not mean the waves were going especially fast.

 

Also, Mag does have the Limbo problem (albeit to a much lesser degree) with Magnetize and not letting people shoot the things.

 

People don't care that Mag is carrying, get over yourself. I'd say at max a quarter of my Sortie groups stick together, it has nothing to do with the frame. I swear to god Mag "mains" are starting to get this annoying complex that the world is out to get them. Spoiler: It's not.

Spoiler

Also I will still argue that Mag is bad for more complicated reasons than potency, there is more to a Warframe than just being able to complete the task at hand. But this is a discussion for another topic. And Mag (Prime) is my most played frame so there's also that.

 

[Gemini_Jenvas]

Why do people even farm affinity? Imo that's the worst way one could waste their time in warframe, a game that is built around wasting time.

[TheGrimCorsair]

Err, can't speak for the group you found, OP, but when I level weapons on Hydron, most groups seem to leave at 10 which leaves me needing around 3-4 waves to top off whatever's left.

[Legion-Shields]

6 minutes ago, DrBorris said:

Also, Mag does have the Limbo problem (albeit to a much lesser degree) with Magnetize and not letting people shoot the things.

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Also I will still argue that Mag is bad for more complicated reasons than potency, there is more to a Warframe than just being able to complete the task at hand. But this is a discussion for another topic. And Mag (Prime) is my most played frame so there's also that.

 

I've never understood this part. Magnetize cannot be cast unless there's an enemy to cast it on. If you see a Magnetize Bubble it means shooting it will damage enemies, amplify your damage, and cause a huge satisfying explosion once the bubble's duration ends. Every time I see a Nyx use her 4 I shoot into it because it helps clear enemies. Same with other Mag players and their bubbles. What's the big deal?

[(XBOX)Tucker D Dawg]

Just now, Legion-Shields said:

I've never understood this part. Magnetize cannot be cast unless there's an enemy to cast it on. If you see a Magnetize Bubble it means shooting it will damage enemies, amplify your damage, and cause a huge satisfying explosion once the bubble's duration ends. Every time I see a Nyx use her 4 I shoot into it because it helps clear enemies. Same with other Mag players and their bubbles. What's the big deal?

My only issue with it is often the Mag player is terrible and spams them all over on low priority targets while the high priority targets can't be hit because all the damn bubbles.

As for the OP - people leave for whatever reason they want - they don't like the squad, they get called away from the game, they're done with levelling up their thing, they want to do something else.  You are being hypersensitive.

 

As for most damage dealt - that number is just plain broken.  You can put a mag bubble out and "steal" everyone elses damage. Sure you might be amplifying it - but If i shoot it with 38k damage, I'll get credit for none - you get my 38k*your muliplier.  They had actually changed nova's 4th and the way damage is attributed for this very reason and am surprised they didn't do the same with mag.  But that aside, the number is still glitched and meaningless - just as one example I can throw out a zenistar, go to tenno form, and kill everything while my teammates sit on their backside. But i'll do ZERO damage because the damage I deal goes into a black hole when I do that.

So Mag can claim credit for others damage, the number is flat out wrong and then there is the most important point:  that number is meaningless for almost every mission type.

 

[Legion-Shields]

2 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Tucker D Dawg said:

My only issue with it is often the Mag player is terrible and spams them all over on low priority targets while the high priority targets can't be hit because all the damn bubbles.

As for the OP - people leave for whatever reason they want - they don't like the squad, they get called away from the game, they're done with levelling up their thing, they want to do something else.  You are being hypersensitive.

 

As for most damage dealt - that number is just plain broken.  You can put a mag bubble out and "steal" everyone elses damage. Sure you might be amplifying it - but If i shoot it with 38k damage, I'll get credit for none - you get my 38k*your muliplier.  They had actually changed nova's 4th and the way damage is attributed for this very reason and am surprised they didn't do the same with mag.  But that aside, the number is still glitched and meaningless - just as one example I can throw out a zenistar, go to tenno form, and kill everything while my teammates sit on their backside. But i'll do ZERO damage because the damage I deal goes into a black hole when I do that.

So Mag can claim credit for others damage, the number is flat out wrong and then there is the most important point:  that number is meaningless for almost every mission type.

 

So you're saying if DE fixed the way Magnetize credited damage dealt to enemies people would shoot into it more?

[(XBOX)Tucker D Dawg]

7 minutes ago, Legion-Shields said:

So you're saying if DE fixed the way Magnetize credited damage dealt to enemies people would shoot into it more?

no i was addressing this

Quote

 

Mag gets top damage and everyone leaves at wave 5.

 

 

and saying that "top damage" is broken in many ways some of which are related to mag and many of which are not and a pointless stat to look at.  DE should just remove it from the summary screen.   And further I was saying that even if mag was doing "top damage", that people leave for many reasons that have nothing to do with damage dealt.

 

EDIT TO ADD: Also, I don't think many people look at damage dealt number when deciding to stay or leave since it is not shown until after you have left unless you bring it up specifically AND you need to do so BEFORE the stay/leave screen appears.  

Edited January 3, 2018 by (XB1)Tucker D Dawg

[Legion-Shields]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Tucker D Dawg said:

no i was addressing this

and saying that "top damage" is broken in many ways some of which are related to mag and many of which are not and a pointless stat to look at.  DE should just remove it from the summary screen.   And further I was saying that even if mag was doing "top damage", that people leave for many reasons that have nothing to do with damage dealt.

I completely agree, DE should remove it along with the rest of the mission stats. I was completely shocked when I first realized the tab button had a feature and that said feature was exactly what you'd expect to find in a competitive shooter. The only reason I found out about it was because it was impossible to ignore the way other people behaved when they were the top damage dealer. It took me like 300-400 hours of playing this game before I finally decided to press it during a mission, since it's supposed to be a cooperative game where everyone plays off of each other's strengths to complete the mission as smoothly as possible. But when everyone else is treating it like a competition and is playing to make themselves look good while leaving their teammates in the dust it kind of rubs me the wrong way.

 

and of course I understand that there is no way to know why any one person leaves on an individual basis, but when you play long enough and gather a large enough sample size you can't help but notice patterns (sure, maybe they're wrong, but that's why I made this thread). I started Waframe in update 9, and the more popular this game has become the more I began to notice this competitive atmosphere in my missions. Anyways I'm way past venting and ranting about this, it was 2 AM when I made this thread. Time to move on.

[Lahared]

Let's try this again then:

Nyx's energy drain is affected by allies or enemies shooting the bubble, this is known. Additionally as I mentioned before my overwhelming confusion, rivens and specific high damage weapons can take a chunk out of the energy pool. Efficiency can only do so much against the amplified damage that rivens can give weapons. Provided one doesn't have the gear, a trinity, or any other energy generating frame, I suppose I can see the frustration they might have. The only way I could see these issues is because I did use the frame on hydron and noticed what happened.

 

 

 

Edited January 3, 2018 by Lahared

[Kinetos]

I don't care who has what place on the scoreboard if I'm for all intents and purposes not there I'll make it a reality. 

[(XBOX)Tucker D Dawg]

4 minutes ago, Lahared said:

 

 

 

Is your issue the numbers on the mission summary screen or that playing co-op exposes you to things that you don't like? If it isn't that then, I'm not really not seeing what this is about.

You've quoted my post 2x now.  I've already explained it.  I thought it was time to move on? but to answer your question, no it doesn't exposeme to things I don't like.  Are you perhaps trying to intimate that I would be exposed to not doing enough damage? as it is a rare case indeed regardless of what frame I play or anyone else in the mission that I don't do most damage.

I don't like the screen because

• The stat is wrong
• for the most part, it is meaningless even if it was correct in terms of mission objective
• all it leads to is a bunch of overly sensitive people thinking either people are stealing their kills, some things need to be nerfed, or people are leaving because they did most damage.

pick one.

 

[Lahared]

19 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Tucker D Dawg said:

You've quoted my post 2x now.  I've already explained it.  I thought it was time to move on? but to answer your question, no it doesn't exposeme to things I don't like.  Are you perhaps trying to intimate that I would be exposed to not doing enough damage? as it is a rare case indeed regardless of what frame I play or anyone else in the mission that I don't do most damage.

I don't like the screen because

• The stat is wrong
• for the most part, it is meaningless even if it was correct in terms of mission objective
• all it leads to is a bunch of overly sensitive people thinking either people are stealing their kills, some things need to be nerfed, or people are leaving because they did most damage.

pick one.

 

I don't think I quoted it twice, but if I did, I apologize. I doubt it sent anything when I already had something typed out and went back a page to read comments on the first page. Refreshing the page showed it, I am sorry for that, it wasn't my intention.

 

I'm not trying to 'intimate' anything, I merely did not understand what your specific issue(s) are with what you originally typed out.

 

If you want to say the stats are wrong, then the stats are wrong. Numbers exist to tell something though. I will agree though that there doesn't seem much sense in making comparisons of ones' performance to another. It doesn't always lead to that, and I don't know why you're making an assumption on the behalf of a large number of players.

 

 

Edited January 3, 2018 by Lahared

[(PSN)Chel-El]

There has to be more variables considered in context other than raw numbers 

Today on Ambulas sortie my Mag was top DPS on defense too. 

Sure I brought max arca plasmor and prepped it with mods but if you look at my squad: 2 Rhino cc tanks and 1 Volt that spammed shileds to protect the operative. 2 tanks 1 barrier that made me the dedicated dps cc 

In Overwatch there’s stats for damage taken by barriers and health restored by the support. Can this help foster support/tanking attitudes so we don’t overly focus on DPS? Will it make us more coop than competitive? 

Also, it’s known that AI mode is friendlier and nicer than competitive mode. I don’t think it’s the stats or the loot but something is making people more friendly in OW AI.