Does anyone here actually like the Operator?

[DreamsmithJane]

1 hour ago, MirageKnight said:

Because honestly, said dialogue really IS cringe-worthy at times.

Agreed.

1 hour ago, MirageKnight said:

Because that's such a reasonable and mature way to deal with someone that has an opinion you don't agree with.

The function exists for a reason. I'm allowed to use it. If I find the history and the prospect of discussing with someone (which we can all see) to be fruitless, there is nothing unreasonable or immature about electing to refrain. If it worked like it should, it would never have been an issue.

39 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

There's also a reason why ignoring someone doesn't notify them, and is handled in a discreet manner. It's kinda tactless to go out of your way to call it out to the person; try logging-out and back in if it bothers you that much.

Okay, no. If it doesn't work, my only recourse is to actually tell someone I don't want to hear from them. It is absolutely not tactless to ask someone to leave you alone. It's far more tactless to try to make someone feel guilty for it. The reason it doesn't notify people is to protect the people who use it from potential retaliation, not to protect people from knowing that someone has opted out of interaction (which is straight up not something I should feel sorry for). Will logging out and in again actually fix it? Can't hurt to try...

[DiabolusUrsus]

15 minutes ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Okay, no. If it doesn't work, my only recourse is to actually tell someone I don't want to hear from them. It is absolutely not tactless to ask someone to leave you alone. It's far more tactless to try to make someone feel guilty for it. The reason it doesn't notify people is to protect the people who use it from potential retaliation, not to protect people from knowing that someone has opted out of interaction (which is straight up not something I should feel sorry for). Will logging out and in again actually fix it? Can't hurt to try...

BullS#&$.

You just ignore the notification. It's not tactless to ask someone to end the conversation, but it is tactless to tell them that you're ignoring them while effectively trying to claim the last word. If you want the conversation to end, stop replying. They're not going to continue re-quoting you to drag you back into it.

Being discreet about ignores protects both parties involved, and minimizes the potential for conflict. By throwing your "ignored" status out in the open, you're completely undermining that purpose - both to stop the one ignored from getting offended or prompting retaliation against the one who did the ignoring.

It's 100% unnecessary.

[StabbyTentacles]

3 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Now, I already have you on my ignore list, so I should not have received a notification just now. It would be great if that would work the way it's supposed to.

Spoiler

 

[StabbyTentacles]

1 hour ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Okay, no. If it doesn't work, my only recourse is to actually tell someone I don't want to hear from them. It is absolutely not tactless to ask someone to leave you alone. It's far more tactless to try to make someone feel guilty for it. The reason it doesn't notify people is to protect the people who use it from potential retaliation, not to protect people from knowing that someone has opted out of interaction (which is straight up not something I should feel sorry for). Will logging out and in again actually fix it? Can't hurt to try...

Quote

my only recourse is to actually tell someone I don't want to hear from them.

Or... I could read on, with my eyes, like a human being; correspondingly... Reads on.

 

57 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

BullS#&$.

You just ignore the notification. It's not tactless to ask someone to end the conversation, but it is tactless to tell them that you're ignoring them while effectively trying to claim the last word. If you want the conversation to end, stop replying. They're not going to continue re-quoting you to drag you back into it.

Being discreet about ignores protects both parties involved, and minimizes the potential for conflict. By throwing your "ignored" status out in the open, you're completely undermining that purpose - both to stop the one ignored from getting offended or prompting retaliation against the one who did the ignoring.

It's 100% unnecessary.

[DarkRuler2500]

I liky my Operator, i play 3 focus schools frequently.

Either the brizzle-sizzly Zenuriik lightning operator.

Then the flaming Madurai operator

My last (and somehow the most refreshing one) is the trickster of Unairu with the magnetize bubbles.

[DreamsmithJane]

2 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

You just ignore the notification.

And all of the ones that follow, because I'm too "tactful" to say "stop"? Well, that is not ideal. By the way, re-logging didn't work, so now my notifications will be cluttered by people I don't want to talk to, whenever they feel like it. *huge, sarcastic thumbs-up*

2 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

it is tactless to tell them that you're ignoring them while effectively trying to claim the last word.

No, it's really not. I used the "ignore" function for a reason. "Tactless" suggests I don't know it was impolite to say so. I do. In this instance, I am not obligated to care. It's not as if the other party was tactful in being snide about "opinions" that weren't actually opinions. Sometimes, it's necessary to put aside the appearance of courtesy in order to stand up for oneself. I'm not claiming any kind of victory by stepping away from that conversation. I doubtless haven't succeeded in convincing that person of anything.

That's not the point. In fact, the point is rather that the other party can save their breath/time (a rather more genuine courtesy than being outwardly polite, IMO) and not bother trying to convince me of whatever it is they wanted to say. A reasonable response to that is to let it go, and leave me out of the discussion from that point on. However, contrary to your suggestion, it rather precludes my claiming the last word, as you can see.

3 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

They're not going to continue re-quoting you to drag you back into it.

Then...what are those consecutive notifications I just got without further reply? Don't actually tell me, though. I don't want to know. That's kind of the point I'm making. Whatever that is...it's not a reasonable response.

3 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Being discreet about ignores protects both parties involved, and minimizes the potential for conflict. By throwing your "ignored" status out in the open, you're completely undermining that purpose - both to stop the one ignored from getting offended or prompting retaliation against the one who did the ignoring.

It's 100% unnecessary.

Unless it doesn't work, in which case it protects exactly no one. If it had worked, there would have been no need to declare my intentions. I wouldn't need to say I'm not going to continue responding, because I would never have received that notification at all. I'm undermining something that doesn't work in the first place by taking an alternative approach? That's a hard sell.

Now, if I'm not mistaken, this is considerably adrift from the topic of the thread, and given that you haven't made a lot of headway in convincing me... Look, I get it. You don't approve of my choice. But I don't feel an ounce of remorse. And I won't. I've heard you, and I don't agree. I don't see a point in continuing this.

[Airwolfen]

8 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

Nice insult.

Childish need to personally insult others rather than respond through logic aside...

I have 3 people working on Operator's: hair/mechanics/fashion/movement/abilities...

I have less people working on Warframes: mechanics/fashion/movement/abilities...

Yes this seems to be an issue, IF I, AS A PALYER PREFER WARFRAMES.

Insert preferred personal insult here.

Childish? hardly.

I originally just stated that improved cosmetics were in development as shown inn the latest devstream as people on both sides of the main arguement see the lack of customizations as a downside. What's childish was your reason to throw a fit over that post just because you don't like it happening at all.

What do players prefer? A ton of different things. that's what.

They are going to make operator cosmetics whether you like it or not. Is it the majority of the artists in DE? Far from it.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

I do like the Operator Quest story line.

Though I am enjoying my Operator and 223 Amp...I do wonder if we will get to be as powerful as they are presented in the quests.

(2nd Dream pre War Within Transference boost.. literally just 1-shots Sentients, plus Invincibility, plus Psuedo-Warframe-Telepathic controlling : Frame->Breaking War without appearing to be controlled.)

Then in War Within: Transference into the deadly Orokin Golden Maws (waiting for this to come back) Not to mention Operator handled falling and piercing leg, like a boss. (Yet Operators are associated with being Fragile)

Then we get a glimpse of a truly powerful Tenno: Rell, oh my gosh I cannot wait until my Operator is at Rell's level.

Rell looked like he could solo LoR or JV and just summon Shadow clones that will actually follow his commands: aka stand here on platform.(Reminded me a little of Ajin 'Flood")

 

The Quills is where I get confused, because it seems as though there are adult 'Tenno' that control their void beams via Amps and/or can use Void energy to time travel. (Maybe more will be explored later)

 

I do hope we get Stealth Finishers with Operator soon.

 

As for Operator DPS: I currently play 2 ways with the Operator:

•Valkyr Prolonged Paralysis to group up infested (Using Radiation Lacera to disable Auras) the Operator Grenade Amp spam the mob

Or

•Banshee with Sonic Fracture and Resonance Sonar : Spam a couple Sonars, Silence Aura stun and then switch to Operator for some big number AmP killing. (If heavily Armored Units like Sortie 3 Augmented Enemy Armor: I use Sonic Fracture and then switch to Operator for easy pickings)

 

Operator feels ninja-like with hit'n'run tactics. 

(I am looking forward to seeing how the Operators will progress.)

Focus accumulation can use some tweaks: 

✓Allow MR to be tied to Focus affinity multiplier or bonus (Like the mission challenge could reward bonus that has MR multiplier: 10 Melee Kills being the 5k affinity multiplied by MR)

Since MR should be our Operator level: if we are technically playing as the Operator and mastering (leveling) all this gear.

 

[DatDarkOne]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

I do hope we get Stealth Finishers with Operator soon.

Ok.  Not gonna lie.  That would be very cool. 

[(PSN)MrNishi]

5 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

Ok.  Not gonna lie.  That would be very cool. 

Just need to have Covert Lethality type 1-hit execution animations implemented.

(My Operator should be able to vaporize any Grineer/Infested/Corpus Unit if performing a Stealth Kill)

They can even balance it by making it deplete X Operator Energy per Stealth Kill.

(That way it limits Void Mode cloak, but does promote managing Operator Energy by Void dashing through enemies to replenish Operator energy faster.)

Would make Savage Silence + Sonic Fracture + Resonance Sonar very Operator friendly 😋

Edited January 30, 2018 by (PS4)MrNishi

[DiabolusUrsus]

6 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

And all of the ones that follow, because I'm too "tactful" to say "stop"? Well, that is not ideal. By the way, re-logging didn't work, so now my notifications will be cluttered by people I don't want to talk to, whenever they feel like it. *huge, sarcastic thumbs-up*

Why are there notifications that follow? Are these people going out of their way to mention you and continue a conversation you aren't participating in?

6 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

No, it's really not. I used the "ignore" function for a reason. "Tactless" suggests I don't know it was impolite to say so. I do. In this instance, I am not obligated to care. It's not as if the other party was tactful in being snide about "opinions" that weren't actually opinions. Sometimes, it's necessary to put aside the appearance of courtesy in order to stand up for oneself. I'm not claiming any kind of victory by stepping away from that conversation. I doubtless haven't succeeded in convincing that person of anything.

If you say so, but if you really want a conversation to end it's most effective to not give the other person anything to respond to.

Simply say something along the lines of "this is pointless, I'm out," and you should get AT MOST one more notification from that person.

6 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

That's not the point. In fact, the point is rather that the other party can save their breath/time (a rather more genuine courtesy than being outwardly polite, IMO) and not bother trying to convince me of whatever it is they wanted to say. A reasonable response to that is to let it go, and leave me out of the discussion from that point on. However, contrary to your suggestion, it rather precludes my claiming the last word, as you can see.

Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.

Okay, lemme know how saving other people's breath/time goes for you.

6 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Then...what are those consecutive notifications I just got without further reply? Don't actually tell me, though. I don't want to know. That's kind of the point I'm making. Whatever that is...it's not a reasonable response.

You tell me; I'm not looking at your account. Are you following the thread? Are people you don't want to talk to actually that determined to talk with you?

If so, that sounds like a Forum bug that needs to be reported.

6 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Unless it doesn't work, in which case it protects exactly no one. If it had worked, there would have been no need to declare my intentions. I wouldn't need to say I'm not going to continue responding, because I would never have received that notification at all. I'm undermining something that doesn't work in the first place by taking an alternative approach? That's a hard sell.

It still doesn't justify throwing away protections of privacy. There are definitely other ways to go about ending a conversation.

It was hardly your only recourse.

6 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

Now, if I'm not mistaken, this is considerably adrift from the topic of the thread, and given that you haven't made a lot of headway in convincing me... Look, I get it. You don't approve of my choice. But I don't feel an ounce of remorse. And I won't. I've heard you, and I don't agree. I don't see a point in continuing this.

Well okay, then.

But here are a few tips about getting someone not to respond and continue a conversation.

First, don't make any counterpoints. That just prompts them to reply, or else you really are simply trying to claim the last word.

Second, if you really are trying to save people time, how about stating your intention to quit from the get-go instead of following a winded rationalization for why you shouldn't feel any remorse?

I'm really not trying to make you feel remorse either (note the distinct lack of "you owe an apology"); I'm pointing out something that you MIGHT want to try differently next time and explaining that there SHOULD be viable alternatives. I've never had ANY problems with the ignore feature, so I dunno what you're talking about when it comes to unending notifications.

Maybe I missed something, but I don't think Stabby said anything particularly upsetting to you... So I was honestly surprised to see you react like that.

[Redfeather75]

The operator is cool in that it can do stuff my warframe cannot. But it feels very slow compared to regular gameplay, and that is kind of jarring.

I'd rather press '5' and become my kavat. That thing can wall jump attack and spin around in deadly zoomies circles. I'd love to do that.

Edited January 30, 2018 by Redfeather75

[DiabolusUrsus]

3 minutes ago, Redfeather75 said:

The operator is cool in that it can do stuff my warframe cannot. But it feels very slow compared to regular gameplay, and that is kind of jarring.

I'd rather press '5' and become my kavat. That thing can wall jump attack and spin around in deadly zoomies circles. I'd love to do that.

With the whole "possessing stuff using Transference," thing we were shown, that might not actually be implausible.

[MirageKnight]

1 hour ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

With the whole "possessing stuff using Transference," thing we were shown, that might not actually be implausible.

It's funny how in TWW DE took great pains to teach and have you use Transference to hijack a Golden Maw to allow you to continue the quest...and that's been it so far.

So typical of DE. Introduce a mechanic with interesting potential and then they do bugger all with it. I'm starting to think that Transference thing in TWW was just a contrived plot device and nothing more.

Kinda like the whole morality mechanic. Oh look...a dial that shows me being half sun and half moon because I chose a certain dialogue / action path in a quest....and this is affecting me, how again?

[Aleksi134]

Quote

Kinda like the whole morality mechanic. Oh look...a dial that shows me being half sun and half moon because I chose a certain dialogue / action path in a quest....and this is affecting me, how again?

 

Thats called illusion of choice.

[Gamma745]

29 minutes ago, MirageKnight said:

It's funny how in TWW DE took great pains to teach and have you use Transference to hijack a Golden Maw to allow you to continue the quest...and that's been it so far.

So typical of DE. Introduce a mechanic with interesting potential and then they do bugger all with it. I'm starting to think that Transference thing in TWW was just a contrived plot device and nothing more.

I'm kinda thinking it's just a small "explanation" on how the Tenno can go into the Warframe. Or not. I'm not sure myself. But hey, they did say they planned to do something akin to that sometime in the future. You know, Soon^tm

 

31 minutes ago, MirageKnight said:

Kinda like the whole morality mechanic. Oh look...a dial that shows me being half sun and half moon because I chose a certain dialogue / action path in a quest....and this is affecting me, how again?

Well, they did say in one of the recent Devstream that they are planning to do something with it. What they want to do with it is another question altogether.

[Chipputer]

7 hours ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

Then we get a glimpse of a truly powerful Tenno: Rell, oh my gosh I cannot wait until my Operator is at Rell's level.

Rell looked like he could solo LoR or JV and just summon Shadow clones that will actually follow his commands: aka stand here on platform.(Reminded me a little of Ajin 'Flood")

I could imagine the player being allowed to choose to forego their Warframe in order to "unleash" their Tenno powers. The downside would be fragility and something like a shortened bleedout timer.

Then they could create a complete set of 4 powers for each school that progressively unlock as you invest more into the school, or something.

[Futurehero]

Hey, thank you for all your responses!

I 'm quite surprised in the popularity of this topic, hell, even content creators like H3dsh0t commented on this in a podcast.

I'm gonna do some more effort posting here, maybe to explain in a little more detail what I'd personally want out of the operator system. 

Maybe people can contribute their own opinions?

 

 

Edited January 30, 2018 by Futurehero

[Haeen]

On 1/28/2018 at 8:47 AM, Twistedsparkle said:

if only we could mod our operators as we can our weapons and frames :/
amps do no damage
survivability is very low
and focus nodes that are focused on damage dealing effects with operator do not scale at all
mobility is clumsy

Amps do quite a bit of damage actually.

For example, the 2-1-2 gilded amp deals 3500 void damage as a base, and the alt fire is a 9k damage base.

To provide a comparison, the strongest single shot weapon a WF can use is the Tigris prime which is 1560 per shot.

The strongest archwing single shot is veloctius at 1800.

So your operator's amp is hitting for almost twice as much as the hardest hitting weapon in the game available to the player.

Now imagine if you could use ALL of the mods available to your weapons.  Yeah...oneshot city wth the click of a weapon.   

The rest of your points I agree with, but keep in mind its not that amps don't deal damage, its the fact you can't modify them to scale which honestly, if you could? They'd kill everything unless it scales harder than it already does.

 

On 1/28/2018 at 8:47 AM, Twistedsparkle said:

just throwing in some ideas

 

[Twistedsparkle]

15 minutes ago, Aegni said:

Amps do quite a bit of damage actually.

For example, the 2-1-2 gilded amp deals 3500 void damage as a base, and the alt fire is a 9k damage base.

To provide a comparison, the strongest single shot weapon a WF can use is the Tigris prime which is 1560 per shot.

The strongest archwing single shot is veloctius at 1800.

So your operator's amp is hitting for almost twice as much as the hardest hitting weapon in the game available to the player.

Now imagine if you could use ALL of the mods available to your weapons.  Yeah...oneshot city wth the click of a weapon.   

The rest of your points I agree with, but keep in mind its not that amps don't deal damage, its the fact you can't modify them to scale which honestly, if you could? They'd kill everything unless it scales harder than it already does.

 

 

DE probably tried to make them with "one size" mentality
because amps obviously were not designed the modding system in mind

that said I dont think rebalancing the values to fit modding system would be that big of a hassle

[Valaska]

Eh... I am ambivalent to it. I hate how annoying it is to keep the buffs up and they should at minimum be 3 minute timers so you don't have to worry about whipping our Zen's energizing dash every 30 seconds. Also in my point of view anything but Zen is a mistake on all but the most boring stock frames that don't need a constant supply of energy like Saryn etc.

I used to use Mind Dash to get around but now if you get too high (or fall from the tile) it sends you all the way back to the beginning of a mission... I was literally set 4000 meters back once, and this just started for some reason. Their HP is ridiculously annoying, the amount of time to pay out is just... Horrific, they're an interesting idea and could eventually work out if they actually made them I dunno...

Personally, I would prefer they roll operators completely back and remove them from anything but the story, as they're a decent narrative piece. Bring back energy overflow etc. But this will never happen at this point, operators are far too ingratiated into their POE update and farming kuva. So like them omr not they're hamfistedly shoved into the game.

 

I honestly feel this should be Warframe instead of Operator Frame.

[MirageKnight]

1 hour ago, Aleksi134 said:

Thats called illusion of choice.

At this point, that's exactly what it amounts to, yet previously Steve said they were going to do something meaningful with that....and here were are several months later with nothing to show for except rambled excuses on a devstream and a nice graphic for your ingame profile.

1 hour ago, Gamma745 said:

I'm kinda thinking it's just a small "explanation" on how the Tenno can go into the Warframe. Or not. I'm not sure myself.

This kinda underscores how ambiguous DE can be about things at times, but I get where you're coming from.

1 hour ago, Gamma745 said:

But hey, they did say they planned to do something akin to that sometime in the future. You know, Soon^tm

Meaning...2019 at best probably.

1 hour ago, Gamma745 said:

Well, they did say in one of the recent Devstream that they are planning to do something with it.

I recall that. I also recall Steve saying he had a great idea a while back but chucked it. What they need to do is sit down and seriously brainstorm and focus on developing stuff they've hinted at and people got all excited about. Or at least say, "we cant make this work folks, sorry." and move on.

[Aleksi134]

25 minutes ago, MirageKnight said:

At this point, that's exactly what it amounts to, yet previously Steve said they were going to do something meaningful with that....and here were are several months later with nothing to show for except rambled excuses on a devstream and a nice graphic for your ingame profile.

This kinda underscores how ambiguous DE can be about things at times, but I get where you're coming from.

Meaning...2019 at best probably.

I recall that. I also recall Steve saying he had a great idea a while back but chucked it. What they need to do is sit down and seriously brainstorm and focus on developing stuff they've hinted at and people got all excited about. Or at least say, "we cant make this work folks, sorry." and move on.

Technically they promised the sacrifice quest for last year december yet here we are almost in february without any.

[MirageKnight]

6 minutes ago, Aleksi134 said:

Technically they promised the sacrifice quest for last year december yet here we are almost in february without any.

Indeed. But that's another topic entirely.

[DreamsmithJane]

5 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

You tell me; I'm not looking at your account.

They're in this thread. From the same person. Process of elimination tells me they're the two consecutive posts after yours that are hidden from me (because at least that part works). Now, I definitely didn't further reply after the first one. Evidently, nobody did.

5 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

I've never had ANY problems with the ignore feature

And yet you still feel the need to try to lecture me about the correct course of action when part of it isn't working. I don't know what gave you the idea that I was dissatisfied with my course of action and needed advice, and I definitely don't know what makes you think you're the one to give it. To be exceedingly clear, I did not ask for advice, from you nor from anyone else. That's why I thought your motivation must be some sort of moral objection. Now, I can't figure out what possible reason you had for interjecting.

5 hours ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

I don't think Stabby said anything particularly upsetting to you.

To me? It was a trifling annoyance in a thread full of them. But I actually read threads before replying. Shocker, I know. I already concluded that such a conversation wasn't going to go anywhere. You, however, have surprised me. Oh, well.