So sick of trading chat, why can't we get an auction house?

[PatternistSlave]

Just now, (PS4)KresTias said:

Since when trade become about seller's satisfaction?

• Trade chat right now
  • desperate new player sells god roll rivens for 20p, because they dont know
  • new players cant look what actual prices is and more likely will be robbed
  • instead of playing and learning players wasting their time, which will affect their moral

AH can help, it doesnt mean your offers will be there while you r offline, it will be good practice while you online ur items available for purchase in AH.

An AH would make it easier to abuse your ignorance because it makes it all too easy for me to control prices.  It would allow me to abuse the ignorant on a much larger scale and you wouldn't even know I was doing it.  New players are able to obtain plat with the current system because for the most part it isn't worth the hassle for me to sell the items a new player does.  You'd throw that away for the privilege of blissful ignorance.  This idea a lot of you have that a more convenient system somehow benefits you more than a person who uses any system to its full extent is absurd.

[(PSN)KresTias]

My ignorance? Only ignorance i see comes from you.

People already abusing trade chat, almost every few mins messages "Guys dont trade with this guy, he is a scammer". 1 simple example.

And im not talking about ppl who has friends n they all together targeting 1 person by offering insulting bs to make sure this person will buy/sell at prices they want.

You dont need to answer me, i already read your posts.

[PatternistSlave]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)KresTias said:

My ignorance? Only ignorance i see comes from you.

People already abusing trade chat, almost every few mins messages "Guys dont trade with this guy, he is a scammer". 1 simple example.

And im not talking about ppl who has friends n they all together targeting 1 person by offering insulting bs to make sure this person will buy/sell at prices they want.

You dont need to answer me, i already read your posts.

It's not "scamming" to get the best price you can for an item.  High value for time compared to money isn't "scamming".  I've made hundreds if not thousands of trades and can count on one hand the people I've seen actually trying to scam and DE have since limited the avenues they were abusing.

[Grizman21]

Because it would by just another Maroo's bazaar.

[Vryheid]

21 hours ago, Fenwyn said:

It's beyond sickening having to go through all the drama of belligerent players, sorting through an disappearing mess to sort through, where in every single MMO it's a simple search query, purchase, and equip.  No drama, just done.  Everyone will post that it isn't so bad, that there's another website, all these other solutions, but the fact that there are such solutions in the first place is the issue.  It's still a headache to navigate trading for half an hour or longer to find what you want, it's still a headache to have to play guessing games with morons who won't just give you a flat honest price and expect you to correctly guess right away based on any of the arbitrary numbers listed on a 3rd party website, and it's still a headache to not have a firm comparison of final price points to have some idea if you're being ripped off or not.

 

Please, please, please DE, add an auction house.

Oh lordie, not having to communicate or socialize with other players! You might end up having to do something terrible like saying "I'm interested in X"" and "thank you" when you buy an item instead of just hiding behind an automated shop! How utterly sickening! 

you can look at the absolute garbage communities in mmos like ffxiv compared to warframe to see what happens when you progressively make easier and easier to avoid all interaction with anyone not on your friends list

Edited February 25, 2018 by Vryheid

[Kaminariss]

4 hours ago, PatternistSlave said:

If you're that deluded and ignorant there's nothing worth discussing.  It would massively change the economy once every BS item I couldn't care less how much plat I got for was conveniently sold for next to nothing.

You are ignorant saying that adding ANOTHER AH will change anything. From economy point of view AH already exists and it is called warframe.market, wftrader and there was some other website for trading rivens.

There is little to no difference between having AH as website and in game. And considering how much of offeres are there it seems that it is quite popular.

[PatternistSlave]

18 minutes ago, Kaminariss said:

There is little to no difference between having AH as website and in game

Then you don't need one in game.  But I think we both know how ridiculous what you're saying is.

[TherenWolfsbane]

warframe.market. nuff said

[Kaminariss]

2 hours ago, PatternistSlave said:

Then you don't need one in game. 

I certainly don't. There is not much for me to buy anyways.

Let me make some example that would explain how economy works and why AH in game would not be any different from online site.

Warframe is like a big city, in the town square there is enough space you can put your wares on display, set up your shop and wait for customers to arrive and purchase products. That how the current state of the game is. And how online site work (warframe.market) No middle man, no regulations about prices, no taxes. Market as free as it can be.

So why prices are kept at steady level? It's simple, prices are regulated by supply and demad.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand

In the normal market you can fluctuate prices by making big purchases or dumping wares at low prices. But unless you are filthy rich you cannot permanently change price of something by simply buying and selling. You can affect a price of a praticular product by providing a cheaper or better alternative. None of what I just said is possible in warframe, simply because:

• Even if you are filthy rich you cannot make more than 25 purchases per day (It would be possible using bought MR20+ level accounts but I am pretty sure you would get banned)
• Each transaction also costs money in the form of time. Time = Money.
• There are no alternatives and you cannot make one

There are other aspects of price fluctuations but most of them does not affect game.

Now the City Mayor comes up with the idea to give people the auction house (auctions are not actually applicable to anything besides rivens, it only makes sense to auction exclusive goods). It would be more convenient for both buyers and sellers because sellers wouldnt need to be present at the time of purchase and buyers would have it easier to buy goods. However that comes with a price: tax. So in the end time you just saved to buy/sell would be paid with currency.

In the end it would not change prices much. And it would certainly not shake/destroy/whatever economy. Economy is still regulated by supply and demand curve. You would be only adding another form of distribution channel:

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/distribution-channel.asp

Right now warframe operates on shortest distribution channel possible, P2P, no middle man.
And it would still be perfectly possible to buy directly from seller (unless DE would remove trading in game lol).

Auction house would operate on first intermediary level with just one middle man.

PS. I am NOT PRO Auction house. I am neutral in this case. But "destroying economy" is not valid argument against.

Edited February 26, 2018 by Kaminariss

[CandyManCriminal]

im not exactly pro auction house
but i AM for a better way to trade, because trade chat is awful

[hellodownthere]

an auction house isn't needed on warframe just go to warframe.market

[sixmille]

Most people don't trade currently, because it's time consuming, which is a good thing because they will either buy the prime access or farm (ie, play more). All in all, that's good for the company running the game. With an auction house, there would be a huge influx of items on the market and a ton of new sellers, but the buyer's market would still be limited to people who spend money on F2P games (and it's really not many). More sellers + no more buyers = huge price drops.

This may sound like a great deal for you on the short term, and maybe it is, but not for DE. It means that they would have to work a lot on prime access so that it retains value. They would have to create a lot of new items to add to baro kiteer because of cheap ducats. They would also have to add a (huge) new database for a market and that means more servers. All you're asking would either require more work or more money for a quite meager benefit. They would also have to dramatically lower the drop rates of rare parts so that we don't get prime sets for 10p, and if you think they wouldn't do it, trust me, they would. All in all it would make the game worse for everyone involved, players because of S#&$ drop rates and devs because of the ton of extra and pointless work.

I buy and sell a lot of things on trade, and when I want to buy something, there is always a seller within the first 15 minutes. Always. Maybe you don't like the price and would like the market to crash with a ton of players here just for a couple plat, but right now, it's not in the game's best interest because of the insane requirement in dev time it would take, and I'd rather have the devs working on something else to be honest. I would also like to keep drop rates as tolerable as they are for prime stuff (30% chance in a full radiant party isn't too bad) instead of turning every prime BP into a 0.02% drop chance like in every asian P2W MMO. We're really talking about turning the game into some crap tier asian grinder MMO because some people argue about a few pennies...

Edited February 26, 2018 by sixmille

[Peter]

Trade chat is the best trade system, where only active players will be rewarded.

It's easy to use, just see how peoples communicating... WTB/WTS... you need an specific item? Put it on filter. You don't have much time to sell? Put a fair price or just put on filter and wait for interested one. 

Auction house will kill this game, the current market is funny if you know how to use, with auction house you didn't have any reason to farm because all things of the game will worth 10p (I'm not kidding).

[sixmille]

Il y a 10 heures, (PS4)KresTias a dit :

Since when trade become about seller's satisfaction?

• Trade chat right now
  • desperate new player sells god roll rivens for 20p, because they dont know
  • new players cant look what actual prices is and more likely will be robbed
  • instead of playing and learning players wasting their time, which will affect their moral

AH can help, it doesnt mean your offers will be there while you r offline, it will be good practice while you online ur items available for purchase in AH.

I bought some god tier rivens for about 20p. I also sold prime crap sets for ten times their price. So what? In this I'm just an agent. If you think I'm filling my own pockets, you're wrong. I'm filling DE's pocket and having some good fun in the process. What do I do with this plat? Not much. Sometimes a few weapon slot or a new warframe slot, that's about it. Occasionally, a riven for a new weapon, but that's rare. All I really want from trade chat is the thrill of the hunt: the hunt for the perfect price, and I suspect that those who spend a lot of time on /trade like me are there for the same reason. They don't need plat. The hunt is where the fun is.

But that's mostly irrelevant. My point is, nobody is being robbed. Selling cheap doesn't make you a fool. What makes you a fool is spending time on trade chat if you don't enjoy it. If you don't then just sell for whatever and buy at the requested price. You're losing nothing, it's just a virtual currency for digital items. If you think you're robbed because you paid the price of a coffee for some digital item instead of the price of a 3 day old slice of bread then you do really have weird priorities. The people selling god tier rivens for nothing are totally right if they want to get rid of their stuff within 5 minutes, log out and go to bed.

As for why an auction house would change the game for the worst, read my other post.

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

38 minutes ago, hellodownthere said:

an auction house isn't needed on warframe just go to warframe.market

Come back when you can actually have a constructive conversation. it has already been stated that that site should not need to exist if DE actually did their jobs correctly in implementing a trading system.

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

1 minute ago, Zanakeph said:

Trade chat is the best trade system, where only active players will be rewarded.

It's easy to use, just see how peoples communicating... WTB/WTS... you need an specific item? Put it on filter. You don't have much time to sell? Put a fair price or just put on filter and wait for interested one. 

Auction house will kill this game, the current market is funny if you know how to use, with auction house you didn't have any reason to farm because all things of the game will worth 10p (I'm not kidding).

Come back once you have read the entire thread. Don't worry, we'll wait.

[Peter]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Boomstickman98 said:

Come back once you have read the entire thread. Don't worry, we'll wait.

 Come back once you have read how to use the filler. Don't worry, i can wait. 

[Loswaith]

On 2/25/2018 at 11:51 AM, Tokens210 said:

Noone needs any arguments against AH really as DE has flat out said multiple times their not going to add it, only in recent streams in the past year or so have i even seen them entertain the conversation about them in which i believe it was Steve said how bout this if the majority of the community comes to agree then maybe well try to add one

DE also once said they would never include Platinum in the trading system, and in fact was why it took so long to initially get in the first place as DE was very reluctant to include any trading what so ever.  DE also has the motto of "Never say Never".

 

10 hours ago, PatternistSlave said:

An AH would make it easier to abuse your ignorance because it makes it all too easy for me to control prices.

This is ridiculous.  How on earth could you possibly think that some 25 trades (or whatever your mastery rank happens to be) could possibly have any significant influence over thousands of transactions per day.  It is highly unlikely DE would ever remove that limitation to trading regardless of the medium that we end up having.

You would need to organise a vast number of people to even have a mediocum impact on the trading, let alone highly influence it.

----------------

We can all have this trade chat round and round, but there is a clear reason games moved from using a chat program to handle trading to the trading post/auction house system.  We may not know why ourselves (outside of being better for games as a whole) but there is a good chance the developers of the games that spear-headed that movement (and likely some others even now) did the change.

[sixmille]

il y a 2 minutes, Loswaith a dit :

DE also once said they would never include Platinum in the trading system, and in fact was why it took so long to initially get in the first place as DE was very reluctant to include any trading what so ever.  DE also has the motto of "Never say Never".

 

This is ridiculous.  How on earth could you possibly think that some 25 trades (or whatever your mastery rank happens to be) could possibly have any significant influence over thousands of transactions per day.  It is highly unlikely DE would ever remove that limitation to trading regardless of the medium that we end up having.

You would need to organise a vast number of people to even have a mediocum impact on the trading, let alone highly influence it.

----------------

We can all have this trade chat round and round, but there is a clear reason games moved from using a chat program to handle trading to the trading post/auction house system.  We may not know why ourselves (outside of being better for games as a whole) but there is a good chance the developers of the games that spear-headed that movement (and likely some others even now) did the change.

Games also moved on from having decent drop rates for desirable items to 1 in 25000 chance to drop something valuable. Should warframe go in that direction? Because that's what you're asking for. The devs are never going to make Prime Access irrelevant just for your market browsing pleasure. It's either trade chat or asian MMO (with an auction house) drop chances, there is no other alternative.

[Loswaith]

10 minutes ago, sixmille said:

Games also moved on from having decent drop rates for desirable items to 1 in 25000 chance to drop something valuable. Should warframe go in that direction? Because that's what you're asking for. The devs are never going to make Prime Access irrelevant just for your market browsing pleasure. It's either trade chat or asian MMO (with an auction house) drop chances, there is no other alternative.

Warfame does have drop rates close to that low already.

Likewise any trading what so ever devalues the prime access packs as does the entire relic system.  I know many players that still buy PA despite frequently use trading, for 2 main reasons, they don't want to way the 3.5 days to build the frame or they want to support a game they enjoy (heavily note the last part).

A trading post/auction house, isn't an exclusive situation of have one and be an asian MMO grind fest, or don't have one.  Plenty of Western market MMOs have posts/houses as well.  The vast majority of them don't have daily trade limitations on them either (I say 'vast majority' as I have not come across any that do yet, but I hardly know all of MMOs that exist).

Edited February 26, 2018 by Loswaith

[Urabask]

Just now, Loswaith said:

Warfame does have drop rates close to that low already.

Likewise any trading what so ever devalues the prime access packs as does the entire relic system.  I know many players that still buy PA despite frequently use trading, for 2 main reasons, they don't want to way the 3.5 days to build the frame or they want to support a game they enjoy (heavily note the last part).

A trading post/auction house, isn't an exclusive situation of have one and be an asian MMO grind fest, or don't have one.  Plenty of Western market MMOs have posts/houses as well.  The vast majority of them don't have daily trade limitations on them either (I say 'vast majority' as I have not come across any that do yet, but I hardly know all of MMOs that exist).

 

The most readily available source of plat are prime parts and a rare drop has a 33% drop chance in a radshare.  In a game with an auction house you'd have trouble selling items with a drop rate that high.  In Warframe they are what makes F2P even viable for most players.

[Borg1611]

This game would greatly benefit from an in-game trading post. I don't necessarily want an "auction house" since I don't like to bid on things, I just want a UI where we can post things for a buyout and buy them. If it's an auction house with bidding as well, that's fine too, as long as it includes adequate search functionality for rivens and the ability to set a buyout. 

They can add a 5% plat tax or whatever if they want to help remove plat from circulation. I'd still use it, as would a great many other people. Some would still trade face to face to save on the tax (just like people do in WoW which taxes the AH but not face to face trades), but a lot of people who don't want to use the outdated existing trade system would use a marketplace UI with a tax. At the very least we need one for rivens.

The way things are now we have a tiny minority of the playerbase playing a different game because they have god-tier rivens they find on third party sites. Some people find a lot of rivens they don't want or need, but they don't want to participate in trade the way it is now, so they go to waste. An in-game market for rivens would be an equalizer (at least in trade accessibility) as well as a way of opening up trade to people who are willing to trade, but don't want to deal with a garbage outdated inconvenient system.

It would also work similar to the WoW token system in that free to play players would now be able to earn plat in a more reasonable and accessible way, which would get them to stick around as you NEED plat to enjoy this game. You need slots at the very least. The things F2P players buy for plat are still being paid for, just as anything with b.net balance token money is. There would just be a better synergy between F2P players and those actually buying the plat that ends up in circulation. Some people would even start farming for kuva and rolling rivens to sell at higher prices. It would increase participation in those kinds of systems as more people would use it as a way to pay for things they want for plat by farming for things to sell for plat. 

After seeing how successful an in-game tradepost for rivens would be, they may then decide to expand on the crafting systems in this game and add a wider variety of markets that players can become involved in. 

Trade accessibility is not bad for the game, or DE, or the players. It would be a huge improvement. 

[Loswaith]

10 minutes ago, Urabask said:

The most readily available source of plat are prime parts and a rare drop has a 33% drop chance in a radshare.  In a game with an auction house you'd have trouble selling items with a drop rate that high.  In Warframe they are what makes F2P even viable for most players.

And yet that rad-share drop chances has not had enough impact on prime access sales for DE to have altered it in any way.
It is also only that chance under very limited circumstances; a 4 person squad with identical radiant relics (which is actually 34% to get at-least one rare), with a lot of setup to actually even get those odds. 
Any deviation from that and the chances drop significantly.  Thus the true drop rate of rare prime parts is significantly lower than that 34% in practice.

Edited February 26, 2018 by Loswaith

[savoteemu]

Aye the trading chat is horid 

But antavat aution housut wud flood  the markets and make selling  stuff easier and harder i mean if theres over 9000 similar  items and you list  yours its not gonna sell enytime soon. But maybe a player  cudling list a price and then 1 cud  deliver and sell. Kinda like steam item listing works 

[(PSN)KresTias]

Looking at PoE bounty drop/Looking at riven rolls/Looking at Asian MMO.

"Only active players must be rewarded" you mean selfish? Many vets out of there spend bunch of their time helping new players, for example, and they deserve nothing?

AH Terminal is necessary for rivens (Maroo bazar good place for it), trade and trade chat must get improvements too (Filters doesnt solve problem).

Dont forget, theres different markets PC/PS/Xbox (all of them different), different timezones and different regions.

If people buying plat - less thing they want is wasting their time in a trade, if AH somehow will affect prices and people could get more for their plat, they might buy plat again and b4 next PA.