Tenno lore question

[Ragnarok160]

So according to the PoE lore gara along with mirage helped defeat the sentients but apparently there was an original gara. So my question is since all tenno are just children then did every tenno have there own unique warframe? We know rell had harrow and we know there are " lost" warframe blueprints but according tot he lotus during harrows quest she said she knew the location of all tenno minus rell.

 

So what exactly are the original varients of warframes? Was there an original excalibur? Also why do the tenno we hear about in the lore only use 1 warframe and not many like the current tenno do?

[KelsierSurvivor]

2 minutes ago, Ragnarok160 said:

So according to the PoE lore gara along with mirage helped defeat the sentients but apparently there was an original gara. So my question is since all tenno are just children then did every tenno have there own unique warframe? We know rell had harrow and we know there are " lost" warframe blueprints but according tot he lotus during harrows quest she said she knew the location of all tenno minus rell.

 

So what exactly are the original varients of warframes? Was there an original excalibur? Also why do the tenno we hear about in the lore only use 1 warframe and not many like the current tenno do?

Well, I'd hate to get real world technical about this, but I'm sorry, I am a bit of a grammar police and logic nazi. 

You can't have any one thing that didn't have an "original". There are always prototypes and experiments, there's never a whole bunch that all came into existence in the exact same way at the exact same time. There's always, in some form or fashion, an original.

Now, putting logic aside, I will answer to the best of my ability.

Yes, I personally think that all Tenno either had their own Warframe, or at least all had influence in the making of several Warframes, similar to how the Tenno design council in real life works. We give DE info on what we want and they construct the Warframes accordingly. We give them ideas on what class of Warframe, style of abilities, (Lightning, technology, music, I don't think there's anything we can't do. WITH THE EXCLUSION OF TIME.) and looks. DE listens, and I think that the Orokin, if not only to make the Tenno feel a little more like they were in good hands, allowed the Tenno to pitch ideas and such for their Warframes. They probably mixed some ideas into one in many cases as well and gave these Warframes to the Tenno that created them free of cost. I would guess that Tenno weren't given immediate access to all Warframes in the Old War, they probably had to work their way through the ranks until they were considered "worthy".

[AuroraSonicBoom]

The primes we build use blueprints recovered from the prototype of a warframe. Non-prime warframes are "consumer" versions of prime frames, heavily inspired by the prime of the type, but optimized for mass production.

[Miser_able]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Teloch]

[(PSN)Lowk721]

Depends entirely on how many warframes DE is willing to make. Going by the fact moon clan exist indicates there are at least a few thousand plus Tenno. Personally I don't think there's going to be that many frames. It could be there were originals and the other tenno just went off tgat.

Or, it could go against what people always assume. Maybe the frames we find weren't the originals. Maybe they just happen to be the only remnants left of that particular frame that were easy to find/scavangable.

[__S0ck__]

Presumably. The quests let us know that Limbo, Mirage, and Harrow each had their own respective Tenno. 

[SeaUrchins]

The spoilt brats simply wanted original stuff:

- Hey, Tenno, we got a harrow for you!

- No, Rel has it, I want something different, go design me a new warframe.

Then they would refuse to pilot the same model after it got lost in battle:

- Tenno, we have produced a new Mirage to replace your lost one.

- No, shed died.

- What? "She"? "Died"?

- Role played it. She died a hero, so I am not using her anymore. Go design me another warframe.

- WTF?!!

And that's why eventually all Tenno were put to second dream, no sentient being could cope with their spoiled orokin character.

[NightmareT12]

5 hours ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

The primes we build use blueprints recovered from the prototype of a warframe. Non-prime warframes are "consumer" versions of prime frames, heavily inspired by the prime of the type, but optimized for mass production.

I am tired of seeing this lie being repeated over and over again where absolutely nowhere this is stated. It's just a fan theory or community driven mistake, like the good old "Ether Reaper -> non Prime Reaper Prime!" that had to be debunked by Rebecca herself (as if logic wasn't enough).

Not saying it's your fault though, that's what happens when DE doesn't explain the basics properly in its own game c:

The Prime Warframes are the versions the Orokin made themselves. The non Prime Warframes are the Tenno's best attempt to recreate them. Why they did this back in the War is unknown, but I guess it's either, patched up versions made by the Tenno or the equivalent of slaves breaking their shackles. Same goes for weapons and Sentinels: stuff like the Corpus Braton or the non-Prime Helios are the Corpus best attempt at achieving the results the advanced Orokin technology lost to the ages.

Quote

WHAT IS A PRIME?
Prime Warframes, Weapons and Sentinels are actual pieces of Ancient Orokin technology. These elite intricately gilded items have highly advantageous qualities and feature added polarity slots – allowing you to equip more powerful Mods and saving space in your MOD Capacity.

Non-Prime Warframes, Weapons and Sentinels are based on Orokin technology, however they are not genuine Orokin articles.

https://www.warframe.com/news/primes-and-prime-access

That is why we must achieve the Primes through recovered Blueprints of relics of the Orokin era or, as it was best fit back in the day, raiding the Orokin vessels in the Void.

Also this:

4 hours ago, Teloch said:

Edited March 3, 2018 by NightmareT12

[VoxGray]

The Frames we see appear in quests are simply the last Frame that Operator was using before they died. Operators do feel pain through the Somatic Link, and sufficient trauma over a short period could very well kill or incapacitate them. After the fall of the Orokin empire, a vast amount of technology was lost, Warframes being among them. The quests we play lead us to the first discovered remnants of some of these lost technologies, the Operators having died in such a way that their Warframe's schematics were particularly well-preserved.

[ant99999]

You see, in the Old War tenno were the elite soldiers of the Orokin army. Just like in modern armies a rifle is tied to a certain soldier, there in the Orokin army a warframe was tied to an operator. I also think that in fact every warframe back then was developed and build exclusively for one tenno to best suit his own uniquie advantages.

While now we are just a bunch of mercenaries (just like Sargas Ruk said). We find anything we can carry from Greneer and Corpus ships and build our equipment from it. There is no any strict subordination in the tenno army like we see it now. We just go where we want, grab what we want and build what we want. That is why every tenno has dosens of different frames.

[JPADJOSH2602]

7 hours ago, XxXNob0dyXxX said:

Presumably. The quests let us know that Limbo, Mirage, and Harrow each had their own respective Tenno. 

And I believe Titania

[Ragnarok160]

20 hours ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

The primes we build use blueprints recovered from the prototype of a warframe. Non-prime warframes are "consumer" versions of prime frames, heavily inspired by the prime of the type, but optimized for mass production.

That doesnt make sense since original mirage and gara were not said to be primes and since harrow was exclusive to rel and he wasnt primed well

Edited March 3, 2018 by Ragnarok160

[Ragnarok160]

9 hours ago, EmissaryOfInfinity said:

The Frames we see appear in quests are simply the last Frame that Operator was using before they died. Operators do feel pain through the Somatic Link, and sufficient trauma over a short period could very well kill or incapacitate them. After the fall of the Orokin empire, a vast amount of technology was lost, Warframes being among them. The quests we play lead us to the first discovered remnants of some of these lost technologies, the Operators having died in such a way that their Warframe's schematics were particularly well-preserved.

That still doesnt explain the way garas story is told since it refers to singular gara, the same with inaros being the only one of its kind

[NightmareT12]

17 minutes ago, Ragnarok160 said:

That still doesnt explain the way garas story is told since it refers to singular gara, the same with inaros being the only one of its kind

The only people who know of a Warframe true nature are Ballas, the Lotus, Palladino, Onkko (post disappearing and becoming a member of The Quills) and Hunhow. Everyone else is just blind to the real deal.

But as Teloch said, plotholes.

Edited March 3, 2018 by NightmareT12

[Sloan441]

21 hours ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

The primes we build use blueprints recovered from the prototype of a warframe. Non-prime warframes are "consumer" versions of prime frames, heavily inspired by the prime of the type, but optimized for mass production.

This was the stance I always held, since it makes sense in terms of economics and the realities of wartime production (90% of the capability at 75% of the cost...).  

However, that was a few years ago and since that time we've seen the devs pretty much come out and say the primes are/were the actual production during the Orokin era. That leaves the more pedestrain warframes with a somewhat nebulous status. The general consensus is they were produced after the fall of the Empire and are best the tenno could do at that time.

This runs into issues of timeline, but, again, makes sense considering what we know now. That may change with the next devstream and it may not. Consider we still don't know how the warframes were developed and constructed by the Orokin. We have a few hints (RPC, Mirage trailer), but that's what they are: hints and tidbits of data. 

16 hours ago, NightmareT12 said:

I am tired of seeing this lie being repeated over and over again where absolutely nowhere this is stated.

Reel your neck in, dude. It is an older theory and not unreasonable. There is still much we don't know. We're constructing our own theories out of bits and pieces of lore and offhand dev comments. Chill. 

Edited March 3, 2018 by Sloan441
Editing tools freakout.

[NightmareT12]

4 minutes ago, Sloan441 said:

This was the stance I always held, since it makes sense in terms of economics and the realities of wartime production (90% of the capability at 75% of the cost...).  

However, that was a few years ago and since that time we've seen the devs pretty much come out and say the primes are/were the actual production during the Orokin era. That leaves the more pedestrain warframes with a somewhat nebulous status. The general consensus is they were produced after the fall of the Empire and are best the tenno could do at that time.

This runs into issues of timeline, but, again, makes sense considering what we know now. That may change with the next devstream and it may not. Consider we still don't know how the warframes were developed and constructed by the Orokin. We have a few hints (RPC, Mirage trailer), but that's what they are: hints and tidbits of data. 

Reel your neck in, dude. It is an older theory and not unreasonable. There is still much we don't know. We're constructing our own theories out of bits and pieces of lore and offhand dev comments. Chill. 

Go back to my post and read the DE source. I also don't need to chill because the comment wasn't heated in any way.

Edited March 3, 2018 by NightmareT12

[-skimmer-]

Well, Warframes themselves are probably modeled after the greatest warriors Orokin had, imitating their abilities and personalities. There is the story of Ordan Karris who was probably as strong as the warframes are if we can trust his narration. I wouldnt be surprised if there is a warframe somewhere modeled after the Beast of Bones, obviously with Orokin Prime version as the original warframe version of itself.

There is a good chance that the original Limbo, Mirage or Gara were not actually Warframes.

Edited March 3, 2018 by -skimmer-

[Sloan441]

Just now, NightmareT12 said:

Go back to my post and read the DE source. I also don't need to chill because the comment wasn't heated in any way.

I don't care about your source. I've seen the same streams and commentary you presumably have. Don't lecture me on sources. 

You did get in that guy's face, figuratively. 

That older theory was just that: older and a theory. It was as valid as it could be when it was conceived. Things have changed since then. We move on. 

Like I said, what we think we know now might change with the next devstream or trailer. It's a work in progress and always subject to change. 

[NightmareT12]

22 minutes ago, Sloan441 said:

I don't care about your source. I've seen the same streams and commentary you presumably have. Don't lecture me on sources. 

You did get in that guy's face, figuratively. 

That older theory was just that: older and a theory. It was as valid as it could be when it was conceived. Things have changed since then. We move on. 

Like I said, what we think we know now might change with the next devstream or trailer. It's a work in progress and always subject to change. 

And that person passed it as a fact. At no point he stated otherwise. It's the same thing as I explained, the good old "Ether Reaper = Reaper Prime" thing. People came up with it, believed it, and spread it. At no point it was theory, they legitimetely thought as much. So if I come here and post a link, straight from DE's website, with the explanation, then yes, I may explain the other person that what he or she wrote was wrong. I even joked about how DE misses the very basics of this stuff in the first place it should be on.

And I'm not lecturing you on anything. But you can't really come at me and tell me you don't care about sources and then proceed to tell me what's valid and what not, because it's a contradicition on itself.

And don't ever assume again what I'm doing just because you interpreted it in the wrong way. On this I am lecturing you.

If you want to answer me again, I advise we move to PMs too before we derail the thread or things get out of hand for the sake of the topic. I wouldn't like a mod having to come here to delete posts or something.

EDIT: And, at all this, if Aurora feels it was an agressive comment and says so, I'll just explain it really wasn't and tell him/her I'm sorry for the confusion, of course. I am the first to understand that text messages sometimes are interpreted in a wrong way. Especially when it comes from a guy named NIghtmare with a dark ominous Nekros Prime avatar lol

Edited March 3, 2018 by NightmareT12

[VoxGray]

59 minutes ago, Ragnarok160 said:

That still doesnt explain the way garas story is told since it refers to singular gara, the same with inaros being the only one of its kind

It refers to a single Gara, and an Inaros. The particular Tenno in question were significant to the populations telling their stories, and since no civilian knows the true nature of the Tenno, it makes sense they'd interpret the Warframe and the Tenno as one and the same. In both of those specific cases, it's mentioned that they were the only Tenno to bother protecting those areas, which further reinforces this idea. Why bother differentiating from other Gara users if there are no other Gara users around? It's never quite specified whether there's one or many of these Warframes, so for now we can't really say definitively that they were the only user of that specific Warframe.

[Sloan441]

8 minutes ago, NightmareT12 said:

And that person passed it as a fact.

None of this is 'facts'. It's all conjecture and theory. DE makes very few concrete declarations when it comes to lore.  

When that theory was made it covered all the bases. It was discredited by an offhand comment DE_Steve made in a devstream. Steve didn't elaborate then and to the best of my knowledge never did. It had to accounted for, though, so we now assume that the primes were Orokin production and everything else...came from somewhere/when else. 

If that single statement is modified or clarified, that old theory could become valid again--or at least until yet another data point kicks it to the curb. 

If you've got more information on the whole thing, feel free to put it out there. 

[NightmareT12]

6 minutes ago, Sloan441 said:

None of this is 'facts'. It's all conjecture and theory. DE makes very few concrete declarations when it comes to lore.  

When that theory was made it covered all the bases. It was discredited by an offhand comment DE_Steve made in a devstream. Steve didn't elaborate then and to the best of my knowledge never did. It had to accounted for, though, so we now assume that the primes were Orokin production and everything else...came from somewhere/when else. 

If that single statement is modified or clarified, that old theory could become valid again--or at least until yet another data point kicks it to the curb. 

If you've got more information on the whole thing, feel free to put it out there. 

Well, the thing is, for better or for worse, for now we have to believe what comes from DE unless at a newer point of time they tell us something else. Just like the lore entries on some Codex entries we have. For example, at first glance the Ember Prime codex entry we have has a few conflicts with The Second Dream. Logic dictates it could easily be an early draft of the story, but it can of course also be something completely valid because it hasn't been adressed yet.

Or my favorite yet: In the story we're the sole Tenno to make it out of the Moon, next time we enter there's all those pods left behind. Something that can easily be explained by having a mission type in Lua where we escort other Tenno out, but nope, a wizard did it.

Just the typical DE moves onto the next thing and the old thing becomes abandoned.

BTW, I can already see the jokes of us kidnapping Ostrons if The Sacrifice goes the "Warframe is made off a person" route it seems to be going but we construct our frames with nanospores and neurodes lol

Edited March 3, 2018 by NightmareT12

[Circle_of_Psi]

As far I know, the "Primed" Warframes. are the originals and the theory is that, each Tenno before they were able to perfect Transference where bound to their frame, inside their warframe, via their mind, rather than using what we use today.

This is why Warframes like, Limbo/Mirage/Gara where killed.

 

However, the more likely theory is:

If a Tenno suffers too much trauma, due to their frame being outright destroyed, the Tenno's mind is destroyed due to the somatic link causes too much shock, this is why some Tenno are outright killed, as its proven they feel pain, as the Warframe does (That Hurt!) as one of their comments are.

Also, keep in mind, Tenno didn't know who and what they were so whatever trauma they suffered (Being torn apart by Alad V), gets to them as they think it's their "Real body"

 

So, what I believe is that, if a Tenno's Warframe is outright destroyed: Limbo being torn apart by the void, Gara died by a Void Atom bomb, Mirage being killed by self-destroying her frame, The Tenno dies. Due to the feedback/trauma

However, if we're simply damaged or stabbed by Stalker, the Warframe is able to be brought back to the ship and repaired.

 

However, it all depends on whenever the Tenno unlocked "Transference" or "Transderence", Tenno who have France, are likely forced out of their frame, when it's destroyed, and remain wounded, but Derance: The tenno dies. (Ghost Tenno/Physical Tenno. Its likely the frames who "Died" didn't know or unlock  Transference

[-skimmer-]

24 minutes ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

As far I know, the "Primed" Warframes. are the originals and the theory is that, each Tenno before they were able to perfect Transference where bound to their frame, inside their warframe, via their mind, rather than using what we use today.

This is why Warframes like, Limbo/Mirage/Gara where killed.

Sounds more like a an outdated way to control warframes and not a "perfect transference". You dont want the possibility of your greatest warriors getting killed.

I think Orokin had to use Kuva to permanently transfer minds of people into combat suits and they also had to keep training new ones whenever they died until the Tenno incident where they essentially got a whole ship full of immortal soldiers who could learn from each defeat because they could use transference at will instead of the lenghty proccess with Kuva.