I don't want scaling rewards

[Hypernaut1]

1 hour ago, Wildcardgsx said:

See the thing Is A "New Player" Isn't going to be doing a Mission on Kuva Fortress, there's just no way. You should be atleast MR 10-14 before you even have the Kuva Fort to goto to begin with. The amount of Questing alone that you have to do to get there.

A new player should be more focused on Unlocking the "Star Map" thats every single tile set/planet/ and mission in Navigation while your doing that You should be ranking up frames, getting resources to get new frames, farming some bosses along the way to get new frames to begin with and then getting the Two Main Story Quests done which are requirements for junctions to even get to the Fortress.

You Should Not be nit picking at content that is more then likely beyond your level or ability to currently do, Nor should you be putting idea's out there that will/can/could potentially Hurt Not Only The Veterans But You When You Get To That Point In The Game.

We as veterans have literally nothing to do in the game! Dont you get that? We do the same thing over and over again that we have been doing for the past 20+ Mastery Ranks, There are players that are leaving left and right because the only thing left to do is Fashion Frame. Instead we have the opportunity here to make an Endless Mission that is actually worth a damn and this OP (and others like this) are basically trying to ruin it?

Spamming a mission for 40+ minutes straight is not something to do for veterans. It's burnout design when gating the carrot of Kuva behind it. 

This is exactly what I mean by"forcing" me to play it. If staying 40 minutes in survival is the best way to get Kuva then that's what I'm going to be doing more often than I want to for rewards, and NOT because I feel that 40 minutes runs are compellingb and challenging. And when I say me, I mean vets in general. The "just don't do it" excuse doesn't work. People didnt have to run the void nonstop, yet they did. 

You just don't provide an optional way to get an end-game resource with the response "well just don't do it". It's unfair to players that have reasonable play session expectations. Don't lock find kuva rewards behind extra long endurance runs. Simple.

Make the rewards and challenge have a better starting off point. Going to 20  in the Kuva fortress shouldn't be a trivial affair, and the rewards should reflect that. Don't make us go to 20 before feeling any kind of pressure THEN start to rewards vets that's ridiculous. 

 

Edited March 30, 2018 by Hypernaut1

[(PSN)BOSS_TPH76]

7 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Spamming a mission for 40+ minutes straight is not something to do for veterans. It's burnout design when gating the carrot of Kuva behind it. 

This is exactly what I mean by"forcing" me to play it. If staying 40 minutes in survival is the best way to get Kuva then that's what I'm going to be doing more often than I want to for rewards, and NOT because I feel that 40 minutes runs are compellingb and challenging. And when I say me, I mean vets in general. The "just don't do it" excuse doesn't work. People didnt have to run the void nonstop, yet they did. 

You just don't provide an optional way to get an end-game rewards with the response "well just don't do it". It's unfair to players that have reasonable play session expectations. Don't lock find kids rewards behind extra long endurance runs. Simple

Hmm....this sounds a lot like "I am on a diet so you can't have icecream".

Maybe I misinterpret you but are you saying you do not want an endless mission that rewards players for time spend playing because you feel compelled to then play it too or do you want both those missions for people who enjoy them and your type of missions? 

[SeaUrchins]

In other topic you said Kuva is useless to you, so you could as well ask for it to be removed from the game following your logic (which is "I don't want it because I don't like it"). Why are you forced to have those missions in your game, eh? lol

Basicly as soon as you claim kuva is useless to you, you are removing yourself from the discussion if its rewards should be scalable or not. Your opinion becomes irrelevant, because the subject is of no use to you anyway. But it's fun to read "it's useless" in one topic and "I am forced to farm it" in the other, make up your mind already

Edited March 30, 2018 by SeaUrchins

[Hypernaut1]

23 minutes ago, (PS4)BOSS_TPH76 said:

Hmm....this sounds a lot like "I am on a diet so you can't have icecream".

Maybe I misinterpret you but are you saying you do not want an endless mission that rewards players for time spend playing because you feel compelled to then play it too or do you want both those missions for people who enjoy them and your type of missions? 

Sigh.....

1. You do get rewarded for staying. Rewards don't stop

2. If players truly enjoyed 40 minutes runs, they would do it anyway. I'm not against endless, I enjoy it at times. I do play to 20 just because sometimes. Many groups go to 20, but rarely do people go to 40 because it's too much. 

3. If the main reason to stay 20+ minutes is challenge and rewards, why not have nodes that start at that challenge?

4. Endurance runners can still run endurance without scaling rewards. If they are into it for the endurance, then they should have no problem. 

5. Yes, in a grind game, vets are going to compelled to participate in the most efficient grind whether it's healthy for the game or not. 

6. I don't think devs want to add scaling anyway. I'm expressing that we could at least get a higher difficulty with increased rewards as that's what I truly feel players are trying to ask for in a roundabout way. 

7. I think fissure missions scaling should apply to all endless. To me that's just enough incentive without being too obnoxious.

Edited March 30, 2018 by Hypernaut1

[Hypernaut1]

24 minutes ago, SeaUrchins said:

In other topic you said Kuva is useless to you, so you could as well ask for it to be removed from the game following your logic (which is "I don't want it because I don't like it"). Why are you forced to have those missions in your game, eh? lol

Basicly as soon as you claim kuva is useless to you, you are removing yourself from the discussion if its rewards should be scalable or not. Your opinion becomes irrelevant, because the subject is of no use to you anyway. But it's fun to read "it's useless" in one topic and "I am forced to farm it" in the other, make up your mind already

I've never claimed kuva was useless to me if that's addressed to me. Kuva is one of the best resources in the game. It's a virtually endless sink. I have a bunch of Rivens (even ones I'm satisfied with) I can keep rolling to try my luck at better stats. 

Edited March 30, 2018 by Hypernaut1

[SeaUrchins]

@Hypernaut1 my apologies, I've mistaken you for someone else

[(PSN)BOSS_TPH76]

37 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Sigh.....

1. You do get rewarded for staying. Rewards don't stop

2. If players truly enjoyed 40 minutes runs, they would do it anyway. I'm not against endless, I enjoy it at times. I do play to 20 just because sometimes. Many groups go to 20, but rarely do people go to 40 because it's too much. 

3. If the main reason to stay 20+ minutes is challenge and rewards, why not have nodes that start at that challenge?

4. Endurance runners can still run endurance without scaling rewards. If they are into it for the endurance, then they should have no problem. 

5. Yes, in a grind game, vets are going to compelled to participate in the most efficient grind whether it's healthy for the game or not. 

6. I don't think devs want to add scaling anyway. I'm expressing that we could at least get a higher difficulty with increased rewards as that's what I truly feel players are trying to ask for in a roundabout way.

Don't sigh at me. I am asking you for clarification because you seem to exclude one over the other and yo are still not making it clear. 

1). There is a diminishing return in rewards. Life support drops less frequent. Which means towers need to be sacrificed. And at higher levels it becomes harder and harder to keep the towers alive because of enemy scaling. So you need some form of scaling to keep the rewards at the same level they are. 

2). Longest I have gotten was 1 hour and 25 minutes and we had to leave because one of the team could no longer hack it. We wanted to stay longer. Fissure run. The fact that I enjoy endurance runs does not mean that I do not want them to be rewarding my time. Given the fact that such runs end up with diminishing returns...the longer you stay the less rewarding it becomes. 
 
3). It is the time. Endurance runs are about time and seeing how far you can get....they always start at 0...you don't skip because that is antithetical to an endurance run. 

4). So essentially in your opinion endurance runners do not need good rewards for their time and effort because the activity is reward in itself....gotcha. You do understand that is incredibly selfish, a tad hypocritical and contradictory to your own claims right? Look...you are not going to do a challenge repeatedly if it doesn't offer rewards. Not if it lasts 20 minutes or 5 minutes or 6 hours. You may do it once...maybe twice for the kick and than you quit it. If you are really stubborn you may even do it 10 times or whatever...but the fact is even if you get an end game you want a good reward for playing it. Same for endurance runners.  

5). This does not answer my question...I think I was rather clear. Are you in fact arguing that we should not have endless missions with good rewards OR are you arguing we should have both? This ties in with 6). 

6). Players are asking for end game. Anything really. Because there really is none. The Riven system is merely a very bad designed band-aid to keep people occupied. But when they get the perfect Riven there is still nothing to do with it. This is the problem. Yet the Devs need to scale this Endless mission type to payers who are not entirely ready for end-game....and making it more difficult would defy that purpose. So asking for an end game challenge mission where you can farm Kuva can, and should, only be additional to this mission. 


 

Edited March 30, 2018 by (PS4)BOSS_TPH76

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

I'm not seeing the problem here.

You have quick missions that you can do a handful of for a decent amount.

Then you have "amped" quick missions which net you double for the extra effort vs difficulty.

Now you have an option to get a lot more but you end up spending a lot more time.

like...There is something for everyone.  I don't see how someone is being forced.

I personally don't like the idea of a "harder" endless variant.  I play endless missions to casually relax and depending on how I feel I stick around longer for the sake of endurance.

I don't really seek difficulty.  And I rather enjoy the ramp up of difficulty for endless.  Making it hard from the get go just would feel off.

[Wildcardgsx]

4 hours ago, (PS4)BOSS_TPH76 said:

Hmm....this sounds a lot like "I am on a diet so you can't have icecream".

Maybe I misinterpret you but are you saying you do not want an endless mission that rewards players for time spend playing because you feel compelled to then play it too or do you want both those missions for people who enjoy them and your type of missions? 

 

5 hours ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Spamming a mission for 40+ minutes straight is not something to do for veterans. It's burnout design when gating the carrot of Kuva behind it. 

This is exactly what I mean by"forcing" me to play it. If staying 40 minutes in survival is the best way to get Kuva then that's what I'm going to be doing more often than I want to for rewards, and NOT because I feel that 40 minutes runs are compellingb and challenging. And when I say me, I mean vets in general. The "just don't do it" excuse doesn't work. People didnt have to run the void nonstop, yet they did. 

You just don't provide an optional way to get an end-game resource with the response "well just don't do it". It's unfair to players that have reasonable play session expectations. Don't lock find kuva rewards behind extra long endurance runs. Simple.

Make the rewards and challenge have a better starting off point. Going to 20  in the Kuva fortress shouldn't be a trivial affair, and the rewards should reflect that. Don't make us go to 20 before feeling any kind of pressure THEN start to rewards vets that's ridiculous. 

 

Sir you logic Is flawed, I see you beginning to see or atleast understand the other side of your argument
 

 

4 hours ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Sigh.....

1. You do get rewarded for staying. Rewards don't stop

2. If players truly enjoyed 40 minutes runs, they would do it anyway. I'm not against endless, I enjoy it at times. I do play to 20 just because sometimes. Many groups go to 20, but rarely do people go to 40 because it's too much. 

3. If the main reason to stay 20+ minutes is challenge and rewards, why not have nodes that start at that challenge?

4. Endurance runners can still run endurance without scaling rewards. If they are into it for the endurance, then they should have no problem. 

5. Yes, in a grind game, vets are going to compelled to participate in the most efficient grind whether it's healthy for the game or not. 

6. I don't think devs want to add scaling anyway. I'm expressing that we could at least get a higher difficulty with increased rewards as that's what I truly feel players are trying to ask for in a roundabout way. 

7. I think fissure missions scaling should apply to all endless. To me that's just enough incentive without being too obnoxious.

Yet this type of play style doesn't interest you. We all get that. you've said this numerous times. Personally I cannot relate since from the time that I started getting serious about this game wanting to push my self to see what I could do and find out exactly where my frame, weapons and builds would break down and I could never find a group wanting to more then 40minute-120minute runs.

I dont know if your true goal here is to just get into missions get your reward and get out? Personally I think this is a great idea if at its core is utterly naive and will never happen. Atleast not in this game, you have to work towards your goals what ever those may or may not be.  The fact remains though, you're speaking to a topic that you have no interest in doing.

I dont see many people doing something in a game that they dont enjoy doing, this fact is highlighted by the current daily average player count compared to how DE likes to put its numbers in "Registered Users" and the vast and frankly overwelming disparage between the two.

At this point I feel like this is going in circles.

Look dude it boils down to this; If you dont want to do Endless again that Fine, and Yes I can say "Just Dont Do Them" its as easy to say as it is to do. You get more Kuva per minute by just doing Siphons and Floods and keep doing Siphons until the next Flood pops back up. Seriously its much easier and far less time consuming as the missions currently stand to do it this way. 

Continuing to talk about the Endless Kuva Survival is pointless as its been gimped so severely that its not worth talking about. DE is clearly not going to give us any kind of Endgame and it looks like your getting your wish any way as the rewards dont scale for S#&$ and are going to remain horrible. 

So congrats, you got what you wanted. Rewards wont scale. Chalk up a victory for you and another reason for more people to leave.

[dudefaceguy]

6 hours ago, (PS4)BOSS_TPH76 said:

this mission has a diminished return....where the amount of Kuva rewarded per hour becomes less as the drop rate of life support falls

It doesn't work that way anymore. Life support drops every 90 seconds no matter what you do, so you get 133.333 kuva per minute for the duration of the mission. The kuva does not scale up or down.

[Leland_Gaunt]

Endless kuvais the best thing that happened to WF in a while.  I Live survivals and finally there is a great node again, that is actually worth playing. I get kuva, relics and other stuff, it's great.

I don't understand why anyone would be against scaling rewards for staying longer though, it would just be alright. You can get more kuva more quickly doing siphons/floods, why not amp it up a little bit on the endless? Make it scale, make it drop double kuva every n-th harvester,  make a siphon appear every 20 min, I dunno. Many possibilities. 

Why people are against that is beyond me. It's the "I don't want it so you can't have it"-attitude that's been becoming more and more prominent lately. Dunno why that is, I can only assume it's a change in the playerbase itself. 

What I know for damn sure is that none of those snowflakes would've lasted in this game years ago when there was no guaranteed reward at the end, parts were drops and could fall off map, no easy peasy radshare and no ADD-encouraging reward-system. The game has become a joke in the sense that people nowadays expect everything handed to them within hours and DE caters to that to the max. Farming new primes within not even 2h and people still complain that the grind is too much/whatever is just ridiculous.

[(PSN)BOSS_TPH76]

10 hours ago, dudefaceguy said:

It doesn't work that way anymore. Life support drops every 90 seconds no matter what you do, so you get 133.333 kuva per minute for the duration of the mission. The kuva does not scale up or down.

I was talking more about the drop rate of life support by the enemies. Which means that you will eventually have to start sacrificing life support stations. Further excacerbated by the fact that life support stations itself become increasingly more vulnerable and less dependable because of enemy scaling.  

While it certainly depends on RNG and team composition/quality at what point that starts to become an issue there is a diminishing return. 

[dudefaceguy]

On 3/30/2018 at 7:47 AM, Leland_Gaunt said:

I don't understand why anyone would be against scaling rewards

There are a few good reasons.

1. Increased rewards cause inflation. Warframe has an economy, and kuva rewards affect prices between players, and also incentives to buy boosters. If rewards scale infinitely, kuva will suffer inflation, possibly to the point that it will be worthless, because people will have more than they could ever need. This means that after a few long missions, you will get no rewards at all because you will already have all the kuva you need. It would be like scaling alloy plate rewards.

2. To prevent ridiculous inflation, rewards would have to be capped, and would have to start below the optimal farming level. For example, they would start at 100 and scale up to 300 over a few hours. This is much worse for people who don't want to stay in very long missions.

3. A scaling reward feels like a punishment for extracting. It also feels like you are wasting your time in the early stages of the mission.

To fix inflation, and to give people who don't like very long missions a reasonable reward, and to avoid feelings of wasted time while waiting for rewards to scale up, you can just start the rewards at a reasonable level and have them stay reasonable forever. Then everyone gets a reasonable reward, no matter how long they stay.

Edited March 31, 2018 by dudefaceguy

[fluffysnowcap]

35 minutes ago, dudefaceguy said:

1. Increased rewards cause inflation. Warframe has an economy, and kuva rewards affect prices between players, and also incentives to buy boosters. If rewards scale infinitely, kuva will suffer inflation, possibly to the point that it will be worthless, because people will have more than they could ever need. This means that after a few long missions, you will get no rewards at all because you will already have all the kuva you need. It would be like scaling alloy plate rewards.

2. To prevent ridiculous inflation, rewards would have to be capped, and would have to start below the optimal farming level. For example, they would start at 100 and scale up to 300 over a few hours. This is much worse for people who don't want to stay in very long missions.

3. A scaling reward feels like a punishment for extracting. It also feels like you are wasting your time in the early stages of the mission.

To fix inflation, and to give people who don't like very long missions a reasonable reward, and to avoid feelings of wasted time while waiting for rewards to scale up, you can just start the rewards at a reasonable level and have them stay reasonable forever. Then everyone gets a reasonable reward, no matter how long they stay.

1. Is Kuva tradable? Why no its not so i fail to see that issue, 1.2. You want us(the players) to be forced to buy boosters? Shame on you!

2. Most argument are asking for a cap or for difficulty to grow exponentially to counter that at some point.

3. This point is so Vapid I can't even bring myself to answer it sensibly but here goes. A lack of scaling cements the meta at a single C rotation before extraction.

A complete lack of scaling will forever hold us back and prevent us from experiencing any difficulty in this game, and the only reason why any of us will ever see an enemy over level 100 is because were doing a sortie. Allowing rewards to scale on all endless missions a similar way to void fissure will add a sense of reward and accomplishment, whilst encourages us to go to the point of failure. Ultimately growing as players and as a community able to achieve things that we once thought impossible.

 

[Aggh]

1 hour ago, fluffysnowcap said:

1. Is Kuva tradable? Why no its not so i fail to see that issue, 1.2. You want us(the players) to be forced to buy boosters? Shame on you!

1.) Rivens are among the most profitable items in the game for DE.  Kuva is one of the reasons why they're worth so much.  DE not only gets people to keep playing with the system, but they give just enough chance for more high value rivens to be generated to create a chance for even more big plat purchases without driving down the value of rivens.
1.2) God forbid you support the game, right?  The game has always had a grind or pay business model.  Nothing is forcing you to buy boosters other than your own wants.

Edited March 31, 2018 by Aggh

[Hypernaut1]

2 hours ago, fluffysnowcap said:

 

A complete lack of scaling will forever hold us back and prevent us from experiencing any difficulty in this game, and the only reason why any of us will ever see an enemy over level 100 is because were doing a sortie. Allowing rewards to scale on all endless missions a similar way to void fissure will add a sense of reward and accomplishment, whilst encourages us to go to the point of failure. Ultimately growing as players and as a community able to achieve things that we once thought impossible.

 

No, gating challenge behind 20 minutes of content is what's holding us back. If you consider the first 20 as having NO difficulty, why would you want to have to do that every time to feel rewarded for doing survival? 

20 minutes is no "jump in and jump out" gameplay. We should get adequate rewards and challenge for staying 20 minutes max. Anything beyond that should not be rewarded any (much) extra than the previous 20 minutes. 

Edited March 31, 2018 by Hypernaut1

[fluffysnowcap]

 

11 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

No, gating challenge behind 20 minutes of content is what's holding us back. If you consider the first 20 as having NO difficulty, why would you want to have to do that every time to feel rewarded for doing survival?  

The reason why we consider the first 20 minutes to have no difficulty whatsoever is because this content and level of difficulty has been drilled in to ouer heads again and again to the point where it has become a mind numbingly boring, repetitive and easy.

11 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

20 minutes is no "jump in and jump out" gameplay. We should get adequate rewards and challenge for staying 20 minutes max. Anything being that should not be rewarded any (much) extra than the previous 20 minutes. 

Are multi caps jump in jump out? Where raids jump in jump out? Why should a hour long survival be any different?

[DatDarkOne]

I still have mixed feelings about this topic.  On one hand, having scaling rewards would be nice.  But on the other, I don't want to feel obligated to stay longer just to get better rewards.  

I think this might be the meat of the discussion, and one that isn't easily rectified.  Of course I could be completely wrong. 

[fluffysnowcap]

@DatDarkOne How do you feel about void fissure survival? as that's the kind of scaling rewards i have been arguing for.

[DeMonkey]

20 minutes ago, Aggh said:

1.) Rivens are among the most profitable items in the game for DE.  Kuva is one of the reasons why they're worth so much.  DE not only gets people to keep playing with the system, but they give just enough chance for more high value rivens to be generated to create a chance for even more big plat purchases without driving down the value of rivens.

16 hours ago, DeMonkey said:

Nothing in this game should be balanced around trade chat.

Arcanes were much the same, DE still made them easier to get.

10 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

We should get adequate rewards and challenge for staying 20 minutes max.

In your opinion.

Quite frankly though, what is then the point in endless missions? I've seen people bring up health issues with staying too long, so why not go the full mile and just remove the ''endless'' part of the mission.

What real point is there? Bragging rights? Bragging rights are inconsequential and should have no standing in a balance discussion.

It may be a strawman, but that's the logic that I'm seeing from some people. 'Going longer than 20 minutes is bad and should not be rewarded any differently' to me is tantamount to saying that beyond 20 minutes shouldn't exist, from the games point of view we should all quit after 20 minutes and restart.

Where's all the people from the maiming strike threads crying about how ''you can't tell me how to play''. I'd kinda like to do that, if you don't want to play and be rewarded for endurance you have other options currently available. I'd love to also see more options available on the Fortress, but why is it that endurance itself is completely unacceptable for rewards? Why is it, that as someone who doesn't want to play this mode and be rewarded for it, you want to argue against it and potentially ruin it for those that do. Because you don't want to be ''forced'' to run it? You have other options available, unlike so many other rewards in this game like ''arcanes, fish, mining, argon etc'' and I'd love to see even more options on the fortress.

I know I sound incredibly antagonistic, but I hope I've explained well enough why I might be coming across grumpy.

[Hypernaut1]

33 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

Arcanes were much the same, DE still made them easier to get.

In your opinion.

Quite frankly though, what is then the point in endless missions? I've seen people bring up health issues with staying too long, so why not go the full mile and just remove the ''endless'' part of the mission.

What real point is there? Bragging rights? Bragging rights are inconsequential and should have no standing in a balance discussion.

It may be a strawman, but that's the logic that I'm seeing from some people. 'Going longer than 20 minutes is bad and should not be rewarded any differently' to me is tantamount to saying that beyond 20 minutes shouldn't exist, from the games point of view we should all quit after 20 minutes and restart.

Where's all the people from the maiming strike threads crying about how ''you can't tell me how to play''. I'd kinda like to do that, if you don't want to play and be rewarded for endurance you have other options currently available. I'd love to also see more options available on the Fortress, but why is it that endurance itself is completely unacceptable for rewards? Why is it, that as someone who doesn't want to play this mode and be rewarded for it, you want to argue against it and potentially ruin it for those that do. Because you don't want to be ''forced'' to run it? You have other options available, unlike so many other rewards in this game like ''arcanes, fish, mining, argon etc'' and I'd love to see even more options on the fortress.

I know I sound incredibly antagonistic, but I hope I've explained well enough why I might be coming across grumpy.

Again, your exaggerate the issues, as if rewards STOP after 20. No, you still get rewarded. That's your reason to keep playing. 

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Again, your exaggerate the issues, as if rewards STOP after 20. No, you still get rewarded. That's your reason to keep playing. 

At least I can admit my strawman.

Where did I say, imply or otherwise act like rewards stop after 20 minutes?

This isn't a counter argument.

[fluffysnowcap]

1 minute ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Again, your exaggerate the issues, as if rewards STOP after 20. No, you still get rewarded. That's your reason to keep playing. 

There is no reason to go past 20 minutes.
!THAT IS THE POINT WE HAVE TRY TO GET IN TO YOUR HEAD!

It is considerably more efficient to do a run of 20 minutes camping next to the exit and leave a few seconds after the 20 mark and repeat instead of doing a 40 minute run. -_-

[Radagosh]

vor 5 Minuten schrieb Hypernaut1:

Again, your exaggerate the issues, as if rewards STOP after 20. No, you still get rewarded. That's your reason to keep playing. 

The whole argument is that you get the same rewards for 6x10 minutes and 1x60minutes run, which should not be a thing!

Going against harder content (in this example lvl200 enemies) should reward you for the risk you're taking, which we currently only see in endless fissure missions. I would thus like to see a "fissure-esk" system not just for endless kuva but for all endless type missions.

Just imagine being rewarded with additional exp from staying in longer in hydron instead of aborting after 5 waves or as suggested here, a little more kuva from a ressource increase in endless kuva missions

 

[DatDarkOne]

53 minutes ago, fluffysnowcap said:

@DatDarkOne How do you feel about void fissure survival? as that's the kind of scaling rewards i have been arguing for.

Good question.  I view them as convenient.  Convenient because I can open multiple relics in the same mission and easily solo them at my own pace.  

That last one is kinda more important now that my internet connection is not up to my usual standards.  

Either way I can't say that I'm for or against scaling rewards.  So, I'm mostly trying to be open minded about the needs/wants of others in regards to this topic.