Univac Before new Pets

[ImperatorJonah]

Add univac, make it a toggle in gameplay settings. Everybody's happy. 

[TheChaotic1]

I'm pro vac on all companions just so they buff sentinels to keep up with the animals

[d3me]

Maybe Mag's passive (vacuum on bullet jump) should be universal. It will silence a lot of pro-univac users :)

[fluffysnowcap]

1 hour ago, ImperatorJonah said:

Add univac, make it a toggle in gameplay settings. Everybody's happy. 

get this man a medal

[RedDirtTrooper]

Univac should exist. I played before vacuum was added, and I honestly won't go back. It makes a night and day difference for me in how much I enjoy the game, and over the last several years I've had that opinion shared with me by the vast majority of players I've interacted with. The only valid opinions in opposition to univac are about resource management and could be entirely negated by having an option in the game settings to disable it for those few who don't want it. Honestly, anyone I've seen opposed to it, other than those few resource management people, has been a truly obnoxious, elitist snob. Again, I played for years without vacuum. I am perfectly capable of doing so now. You aren't impressing anyone with your garbage "I do just fine without it" argument, and you definitely aren't proving that you're somehow better than anyone. This game is much more fun with vacuum than it is without it. I see no reason to spend my fun time having less fun than I could, so I keep all my non-sentinel pets frozen. Even though I have some really, really cool ones. Even though I'd enjoy taking them out once in a while. It's not worth the decline in enjoyment to bother equipping them. The fact that some tiny vocal minority doesn't is of zero concern to me, especially when, again, there could be a toggle and they could just not use it and go on being smug and condescending to others exactly like they are now.

Edited April 17, 2018 by RedDirtTrooper

[Ferbsol]

hace 3 horas, goomowiec dijo:

Maybie for you, tho. Using smeeta since kavat release, without any problems with farming or something. You're just lazy. #throwstonesatme

 

hace 14 minutos, RedDirtTrooper dijo:

Your an elitist with a garbage personality and a bad opinion though, why would he listen to anything you say?

so true

[Ferbsol]

thank you for being a voice of reason 

hace 1 hora, ImperatorJonah dijo:

Add univac, make it a toggle in gameplay settings. Everybody's happy. 

Edited April 17, 2018 by Ferbsol

[GinKenshin]

2 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

Funny, you ignore the perfectly valid case of getting all of my primed mods to R10, and maxing out all of the other mods as well, which needs about 40k endo PER PRIMED MOD, in addition to whatever the non-primed mods need.

SMH, just because you see it as a noob thing, doesn't mean I find it completely useful, especially if someone has hit MR22 in about two years of gameplay - which is probably far shorter than many of the slackers here that haven't hit MR20.

You do know you farm endo in rathuum and sorties rights? I haven’t played rathuum but I don’t think you can use companions in it, as for sorties, it’s from the ayatan and the reward 

 

  Say you do max these mods, what else is your reasoning for using something you don’t even need at this point? 

[Vox_Preliator]

You know, I want Univac but won't be especially broken up when we don't get it, but hot damn the arguments everyone make both for and against it are awful.

No, it is not required.  No, it is not useless.  You're deluding yourself if you believe either of those.

It's nice.  That's it.  It's nice to have.

The way everyone always exaggerates in either direction ("VACCUUM IS THE BEST/ONLY THING THAT COMPANIONS OFFER" vs "WELL I GUESS YOU JUST SUCK AND ARE LAZY") is dumb and shows that nobody knows how discourse works.

If a middle ground is required, I'd like to see all pets have innate Retrieve at all times (And give Chesa something else).  For reference, this causes pets to automatically loot everything they run over, except for picking up mods and bringing them to you because it's fancy I guess.  Innate Retrieve, frankly, would be nearly as effective as innate Vaccuum, with the only notable exception being picking up stuff that falls out of the map, an event whose frequency I can only assume is often overestimated considering I've never had it happen in nearly 1500 hours.

[(XBOX)oOJeshuanOo]

4 hours ago, Blade_Wolf_16 said:

Oh of course, having to grab the loot by yourself like the noob you once were is complete nonsense. 

No Vacuum? Completely useless. No matter how many usefull buffs companions can give, no matter how durable they can be, no matter how strong they can be, they'll always be useless because they won't let you grab loot from miles away with little to no effort. 

*sarcasm overdose, need coffee*

Expensive? It cost 5k cred for 6 stabilizers instead of 75k like before. If you think that's expensive, think twice and compare that to buying an unranked Primed mod from another player. THAT is expensive.

Oh wow I'm glad for that, its been a year since I used my ugly kavat

[Gandergear]

Mr25 and have built everything in the game

 

I support univac

 

Bite me i want a reason to use fluffy boys who die of old age faster than mayflys

[Gandergear]

6 hours ago, Vox_Preliator said:

You know, I want Univac but won't be especially broken up when we don't get it, but hot damn the arguments everyone make both for and against it are awful.

No, it is not required.  No, it is not useless.  You're deluding yourself if you believe either of those.

It's nice.  That's it.  It's nice to have.

The way everyone always exaggerates in either direction ("VACCUUM IS THE BEST/ONLY THING THAT COMPANIONS OFFER" vs "WELL I GUESS YOU JUST SUCK AND ARE LAZY") is dumb and shows that nobody knows how discourse works.

If a middle ground is required, I'd like to see all pets have innate Retrieve at all times (And give Chesa something else).  For reference, this causes pets to automatically loot everything they run over, except for picking up mods and bringing them to you because it's fancy I guess.  Innate Retrieve, frankly, would be nearly as effective as innate Vaccuum, with the only notable exception being picking up stuff that falls out of the map, an event whose frequency I can only assume is often overestimated considering I've never had it happen in nearly 1500 hours.

Retrieve doesnt work in combat and even worse only works when the pet feels like it.

 

Its not a good mod

[Shalath]

I can't be bothered to kill enemies, can we make the game do that for me while we are at it?

It isn't fair that I have to equip my Smeeta if I want Charm. Please put all companion abilities on my Warframe.

Vac is a choice, not a right.

[AperoBeltaTwo]

18 minutes ago, Shalath said:

I can't be bothered to kill enemies, can we make the game do that for me while we are at it?

It isn't fair that I have to equip my Smeeta if I want Charm. Please put all companion abilities on my Warframe.

Vac is a choice, not a right.

 Not when 80% of the playerbase uses it. It's not a matter of choice anymore.

 Whenever I see people objecting against the Univac, I can't help but wonder why are you doing this? Univac doesn't have to be permanent. If there's a switch on\off in the menu, it wouldn't affect your playstyle at all. But for people who use vacuum all the time it's a difference between enjoying the game and hating it. So it's basically forcing them into a particular choice of a companion, limiting variety. And that's exactly why people have been asking for Univac literally for years. On the other hand, what's your catch? Just to troll the guys on the thread who are being ignored by the devs? I don't get it.    

Edited April 18, 2018 by AperoBeltaTwo

[Birdframe_Prime]

Good news! We have universal vacuum! It's a base part of our warframes at all times and usable everywhere we go!

Bad news, it's 3m radius and DEScott doesn't ever want to increase that.

Conversationally; I rarely use any companions unless I'm going into a difficult mission where I need a full loadout. I don't need universal vacuum, haven't for several years. If I take a companion these days, it's actually usually Djinn for the radial CC on a crowd of enemies, for the 'Sacrifice and Primed Regen' combo and for extra damage/status on things while I'm concentrating on something else.

Warframes are so fast and mobile that there is literally no penalty for having to divert a few meters to your loot, it's just not an inhibiting factor for gameplay unless, and yes I'm going there, unless you're lazy enough to think it's a problem.

I'm not against it, I'm just okay with it never being better than we have it now. I've accepted DE's decision to grant us a very limited vacuum radius and to keep the large-area vacuum as a function for one type of companion. I don't need it, and neither do any of you. You just want it, and aren't prepared to take a little utility off in favour of other bonuses.

[den2k]

The main reason univac is felt to be needed is that the pet AI isn't customizable (Swords of Mana for GameBoy Advance had a simple 2-axis {support vs attack, wander vs stay close} and it was already a huge help) and it's plain stupid. They're less mobile than the warfaremso often they go down and are too far to be rescued. They don't have CC ability.

Now, sentinels have much more fexibility. Tough mission and/or frail frame? Taxon will help with overshields. Bullet soaking enemies or trainign weak weapons? Carrier and ammo becomes (almost) a non problem. Farming mission? Helios will help scan while you kill, not that you need help so it's a nice side job.

Kubrows are very helpful but each breed has a single useful feature. They have great attack but they do not employ hit and run tactics - at least some breeds should, Dogo Argentino don't do that but Sheperd dogs usually do, why not the same differences between pets? - while Kavats are a mess to farm for and IMHO they do not justify the expense until the AI improves or becomes customizable. Healing them with melee strikes make them durable but what about non melee oriented players?

Customization or at least profiling would help since Defense, Rescue, Survival and Assassinations have different needs.

If pets would become actually usable in a wider variety of situations then univac would cease to be reasonable since it really becomes a matter of choosing which benefit to obtain between different companions.

[RedDirtTrooper]

There are no valid arguments against univac that can't be rectified by a toggle in the game settings, just smug, condescending elitists to tell us we enjoy the wrong thing and linguistic experts to tell us the difference between need and want. I'm a master rank 25 player going on five years playing this game, and I will continue to ignore all companions that aren't sentinels unless a decent univac is implemented. It makes that big of a difference in how much I enjoy the game. If they removed vacuum tomorrow, I'd uninstall the game and walk away. What I don't understand, is the fact that I play with vacuum everyday and it doesn't effect these elitists in the slightest, so why do they care if univac is implemented and I continue to play with vacuum? How does it impact them in any way, whatsoever? Because I assure you, I could care less about how well they are playing and enjoying the game without it.

[Vox_Preliator]

8 hours ago, Gandergear said:

Retrieve doesnt work in combat and even worse only works when the pet feels like it.

Its not a good mod

 

14 hours ago, Vox_Preliator said:

innate Retrieve at all times

Outside of combat, my Chesa was extremely effective at collecting things.  If it was also active while in combat like how I'm suggessting, then very little loot would ever be missed.

[BlackCoMerc]

Let's tackle this from a different perspective - Loot Pickups:

Principle Reasons to institute manual loot pickups in games:

Loot reinforces a coherent sense of place, and reinforces internal consistency in world building:

In Borderlands, Diablo and Skyrim, loot items are "real" physical objects. Weapons, ammo caches, armor, etc all exist as actual objects in the world. Thus, picking them up manually makes logically consistent sense, and fosters internal consistency in world building. 

Warframe lacks this for several reasons. First, many objects don't exist in world. Most materials have no in game model. You break their containers (which often exist in immersion and consistency shattering locations to begin with, a la, rock formations in ship hallways) and numbers in your inventory increase. Likewise, weapon and frame parts have no world models, nor do blueprints. Manually retrieving loot in Warframe does not foster a sense of internal consistency in world building.

Risk/Reward: 

Retrieving loot in Borderlands and other action games sometimes represents a risk/reward trade-off. For instance, breaking from cover to retrieve that rocket launcher ammo during boss fights. Thus, manually retrieving loot - or not - represents an important bit of player agency.

Warframe lacks any sense of risk/reward when retrieving loot. Crowd Control and Damage Mitigation powers, coupled with frame mods and movement, see to this. Moreover, most loot retrieved in Warframe has no affect on combat (in 1300 hours, I have literally NEVER run dry of ammo during a fight). And Warframe lacks meaningful cover from which to break in the first place. So no, manually fetching your own loot in Warframe is not an.interesting trade off, or engaging, important player decision.

Slowing Players Down:

Some games use loot drop retrieval to slow pacing. To encourage careful examination of areas. This helps players spot hidden entrances, traps and secret areas. 

Warframe lacks much of this. Traps are blatant and obvious. Secret areas are well known and easy to spot and access. And in a game built upon speed and agility, slowing players down hads no value, and actively detracts from the player Experience.

If manually fetching loot neither fosters a coherent sense of world building, nor represents meaningful player agency, while detracting from the experience, THEN WHY DO IT IN THE FIRST PLACE?

Careful examination of the facts reveals that manually fetching loot in Warframe adds nothing to the game. Nonetheless, some people like it. 

So make a 12m universal vacuum. Players who don't like it, can toggle it off. BUT make it ignore Energy and Health drops, so players can decide when to retrieve those, and actually maybe experience some risk/reward while doing so.

There. Problem solved. For everyone.

Edited April 18, 2018 by BlackCoMerc

[BlackCoMerc]

3 hours ago, RedDirtTrooper said:

There are no valid arguments against univac that can't be rectified by a toggle in the game settings, just smug, condescending elitists to tell us we enjoy the wrong thing and linguistic experts to tell us the difference between need and want. I'm a master rank 25 player going on five years playing this game, and I will continue to ignore all companions that aren't sentinels unless a decent univac is implemented. It makes that big of a difference in how much I enjoy the game. If they removed vacuum tomorrow, I'd uninstall the game and walk away. What I don't understand, is the fact that I play with vacuum everyday and it doesn't effect these elitists in the slightest, so why do they care if univac is implemented and I continue to play with vacuum? How does it impact them in any way, whatsoever? Because I assure you, I could care less about how well they are playing and enjoying the game without it.

There's a brand of gamer - most of them, I suspect, young, but all of them gleaned on Grinding - who pride themselves on their ability to tolerate Tedium in games. It makes them feel like they are "putting in effort" that others "lack the will" to put in. Hence, the Elitism.

Back when I didn't work and had tons of free time and very little in my life upon which to pride myself on, I caught myself slipping into this mentality.

Years later, As someone who already puts in 40+ paid hours, plus housework, meals, shopping and and pets and a relationship...I will never understand this desire for gaming to feel like working. It's an absurd, perverse mindset that I am almost certain would not exist, had a lot of these people any other source of pride.