The Sacrifice - Meh

[Kashuken]

Pure disappointment, the only thing i sacrificed was time and effort into a poorly made quest.

Operatorframe as it is now called became key again where i had to space magic out of a powerful warframe and become the emo child where i died quickly and just respawned for about 10 minutes while i spammed some terrible powers and touched my target to trigger some flashback on par with a b movie featuring a Na'vi with an extra long arm. My warframe is slowly becoming basic transport because i am forced to use the emo child due to DE forcing terrible mechanics onto us and making quests which focus around emo child who is as useless as a chocolate teapot and it is not going to get any better and i know this will become worse because they will not allow us the option to kill it off and go back to being awesome super powerful space ninjas who nuke things for the fun of it.

Really what did we find out? the lotus buggered off and the operator has mummy issues and now abandoment issues to boot, still doesnt stop the lotus from giving missions it seems and upgraded ordis was probably the best thing that happened tbh. The reward of the Umbra warframe was a let down, reskinned Excalibur which is good for sentinal bashing and thats about it but requires to take up a few more mod slots instead of it being unique to the suit itself which is a missed opportunity.

Warframes were the Tenno to me, they were a race on there own and did not need an emo kid to control them, lore wise its as simple as this.

• Warframes are Tenno, beings grown for the orokin war against the sentinals
• Orokin stab them in the back by killing there general
• Tenno wait to strike and then hammer them when defences are down at a victory party
• Tenno scatter and lay low since they are no longer needed, enemy is gone/vanished
• Tenno reawaken hundreds of years later due to new threats like Corpus/Grineer and later find out old enemies maybe also be pulling the strings

Thats damn basic but does the job well, no need for terrible plot ideas which were never needed, the stalker could easily be a Tenno spy or a rogue Tenno who disagrees with there ideals and works to bring them down for personal reasons maybe, the orokin just want revenge, the sentinals want revenge and victory, the Tenno want to keep peace in the systems.

Now i know you complain how do we control other warframes well thats quite easy, Tenno are like ants and have a hivemind so to speak but you only start off with one warframe and to be able to aquire other frames all you have to do is defeat the warframe in combat and then link up with it and then you are able to switch from one to the other but to stop it being godlike from the get go you still have to use your frame to level up and bond with it, this can be through tests/quest or also on planets where they live or guard a population perhaps. It could even become a family and certain frames together give perks and boosts, even send them on missions if you are not using the frames to gather resources etc and give a proper backstory for each one.

See that, nice and simple really and a different way to acquire a frame with plenty of room to expand the lore without ballsing it up.

Back to the quest itself weakest entry of the 3, Second dream was better but the twist is still one of the worst ideas ive ever seen in a game and was a huge letdown and everything onwards from that slowly got worse as it became operator frame and the lore became a joke.

 

 

 

[Beartornado]

The gist I got of this is you hate Operator and aren't interested in doing much more than grossly oversimplifying the universe DE has created so you can skip straight to the part where you talk even more about how much you hate Operator.

It's a damn shame you think this is the weakest of the 3 too, I think this steps well above TWW and easily competes with TSD for a great story. 

Edited July 16, 2018 by Beartornado

[Kashuken]

Just now, Beartornado said:

The gist I got of this is you hate Operator and aren't interested in doing much more than grossly oversimplifying the universe DE has created so you can skip straight to the part where you talk even more about how much you hate Operator.

It's a damn shame you think this is the weakest of the 3 too, I think this steps well above TWW and easily competes with TSD for a great story. 

It has no credible story thats the problem and the operator will always be hated because it is not just lore but forced game mechanics which cannot be avoided.

I already said my idea was basic, i guess you skipped that part but it can be easily expanded and added without having to force in crappy mechanics because you made a bad choice in telling the lore, the sacrifice could have easily given you a choice to kill the operator and become your true self and be self aware for the first time or just continue being a puppet yet it did zero.

[LegacyDM]

Shrug. I enjoyed the quest and thought the storyline was well done. I enjoyed playing othello against that ahole. Only thing I was disappointed about was I couldn't bring my warframe of choice to fight ballas. But It makes sense lore wise why you need to use umbra. 

To each is their own I guess.

[peterc3]

6 minutes ago, Kashuken said:

• Warframes are Tenno, beings grown for the orokin war against the sentinals
• Orokin stab them in the back by killing there general
• Tenno wait to strike and then hammer them when defences are down at a victory party
• Tenno scatter and lay low since they are no longer needed, enemy is gone/vanished
• Tenno reawaken hundreds of years later due to new threats like Corpus/Grineer and later find out old enemies maybe also be pulling the strings

You've basically said you dislike everything remotely interesting or original about Warframe's story. How is it you've gotten this far in a game you find it so easy to hate?

9 minutes ago, Kashuken said:

Thats damn basic but does the job well, no need for terrible plot ideas which were never needed, the stalker could easily be a Tenno spy or a rogue Tenno who disagrees with there ideals and works to bring them down for personal reasons maybe, the orokin just want revenge, the sentinals want revenge and victory, the Tenno want to keep peace in the systems.

Now i know you complain how do we control other warframes well thats quite easy, Tenno are like ants and have a hivemind so to speak but you only start off with one warframe and to be able to aquire other frames all you have to do is defeat the warframe in combat and then link up with it and then you are able to switch from one to the other but to stop it being godlike from the get go you still have to use your frame to level up and bond with it, this can be through tests/quest or also on planets where they live or guard a population perhaps. It could even become a family and certain frames together give perks and boosts, even send them on missions if you are not using the frames to gather resources etc and give a proper backstory for each one.

This is an entirely different game.

[Goodwill]

Fair enough, you don't like it.

As they say, one man's trash is another man's treasure.

[(PSN)Acheronrock33]

I thought The Sacrifice was superb and I'm sorry to hear you didn't enjoy it. I think the addition of the Operators is what helps set Warframe apart. It subverts the expectation of the tough video game hero whilst adding a disturbing layer to pretty much everything we've ever done in-game. It's refreshing to play a game that challenges the audience and tries to do something a bit different.

[ReinAxefury]

TL;DR: Operator hate thread disguised as discussion about The Sacrifice quest.

 

I liked the quest, did it almost entirely using my operator, even facetanking Mimics with no issues (anyone can do it with Magus arcanes and maybe some waybounds).

[fadingtheory]

I agree that the Operator is a poorly disguised, completely unexplained tumor on the side of the game, but that's just from a gameplay perspective. As part of the story their fine.

I'd be lying if I said that having to use the Operator (And die 30 times) during The Sacrifice didn't hurt the story of the quest as a whole, though. Hard to really get into it when I'm angry at the gameplay.

[(PSN)RockGotti]

I personally do not give a crap about the lore in Warframe, only played the quest to get Umbra. Quite frankly I was irritated that the cutscenes were unskippable.

Im glad others enjoyed it but I couldnt tell you anything about the story whatsoever. All I remember about it was playing a board game with a reject God of War character.

[novalery]

41 minutes ago, Kashuken said:

Operatorframe as it is now called became key again where i had to space magic out of a powerful warframe and become the emo child where i died quickly and just respawned for about 10 minutes while i spammed some terrible powers and touched my target to trigger some flashback on par with a b movie featuring a Na'vi with an extra long arm.

So

 you don’t like it because you can’t use your operator very well... or you don’t like operator so you don’t bother to learn on how to use them correctly. couldn’t do the mission correctly because of it. And because of that you don’t like the mission.

 

well. You do you friend... i like the operator. even maxed his naramon focus tree. It is the first class that i choosed, without even looking into it in the internet, because i like its description. 

I did die in operator form during this mission, but only a few times because i goofed up. But i did play Go very well vs ballas.

All in all, i like this quest. it is the best one of the three main quest

Edited July 16, 2018 by novalery

[(PSN)vl_Monarch_lv]

47 minutes ago, Beartornado said:

The gist I got of this is you hate Operator and aren't interested in doing much more than grossly oversimplifying the universe DE has created so you can skip straight to the part where you talk even more about how much you hate Operator.

It's a damn shame you think this is the weakest of the 3 too, I think this steps well above TWW and easily competes with TSD for a great story. 

This, so much.

TC is salty that DE isnt just abandoning a system he doesn't like.

Get over it. Get some Focus, get some amps, and just git gud.

[tinyranitar]

The only thing I agree with you is the final fight between me and Umbra where he spams Radial Javelin and I got killed every 5s, respawning and repeat the same agonizing process for like 20 times until I finally broke his shield and use transference on him. 

The remainder? Can't say it's award material but it's damn good. Especially the part where they explained how the Tenno are able to control the Warframe

"Somehow, those little devils can look inside an ugly, twisted and broken thing.
And take away its pain"

I think you just have a prejudice against it because you hate the operator

[DeathDweller]

43 minutes ago, Kashuken said:

 

• Warframes are Tenno, beings grown for the orokin war against the sentinals
• Orokin stab them in the back by killing there general
• Tenno wait to strike and then hammer them when defences are down at a victory party
• Tenno scatter and lay low since they are no longer needed, enemy is gone/vanished
• Tenno reawaken hundreds of years later due to new threats like Corpus/Grineer and later find out old enemies maybe also be pulling the strings

Thats damn basic but does the job well

 

Warframes can't be Tenno since that name has to do with the Zariman 10-zero so let's say that the Frames are just Frames.

Orokin stab them in the back why?Cause they created them to fight for them as u said.Just for the plot?Ok...

If that's the case there would not be no reason to continue working with the Orokin or attend a victory party in their honnor.

If all of the above are true there were never needed they were created and used and who is the enemy Orokin or Sentients?

Corpus and Grineer aren't new threats.

Also since frames are frames who switches from frame to frame?Why a frame would defeat another frame to acquire it or bond?

So your suggestions don't do the job well, pretty much the opposite.Like it or not the whole universe of Warframe is around those emo kids from the start.If it weren't for them there would be no Lotus, no Tenno etc.

I agree the Sacrifice was weak in comparison to the other 2 but still.None forces you the operator the only times you have to play as operator are in Eidolon hunt which gets you focus and gear for your operator so it doesn't affect your warframe play and in story quests.But you don't like the story to begin with so why bother playing the quests in the first place?

[(PSN)watt4hem]

Tbf, the operator isn't as annoying in the sacrifice. And about it being generally meh, i think it just suffered from the sequel effect. I just stopped making any expectation and ended up enjoying it a kin to random movies i get from hitting random.

Tho, the digi lotus is weird, no argument there. Give us full on ordis, de.

[Beartornado]

1 hour ago, Kashuken said:

It has no credible story thats the problem and the operator will always be hated because it is not just lore but forced game mechanics which cannot be avoided.

You will always hate Operator, you and your decidedly few who feel as strongly with you. And the only reason I'd even quantify you as few is because, while I wasn't that bothered by it, I'd gladly agree to the idea that TWW's release was botched. They committed to a release schedule they didn't get anywhere near meeting, and by the time it came out it was still a buggy mess because they were trying to get the new Operator control system sorted. And despite all of that they haven't felt the need to backpedal on Operator. I honestly think they would've with this quest if there was genuine concern that the playerbase would hemhorrage and the game would lose popularity. They've done this before with features that received significant backlash, heck they killed off the original Raids because of how low their popularity was vs how much effort it took to maintain them. I was in a raiding Clan and while I do miss them it wasn't a deal breaker for me.

With everything they've done to Operator after PoE and beyond they control much better and the upgrades have a meaningful impact on your power and surviviability. The only obstacle is the grind which they'll hopefully tone down with future Focus affinity changes. It's clear they want Operator to stay.

1 hour ago, Kashuken said:

I already said my idea was basic, i guess you skipped that part but it can be easily expanded and added without having to force in crappy mechanics because you made a bad choice in telling the lore, the sacrifice could have easily given you a choice to kill the operator and become your true self and be self aware for the first time or just continue being a puppet yet it did zero.

That sounds like one of the least interesting most shounen-esque power fantasy story arcs you could go with. You riff against Operators for being some annoying emo child when it's giving a relatively honest portrayal of an untouched young mind who has only known combat and Warframe for as far back as they can remember and must now make their own decisions after never needing to do so.

I was absolutely captivated by The Sacrifice because it wasn't a power fantasy (well, not JUST a power fantasy, Excalibur Umbra has some massive perks to his polarities and ability effects). It boiled down to a simple story, it didn't just finish the tale of the Origin system about how the Operators are scarred children who survived a horrific accident and the Warframes are based off of Helminth-mutated humans/warriors from the Orokin empire. Dropping lore like that is meaningless, and so the Sacrifice brought it all together with the one seemingly minor detail: that they found comfort in each other's presence. The Operator's void powers could be calmed in transference to the Warframes, and the broken minds of the original Warframes could be tamed by an Operator's transference, by an empathy they shared as two broken products of the Orokin war machine.

The story you describe has no moments like that, no room for moments like that. You're an emotionless, overpowered killing machine who always has the moral high ground, there is no grey area. What a boring, safe story, reminiscent of the now flailing Destiny 2 that can't even appease its veterans with answers they've deserved since 2014.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Beartornado

[(PSN)REAPER_021417]

I liked the quest but have always hated operator mode so I feel your pain on that

[khazlol]

I also hate operators but i love the story and lore.

and by hate i mean the gameplay aspect,

They feel kinda akward and limited compared to the warframes, and if not for enemies with immunities i would never press 5

[EibonEthos]

Most likely, as with Railjack and it's future, we will see more elements the tie together the loose and odd mechanics that DE has given us. The things that are hated today will become amazing as the game continues to improve and master it's design. So I'm sorry you didn't enjoy it but wait until the New War and cinematics beyond that. 

 

I am also a story lover and lore junkie so it's crack to me.

[Justice_Ember]

Headcanon is by no means a proper argument against a game's story and lore.

[Tora.Prime]

Farm focus, get an amp, some arcanes and git gud, when you build it may it change you opinion

[SherpaRage]

How I feel reading this thread:

[(XBOX)DShinShoryuken]

The Sacrifice was a given Thank You to the player base for our patience and support of the game. DE has given us only 2 Warframes since we have started- our beginning choice and Umbra. With Umbra, they gave us a power upgrade as well as a story to make things go forward. We used our Frames and Void Demon to find out more about where the game lore came from and is going.

Many who are rushing through the game miss many of the Easter Eggs DE gives. We get a new Poster Boy for the vets. This is the reason we lose the Warframes we had before and take our Void Demon to get this one- we are going into new territory where what we had before was the beginning. This is a new Frame to go forward into the next chapter of the games growth. 

We are told more about our ship and the room of Infested we have. What reason is Ballas informing us about Helminth now after all this time players have been complaining about the cyst ruining FashionFrame (true endgame)? Because while they were clearing their cyst from those Frames, those Frame will not be able to be used in the coming of the true power behind the Orokin. They will have to go with new ones. It is kind of like how women choose Style over Comfort. 

You can not like the story or the operator. Others do not like PVP or Archwing. Others do not like TradeFrame or grinding. And that is fine....as long as you do like to play the game. Keep playing and like and dislike what you do....the game will keep giving more content and growing. 

Cheers

[(PSN)MrNishi]

1 hour ago, DeathDweller said:

Warframes can't be Tenno since that name has to do with the Zariman 10-zero so let's say that the Frames are just Frames.

...

Have to disagree here, only because Gravidus Dilemma was fight over control of "Tenno".

Whom Sargys Ruk got his Augmented armor from "Tenno" and Alad V rebuilt "Tenno" as Zanuka. Clearly Alad later clarifies as seeing inside a Tenno and not making sense of what was inside. 

-I assume they were interchanging between Warframe and Tenno. Other wise Ruk is crafting Alloy Armor from Tenno Children, Zanuka is also crafted from Tenno Children and Alad V has been dissecting Children for experimentation and not Warframes all this time.

Alad V Various Quotes:

• "Oh, Tenno, Project Zanuka is the next step in your evolution. I will make you a hundred times stronger! Why resist this?"
• "Huh, I can't decide Tenno, have you come to save your friends? Or just steal my property?"
• "Now play nice Tenno, Zanuka is one of you. (Laughs) Actually, come to think of it, Zanuka is many of you."
• "You must be asking, 'Alad, what's in this for you?' It's simple really; I scratch your metal back, and you scratch mine. All the credits in the system aren't worth half as much as a Tenno owing you a favor."
• "Of course, the Lotus sends the mute peasants to disrupt my business. So please, come closer. Let me introduce my latest line of robotics, hybridized with Warframe components. Zanuka! KILL!"

 

Seems like Alad V interchanges between Tenno and Warframe, as if they are one in the same.

 

As for the meat of this thread:

I actually enjoy my Operator and thought the queste was pretty easy...on my main account.

On my alt accounts where I had the base 250 health and base Mote Amp...I was questioning why "Void Mode" still left you vulnerable to Umbra Skiajati attacks? Hoping there is further explanation.

If Void Mode "worked" the Operator Story missions would be that much easier with proper timing even without Amps, Focus nodes, and Arcanes.

As for not liking Operators: that is basically who/what we have always been and is the actual Mastery Rank Reflection of our Operator gaining experience. I can understand enjoying the game for the mechanics and not really caring for the story, however I don't feel it was done generically and perhaps I did not feel "it" was coming or paragraphed.

I will admit to being perhaps too engrossed that I may not have an entirely objective view and maybe the Story telling from Second Dream until now really was lazily written and easily predictable.

(Basically been getting only bite sized pieces of lore from Events until Second Dream cinematic quest came along. Comparatively to the 4900+hrs on main account all the story missions still leave a lot for full grasp of lore. With lots of unanswered questions:

-How are the Quills adults whom harness the Void power to time/dimesion travel? Along with teaching us how to better fight Sentients?

-Why does Hunhow whom clearly knows a distinction between Grinner, Infested, Corpus, and Orokin, refer to Alad V as the "Orokin called Alad V"? Does this mean Alad V was experimenting on Prime Warframes hence Valkyr Prime still having painful shrieks and Orokin wrist bindings?

-Is the Armor degradation in Infested Salavage, and formerly Jordas Verdict, allude to Armor and Helminth bonding becoming out of sync? Is this why we start hearing Jordas/Helminth/Lephantis/Phorid like taunts about being the same/embrace us?

-How are our Operators being immune to the infection be any different than Neewa?

More importantly on PS4, if we decided to side with Nef Anyone in Tubeman event...how the heck did Alad V get cured in Second Dream?!? We definitely should have had different imaging and he could have received cure for helping us out after 2nd Dream!

[(PSN)zeratul____12]

Heres a thought, maybe if you spent actual time working on your Operator and made them stronger you could have breezed through the parts you hate.

Operators are here to stay and that is the end of it, now you can continue to whine and complain about them and do nothing to improve your Operator, so when the next bit of Operator content comes around you can get frustrated because your Operator was weak OR just face the facts and deal with it.