Is Garuda, insulting to Religion? (closed, questions answered)

[General_Durandal]

9 hours ago, Unibot said:

Too bad I can't downvote blasphemous posts. White knights - begone. Your time is gone.

Huh?

Did you read past the title?

[General_Durandal]

7 hours ago, Yrkul said:

Funny how, apart from certain monotheists, most followers of different faiths don't agonize over the portrayal of their deities in popular media. Even more hillarious is the tendency of a certain ideology to come up with problematisms where there are none outside their own narrative.

Unless you yourself are a devout worshipper of Garuda, the only one insulting someone here is you, by insinuating that others are too meek and powerless to speak up themselves.

And for your information, a lot of companies are using the name for anything from restaurants, pilates studios and an airline company, to recruitment companies and music creators. A quick search with your favorite search engine would tell you that. Perhaps you should start your crusade with a little more research than a Wikipedia article, and start on a very long list. And while you're at it, go bother Marvel, Neil Gaiman and a whole host of other modern media creators for their outright egregious and outright insulting use of norse mythology for a start. This (mis)use of mythology/religion and history has been going on for a long time now, and funny enough, it is only thin skinned SJWs looking for their next cause to fight for, that find it "problematic".

I'll repeat what I wrote the last time someone was raising a fuss over the use of deities in Warframe: I play games for respite from daily life. Don't drag bigotry and fights over nothing into Warframe.

I'm not agonizing over this, or fussing, or bigoting.
I am merely pointing out that Garuda doesn't fit the theme of the god she's named after,
while every other warframe based off a god does fit that god's theme.
(except Zephyr, who in myth was a male)

as-well-as asking where DE got the idea for this Garuda.
I pointed at Garuda from Street Fighter, who is also bloody, and spiky.
Perhaps the same source Street Fighter went with is what DE went with?
Maybe DE based their Garuda on the Garuda from Street Fighter?

[General_Durandal]

9 hours ago, (PS4)Kamranos said:

To be fair, “being offended” kind of goes against Buddhism in the first place, so No I don’t think it would be deemed “offensive”.

My religion is a resurgent Ancient Egyptian, but Inaros does not offend me.

I'm not a Buddhist, but I respect them and others.

Inaros fits his theme as far as I can see.
Just as well as others like Wukong, Nehza, and Loki.
But Garuda doesn't fit any aspect of the god Garuda's myth, and would like to know what Garuda from what myth does fit it.
The only bloody/spiky Garuda I know of, is the one from Street fighter.
Don't know where they got their idea, but it might be where DE get their idea too.

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

As an Agnostic, and therefore a completely unbiased perspective on the issue.

I declare that: No, Garuda is not offensive.

Edited November 11, 2018 by (PS4)haphazardlynamed

[General_Durandal]

5 hours ago, NinjaZeku said:

Just out of curiosity, using the same source ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garuda

The Garuda is a legendary bird or bird-like creature in Hindu, Buddhist and Jain mythology.
[...] shown either in zoomorphic form (giant bird with partially open wings) or an anthropomorphic form (man with wings and some bird features)

Warframe's Garuda has huge claws stylized to look quite a bit like wings, checks out.

Garuda is invoked as a symbol of impetuous violent force, of speed, and of martial prowess.
Powerful warriors advancing rapidly on doomed foes are likened to Garuda swooping down on a serpent.
Defeated warriors are like snakes beaten down by Garuda.

That doesn't sound like Warframe's version contradicts (that part of) the source material at all, either.

India primarily uses Garuda as a martial motif

So the link of Garuda = elite warrior / protector is well established.

Indonesia uses the Garuda, called the Garuda Pancasila, as its national symbol. It is somewhat intertwined with the concept of the phoenix.

Part of Garuda's kit is about coming back from the brink of death.

It's quite possible I'm culturally insensitive but ... really, seems to me like DE did their homework here,
and Garuda is a totally acceptable name for what we ended up with.

^{_{better name than Hydroid or Gara, in any case, or the design mess that is Khora}}

Very interesting finds!

~

Passive: Less health = more damage.

Power 1: Steal enemy's soul and use it as a weapon.

Power 2: Impale enemies on spikes and drink their blood to heal.

Power 3: Cut self to recharge energy.

Power 4: Float around as blades spin around you. Become a sentient blender.

While irl myth Garuda was an unstoppable force, a great warrior, defended the weak, 
a courageous hero, also a bard possibly, involved with singing and rhythm.
If I was in-charge of designing a Garuda themed frame,
Passive: Less health = more armor for self / Allies with less health = more armor for them too.
Power 1: Recharge party's shields, or give 100+ over-shields to those with 0 base shield, or shields are already full. 
Power 2: A combination of Zephyr and Excal's 1st. Fast flight when not targeting an enemy. Quick rush attack when targeting an enemy.
Power 3: AoE music that buffs allies as long as it is playing.
Power 4: Take to the sky with mighty wings,
with exalted throwing wind orbs that explode in gales of force that always knock-back enemies and generate tornadoes.

[(PSN)Kamranos]

23 minutes ago, General_Durandal said:

I'm not a Buddhist, but I respect them and others.

As do I, but Buddhists if “offended” are taught to look inward on what negative emotions they feel and make corrections on themselves. So again, they couldn’t really get “offended” anyway. Now that is no reason to intentionally try to. Every religion and mythology has had their deities used in popular media one way or the other with some major liberties taken, the ones with stronger fortitude don’t care much about the fictional variants.

[General_Durandal]

4 hours ago, MudShadow said:

Garuda is mythological figure. If it was a religious figure that was being depicted such as Jesus or Allah then I'm sure some people would have something negative to say about that. But complaining about Garuda would be on the same level as complaining because a game has a Succubi from Christianity or a Jinn/Djinn/Genie from Islamic Mythology. Overall that would be childish and difficult to take seriously.

All gods are mythological figures.
Even Jesus counts as mythology, because you can't actually prove he could heal, or create more food from some food.
History is things with proven fact.
Mythology is things that can't be proven.
I believe Jesus was real, and had powers, but can't prove he did, so no point arguing about it.

Garuda however, in irl myth, is a great warrior, protector of the weak, courageous hero, and even bardic type figure.
But in-game, steals souls, impales enemies, drinks blood, cut's self, and tears enemies apart like a blender.
Garuda should have been male, and named Vlad maybe instead, he stole souls, impaled enemies, and drank blood.

[General_Durandal]

1 hour ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

There was a thread about this concerning Harrow.

Why?
I don't know of any god named Harrow.
And he does seem to fit his theme as a dark priest.
I see nothing wrong with him.

[(PSN)psycofang]

4 minutes ago, General_Durandal said:

Why?
I don't know of any god named Harrow.
And he does seem to fit his theme as a dark priest.
I see nothing wrong with him.

Something about Harrow being blasphemous to catholic religion

One of the stronger troll threads in awhile, had like 400 replies or so

[General_Durandal]

1 hour ago, Amhiel said:

With all due respect: you're complaining DE didn't do their homework while you're confusing Buddhism with Hinduism in the same post. That's not helping credibility all that much... 

 

 

Garuda is from both, and more Religions, just with different names.
Just like every other religion, they all take from the same sources.

Like Ares, the God of War. Named Mars in Roman myth.
No-one knows a God's true name, only the name given to them by the people that worship them.

Edited November 11, 2018 by General_Durandal

[General_Durandal]

44 minutes ago, (PS4)haphazardlynamed said:

As an Agnostic, and therefore a completely unbiased perspective on the issue.

I declare that: No, Garuda is not offensive.

Okay, thank you.

[DeMonkey]

3 hours ago, General_Durandal said:

I don't see anything wrong with either. Their themes are down-pat

So's Garudas.

3 hours ago, General_Durandal said:

They should have named her after that one Queen,
that drained the blood of beautiful young women and bathed in it,
because she though it would make her stay young.
Her passive could be a Blood Counter, kinda like Nidus's thing,
every enemy killed or hurt by a slash proc within 2 meters of her gives her 1 blood point,
and her powers would be fueled by blood instead of energy.
One of her powers would use blood to heal herself and procs.
And her 4th power could be and exalted dagger with 100% slash damage with no crit chance and high status chance.

Why are you proposing a full scale rework in a thread you've made to question the cultural sensitivity of a frame. Surely that would be better suited (although still not a good idea tbh) in the Garuda feedback section.

[Femuru]

im Buddhist but i dont feel offended wat so ever by this, its a fantasy game, there is no insult made, and i find garuda an awesome frame or should we be offended by someone just being offended? cant we live our lives in peace w/o losing our minds from being alittle uncomfortable in life? cant we worry about more important stuff like where is my wukong rework???

[Melbourne404]

You can also say Harrow is offensive to Catholicism

Edited November 11, 2018 by Melbourne404

[Melbourne404]

10 hours ago, General_Durandal said:

I don't see anything wrong with either. Their themes are down-pat.
Garuda is however, not fitting the theme of the god Garuda in the slightest.
Which is why I posted this, as an over-thinker, I over-think things, and like to discus things.

They should have named her after that one Queen,
that drained the blood of beautiful young women and bathed in it,
because she though it would make her stay young.
Her passive could be a Blood Counter, kinda like Nidus's thing,
every enemy killed or hurt by a slash proc within 2 meters of her gives her 1 blood point,
and her powers would be fueled by blood instead of energy.
One of her powers would use blood to heal herself and procs.
And her 4th power could be and exalted dagger with 100% slash damage with no crit chance and high status chance.

Funnily enough, they named her alternate helmet after that queen.

[General_Durandal]

9 hours ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

Something about Harrow being blasphemous to catholic religion

One of the stronger troll threads in awhile, had like 400 replies or so

Religious fanatics usually ignore the bad side of their religion.
Everything about Harrow is based on stuff that real life "dark priests" have done,
so to those Fanatic Catholics with an ego, I can see why they'd find him offensive.

Now i'm wondering if there is a dark side to Garuda that I don't know about.
I wouldn't be surprised.
The main reason I posted this thread is to ask where DE got the idea from.
It's at the bottom of the post, but I'm starting to think if anyone got that far.

[General_Durandal]

6 hours ago, DeMonkey said:

So's Garudas.

Why are you proposing a full scale rework in a thread you've made to question the cultural sensitivity of a frame. Surely that would be better suited (although still not a good idea tbh) in the Garuda feedback section.

In-game Garuda is not down-pat compared to myth's Garuda.

9 hours ago, General_Durandal said:

Passive: Less health = more damage.

Power 1: Steal enemy's soul and use it as a weapon.

Power 2: Impale enemies on spikes and drink their blood to heal.

Power 3: Cut self to recharge energy.

Power 4: Float around as blades spin around you. Become a sentient blender.

While irl myth Garuda was an unstoppable force, a great warrior, defended the weak, 
a courageous hero, also a bard possibly, involved with singing and rhythm.
If I was in-charge of designing a Garuda themed frame,
Passive: Less health = more armor for self / Allies with less health = more armor for them too.
Power 1: Recharge party's shields, or give 100+ over-shields to those with 0 base shield, or shields are already full. 
Power 2: A combination of Zephyr and Excal's 1st. Fast flight when not targeting an enemy. Quick rush attack when targeting an enemy.
Power 3: AoE music that buffs allies as long as it is playing.
Power 4: Take to the sky with mighty wings,
with exalted throwing wind orbs that explode in gales of force that always knock-back enemies and generate tornadoes.

[General_Durandal]

1 hour ago, ShenRyujin said:

im Buddhist but i dont feel offended wat so ever by this, its a fantasy game, there is no insult made, and i find garuda an awesome frame or should we be offended by someone just being offended? cant we live our lives in peace w/o losing our minds from being alittle uncomfortable in life? cant we worry about more important stuff like where is my wukong rework???

I am not offended, I am asking if it is insulting,
and where the idea came from, since the Garuda I know doesn't fit the Garuda frame's setup.
Perhaps there is a dark side to Garuda I don't know?

You are the 2nd to say you are not offended by it directly, so thank you.

[General_Durandal]

16 minutes ago, Melbourne404 said:

Funnily enough, they named her alternate helmet after the queen.

That's interesting, and also confusing.
Garuda and (google searchs) Elizabeth Báthory have nothing I know about in common with each other.

In this post I ask 2 questions,
is it insulting, (2 have said they are not offended by it, so that question is answered)
and where the idea came from. (which has not been answered)
I'm wondering if there is a dark side to Garuda I don't know.

[Melbourne404]

9 minutes ago, General_Durandal said:

That's interesting, and also confusing.
Garuda and (google searchs) Elizabeth Báthory have nothing I know about in common with each other.

Pretty sure it's the blood. All that blood.

[Nazrethim]

hace 18 horas, Thaylien dijo:

 

If you really want to go find something that could be considered a valid argument, though, go read up on Smite and the actual problems they had with Hindu religious activists in relation to their adapted character Kali.

That was hilarious because the in-game representation was actually very accurate to the myths.

[Nazrethim]

hace 1 hora, General_Durandal dijo:

That's interesting, and also confusing.
Garuda and (google searchs) Elizabeth Báthory have nothing I know about in common with each other.

In this post I ask 2 questions,
is it insulting, (2 have said they are not offended by it, so that question is answered)
and where the idea came from. (which has not been answered)
I'm wondering if there is a dark side to Garuda I don't know.

I'm pretty sure they named her Garuda, designed her as a bird of prey, then jumped to blood, then by that point they realised it made no sense to the myth but were too advanced to change course. 

I mean Reveant was suppossed to be a Vampire named Vlad and look at him. Or they made her a vampire because they couldnt make Rev into one.

[General_Durandal]

1 hour ago, Melbourne404 said:

Pretty sure it's the blood. All that blood.

Blood isn't mentioned once in Garuda's wiki page.
So, unless the blood connection is from somewhere else, I would't know it,
and would like to know.

[Infirito]

Religion is an insult to common sense, so all is fair as far as I'm concerned.

Also, Equinox can easily pass as a female version of Shiva with their duality.

 

And while we're on the topic, what about Wukong? He's supposed to be an ape-$#!^ crazy op god-frame, not a monkey-cloud.

[General_Durandal]

36 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

I'm pretty sure they named her Garuda, designed her as a bird of prey, then jumped to blood, then by that point they realised it made no sense to the myth but were too advanced to change course. 

I mean Reveant was suppossed to be a Vampire named Vlad and look at him. Or they made her a vampire because they couldnt make Rev into one.

Maybe, but that still would enplane the powers.
I mean, power 3 is to hurt-self to recharge energy.
Why would self-harm give you energy?
Is this Garuda a masochist, that likes pain, she she cuts herself, and it energizes her?
It makes no sense, even for a vampire, or Bathory theme.
Neither cut themselves, Bathory's maid cut herself on accident, and the blood got on her,
and the parts of her the got bloody felt like they where smoother to her,
which is why she started bathing in blood in the first place.

Garuda's power 3, Bloodletting, is the big main confusing thing about this whole thing for me.
Neither Garuda, or Bathory have any connection to Bloodletting,
which is an old medical treatment to get rid of "bad blood".
(at least I can't find any connections to it)

They did change Vlad's name to Revenant though,
they should have changed Garuda's name to something like,
Barbara, Rancor, Spite, or Malice.