You can do about 60% of Nightwave for rank 30 without convict captures.

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

Some challenges are a little tough. Some a little hard. Most easy. There's a few elite ones but I think everyone forgot you don't need to do everything to hit 30. You can choose to not do something and be fine. Yes 60 min survs can be hard like how Hydrolysts were hard for a lot in last week's Nightwave. But you are not forced to do every task and especially not forced to do it immediately you have a full week to take little bites out of Nightwave and maybe set time aside for the big elite ones. Or if they're not your thing skip em n do missions you do like (Even open world zones) and get convicts for bits of standing to make up for it nice and easy, leisurely even. The amount of times I'm hearing the term "forced" here is in my opinion ridiculous nonsense and for the uninformed at least do not feel you have to do everything on that list of challenges. Yes challenges to challenge you if only a little.

That's my piece about it. I just find this negativity in the face of something I have been really enjoying myself and with friends frustrating especially when it's replaced something frankly worthless. We have stuff to do now people just refuse to do it.

[Rawbeard]

if you constantly skip the "elite" because they are... this... then this 60% will not work out

[RX-3DR]

You cannot assure people that they will make it right on 61% when the current episode ends. You're assuming your schedule for everyone else.

If anything comes up and you miss a week and you realize that you're not going to get what you're aiming for 2 months in, it's not a fun experience. Clearing as much as you can early gives breathing room that is very important for people with not much time or a consistent schedule.

[KnossosTNC]

Noted. And personally, I'm not concerned about hitting that rank 30 mark. My concern is the long term viability of Nightwave as a replacement for Alerts. I just think the balance between effort and reward and their consistency aren't quite right.

For the record, my stubbornness will find the 60 minute Survivals too juicy of a test to pass up, so you can bet I'm going to complete them by the end of the week. However, I'm also very aware that I'm a weirdo, and many people will recoil at the sight of them.

And that's the thing: I don't want them to. I sincerely want Nightwave to succeed. My criticisms are not out of some negative compulsion to resist change, but genuine desire to improve the new system.

Edited March 4, 2019 by KnossosTNC

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

2 hours ago, RX-3DR said:

You cannot assure people that they will make it right on 61% when the current episode ends. You're assuming your schedule for everyone else.

If anything comes up and you miss a week and you realize that you're not going to get what you're aiming for 2 months in, it's not a fun experience. Clearing as much as you can early gives breathing room that is very important for people with not much time or a consistent schedule.

it's never truly out of f reach due to convicts appearing and they'll appear more frequently as time goes on to where likely you'll just earn 150 standing per mission by week 10 and it'll be a viable grind. This is ignoring you likely already getting plenty of groups i've easily hit 20 convict groups that's 3k EXTRA standing right there.

[RX-3DR]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam said:

it's never truly out of f reach due to convicts appearing and they'll appear more frequently as time goes on to where likely you'll just earn 150 standing per mission by week 10 and it'll be a viable grind. This is ignoring you likely already getting plenty of groups i've easily hit 20 convict groups that's 3k EXTRA standing right there.

It is a bit of a rich get richer situation with the convicts. The people who are likely to sit on the borderline due to other commitments are not going to find 50 groups of convicts to compensate. If you're short by a relatively large margin, say 2 ranks off, you can't really expect a person to make up that gap from hunting 100 groups, especially when you find this out a few weeks before the season end.

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

2 hours ago, KnossosTNC said:

Noted. And personally, I'm not concerned about hitting that rank 30 mark. My concern is the long term viability of Nightwave as a replacement for Alerts. I just think the balance between effort and reward and their consistency aren't quite right.

For the record, my stubbornness will find the 60 minute Survivals too juicy of a test to pass up, so you can bet I'm going to complete them by the end of the week. However, I'm also very aware that I'm a weirdo, and many people will recoil at the sight of them.

And that's the thing: I don't want them to. I sincerely want Nightwave to succeed. My criticisms are not out of some negative compulsion to resist change, but genuine desire to improve the new system.

You have to look at what you're replacing with alerts. Honestly my involvement with alerts was the Lotus alerts which are likely still going to appear after each devstream. Sometimes a nitain here n there and once in blue moon maybe a catalyst would float by at 3 a.m. and I'll see it. By mr 3 I ignored basically everything else so alerts are so inconsequential that the replacement to me just feels like a new thing to me.

And it's good you're looking to do em. It's a challenge after all.  

[Randomeer]

60% challenges is highly misleading since challenges do not reward equally. It is possible to do 83% of challenges and not have enough to max out Nightwave if the challenges skipped were Elite Weeklies.

[NocheLuz]

Basically, 60% mean you can skip some Elite challenge but not normal weekly and daily.

If you do all daily and weekly and only done 1 Elite weekly, you'll get about 3 ranks per week and reach rank 30 before 10 weeks.

[(XBOX)Rufnax]

DE: Creating Time investment reward system

Player without a lot of free time to invest: complain

DE: PikachuShockmeme.png

[(XBOX)Dic3man]

For me rank 29 is the only goal the cosmetics on rank 30 is something I couldnt care less about.

Edited March 4, 2019 by (XB1)Dic3man

[(XBOX)Rufnax]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb NocheLuz:

Basically, 60% mean you can skip some Elite challenge but not normal weekly and daily.

If you do all daily and weekly and only done 1 Elite weekly, you'll get about 3 ranks per week and reach rank 30 before 10 weeks.

why people always assuming that everyone can play daily? Dude what when I just can play from time to time every 2-3 wekks? I know that I am not allowed to get the Armor set in that instance and I am even ok with that. DE trying to reward all the no-lifer hardcore players here and I get that but seriously I will need about 3 weeks to get 50 wolf credits to then get some nitain extract? WTF?! There should be another option to earn wolf credits or atleast they should not disappear as soon as the season ends.

[NocheLuz]

1 minute ago, (XB1)Rufnax said:

why people always assuming that everyone can play daily? Dude what when I just can play from time to time every 2-3 wekks? I know that I am not allowed to get the Armor set in that instance and I am even ok with that. DE trying to reward all the no-lifer hardcore players here and I get that but seriously I will need about 3 weeks to get 50 wolf credits to then get some nitain extract? WTF?! There should be another option to earn wolf credits or atleast they should not disappear as soon as the season ends.

If you don't want to play daily there are always Elite challenge. I just layout some facts. If you don't want to do daily just do Elite. If you don't want to do Elite just do daily. It's just as simple as that. Also, Daily is super easy. It don't take even 10 minutes to complete one. But If you feel like 10 minutes per day is very long... Well... Even old Alert require you to play atleast 10 min survival and no body complain about it...

[(XBOX)Rufnax]

vor 13 Minuten schrieb NocheLuz:

If you don't want to play daily there are always Elite challenge. I just layout some facts. If you don't want to do daily just do Elite. If you don't want to do Elite just do daily. It's just as simple as that. Also, Daily is super easy. It don't take even 10 minutes to complete one. But If you feel like 10 minutes per day is very long... Well... Even old Alert require you to play atleast 10 min survival and no body complain about it...

that's not what I said. I just said I don't have the time to play regulary. It's not about having the time to play 10 minutes or 30 minutes or even an hour. It's about finding the time at all.

And just to follow your example I would

1. need to play 10 dailys to get 10.000 XP to get one rank, correct? That means I would need 30 days to get to rank 3 to get 50 wolf credits to get some alert items that I could farm withing a few minutes before?

or

2. play the weekly challenges for about 5.000 standing each with 2 weekly challenges for each weak makes also 3 weeks to get to lvl 3.

Sounds not like a good concept for me but ok.

But that isn't even what I was talking about. I don't understand why you people hate so hard on the people saying that they don't have that much time to invest? Is it really that hard to accept that other people have other life schedules and maybe not the time that you have left for playing games? I always thought the WF community was good but the hate that I see against just some people saying "oh well this new reward system is not really compatible with my life (gaming style)" is astonishing.

Why can't you people accept that there are some people that have not the same life as you and work together to make a reward system that works for casuals and hardcore players instead of convincing me to "just play regulary".

Edited March 4, 2019 by (XB1)Rufnax
added stuff

[Aldain]

1 minute ago, (XB1)Rufnax said:

Why can't you people accept that there are some people that have not the same life as you and work together to make a reward system that works for casuals and hardcore players instead of convincing me to "just play regulary".

Because everyone but them is lazy and endless missions going for 2 hours should be the only game mode and anyone who doesn't like it should stop playing their game.

Or something like that, honestly all I've seen from those in favor of these 60 minute slogs are insults and "BUT YOU ONLY NEED 60%" and it isn't inspiring me to suddenly join their side of the argument.

Most of the time the community of Warframe is fine, but this whole Nightwave ordeal has kicked a hornet nest.

[Talinthis]

60 minutes is bonkers but at least it was for kuva, so now if anyone needs help in my clan i go along for some delicious red juice!! should seriously only be 30 though, or a TOTAL of 60 minutes, not in one run.. what kind of a weekly mission is an hour long game in a single mission? i got 20k kuva for me last run. ofc i NEVER farm kuva without a booster and my smeeta.

Edited March 4, 2019 by Talinthis

[(XBOX)Rufnax]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb Aldain:

Because everyone but them is lazy and endless missions going for 2 hours should be the only game mode and anyone who doesn't like it should stop playing their game.

Or something like that, honestly all I've seen from those in favor of these 60 minute slogs are insults and "BUT YOU ONLY NEED 60%" and it isn't inspiring me to suddenly join their side of the argument.

Most of the time the community of Warframe is fine, but this whole Nightwave ordeal has kicked a hornet nest.

lmfao exactly! "but you only need 60%" sounds like a #*!%ing meme to me at this point already.

But yeah the amount of hate and split in the player base that DE managed to create with this new reward system is insane.

Strangely I only see two kind of people, the people saying that the "time of investment forreward" is not suitable for them and the people that attack them with being lazy.

Why not a few people attacking the no-lifer neckbeards for being hardcore to make the circle perfect? Just strange for me why the community reacts like that instead of working together.

Hardest part is that all the big youtubers / content creators following the same band wagon because there is not a single Tuber that can only invest a few hours every few weeks.

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

32 minutes ago, (XB1)Rufnax said:

why people always assuming that everyone can play daily? Dude what when I just can play from time to time every 2-3 wekks? I know that I am not allowed to get the Armor set in that instance and I am even ok with that. DE trying to reward all the no-lifer hardcore players here and I get that but seriously I will need about 3 weeks to get 50 wolf credits to then get some nitain extract? WTF?! There should be another option to earn wolf credits or atleast they should not disappear as soon as the season ends.

The dailies stack they don't go away likely until the weekly shift if at all so that's more leniency. 

[(PSN)Yes-Man-Kablaam]

1 minute ago, (XB1)Rufnax said:

lmfao exactly! "but you only need 60%" sounds like a #*!%ing meme to me at this point already.

But yeah the amount of hate and split in the player base that DE managed to create with this new reward system is insane.

Strangely I only see two kind of people, the people saying that the "time of investment forreward" is not suitable for them and the people that attack them with being lazy.

Why not a few people attacking the no-lifer neckbeards for being hardcore to make the circle perfect? Just strange for me why the community reacts like that instead of working together.

Hardest part is that all the big youtubers / content creators following the same band wagon because there is not a single Tuber that can only invest a few hours every few weeks.

Framkly unbeknownst to you you were missing a HELL of a lot more stuff before with the old alert system than this. This still allows you to catch up to get stuff. But rng decided every week while you were away you'd miss a catalyst or reactor alert and it's just gone too bad.

[NocheLuz]

38 minutes ago, (XB1)Rufnax said:

But that isn't even what I was talking about. I don't understand why you people hate so hard on the people saying that they don't have that much time to invest? Is it really that hard to accept that other people have other life schedules and maybe not the time that you have left for playing games? I always thought the WF community was good but the hate that I see against just some people saying "oh well this new reward system is not really compatible with my life (gaming style)" is astonishing.

Why can't you people accept that there are some people that have not the same life as you and work together to make a reward system that works for casuals and hardcore players instead of convincing me to "just play regulary".

Is it that hard to accept the Nightwave then? You don't have to do daily, you just have to do every weekly (included Elite) to reach rank 30. So, Is it that hard? Or you find that old Alert where everything appear at random and you don't even have time for it anyway suit you better? Let's say that you have 1 hour each week, you can finish atleast 4 to 6 weekly challenge and get about 12k to 16k point. Is it hard? Or you find that the random time you were play and not getting Alert you want is much easier? I think you should look at what better. Not that I said I won't accept your play style, it's only you who said that. So, I assume you happy with randomness of Alert system than you choose your reward of the new system. Since you said something about nitain extract, I would assume you do have time to play and get those in regular basis... Why can't you do that with Nightwave is beyond my comprehension.

Also, even if you don't do daily. You can do weekly, even if it did reach the 60% meme, I would say you still get reward more then old Alert gave to you.

[(XBOX)Rufnax]

vor 29 Minuten schrieb (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam:

Framkly unbeknownst to you you were missing a HELL of a lot more stuff before with the old alert system than this. This still allows you to catch up to get stuff. But rng decided every week while you were away you'd miss a catalyst or reactor alert and it's just gone too bad.

yeah well nobody said that the alert system was better but all I am saying is that the new system needs a bit of optimization. That's all. Problem is that people apparently assuming that you want to have the old stupid alert system back just because you say that the new one has it's flaws and that's not true.

I like the new system itself from it's idea but I think it can be optimized to appeal to a wider range of people and play styles.

[(XBOX)Rufnax]

Gerade eben schrieb NocheLuz:

Is it that hard to accept the Nightwave then? You don't have to do daily, you just have to do every weekly (included Elite) to reach rank 30. So, Is it that hard? Or you find that old Alert where everything appear at random and you don't even have time for it anyway suit you better? Let's say that you have 1 hour each week, you can finish atleast 4 to 6 weekly challenge and get about 12k to 16k point. Is it hard? Or you find that the random time you were play and not getting Alert you want is much easier? I think you should look at what better. Not that I said I won't accept your play style, it's only you who said that. So, I assume you happy with randomness of Alert system than you choose your reward of the new system. Since you said something about nitain extract, I would assume you do have time to play and get those in regular basis... Why can't you do that with Nightwave is beyond my comprehension.

Also, even if you don't do daily. You can do weekly, even if it did reach the 60% meme, I would say you still get reward more then old Alert gave to you.

please see my comment that I just wrote.

[NocheLuz]

10 minutes ago, (XB1)Rufnax said:

please see my comment that I just wrote.

OK...

Edit :

Basically, you want new system to.... what? have wider range? maybe instead of weekly it should be monthly now (lol). Each person have difference play style, someone play it daily and someone play it whenever they feel like it. So they should get the same rewards? I would say the system do have the flaw. Some people who love to play Warframe but don't really have time for it would love to sacrifice sometime to just log-in and do 10 minutes daily happily. That is, if they really love Warframe and not just log-in whenever they feel like.

But I do feel some people might not be able to log-in and play the game daily. Fortunately, daily persist for about 3 days I think? (need confirmation) so basically you can log-in each 2 or 3 days and still get all the daily easily.

Edited March 4, 2019 by NocheLuz
Adding comment

[IspanoLFW]

57 minutes ago, (PS4)Yes-Man-Kablaam said:

The dailies stack they don't go away likely until the weekly shift if at all so that's more leniency. 

They last 3 days each, there's a timer on them. This also means if you get a daily the day before reset and leave it til after reset, it's still there.

[(XBOX)Rufnax]

vor 27 Minuten schrieb NocheLuz:

OK...

Edit :

Basically, you want new system to.... what? have wider range? maybe instead of weekly it should be monthly now (lol). Each person have difference play style, someone play it daily and someone play it whenever they feel like it. So they should get the same rewards? I would say the system do have the flaw of some people who love to play Warframe but don't really have time for it would love to sacrifice sometime to just log-in and do 10 minutes daily happily. That is, if they really love Warframe and not just log-in whenever they feel like.

But I do feel some people might not be able to log-in and play the game daily. Fortunately, daily persist for about 3 days I think? (need confirmation) so basically you can log-in each 2 or 3 days and still get all the daily easily.

1. I personally would be fine when there would be another option to earn wolf credits instead of every few standing levels and that they do not just decay after the season ends.

So I would atleast be able to farm my wolf credits for the stuff that I would have gotten before with a little luck from time to time like extractors, nitain extract or cosmetics.

So everyone will have something to farm for. You can farm for to increase your standing and I can farm for my basic alert stuff. Wouldn't change anything for the experience on your side in my opinion.

2. make it 5-8k for each standing level or increase the possibilites and amount to earn standing. So the casuals would have an easier time farming standing and the hardcore players can do the same but just faster. Wouldn't also change anything for you just that you can grind faster than the casuals. Right?

**EDIT: I just realized that decreasing the of standing per level wouldn't solve the issue and just move it to another point. But yeah as I said I am no expert with that stuff. Most obvious solution is for me to descease the difficulty to earn standing but I don't know if that will cause other issues.

Would that be such a bad solution? I don't think that this will take anything away from you as an hardcore player but also gives people like me the opportunity to atleast have no downside with the new alert system as I can still regulary get my reactors and stuff. 

Oh and I just want to add that obvious information that I am at no point an experienced game designer or anything.

These are just my thoughts as a casual player loving to grind warframe every few weeks a bit.

I am most probably sure that there are people out there with better ideas how you could optimize the new alert system for the whole player base.

 

Edited March 4, 2019 by (XB1)Rufnax
adding comment see "edit"