Tenebrous Ephemera farm - a step in the right direction. Make farming all Ephemeras token based

[JawNuts]

Most ephemera's drop rates are through pure rng. I have basically given up on farming most of them because of the atrocious drop rates. 

Take for example the Blazing Step ephemera. It drops on rotation C of Elite Sanctuary Onslaught with a 1.01% drop chance. You basically have to sit through 20 mins of the game mode and have a 98.99% chance NOT to get the ephemera. I have nearly maxed out my focus schools and still haven't gotten that ephemera.

The same goes for Vengeful ephemera's from lich. I've killed around 16-18 liches and none of them spawned with an ephemera. I just want my kitty to be sparky sparky shiny.

Solution: Make every rng earn-able ephemera token based like the Tenebrous. Tokens should be different for every game mode. (E.g. Lich token, ESO token, Stalker token, etc.) I don't care if I have to run rotation C of  ESO 20 more times just as long I know there's light at the end of the tunnel.

Edited January 27, 2020 by JawNuts

[(XBOX)CaligulaTwily]

Hmm. It'd get me to fight Profit Taker again, and not just once a month for Nightwave. Don't wanna RNG for those ephemeras.

Tho I guess, once I get enough tokens for all the ephemeras, I'll be back to killing Profit Taker once a month again. 

[Chewarette]

Tenebrous new way is boring. Run this S#&$ 15 times or 8 if you have a booster or fewer if your kavat wakes up at the right time

Yyyyeeaahhhh, 14 first runs are useless and you're only happy to do the last one. And once you have 15 tokens, well you'll buy it, as expected. Boring.

[Chicken-Biryani]

2 minutes ago, Chewarette said:

Tenebrous new way is boring. Run this S#&$ 15 times or 8 if you have a booster or fewer if your kavat wakes up at the right time

Yyyyeeaahhhh, 14 first runs are useless and you're only happy to do the last one. And once you have 15 tokens, well you'll buy it, as expected. Boring.

At least you won't end up doing 38 runs for that pos. 

[seprent]

I plus one this idea for making little duck the ephemera merchent 

exploiter orb kill = 1 token 15 tokens = ephemera bp/built ephemera for you 

[seprent]

1 minute ago, --C--Nehra said:

At least you won't end up doing 38 runs for that pos. 

38 is rookie numbers. My friend they lost count around 90 and part of their sanity too 

[(PSN)Onder6099]

20 times? I counted 160 if I overlook Scenes and Peculiar mods. 

Edited January 27, 2020 by (PS4)Onder6099

[JawNuts]

1 minute ago, seprent said:

38 is rookie numbers. My friend they lost count around 90 and part of their sanity too 

Damn!

13 minutes ago, Chewarette said:

Tenebrous new way is boring. Run this S#&$ 15 times or 8 if you have a booster or fewer if your kavat wakes up at the right time

Yyyyeeaahhhh, 14 first runs are useless and you're only happy to do the last one. And once you have 15 tokens, well you'll buy it, as expected. Boring.

Running it 8-15 times = not fun

Running it more than 15 times = fun?

[JawNuts]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

20 times? I counted 160 if I overlook Scenes and Peculiar mods. 

20 more runs is fine or any set limit. I personally lost count of my ESO runs after the 69th

[Chewarette]

1 hour ago, JawNuts said:

Damn!

Running it 8-15 times = not fun

Running it more than 15 times = fun?

I'm not saying the ominous previous way of getting it was better. Of course it wasn't, due to the addition of extremely low probabilities, it was hella painful (and adding to that that people felt obliged to leave if they didn't get anything worthy).

But a Token system removes all the thrill. It replaces that with expectation. Conclusion? All the runs before the last one will be painfully rude because you very well know you won't gain anything there except progressing toward a definite number through a loading bar. If I tell you that in order to craft the next Warframe, you will need to run a new mission type EXACTLY 50 times because it's no longer a 10-something % drop chance for one part, but it's a token you get 1 of every run, well you'll start doing calculations to know how much time you'll waste before having one worthy run. Yeah, that's maybe 5 hours of gametime doing nothing. Will you start your grind happily or grumbly ?

I would have preferred if DE had implemented what they said earlier : some kind of challenge, requiring skill or not. Token system is none of that.

They could have created Lua or Derelict-like challenges. They could have created mini-objectives, for example : Kill 20 sentients and reach the end tile in less than X minutes and you get to fight the Destroyatorolist which has a 20% chance of dropping the Ephemera, XX% for Captura and YY% for Shedu Parts or whatever, and at least you'd feel something about doing those runs. Each run could give you something.

I know people despise RNG, but it keeps the game alive, if kept reasonable. A low % chance is fine. A % chance below 1% starts to be painful, 0.1% is a joke that noone is interested in. But if you remove RNG entirely from the game, which tokens are doing, it will be painful. Replace the % chances for dropping Warframes blueprints on bosses and create a token which you only need 3 to get the frame and that will suck. Remove Prime Gold parts in Relics by a Token you need 10 of to buy whatever Prime Warframe part you need and the Prime Farm will become hellishly bland.

Edited January 27, 2020 by Chewarette

[GPrime96]

It would only take something that makes ESO worth playing up to 8 everyday for me to get Blazing Step Ephemera.  That Game Mode is only a worse Survival after maxing out the Focus.

[Xaero]

5 minutes ago, Chewarette said:

They could have created mini-objectives, for example : Kill 20 sentients and reach the end tile in less than X minutes and you get to fight the Destroyatorolist which has a 20% chance of dropping the Ephemera, XX% for Captura and YY% for Shedu Parts or whatever, and at least you'd feel something about doing those runs.

And that's where "The game's too difficult" crew comes in.

[paszanobicep]

Honestly I like the change to the ephemera but it was too easy to obtain make it around 100 Tokens, so its actually still something you need to work for. 

[Xaero]

21 minutes ago, Chewarette said:

I know people despise RNG, but it keeps the game alive, if kept reasonable. A low % chance is fine. A % chance below 1% starts to be painful, 0.1% is a joke that noone is interested in. But if you remove RNG entirely from the tokem, which tokens are doing, it will be painful. Replace the % chances for dropping Warframes blueprints on bosses and create a token which you only need 3 to get the frame and that will suck. Remove Prime Gold parts in Relics by getting a Token you need 10 of to buy whatever Warframe you need and the Prime Farm will become hellishly bland.

Keep in mind that systems like frame acquisition are monetized, so people can always opt out of rng.

Edited January 27, 2020 by Xaero

[(PSN)Onder6099]

1 hour ago, JawNuts said:

20 more runs is fine or any set limit. I personally lost count of my ESO runs after the 69th

Correct me if I’m wrong but I see little misunderstanding here. Lato, Braton and Ephemera it’s 8 parts x 20 in Your Token system.

[Chewarette]

1 hour ago, Xaero said:

And that's where "The game's too difficult" crew comes in.

Yeah I know but that's sad. I'm not saying we need some ultimate difficulty stuff requiring perfect teamplay, meta team and the likes. Just kill 20 sentients in 3-5 minutes, which isn't something you absolutely need a meta for, and kill a boss which isn't Hydrolist of Profit Taker but more a... Raptor-like ? Dunno, something that you may need to work toward but not sacrificing any virgin to the Meta god

[(PSN)robotwars7]

2 hours ago, Chewarette said:

Dunno, something that you may need to work toward but not sacrificing any virgin to the Meta god

then it will be dubbed "too easy" for some people. this is the problem: challenge is subjective, and there's no way of making everyone happy no matter what acquisition method is used for Ephemeras. RNG increases Longevity sure, but I wouldn't argue it makes anything more interesting. if anything, spending too long on one thing makes it less interesting, and that's what leads to burnout.

[Chewarette]

14 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

then it will be dubbed "too easy" for some people. this is the problem: challenge is subjective, and there's no way of making everyone happy no matter what acquisition method is used for Ephemeras. RNG increases Longevity sure, but I wouldn't argue it makes anything more interesting. if anything, spending too long on one thing makes it less interesting, and that's what leads to burnout.

I totally agree. But anyway even if it's "too easy", it's not a problem. The quick thing I proposed was just to have nearly the same "difficulty" as a starchart boss, with a minor RNG (10% chance for the "big thing" you'll be after) that may guarantee you get the Ephemera while grinding for the Shedu, I think that's acceptable.

Imo RNG is mandatory in this game, but it has to be balanced. The RNG we got so far in Warframe is fine (except for Riven, of course), but everything with ridiculously low chances should be reviewed (mostly Ephemeras). Token system is as bad as 0.1% RNG in my opinion, at the other extreme. That's like "congratulations, you did something totally normal, take that".

Edited January 27, 2020 by Chewarette

[White_Matter]

Well, honest to god if it wasn't for the gian point glitch, I wouldn't farm it. 

Both grind and rng are Ok as long as they are implemented well.

DE has lost their touch and made a mess of both recently. So while a token based system sounds fine on paper, if the grind for it is excessive, then it can become just as bad as layers of rng, because one of the major problems with WF at this time is that it has no sustainable gameplay. So doing something over and over again becomes boring real fast, whether you are repeating to grind or test the rng doesn't matter.