Acolytes Lore NW

[Maj-Cero]

With the Acolytes making yet another return always gets me to thinking of their background. But I don't think DE should go and make a completely new quest around them, but maybe utilize a current mini-lore method for a potential future Acolyte return down the road.

What I'm talking about is putting them into a Nightwave short story. Not all of them, though it would still give background to their existence, I think it should focus specifically on one of them. The one that hasn't returned since the first Acolyte event, the return of Misery.

In addition to Misery having the regular drop table of all the mods, Nightwave rewards could include possible new mods, Acolyte weapons (I've always wanted Vengeance's Rapier/Claw melee, although think their weapons should be added to normal Acolytes drop table in their own regular event, so Misery's only for this), and even a universal Acolyte Stalker helmet that can be used on ANY Warframe (probably work same way as the Dullahan Mask).

Regardless what I think good rewards could be, I still think Nightwave would be the perfect platform for adding a small amount of lore/story behind these guys.

Edited February 10, 2020 by Maj-Cero

[HugintheCrow]

100% agreed. The acolytes are very much in the "There is literally no explanation" territory currently. Nightwave would be the perfect way to put them properly in lore.

[FireSegment]

i think it's not that DE don't want to make a story about them, more like the story they got for them years ago already outdated and discontinue. 

Lore wise, acolyte are ... err .. "frames" that took Stalker route instead of 2nd dream route. But then what stalker route suppose to mean got scrap in a sense and DE moved on into War Within. (off topic but u can search for the rant of how long the war within quest got delayed and how DE mention how they need to rewrite it on some devstream back then)

Basically, I fully expect the environment artists that first developed the Kuva Fortress tile set was instructed something to the like of "make a stalker theme tile set". But then the operator got some ... mixed feedback .... and due to how all eye are on what a frame really is from the last scene of 2nd dream, I believe DE looked at all that and want to put more emphasis on the operator instead so the tile set are re-purpose into kuva theme. (then what ever left of that stalker theme route that survive are turned into The Sacrifice and how umbra re-contextualize the essence of what a frame is).

So ... basically, if they touch acolyte, they need to touch stalker and do a hell of a recon to make stuff at least look consistent, if they don't touch stalker and rework them away from stalker and made up a faction of evil operator that contr... err .. "work" with the acolytes, then that would dilute what the New War would be about, and generally a bad direction to take things to

Edited February 10, 2020 by FireSegment

[Drachnyn]

It doesnt exactly fit into nightwave as those stories are supposed to not be about the tenno, we're just cleaning up. I would be very interested in a potential acolyte nightwave season though or any development for them really. Personally I want them as frames to have access to their power remixes.

[Marine027]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb FireSegment:

i think it's not that DE don't want to make a story about them, more like the story they got for them years ago already outdated and discontinue. 

Lore wise, acolyte are ... err .. "frames" that took Stalker route instead of 2nd dream route. But then what stalker route suppose to mean got scrap in a sense and DE moved on into War Within. (off topic but u can search for the rant of how long the war within quest got delayed and how DE mention how they need to rewrite it on some devstream back then)

Basically, I fully expect the environment artists that first developed the Kuva Fortress tile set was instructed something to the like of "make a stalker theme tile set". But then the operator got some ... mixed feedback .... and due to how all eye are on what a frame really is from the last scene of 2nd dream, I believe DE looked at all that and want to put more emphasis on the operator instead so the tile set are re-purpose into kuva theme. (then what ever left of that stalker theme route that survive are turned into The Sacrifice and how umbra re-contextualize the essence of what a frame is).

So ... basically, if they touch acolyte, they need to touch stalker and do a hell of a recon to make stuff at least look consistent, if they don't touch stalker and rework them away from stalker and made up a faction of evil operator that contr... err .. "work" with the acolytes, then that would dilute what the New War would be about, and generally a bad direction to take things to

Oh please, as much i like DE as far they come on there own, but stop making excuses for them, they abandoned alot of conepts in the past and keep abandon things in the future and it may take years before it even gets mentioned again, look at Codex entrys for Lore, or Quests they first wanted then not wanted then want again for the "main lore", what about Lore for each Warframe?

Now they make this Levirian museum which suddnely is suppsoed to make Lore for a frame AND it's weapons and even it's Syandana? I can promise this will be abandoned soon once again and instead i have Quests like Harrow and Octavia, tho what i also not need was crap like Nidus and Revenant which was chores with barely connected to anything.

By now i rather have more lore and quests instead of a new frame and weapon while we play trough the same old content over and over and yes they need to make money but cosmetics are a thing aswell right, now they trow in new weapons like Lich Kuva stuff which can be grindy as hell, same as Rivens, it not enhances the gameplay or brigns something new content wise, just a shiny new weapon with more damage to kill the same enemys.

Lich's are not unique, they are just the Wolf mixed with the Stalker ability wise as example, you sitll do the same missions over and over and special kill enemys for murmur at best whihc is basically a mass capture mission then. They are out of ideas but then there dumb publishers they have now DEMAN numbers and then we have this mess not getting more Lore but only more things ot force players to play and grind all day.

Publishers ruined them like every goddamn publisher does today, i am loosign trust in them trough this and DE lost it's touch way long ago.

Don't get me wrong as said i like them and this game but we need ot stop defending them for things they clearly repeat over and over.

[Maj-Cero]

5 hours ago, Drachnyn said:

It doesnt exactly fit into nightwave as those stories are supposed to not be about the tenno, we're just cleaning up. I would be very interested in a potential acolyte nightwave season though or any development for them really. Personally I want them as frames to have access to their power remixes.

Story doesn't even have to be about the tenno, for all we kno the Acolytes are "unawakened" as I assume so is the Stalker. Chapter 1 be quick "How they got together". Chapter 2 "Something that leads to Misery not coming back". Chapter 3 "Possible betrayal? The Cause/Outcome". Chapter 4 "Escalation". Chapter 5  As you put it "Clean Up". Like current Nightwave each chapter no longer than a short paragraph each.

The above could easily be done without delving into any tenno/transference lore and if Stalker is involved at most in first chapter it's pre-Second Dream making main story completely spoiler free for anyone to enjoy the event.

As for frames having their power remixes those could be new Augment mods for Tier rewards. Wouldn't work on all frames, but would be specific to the frame the Acolyte is based on. Don't see us getting their powers, but could be interesting I guess.

Edited February 10, 2020 by Maj-Cero

[HugintheCrow]

5 hours ago, FireSegment said:

Basically, I fully expect the environment artists that first developed the Kuva Fortress tile set was instructed something to the like of "make a stalker theme tile set".

That's highly unlikely, considering that kuva fortress' tileset is straight up Grineer-styled in every single way (one can even see how some of it's rooms and assets are simply older grineer stuff recolored to match the black/red/white (Yes, WHITE, Stalker doesn't even use that color) kuva palette). Stalker has no association with them, so there is no reason for why it would be connected to him.

 

Not to mention, War Within' promo materials were teasing Grineer Queens and Grineer focused-story from the very beginning.

Edited February 10, 2020 by HugintheCrow

[GrandLompus]

I don't think Nightwave would be the best option here, since that is always time limited, non-replayable content.  So as soon as the NW season is over, the next generation of Tenno will start wondering where those Acolytes come from.  Better pick a more lasting option for this like a (mini) quest or such, I think.

[Maj-Cero]

2 hours ago, GrandLompus said:

I don't think Nightwave would be the best option here, since that is always time limited, non-replayable content.  So as soon as the NW season is over, the next generation of Tenno will start wondering where those Acolytes come from.  Better pick a more lasting option for this like a (mini) quest or such, I think.

That may be true, but same would go for the Wolf and Emissary too don't ya think?

[(PSN)robotwars7]

9 hours ago, HugintheCrow said:

"There is literally no explanation"

there are many Tenno out there who are a bit edgy; they clad themselves in black and red, everything matching, then maybe blare a little heavy metal over the mic if they have one. but the edgiest of edgelords, the ones who were too dark and extreme for even Red Veil, were rejected by the rest of the Tenno. they instead rallied behind the figure they secretly admired; Stalker. NOT the pushover we face now, I'm talking the OG Stalker who could cloak and put a dozen arrows and knives in you in the blink of an eye. the Stalker who had new Tenno crapping their Chassis, not knowing what would come next. the Stalker who made you think twice about getting the killing blow on a Boss.

they Idolized him, and saw the Stalker for what he believed himself to be: a dark harbinger of twisted justice, ensuring all actions had consequences. even the infested, the evil, have a right to be avenged in the Stalker's eyes, and the Acolytes saw this, and agreed. they followed him. worshipped him, and he accepted these uber-edgelords as his own. he gave them unique weapons and armour, and the iconic Stalker helm for their favourite frames, and sent them forth. their first mission: to get answers from Alad V, in an effort to draw out the tenno for their master, so he may take them down, one by one.

..then Stalker got into bed with Hunhow and lost his edge. (literally, he swapped the slash-damaging Hate Scythe for War, which does Impact damage!). the acolytes still follow him, but they to realise he is but a shadow of his former self. time after time, they watched Shadow Stalker get his a$$ handed to him by even the lowliest of scrubs. the days of him putting fear into the hearts of veteran players, long past. but the Acolytes still continue their dark quest, in the hope that one day, they will kill themselves some Tenno, and make Stalker proud, and just maybe, Stalker would then listen to them when they say those fateful words:

"you were SO much cooler back in like , 2015! we want the old you back!"

TL;DR, a gripping, fictional story that explains the Acolytes, and is (probably) true.

[HugintheCrow]

42 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

snip

"Stalker who literally hunts tenno for a job has a team of tenno sidekicks."

Yup, ok, seems legit. That's like if Frodo and company were orcs trying to get to mordor to destroy their own master. Like if Luke Skywalker was also the Emperor. It's like if Harry Potter was in slytherin and casually joined Death Eaters.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

1 minute ago, HugintheCrow said:

"Stalker who literally hunts tenno for a job has a team of tenno sidekicks."

Yup, ok, seems legit. That's like if Frodo and company were orcs trying to get to mordor to destroy their own master. Like if Luke Skywalker was also the Emperor. It's like if Harry Potter was in slytherin and casually joined Death Eaters.

you did read the "fictional" part, right? it was a joke based on a silly idea I discussed with friends, nothing more.

[Spoop3]

If stalker mode ever actually survives development hell i think it would be neat to choose to play as either stalker or one of the acolytes.

[Xolot]

Sadly, it feels like the only chance we could have for Stalker/Acolyte lore was scrapped, because people didn't like the Stalker Mode.

But yeah, having a Nightwave dedicated to the Acolytes would be a good way to explain why Misery has been missing for more than 4 years now (although we know that they forgot about them and haven't found a satisfactory way to reintroduce Misery). Maybe even adding new acolytes, as current ones are too battered by now.

If everything fails and they don't want to make a Nightwave for them, at least add them to the Leverian with a fitting story and Prex card to match

[Maj-Cero]

17 minutes ago, Xolot said:

If everything fails and they don't want to make a Nightwave for them, at least add them to the Leverian with a fitting story and Prex card to match

I'd be happy with this too

[FireSegment]

12 hours ago, Marine027 said:

Oh please, as much i like DE as far they come on there own, but stop making excuses for them, they abandoned alot of conepts in the past and keep abandon things in the future and it may take years before it even gets mentioned again, look at Codex entrys for Lore, or Quests they first wanted then not wanted then want again for the "main lore", what about Lore for each Warframe?

which part of my response make u think i'm making excuse for them? lol

my point is that if DE started to recon acolyte, it would take a long time to make it, and that we won't like the result. Because as far as "abandon" contents are considered, acolytes had it worse than others because they weren't just abandoned, they were recycled.

 

8 hours ago, HugintheCrow said:

That's highly unlikely, considering that kuva fortress' tileset is straight up Grineer-styled in every single way (one can even see how some of it's rooms and assets are simply older grineer stuff recolored to match the black/red/white (Yes, WHITE, Stalker doesn't even use that color) kuva palette). Stalker has no association with them, so there is no reason for why it would be connected to him.

yeah, the whole tile set part is just my hypothesis, at the earliest stage of the war within quest development. In the final result that we have, the Kuva resemble the Nightwatch elite grinner squad more than stalker. (and DE recon Nightwatch the heck out of existence) 

It's kinda pointless to talk about the past when all are already said and done now since we have no way to check any of it. What I know is just that DE had to delay the war within, DE had to rewrite the quest, the sentient also have black-red-white color scheme back then, and the stalker was highly associated with the sentient after the 2nd dream (so i should have said sentient theme instead of stalker theme, but whatever) and that there is a large enough portion of player pursuit the head-canon of "the operator is not real". All those details kinda make me realize why DE pick the direction that they did back then when we looking back.

 

[HugintheCrow]

12 hours ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

you did read the "fictional" part, right? it was a joke based on a silly idea I discussed with friends, nothing more.

Yup, and I agreed that it sounds stupid. What's the problem?

7 hours ago, FireSegment said:

In the final result that we have, the Kuva resemble the Nightwatch elite grinner squad more than stalker. (and DE recon Nightwatch the heck out of existence) 

Of course Kuva forces are similar to nightwatch. They are both recolors of standard Grineer forces. From the very beginning Kuva fortress was meant to be a Grineer-themed, and Grineer-owned area (otherwise they wouldn't be using Grineer assets to build it, DUH). I don't see why you conflate it with stalker (or sentients) of all people.

With Railjack out, we can now see a sample of what sentient-themed area looks like, and obviously, it looks nothing like Kuva Fortress.

Not to mention Nightwatch has NOT been retconned, as they appeared in special tactical alerts and events; and Gorth, one of the executioners, is still explicitly mentioned to be former Nightwatch member)