Stealing Eidolon hunter rewards.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

3 minutes ago, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

If you read it and comprehended I said the arcanes should only have effects that apply to hunts . They would literally be useless anywhere else in the game . So what is the issue ? , also Steel path eidolons isn’t easy either . 
 

I don’t want just more rewards I want to let eidolons have an appeal , since DE are moving Orphix to railjack . Which that only spells out an easier grind , therefore the already limited hunters in recruitment would just keep going down . I simply don’t like solo eidolon hunts.

If you read and comprehended my comment you'd see I said "something to sell to new hunters". Mate I only take issue with wanting exclusivity.

[Voltage]

3 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Eidolons aren't being deleted though. The part I'm not on board with is new exclusive arcanes for it. That's just asking for exclusivity and something to sell at a high price. That's a no from me. Steel essence? Ok that doesn't hurt anything besides some extra kuva. Exclusive arcanes however...

Just because the drop is exclusive to hunts doesn't make it expensive (Theorem and Residual Arcanes prove this recently). If DE added Ephemeras or Arcanes that only applied to Eidolon hunting, it would be possible to disregard the rewards. If you want to be a completionist and own them anyway (like I would do), that's just the price you pay as a completionist. Not every reward in the game needs to be apart of a mode that is your cup of tea. I sucked it up for Conclave skins, all Conclave Mods, and the Syandana, so this is no different. I don't see anything wrong with the game asking you to participate in content to get some rewards out of it that aren't seen elsewhere.

[Tesseract7777]

Just now, DrivaMain said:

Then why you bother even joining those groups? There a lot of people hosting casual Eidolon hunts in recruit chat. 

I'm not talking about myself or my personal struggles, I'm commenting on the OP's absolute statement. 

As in "if literally no groups are allowing casual runs and practice" then there may be a tad bit of a gatekeeping problem. 

I understand why the OP is upset, he may be one of those who truly enjoy them for the fun of it, and he is afraid many will stop doing them. 

But to me that speaks more to them not being fun enough content on their own, and being too frustrating to a lot of players. The rewards for them are already excellent, and to be honest doing an eidolon hunt still seems way more meaningful to me than doing an orphix venom run, so rewards imo aren't the issue. Not many people play eidolons already because they aren't fun/accessible enough on their own. 

I think players should feel rewarded, but I'm also a firm believer that gameplay should feel rewarding in and of itself, for the sake of it. If very few people find the gameplay of eidolons fun and rewarding in and of itself, for the enjoyment of fighting them, then maybe that is the real problem here. 

[(PSN)ggh667124]

Just now, -CdG-Zilchy said:

If you read and comprehended my comment you'd see I said "something to sell to new hunters".

That’s not bad at all , okay want me to go in such extreme detail I prevent any bad thing possible . Like say make them not tradable. But no that makes no sense , it’s a free market , the arcanes are supposed to be reward of progression , if you want to pay for it fine . Maybe let’s say they have guaranteed drops so you only have to capture 21 and you’ll have them . 
 

The post isn’t supposed to detail out everything for game balance . Do you understand that ? 

[(PSN)Unstar]

52 minutes ago, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

Since DE is expanding the accessibility to farming for arcanes . Which in my opinion is great for the game but it also might become the more attractive option . Eidolons should get new rewards to compensate.

DE's introducing alternative ways to gain arcanes is the solution to a problem with the game.  You're suggesting that they replace the old problem with a new problem shaped exactly like the old problem.  You've gotta understand why that's a terrible idea.

The game mode you like isn't changing at all.  You can still farm arcanes via Eidolons if you want.  If you still want to play it, you should do that.
 

23 minutes ago, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

The point I’m trying to make is eventually there will be no reason to do Eidolons . They’re fun but it’s hard enough to get a group going for a decent run . 

If the juice isn't worth the squeeze, the content deserves to die.  Dangling carrots behind bad content is not a fix, it is a band-aid made out of sandpaper.

[Zimzala]

From my POV, the whole point of DEs actions is to remove there being only 'one way' to get stuff, so why would they go back and add a different one way to get stuff when they just removed it?

Regardless of the particulars, it really just seems like DE said 'no more exclusives' and this is just asking for more exclusives...

[(PSN)ggh667124]

1 minute ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

DE's introducing alternative ways to gain arcanes is the solution to a problem with the game.  You're suggesting that they replace the old problem with a new problem shaped exactly like the old problem.  You've gotta understand why that's a terrible idea.

The game mode you like isn't changing at all.  You can still farm arcanes via Eidolons if you want.  If you still want to play it, you should do that.
 

If the juice isn't worth the squeeze, the content deserves to die.  Dangling carrots behind bad content is not a fix, it is a band-aid made out of sandpaper.

Okay but essence won’t be exclusive to the eidolons , the exclusive arcane suggestion would only be arcanes that have effects that only apply to eidolon hunts so it shouldn’t effect the general playerbase. 
 

also I shouldn’t even have a rebute for the ephemera portion since it’s cosmetic.

[Tesseract7777]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

If the juice isn't worth the squeeze, the content deserves to die.  Dangling carrots behind bad content is not a fix, it is a band-aid made out of sandpaper.

I have been far too wordy, but this is a really nice summation of what I have been trying to say. 

[(PSN)ggh667124]

1 minute ago, Zimzala said:

From my POV, the whole point of DEs actions is to remove there being only 'one way' to get stuff, so why would they go back and add a different one way to get stuff when they just removed it?

Regardless of the particulars, it really just seems like DE said 'no more exclusives' and this is just asking for more exclusives...

It is exclusives that can’t effect the general player base , the exclusive arcane idea is just to show that you’ve progressed as a eidolon hunter . That’s why I want them to only apply inside hunts and no where else in the game , if a new hunter wants to skip the grind and buy them because they’ll want to hunt long term and they enjoy it . It’s an investment but they don’t need the arcanes for any other content 

[(PSN)ggh667124]

3 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

I have been far too wordy, but this is a really nice summation of what I have been trying to say. 

But isn’t that just a repeat of raids ? . 

[Siri-Piell]

I like eidolons, i dont play them regularly, but when i do i really enjoy myself.  I like it for the gameplay, not for the loot. I would still play it for the fun even if there are no worthy rewards. I would have some fun and get some arcanes (even if less than in orphix) and some focus too.

[Voltage]

4 minutes ago, Zimzala said:

Regardless of the particulars, it really just seems like DE said 'no more exclusives' and this is just asking for more exclusives...

Warframe has a huge list of exclusives though that DE barely makes a dent in. Having reasons to visit all content in the game is healthy. What isn't healthy is conditioning players with the behavior that they have been showing for years. I am not saying it's wrong to have less exclusives in the game, but you can certainly have healthy exclusives and unhealthy exclusives. Moving rewards to other locations is healthy. Undermining older content isn't.

There's a reason most of the game is empty besides the latest content and some hardcore loot caves.

[Tesseract7777]

4 minutes ago, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

But isn’t that just a repeat of raids ? . 

Trials should have been left in, bugs and all, because a lot of clans really loved doing them literally just for fun and all the silly stuff they could do together. 

If the content is truly fun enough that people enjoy it for itself (like conclave) then the few that do it should be allowed to keep doing it. 

But leaving exclusive rewards behind content almost no one plays just creates artificially high platinum prices for items that aren't really meant to be that rare. 

They could have left in Trials, and just did the same thing like here, where there was more than one place to get arcanes. 

[(PSN)ggh667124]

Just now, Tesseract7777 said:

Trials should have been left in, bugs and all, because a lot of clans really loved doing them literally just for fun and all the silly stuff they could do together. 

If the content is truly fun enough that people enjoy it for itself (like conclave) then the few that do it should be allowed to keep doing it. 

But leaving exclusive rewards behind content almost no one plays just creates artificially high platinum prices for items that aren't really meant to be that rare. 

How exactly would arcanes that would only effects eidolon hunts , effect the player base . 
 

if a new eidolon hunter likes hunting so much they’d wanna be all powerful from the jump that is their call since it’s a free market .

[-Vahagn-]

If you are playing something for rewards and not for fun then there is a problem.

 

Also whenever arcanes go anywhere else but eidolons this happens with "my plat" always being the reason.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

13 minutes ago, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

Okay but essence won’t be exclusive to the eidolons , the exclusive arcane suggestion would only be arcanes that have effects that only apply to eidolon hunts so it shouldn’t effect the general playerbase. 

It's still an exclusive reward you can sell to new players and they're gonna jump on it juat like they do the hottest new riven that YouTube tells them they absolutely need. Therefore it's still just asking for a means of over charging for items. Maybe not you yourself but others will. That's why I can't get behind it.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

7 minutes ago, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

if a new eidolon hunter likes hunting so much they’d wanna be all powerful from the jump that is their call since it’s a free market .

Which is exactly what hunters will count on.

[(PSN)ggh667124]

1 minute ago, WH1735S0W said:

If you are playing something for rewards and not for fun then there is a problem.

 

Also whenever arcanes go anywhere else but eidolons this happens with "my plat" always being the reason.

That’s not what this post is about , you probably didn’t read it . Or don’t comprehend the issue 

[(PSN)ggh667124]

1 minute ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

It's still an exclusive reward you can sell to new players and they're gonna jump on it juat like they do the hottest new riven that YouTube tells them they absolutely need. Therefore it's still just asking for a means of over charging for items. Maybe not you yourself but others will. That's why I can't get behind it.

I disagree , most new hunters are completely nescient to the basic arcane requirements I.e. virtuos shadow . So I highly doubt that , unless the player is really invested than there’s no cause for issue. Even still I wouldn’t mind the arcanes being non tradable, I already said that this isn’t to be a detailed analysis but rather just suggestions so DE doesn’t just pump and dump . 

[-CdG-Zilchy]

Just now, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

I disagree , most new hunters are completely nescient to the basic arcane requirements I.e. virtuos shadow . So I highly doubt that , unless the player is really invested than there’s no cause for issue. Even still I wouldn’t mind the arcanes being non tradable, I already said that this isn’t to be a detailed analysis but rather just suggestions so DE doesn’t just pump and dump . 

Non tradeable, I can support that. I just hate seeing new players get gouged.

[Voltage]

22 minutes ago, WH1735S0W said:

If you are playing something for rewards and not for fun then there is a problem.

Warframe is a Looter Shooter. A major part of the game is playing for interesting rewards. Those rewards are a huge part of "the fun".

I am tired of people dismissing rewards in the game as if it isn't important. For something to be fun in a Looter Shooter, the loot needs to be there and worth the time. If content is undermined and rewards are placed elsewhere with a much lower bar of entry, then there is nothing compelling in the previous content except for it's gameplay loop. Some people find that fun. Power to them. Most will just move to the easier farm. That's why it's important to keep systems relevant in some form so that you do not run into the problem Warframe does where 90% of the game's missions are dead outside of players doing them once for progression, or it's an optimal loot cave of sorts.

[-Vahagn-]

5 minutes ago, (PSN)ggh667124 said:

That’s not what this post is about , you probably didn’t read it . Or don’t comprehend the issue 

No offence but by the look of your post it seems you want players to play eidolons for rewards. However I feel people should play them out of enjoyment instead, with rewards being the bonus. 

 

2 minutes ago, Voltage said:

Warframe is a Looter Shooter. A major part of the game is playing for interesting rewards.

You can gain rewards and have fun at the same time. If you are not enjoying yourself while gaining rewards then that is a bad loot shooter.

[(PSN)ggh667124]

5 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Non tradeable, I can support that. I just hate seeing new players get gouged.

Alright glad we could come to an agreement, I just wanted something that showed progression in the content . Like how primed sure footed is great but not tradable but dedication is how you get it .

[(PSN)ggh667124]

8 minutes ago, Voltage said:

Warframe is a Looter Shooter. A major part of the game is playing for interesting rewards.

I am tired of people dismissing rewards in the game as if it isn't important. For something to be fun in a Looter Shooter, the loot needs to be there and worth the time. If content is undermined and rewards are placed elsewhere with a much lower bar of entry, then there is nothing compelling in the previous content except for it's gameplay loop. Some people find that fun. Power to them. Most will just move to the easier farm. That's why it's important to keep systems relevant in some form so that you do not run into the problem Warframe does where 90% of the game's missions are dead outside of players doing them once for progression, or it's optimal loot cave of sorts.

Exactly, just because one person says I find it fun , doesn’t mean it’s the majority . If that was true many would run SP Eidolons , but they don’t since it’s harder with not much more rewards .

[(PSN)ggh667124]

2 minutes ago, WH1735S0W said:

No offence but by the look of your post it seems you want players to play eidolons for rewards. However I feel people should play them out of enjoyment instead, with rewards being the bonus. 

 

You can gain rewards and have fun at the same time. If you are not enjoying yourself while gaining rewards then that is a bad loot shooter.

Okay but what do you say to those who like competition or challenges . Or those who like a system because that system is offered nowhere else in the game (I know orbs exist but they lack reward). 
 

Incentive is a main drive , why should any new player play eidolon just because it’s fun . The pre requisites are too much , while an easier option in RJ have the same rewards (arcanes) .

I guarantee you the player base of eidolon will dwindle so it will be even harder to get groups to play them .