You ever wonder what abilities "altered" frames originally had? Pre-Eidolon Revenant, whole Xaku, Chroma before wrapping a sentient skin, etc.

[(PSN)GingyGreen]

Yes yes I know Chroma Prime have the sentient pelt abilities too somehow. That's why I don't like Chroma Prime. Really, Primes in general. I always felt Primes should be handled like Umbra where one or more abilities are very slightly altered. But I digress.

 

What kind of powers do you think plot device altered-Frames might have had?

-Revenant before he became part eidolon

-Chroma's original 1 and 4 before slaying a sentient to wrap it's skin around him

-Xaku before she became a Frankenstein of different dead frame bits

-maybe Valkyr??????????

Of the 4, Chroma seem to be the most in tact. His Vex Armour and Elemental Ward, alongside his element switching are probably remnants of the original Chroma's kit. Especially funny considering how TRASH all powers associated with his pelt is

Revenant's Thrall and Reave are clearly based on eidolons and vomvalysts. His Mesmer skin and Danse Macabre are more ambiguous. Mesmer Skin could be a remnant of his initial kit?

Xaku is a mess and I'm not even going to bother trying to remember her ability names. All of her powers are clearly void themed, so unless the original Xaku really was a void controller, there's not a whole lot you can glean. Being DE's made up midi chlorian, we have absolutely no idea what Void really is or do either, so it's hard to tell how much of her kit is Void manipulation and how much really is her power (like, say, stealing weapons, void or part of her natural kit?)

Only thing I'll point out is when she uses her 4, her right hand and left arm remains...could those be parts of the original Xaku?

And Valkyr...her treatment by Alad V seems to be entirely cosmetic. Her entire kit looks completely normal and I can easily see a Frame built the way she is. As in, none of her abilities really seem to stem from being stripped and messed with by Alad. I only added her because some people will point out I didn't include Valkyr had I not listed her. But asides from cosmetics, being brutalized didn't seem to affect her much at all. She yells a lot, but what of it? Rhino roars too. She claws because she's a cat frame. And she have Ripchord because Ballas forgot bullet jumping was a thing.

 

Did I miss any frames?

[quxier]

 

13 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

And Valkyr...her treatment by Alad V seems to be entirely cosmetic. Her entire kit looks completely normal and I can easily see a Frame built the way she is. As in, none of her abilities really seem to stem from being stripped and messed with by Alad. I only added her because some people will point out I didn't include Valkyr had I not listed her. But asides from cosmetics, being brutalized didn't seem to affect her much at all. She yells a lot, but what of it? Rhino roars too. She claws because she's a cat frame. And she have Ripchord because Ballas forgot bullet jumping was a thing.

As fair I remember Alad V make her "angrier". I guess her 4th was changed (some bust or something).

13 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

Xaku is a mess and I'm not even going to bother trying to remember her ability names. All of her powers are clearly void themed, so unless the original Xaku really was a void controller, there's not a whole lot you can glean. Being DE's made up midi chlorian, we have absolutely no idea what Void really is or do either, so it's hard to tell how much of her kit is Void manipulation and how much really is her power (like, say, stealing weapons, void or part of her natural kit?)

Deny, Accuse and Gaze. No need to thank me. :D

 

First original "the Lost 3 frames" don't have to be void related. Xaku themselves could alter those 3 abilities into "more void-like".

Secondly there isn't much to say about those frames as you could have different abilities within the same frames.

 

As for "Original Xaku"... haven't Entrati made Xaku to be "composite" frame (have 3 other frames)? In other words there weren't "original Xaku" before.

[(XBOX)The Neko Otaku]

Xaku is 3 different frames, we could do some speculation on their abilities since i know they did concept art on what the 3 frame looked like. I just can't find the image

[(PSN)GingyGreen]

2 hours ago, quxier said:

 

As fair I remember Alad V make her "angrier". I guess her 4th was changed (some bust or something).

Deny, Accuse and Gaze. No need to thank me. :D

 

First original "the Lost 3 frames" don't have to be void related. Xaku themselves could alter those 3 abilities into "more void-like".

Secondly there isn't much to say about those frames as you could have different abilities within the same frames.

 

As for "Original Xaku"... haven't Entrati made Xaku to be "composite" frame (have 3 other frames)? In other words there weren't "original Xaku" before.

For Valkyr, I considered her Hysteria...but growing claws and becoming a bit angrier seems in line with what you'd typically get out of a Warframe's power set. Most you could say is she screams a lot more, but otherwise her powers all seem quite unaffected by her condition.

 

As for Xaku, I think I couldn't remember them due to how non-indicative her ability names are. Her abilities aren't the first to have stupid non-indicative names ("avalanche")...but she's the first with an entire kit of them.

As for your first, it's a possibility. But once again it's hard to tell if her power are all based on effects of the void (due to it being a made up thing DE can make up any effects for) or if they're the powers other frames left behind.

But yeah it's certainly possible the other frames Xaku is part of knew how to fire anti-grav lasers, confuse large groups, and..............render a single guy indestructible so that, logically, it strips the armour of all of that guy's allies near him...

I don't remember reading anything about Xaky in much detail, was she made to be a composite by Entrati or DE? She needed a Leverian

[(PSN)GingyGreen]

2 hours ago, (XBOX)The Neko Otaku said:

Xaku is 3 different frames, we could do some speculation on their abilities since i know they did concept art on what the 3 frame looked like. I just can't find the image

I think I saw it, but their appearance didn't give a whole lot of clues. It's not like they're Grendel or Garuda whose appearance clues you in to their schtick.

[quxier]

40 minutes ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

As for Xaku, I think I couldn't remember them due to how non-indicative her ability names are. Her abilities aren't the first to have stupid non-indicative names ("avalanche")...but she's the first with an entire kit of them.

Yeah, you have to either play them or be into lore/languages.

42 minutes ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

I don't remember reading anything about Xaky in much detail, was she made to be a composite by Entrati or DE? She needed a Leverian

I think by Entrati:

Quote

Neither he nor she, Xaku is a composite... a Warframe assembly made of others lost in the early Entrati Void expeditions.

Forged from the remnants of lost Warframes, they channel the spirits of the Void. This is Xaku, the fragmented, the restored.

 

[(XBOX)Cram Duahcim]

5 hours ago, (XBOX)The Neko Otaku said:

Xaku is 3 different frames, we could do some speculation on their abilities since i know they did concept art on what the 3 frame looked like. I just can't find the image

I hope that those Warframes also make it in that would interesting lore wise. 

And Revenant was an absolute mess when first revealed. I remember when they revealed him on stream and immediately seeing Steve's concern in regard to the design. 

Revenant was and honestly kinda still is a mess thematically.

They did there best to fix it but originally Revenant or "Vlad" was like this vampire/Sentient hybrid thing being described and even as he is now, I feel they could have done more with his theme. 

(I'm actually quite disappointed in his deluxe skin) 

[Kerberos-3]

20 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

 

And Valkyr...her treatment by Alad V seems to be entirely cosmetic. Her entire kit looks completely normal and I can easily see a Frame built the way she is. As in, none of her abilities really seem to stem from being stripped and messed with by Alad. I only added her because some people will point out I didn't include Valkyr had I not listed her. But asides from cosmetics, being brutalized didn't seem to affect her much at all. She yells a lot, but what of it? Rhino roars too. She claws because she's a cat frame. And she have Ripchord because Ballas forgot bullet jumping was a thing.

 

 

Pretty much every single one of Valkyr's abilties aside from her claws can be traced back to various Corpus tech. Ripline? Terra Shockwave Moas. Warcry? Guardian Eximus base but with a different effect. Paralysis? Experimental system based on Blitz Eximus. Hysteria is pretty much the only thing Valkyr has that is wholly her own, and we can't even be sure that was part of her original kit in the first place.

[A-Midnight-Shanking]

25 minutes ago, Kerberos-3 said:

Pretty much every single one of Valkyr's abilties aside from her claws can be traced back to various Corpus tech. Ripline? Terra Shockwave Moas. Warcry? Guardian Eximus base but with a different effect. Paralysis? Experimental system based on Blitz Eximus. Hysteria is pretty much the only thing Valkyr has that is wholly her own, and we can't even be sure that was part of her original kit in the first place.

Ripline, yeah that seems Corpusy

Rest of the effects fit in with a Berserker class-type. And remember, Valkyr was dissected for Tech. It may well be that those Corpus troops trace their tech back to Valkyr.

[TARINunit9]

21 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

-maybe Valkyr??????????

Devs have confirmed that whatever they might have said on Valkyr's release, the current lore is that Gersemi Valkyr today is representative of what Gersemi Valkyr was during the Old War

If that made any sense

21 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

-Xaku before she became a Frankenstein of different dead frame bits

 

Xaku is a mess and I'm not even going to bother trying to remember her ability names. All of her powers are clearly void themed, so unless the original Xaku really was a void controller, there's not a whole lot you can glean. Being DE's made up midi chlorian, we have absolutely no idea what Void really is or do either, so it's hard to tell how much of her kit is Void manipulation and how much really is her power (like, say, stealing weapons, void or part of her natural kit?)

Xaku is multiple dead people. Until -- or rather, unless we get a Xaku Prime, I'm not sure there even was an "original Xaku." It's four different dead people who molded into a single body in order to come back to life.

I mean I AM interested in what they were before they became Xaku. They could be Ivara's squadmates that Ballas tried to erase from the records, for instance

[Corvid]

Regarding Revenant, I personally subscribe to the headcanon that the frame that got physically warped into him was actually a Gauss, due to a surprising number of aesthetic similarities. Full list of shared features spoilered.

Spoiler

Assuming default appearances for helmets, and so on.

They both seem to be made from the same glossy material, albeit more tarnished in Revenant's case. Not the strongest connection to make, admittedly, but I feel it's worth pointing out.

Revenant's default helmet features a noticeable pair of grooves on its sides, matching the relative placement of Gauss' horns (which slot into their own grooves when not Redlining) on his own default. Furthermore, both helmets share a very prominent broad "chin plate", with a metallic patch directly above it (a rounded plate for Gauss, and a protruding horn for Revenant).

The shoulders break this trend slightly, having more distinct pauldrons in Revenant's case, but they do still retain a fairly rounded silhouette in both frames. The lower arms are far more similar, particularly with the elbows having an additional piece of armour at the joint in both cases. It's not hard to imagine that the forearms are the result of Gauss' aerofoil fusing into place. They also both notably feature metallic plating over their knuckles.

The torso plating also share similarities, albeit with more of a stretch. The common element is a metallic object lodged into the chest. In Gauss it fits neatly between the two halves of his torso plating, while in Revenant it seems to have sunk in further while the chest armour fused immediately above it. Both frames also share an almost "layered" appearance in this region, with armour plates built on top of one another. They also both have a relatively narrow midriff in comparison to both their torso and waist.

Their backs also both feature a relatively exposed mechanical design, with plating that reaches around from the front that juts out backwards on either side of the exposed region (admittedly, this is a fairly common feature among frames), and both possess a pulsing, crescent-shaped light in the small of their backs.

On first glance the waist isn't all too similar, what with Gauss having a loose "skirt" while Revenant has additional plating on his outer hips, but I personally imagine that the former ended up fusing and solidifying into the latter. There's already a lot of warping occurring in this transformation, so it's not too unreasonable as far as I'm concerned, especially since the largest sections of Gauss' skirt taper off quite similarly to the plating.

Finally, the legs. While the upper legs and feet are fairly different, the calves do feature similar grooves on their sides in both frames. Enough for me to consider it a repeat of the Aerofoil fusion mentioned in the arms.

While I'll admit that it isn't airtight, and some of it might be seen as a bit of a stretch, I think there are enough similarities (that aren't just design motifs common to most frames) for my hypothesis to have at least some merit. Plus, since the guardian would be stationed near large bodies of water and be expected to respond quickly whenever the Eidolon spirit tried to escape, I feel that our favourite turbo-speed hydroambulator would be a natural fit for the task.

 

[Scruffel]

23 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

Revenant's Thrall and Reave are clearly based on eidolons and vomvalysts. His Mesmer skin and Danse Macabre are more ambiguous. Mesmer Skin could be a remnant of his initial kit?

Thrall, Reave, and even Mesmer Skin, while appearing Eidolon in nature, really do not seem to correlate to any Eidolon abilities. Unless there is some sort of lore related to Vomvalyst in which they are actually the controlled minds of the warriors in the Old War or the Eidolons having the ability to steal/drain health and shields (only thing close is being able to rapidly replenish shields but that's it). I'd be willing to wager that pre-Eido Revenant is mostly the exact same as post-Eido Revenant. Remember, Revenant isn't necessarily an Eidolon Warframe, he is a Warframe corrupted by the Eidolons.

Danse Macabre is a bit ambiguous, but considering Rev's story of being 'the Eidolon hunter' and since the ability is anti-adaptation almost, one could infer that he was designed with the Sentients in mind, almost if he was going to be used to counter them (in case of any rebellion tomfoolery). It would make sense in regards to his quest lore.

I'd imagine if his Prime were to come out, his abilities would be exactly the same just with a more vampiric flare attached to them. Like Vomvalyst being replaced with 'bat-like' apparitions and Reave somewhat borrowing from the original effect it used to have (but less choppy and actually looking like a cloud of some sort). 

23 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

Xaku is a mess and I'm not even going to bother trying to remember her ability names. All of her powers are clearly void themed, so unless the original Xaku really was a void controller, there's not a whole lot you can glean. Being DE's made up midi chlorian, we have absolutely no idea what Void really is or do either, so it's hard to tell how much of her kit is Void manipulation and how much really is her power (like, say, stealing weapons, void or part of her natural kit?)

Only thing I'll point out is when she uses her 4, her right hand and left arm remains...could those be parts of the original Xaku?

Xaku is a composite of 3 other Warframes for them to be a whole creation. You could say there are technically 4 parts of Xaku, the 3 parts from the fragmented Warframes, and the 4th being the skeleton in which they inhabit. It's unknown whether or not the skeleton itself is it's own entity, but honestly, I feel like it could be possibly explained by perceiving it as simply a catalyst for the fragmented Warframes to be hosted. Not exactly like a 3 persons in one body type of deal, more like a collected subconscious sort of deal. Almost becoming one person, but still separate in their own abilities to be considered a 'composite'.

I believe if Xaku Prime were to come out, they would still probably have the whole Frankenstein and the same abilities, but perhaps with more emphasis on the skeleton portion. Also, obligatory *they/their.

23 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

Did I miss any frames?

You could *technically* make an argument for Lavos. Since he was originally just a brute force/prison guard Warframe, that eventually got influenced to learn alchemy, you could infer that pre-alchemy Lavos could have been very different. But since that story was from the Leverian, and most if not all of them imply that the Prime would have been involved with the story, it was very likely that Lavos's alchemy would have carried onto the non-Prime version as well.

[A-Midnight-Shanking]

2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

Devs have confirmed that whatever they might have said on Valkyr's release, the current lore is that Gersemi Valkyr today is representative of what Gersemi Valkyr was during the Old War

If that made any sense

Xaku is multiple dead people. Until -- or rather, unless we get a Xaku Prime, I'm not sure there even was an "original Xaku." It's four different dead people who molded into a single body in order to come back to life.

I mean I AM interested in what they were before they became Xaku. They could be Ivara's squadmates that Ballas tried to erase from the records, for instance

They absolutely need to rework Ripline though.

[(XBOX)Cram Duahcim]

2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

 

I mean I AM interested in what they were before they became Xaku. They could be Ivara's squadmates that Ballas tried to erase from the records, for instance

They'll need to add all the warframes that comprise Xaku for anything to really make sense lorewise, and those warframes all have concept art.

I just hope that they won't tie all these warframes in with Xaku where they all share something in common ability wise.

They don't need to have that to be tied to Xaku considering her overall kit. 

[Corvid]

2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

They could be Ivara's squadmates that Ballas tried to erase from the records, for instance

Since one of the Entrati (Grandmother, IIRC) explicitly states that Xaku's parts came from frames lost during Void expeditions, this is exceedingly unlikely. While a cool idea, it just doesn't line up with what we know.

[(PSN)GingyGreen]

36 minutes ago, Kerberos-3 said:

Pretty much every single one of Valkyr's abilties aside from her claws can be traced back to various Corpus tech. Ripline? Terra Shockwave Moas. Warcry? Guardian Eximus base but with a different effect. Paralysis? Experimental system based on Blitz Eximus. Hysteria is pretty much the only thing Valkyr has that is wholly her own, and we can't even be sure that was part of her original kit in the first place.

Ripline is just shooting a chord out, nothing remotely Corpus about that at all. That's a concept any Factions could easily co-opt. Hell when I think of riplines enemy equivalent I think of the far more ubiquitous Scorpions and Ancients. Warcry is literally just a warcry. Nothing Corpus about it. Paralysis is her expunging her shield to smack enemies around a bit, also nothing particularly Corpus about it.

Only thing you might have a point about us Hysteria...except there's no other apparent source of that power. Who else could simply project laser claws out of their hands. Her prior two abilities being a pretty rage-y ability, Hysteria is pretty in-line with what she could already do.

No, instead Alad V simply extracted robot parts out of her to make Zanuka, hence why it has Gersemi's skin. Nothing indicated that he enhanced her with any new powers. He took from her without giving anything back.

[TARINunit9]

17 minutes ago, Corvid said:

Since one of the Entrati (Grandmother, IIRC) explicitly states that Xaku's parts came from frames lost during Void expeditions, this is exceedingly unlikely. While a cool idea, it just doesn't line up with what we know.

I was just using an arbitrary example, but thanks for that. I had missed that particular line of flavor text

[quxier]

1 hour ago, Scruffel said:

You could *technically* make an argument for Lavos. Since he was originally just a brute force/prison guard Warframe, that eventually got influenced to learn alchemy, you could infer that pre-alchemy Lavos could have been very different. But since that story was from the Leverian, and most if not all of them imply that the Prime would have been involved with the story, it was very likely that Lavos's alchemy would have carried onto the non-Prime version as well.

Hmm... maybe pre-version couldn't use Imbuing system (joining different elements into ability)?

[(PSN)robotwars7]

On 2021-04-14 at 11:48 PM, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

-Revenant before he became part eidolon

considering he was just called "warden" I'm guessing he was probably a kind of defensive specialist, but that's a guess. we don't know exactly how extensively he was altered, only that he was. his powers might have been quite similar before going in and mostly his visuals were changed, but the story alludes to him being totally transformed.

On 2021-04-14 at 11:48 PM, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

Chroma's original 1 and 4 before slaying a sentient to wrap it's skin around him

both of the frames with modular elemental abilities, Chroma and Lavos, seemed to acquire them post creation, so Chroma might have been totally different. if I had to guess, I'd run with his dragon theme and say that he was a fire-controlling frame, much like ember, but with more emphasis in protection, both for himself and his team, and upon taking the Sentient pelt he became able to use all four basic elements as the whatever-it-is that lets Sentients adapt to elements ends up giving Chroma elements instead. his prime version.. I'm just gonna pin that down to to Orokin tech being superior, maybe Chroma Prime originally ahd all the elements, then his Tenno version _ cheaply produced post  collapse - was only capable of using fire until donning the Sentient Pelt, which then restored it's missing elements. idk, if you guys think of something better I'd love to hear it.

On 2021-04-14 at 11:48 PM, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

-Xaku before she became a Frankenstein of different dead frame bits

supposedly Xaku is made up of frames lost during void expeditions, so I don't think there ever was an original Xaku, per se... that's gonna be fun to rant about for people when Xaku Prime happens (remember, ALL frames are eligible, and DE will gladly ignore the lore to sell PA packs.)

On 2021-04-14 at 11:48 PM, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

maybe Valkyr??????????

going over valkyr's lore is travelling a well-trodden path, at this point I just want her to get a proper rework. and if DE decides to settle on her lore properly, they can give us her Leverian Entry (all frames are eligible for those too, though Quest Frames are much lower priority of course). 

[quxier]

49 minutes ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

supposedly Xaku is made up of frames lost during void expeditions, so I don't think there ever was an original Xaku, per se... that's gonna be fun to rant about for people when Xaku Prime happens (remember, ALL frames are eligible, and DE will gladly ignore the lore to sell PA packs.)

It could be that we made non-perfect version, and "prime" will be just better (e.g. from prime parts or something)...