Crossplay: A failure that sacrificed the enjoyment of PC players to the altar of trendiness

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

On 2023-04-11 at 1:52 AM, sly_squash said:

• Crossplay ruined recruiting chat because of the stupid numbers scheme spam.
• Crossplay ruined clan recruiting because recruiters get spammed with requests from people who should know I obviously can't invite them anyway (how are we gonna share a dojo if you know crosstrade isn't enabled...)
• Crossplay ruined fast void fissure runs because they're still loading while we're waiting at extraction.
• Crossplay ruined kuva floods because apparently it's fashionable there to force the entire squad to extract while they're farming out siphon because all you care about is a worthless requiem relic when in 10 seconds we could've all had 2.5-10k kuva as well.
• Most recently, crossplay ruined profit taker runs during double credit events because there's laggy orb vallis and then there's console host laggy orb vallis.

Most of these are right but if your speed running pt for credits, you do it solo not with a party. There is no reason to do kuva floods in a party either. Recruitment chat is quite annoying these days gotta admit.

[Kaiga]

On 2023-04-12 at 6:09 AM, TheArmchairThinker said:

Funny that this was the thing people want and now it's a "failure"

They could have rolled it out correctly and done a performance review. 

But that didn't happen.

[Cr4zyDoc]

So the only thing i experienced are the vastly lower spawnrates in Steelpath survival if someone playing on old Gen consoles is in the lobby. I play them a lot (fissures) and u even notice the diffrence once console players leaves the lobby. 

For example i had a lobby with 3 PC players, one console. The first 6-7 minutes the console player was in our lobby, the spawnrates were so low, Life support was draining quickly. as soon as the console player left the lobby, we were able to get it back to 100% in no time. 

But im not blaming the console players for that. DE clearly should be aware of that and did nothing to compensate (higher drop rates for life support if last gens in the lobby would be an example).

for the rest... i think some people overreact. 

Stuff like recruiting will get less apparent the longer the system is in play. people returning maybe also didnt follow every news and are not aware that stuff is either not possible or that crossplay is even active.

Lot of stuff actually seems to be bad mindset or hate against console players. 

- Fissure runs can be done with a recruited squad easily. easy to avoid if it bugs ppl so much

- Force extracting on some missions happens with PC players alike. happens all the time if people are impatient or dont want to do a specific objective.

[(XBOX)Architect Prime]

When cross save comes out, I'm moving to PC (Xbox One is unpolayable), and I still want to play with my friends on both PC AND console. In about a year, all the bugs will be stomped out. This stuff takes time to polish. 

[DatDarkOne]

I come back from a forum hiatus only to see this topic.  LMMFAO!!!

[Tiltskillet]

18 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

I come back from a forum hiatus only to see this topic.  LMMFAO!!!

Welcome back to paradise!

[sly_squash]

  

On 2023-04-14 at 6:04 PM, (PSN)Joylesstuna said:

Most of these are right but if your speed running pt for credits, you do it solo not with a party. There is no reason to do kuva floods in a party either. Recruitment chat is quite annoying these days gotta admit.

Nope, you run kuva floods in a squad because half the people can run the mission (spy vaults, sabotage the thing, rescue the dude, etc.) while the other half farms out siphon, which makes the overall completion time faster than solo.

And you run profit taker in a squad because it's one of very few mission types where you can join at any point of the mission, meaning you will have a lot of joins where the orb is in its final phase and about to die right when you join the squad.  Nothing is faster than instagib.

You can argue with me, but I have 16M kuva and 1B credits so I wouldn't bother trying.

At least it used to work that way before console, anyway.  Now you join a kuva flood and get pulled out at 3/4 braids complete because you didn't check that there was an extraction timer running and abort because why on earth would anyone squad extract a kuva flood before the kuva is farmed out?  Or join a profit taker run and marvel at the load times and lag consoles are capable of dishing out.

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

4 hours ago, sly_squash said:

  

Nope, you run kuva floods in a squad because half the people can run the mission (spy vaults, sabotage the thing, rescue the dude, etc.) while the other half farms out siphon, which makes the overall completion time faster than solo.

And you run profit taker in a squad because it's one of very few mission types where you can join at any point of the mission, meaning you will have a lot of joins where the orb is in its final phase and about to die right when you join the squad.  Nothing is faster than instagib.

You can argue with me, but I have 16M kuva and 1B credits so I wouldn't bother trying.

At least it used to work that way before console, anyway.  Now you join a kuva flood and get pulled out at 3/4 braids complete because you didn't check that there was an extraction timer running and abort because why on earth would anyone squad extract a kuva flood before the kuva is farmed out?  Or join a profit taker run and marvel at the load times and lag consoles are capable of dishing out.

You may have have 1b credits and 16m kuva but your still doing it wrong. Congrats on all that wasted time. Imagine how much you could of had. Noone cares btw about your numbers so calm down. If your banking on joining a half finished pt run that means your not ready to do it.

Edited April 16, 2023 by (PSN)Joylesstuna

[sly_squash]

I explained to you why squading is--or at least was-- objectively faster in both scenarios, so there's always that, too...  

Even if it's not half dead, worst case scenario (aside from if you get lagged out) is you get a bad squad and have to--you know-- solo the thing.  But even then at least the squad will be killing the adds, which means more calda toroids which are useful for filling that last bit of leftover standing cap each day.

The fastest way to do it is in a premade.  You need a saryn to be fast, but if you solo with saryn you don't get double creds.  So you need a chroma for double creds, but if you solo with chroma you won't be as fast as you could be.  However, because I'm an active trader premades aren't an option for me (I'd have to break up the squads too much), so squad hopping is--or at least was-- the best alternative.

In any event, this is why I was leery of crossplay long before any of the technical issues emerged:  console players simply play the game much more casually and inefficiently than PC players, and I could already tell this from discussions on the forums years ago.  You can tell this from all the posts on these forums that complain PC players take the game "too seriously".  You can tell this from market where PC prices are low because we farm much more effectively and produce more goods.  You can tell this from crossplay missions where the console player is almost always the last person to extraction.  And you can tell this right now, when the PC player makes cogent arguments defending their claims and showing the receipts and the response is just "No you're still wrong just cuz I said so."  You have neither the logic nor the receipts to back up your counter-claim, so you're just going to be insulting and denigrating.  No thank you.  Scrub muted.

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

8 hours ago, sly_squash said:

I explained to you why squading is--or at least was-- objectively faster in both scenarios, so there's always that, too...  

Even if it's not half dead, worst case scenario (aside from if you get lagged out) is you get a bad squad and have to--you know-- solo the thing.  But even then at least the squad will be killing the adds, which means more calda toroids which are useful for filling that last bit of leftover standing cap each day.

The fastest way to do it is in a premade.  You need a saryn to be fast, but if you solo with saryn you don't get double creds.  So you need a chroma for double creds, but if you solo with chroma you won't be as fast as you could be.  However, because I'm an active trader premades aren't an option for me (I'd have to break up the squads too much), so squad hopping is--or at least was-- the best alternative.

In any event, this is why I was leery of crossplay long before any of the technical issues emerged:  console players simply play the game much more casually and inefficiently than PC players, and I could already tell this from discussions on the forums years ago.  You can tell this from all the posts on these forums that complain PC players take the game "too seriously".  You can tell this from market where PC prices are low because we farm much more effectively and produce more goods.  You can tell this from crossplay missions where the console player is almost always the last person to extraction.  And you can tell this right now, when the PC player makes cogent arguments defending their claims and showing the receipts and the response is just "No you're still wrong just cuz I said so."  You have neither the logic nor the receipts to back up your counter-claim, so you're just going to be insulting and denigrating.  No thank you.  Scrub muted.

Your word means just as little as anyone else on this forum. You are a nobody like all of us. The sooner you learn that the better. Go ahead and mute so I never have to see your elitist and backhanded messages ever again.

Edited April 17, 2023 by (PSN)Joylesstuna

[Famecans]

I noticed that there are matches where the enemy spawn is so large that there is no way for the squad to separate without being attacked by numerous enemies, it is pleasant to play as it is possible to test the builds to the maximum. I know console and mobile player has gameplay and hardware limitations that's why the game and AI needs to identify these players during the match.

spawn speed and AI should be related to the type of players in the match so if there are 3 PC players and 1 console player the game should spawn and focus 75% of the strongest enemies on PC players.

these mechanics can also be used against dominating players, the AI can identify that player A or B is dominating 75% of the match and focuse horders/groups of eximus against theses players, this math that identifies dominant players can be found in the match statistics so the game can spawn specific eximus squads

these enemy squadrons can receive special damage reduction modifiers equal to the damage type dealt by the dominant player, so to kill these enemies the dominant player must use another damage type.

other players on tenno team can also completely ignore the enemies modifiers even using the same damage as the dominant player. In this way, the game is balanced in terms of usefulness for everyone on the team.

Edited April 17, 2023 by Famecans

[Kaiga]

On 2023-04-15 at 3:58 PM, DatDarkOne said:

I come back from a forum hiatus only to see this topic.  LMMFAO!!!

This topic dominates the once pinned megathread in the other forum so uh, it never really left. 

DE keeps ignoring these problems

[Lustrouss]

On 2023-04-07 at 3:19 PM, Kaiga said:

Now that crossplay has been out for a while, it's time for DE to face the music of what they've produced: 

-Lowered spawn rates for no reason

-Terrible connections, host migration and slow loading performance 

-Unfamiliar, unresponsive players lagging behind in controlability and player performance 

-Hotfixes held up by cert on every console

-Non-crossplay being dead from it being turned on by default.

 

It is safe to say that the game experience was made objectively worse for the majority of players, in order to accomplish some long awaited bandwagon obejctive, accommodating the increasingly obsolete hardware limitations of last-gen consoles at the expense of the experience overall.

Cross-save and account transfers are the only way out of this mess.

True...

[Lustrouss]

On 2023-04-07 at 3:19 PM, Kaiga said:

Now that crossplay has been out for a while, it's time for DE to face the music of what they've produced: 

-Lowered spawn rates for no reason

-Terrible connections, host migration and slow loading performance 

-Unfamiliar, unresponsive players lagging behind in controlability and player performance 

-Hotfixes held up by cert on every console

-Non-crossplay being dead from it being turned on by default.

 

It is safe to say that the game experience was made objectively worse for the majority of players, in order to accomplish some long awaited bandwagon obejctive, accommodating the increasingly obsolete hardware limitations of last-gen consoles at the expense of the experience overall.

Cross-save and account transfers are the only way out of this mess.

While I was looking at your post, i just had another freeze and host migration, this freeze happens to everyone in the squad, and if your internet suks then you will crash.

[PollexMessier]

yeahh no.
If the spawnrate thing is actually true. This should be solved by just bumping the spawnrate on console to PC levels. cus there's really no reason for consoles to have lower spawnrates.
I play on a pc that was 500$ 8 years ago, Below PS3 spec basically, with controller, and have 0 issues dealing with enemy density.

"player performance" has always been pretty choppy. I've seen a max MR founder fail literally the easiest spy vault in the game, before crossplay came out. Some people just be genuinely awful at the game. And I haven't noticed anything off after crossplay really. If anything I end up on teams with players on the same level, if not better than me, more frequently than I did before.

Disconnects happen about as frequently as they did before. I think a lot of people are experiencing heavy confirmation bias on this one. They want to believe connectivity to console players is worse so every time they get a host migration they blame crossplay. Even tho it happened just as frequently with pc only. 99% of the time it's a router issue, the platform doesn't really impact this at all. At best PC players are more likely to be hard-wired. And even then, being hard wired doesn't necessarily mean they'll have a more reliable connection than someone on wifi if their router or provider is terrible. But hard wired players aren't as common as you'd think anyways. Half the PC players you're playing with are probably on a laptop. Likely a laptop with lower specs than a console.

If anything, people on PC are more likely to have performance issues, both with skill and computing, because in addition to the much lower hardware floor, you can multitask on a PC. Nearly everyone playing on PC probably also has a few browser tabs open at the same time, a few are probably listening to music or a podcast while they play, some might even be watching a stream in the corner of their screen. Console gamers don't have as many options to split their attention and processing like that. Plus viruses or just general software jank computers can have that'll kill performance out of nowhere, like crucial background applications just spontaneously maxing out disk or cpu for several minutes for no reason.

Overall Console is probably a lot more consistently reliable. Much less people are running a 1000$+ up to date PC with a flawless internet connection than you think there are. Most people can't afford that, and people with less money to throw around are exponentially more likely to be playing a free game that can run on a potato instead of a much better paid game that can't.

Crossplay has massively bumped up the population of recruitment chat which is fantastic, and also substantially lowers the average ping between players. Because more platforms = higher likely hood of pairing with someone closer to you. Just having the ability to play with friends that are on a different platform than you is a huge bonus. Overall it's a net positive.

Edited October 8, 2023 by PollexMessier

[BR31]

Something needs to be changed, getting reactants on certain tiles is already a struggle,
on old console hosts is just awful.

Also on the latest disruption mission, i got 4 console hosts in a row and we always had problems during the 4 conduit,
we basically had to wait double the time of the time required to do a rotation. We were killing only already corrupted enemies.
still not enough.

I deactivated crossplay- on the first try we got the full reac during the 2 conduit...

Pls make priority of hosts, if it's already a thing- optimize pls. Duviri switch host was the experience.

[PollexMessier]

Woop this was an accident. wish we could delete posts

Edited October 8, 2023 by PollexMessier
Accidental post