Petition for auction market in the game

[ShadowStarx1]

we do need some sort of Community Market that works like an AH, where we can Click, Post Done instead of having to wait and wait and set up live trade to buy or sell stuff.

 

[jibbahjabbah]

5 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

and how is this, ok `opinion`, won't get me far?

Because you're only seeing things from your perspective. Instead of trying to see if from the Devs perspective you write them off as being lazy. Doing so means you don't actually have to consider things that would lead to you not getting what you want. You're essentially trying to bully DE into giving you what you want. People don't like to be bullied so the way you're behaving will, most likely, only result in people not wanting to work with you. 

[Birdframe_Prime]

9 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

thats the problem cause they r lazy f's who dont wanna buy servers.

Lazy... 'Lazy'... Eh. If by lazy you mean that they don't want Warframe to effectively cease all production for six to eight months, then sure.

I mean, it's not like switching to dedicated servers affects... the entire base netcode of the game that they've been building on for ten years or something. Or that the act of stopping to recode everything would effectively halt all development of any new content they have, because it's just extending how long the change-over would be.

Oh, and of course Dedicated Servers are so easy and reliable, we certainly haven't seen FF14, or Destiny, or Overwatch, or League, or WoW, or Diablo just... completely seize up whenever they need to update or when a new bit of content comes out that causes every one of their servers to queue anywhere up to 500 people deep just to log in...

That's definitely them being lazy, when the alternative is just to keep actually working on the game, with quests and other content to keep bringing in players for their revenue stream.

The trade system works. It may not be amazing, but it works. And it's one of the only free-to-play games that actually allows players to trade the premium currency to non-paying players. Which I consider lucky when Tencent keeps pushing for more monetisation, like those stupid Aya purchases in the Heirloom bundles...

[Tsukinoki]

9 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

how am i wrong though? that they are lazy of buying servers?

DO you honestly think that they can just "buy servers" and then the problem goes away?

Do you have any idea the amount of time, effort, and money would need to go into completely rewriting the entire games netcode to work off of centralized servers?

It's not a simple "they just need to buy servers then flip the switch to go to centralized servers!"
It is a hek of a lot more than that and would cause them to essentially have to divert most resources into changing the netcode over.
It would be messy and slow and introduce a ton of bugs and issues that would need to be fixed.

And with consoles in the mix it just gets messier.

 

Calling a company lazy for not rewriting their entire netcode on a single persons whim is astoundingly self-centered and obtuse.

9 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

how is this, ok `opinion`, won't get me far?

Being aggressive on the forums won't get you very far.

Especially when the target of your aggression is the devs themselves.

Especially when you're entire point boils down to, and I quote:

9 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

cause they r lazy f's

 

[PollexMessier]

The reason there's nothing like this in the game is because the player trading system being the way that it is, is the main thing keeping the platinum economy in check.

If you've played other live service games with in-game player markets of any kind you'd have likely seen how obscenely out of control the prices get as earning the currency becomes exceedingly easy. The price of common things crashes to nothing, and the price of rare and desirable things skyrockets indefinitely until the developers need to go as far as to higher an Economist to fix the issue, usually culminating in the introduction of a new currency and completely devaluing the old one. I have seen this happen multiple times.

Warframe has the most under-control player market I've ever seen. And that's definitely due to the roundabout and inconvenient way it's setup. Just learn to live with it. cus if it changes, warframe's reputation as the most ftp friendly live service game would change real fast.

Edited November 9, 2023 by PollexMessier

[--iNTRoVeRT--]

On 2023-11-08 at 5:33 PM, Silligoose said:

An auction house system would be great for players, but it could potentially be bad for the developer's revenue as the avg item price would likely drop with an auction house system, so we haven't gotten it despite the various petitions and requests, even after a decade.

it actually won't, due to the fact of items being higher price (as it now would be easier to trade them), hence the higher need for more plat, hence new players would rather buy prime bundles or plat packs to buy from the market.

On 2023-11-08 at 5:33 PM, Silligoose said:

That being said, back in Apr 2023 there were talks of Warframe China looking to implement some sort of trade house system. At a stage it looked more like a website along the lines of warframe.market, but I wasn't following the development and have no idea what ended up happening there. A quick Google search didn't give me any more info, but I didn't spend more than a minute on there, so you may find more.

 

also heard bout this, also not know any news on that. but if wat u say is true and it would be on the site instead of the game that won't change things massively. or at least i don't see wat was the original idea.

 

On 2023-11-08 at 8:08 PM, jibbahjabbah said:

Because you're only seeing things from your perspective. Instead of trying to see if from the Devs perspective you write them off as being lazy. Doing so means you don't actually have to consider things that would lead to you not getting what you want. You're essentially trying to bully DE into giving you what you want. People don't like to be bullied so the way you're behaving will, most likely, only result in people not wanting to work with you. 

being unable to fix a door for 10 years is not lazy? dropping all previous expansions is not being lazy? not finishing half of the implemented things is not being lazy? not being able to buy servers and still using players as hosts (when they do have the money and ability to do so) is not being lazy?
interesting, how am i trying to bully them into making `wat i want` and not just speaking the overall view of players on a company?

On 2023-11-08 at 11:33 PM, Birdframe_Prime said:

Lazy... 'Lazy'... Eh. If by lazy you mean that they don't want Warframe to effectively cease all production for six to eight months, then sure.

they ceased production for a year to make a 1 month of content? how this would change?

 

On 2023-11-08 at 11:33 PM, Birdframe_Prime said:

Oh, and of course Dedicated Servers are so easy and reliable, we certainly haven't seen FF14, or Destiny, or Overwatch, or League, or WoW, or Diablo just... completely seize up whenever they need to update or when a new bit of content comes out that causes every one of their servers to queue anywhere up to 500 people deep just to log in...

we still do the exact same things with every update as all of ur examples, the difference with the queue is by the simple math of warframe having 10x fewer people even on a daily base?

 

On 2023-11-08 at 11:33 PM, Birdframe_Prime said:

The trade system works. It may not be amazing, but it works. And it's one of the only free-to-play games that actually allows players to trade the premium currency to non-paying players. Which I consider lucky when Tencent keeps pushing for more monetisation, like those stupid Aya purchases in the Heirloom bundles...

having that something works is not a good enough answer for no need for change and development.

 

On 2023-11-08 at 11:37 PM, Tsukinoki said:

It's not a simple "they just need to buy servers then flip the switch to go to centralized servers!"
It is a hek of a lot more than that and would cause them to essentially have to divert most resources into changing the netcode over.
It would be messy and slow and introduce a ton of bugs and issues that would need to be fixed.

And with consoles in the mix it just gets messier.

i love how u all just focus on 1 aspect and completely different points of this whole forum page. did i say it would be easy? did i say it would not take time? did i say it will come with a `switch` as u call it? did i even mention any of it? all i said is that all the problems that arise with implementing auction is solved by introducing servers that SUPRICE SUPRICE would also solve 90% of server and host connection problems that the game has on a daily basis. 
 

 

On 2023-11-08 at 11:37 PM, Tsukinoki said:

Calling a company lazy for not rewriting their entire netcode on a single persons whim is astoundingly self-centered and obtuse.

u focusing on a different point here is `astoundingly self-centered and obtuse.` when wat i said was a simple answer to a question of how could this be solved and y they don't do it. 
+ They are lazy, how long has it been since a proper update? well before dagath cause ok they at least after 10 years finally decided to change and fix the problems that the game had for all this time.

 

On 2023-11-08 at 11:37 PM, Tsukinoki said:

Being aggressive on the forums won't get you very far.

Especially when the target of your aggression is the devs themselves.

Especially when you're entire point boils down to, and I quote:

how was i aggressive at any of the points? if u love to imagine things that great, but i would applicant u not placing tags on people cause u cant even control ur self😁

On 2023-11-09 at 12:29 AM, PollexMessier said:

If you've played other live service games with in-game player markets of any kind you'd have likely seen how obscenely out of control the prices get as earning the currency becomes exceedingly easy. The price of common things crashes to nothing, and the price of rare and desirable things skyrockets indefinitely until the developers need to go as far as to higher an Economist to fix the issue, usually culminating in the introduction of a new currency and completely devaluing the old one. I have seen this happen multiple times.

please don't forget that it's not like other games where their trade currency is the main currency such as gold in most of them
we have plat that can be only obtained via real money or trade 

we can't get it from mobs like in all those games u think. hence the price difference and better economy

On 2023-11-09 at 12:29 AM, PollexMessier said:

Warframe has the most under-control player market I've ever seen. And that's definitely due to the roundabout and inconvenient way it's setup. Just learn to live with it. cus if it changes, warframe's reputation as the most ftp friendly live service game would change real fast.

interesting though with 0 explanation, develop on that and maybe i even consider on deleting this post if u can prove ur point🙃

[Birdframe_Prime]

2 minutes ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

they ceased production for a year to make a 1 month of content? how this would change?

No patches. No updates. Nothing. Do you think DE does absolutely nothing all year between Quest updates? Have you not seen the monthly and sometimes weekly patches that happen?

We've seen exactly what that kind of downtime does to games in the past.

If you knew that DE were going to stop working on anything else for a year, and then had to start making stuff again after that year, meaning the next update wouldn't be for months after that? You'd stop playing.

All of the people that pay for the game would stop playing.

A year would be a death sentence.

5 minutes ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

we still do the exact same things with every update as all of ur examples

How? We literally don't, because the game is peer-to-peer instanced, as soon as the update is done, we can get back in instantly, start a mission in around 27 seconds (on average, players tested) after an update is finished and on our machine. Dedicated servers for those other games mean that hundreds upon thousands of players are literally locked out of playing or even viewing their own progress for up to two days after an update.

Don't pretend, it's literally been reported for years when it happens.

8 minutes ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

having that something works is not a good enough answer for no need for change and development.

Not having what specific option you want is not the same as having no change or development.

The trading system has gone through hundreds of changes over time, improving and becoming more and more user friendly.

The one thing it is not going to become is a general market where you can AFK sell items. That's it. That's the one thing it's not going to be. Development and changes are still ongoing and will still happen.

Just not the one thing you want. Deal with it.

[Famecans]

On 2023-11-08 at 6:02 AM, (PSN)FirmBizkit said:

Auction houses can be a nightmare to manage and often have bots and no lifers watching the panel 24/7 to immediately undercut anything you post and players with large sums are able to manipulate markets - unless they’re controlled in a way like Black Desert. I actually kind of prefer the current “old school” system of just shouting for trades. The chat filter facilitates this pretty well too.

Youd also probably see the entire market collapse with 99% of items trading for 1 plat because of increased market availability.

ok let's talk about bots, look at the screenshots below, on left you see organic listings and right buying bots:

Spoiler

Note that there is someone using multiple bots to make listings in sequence, while ordinary players are limited to 30 daily trades, slow screen loading and an extremely exhaustive and problematic trading system.

I hate invitation disputes, everyone wants to avoid loadings, most sellers/buyers are robotic and have no conversational personality, I think there are other places in the game to make friends.

you mention the market collapse without understanding supply and demand, without understanding speculative value and without realizing that there is an external website destroying the value of platinum.

The trading system is essential for account progress and needs urgent rework. be honest, you don't want to see the common player evolve in the market, that's why you don't support auction houses.

 

On 2023-11-07 at 11:34 AM, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

i dont really understand what this is about. can u explain this please)

I wrote hypothetical commands that would be used to manage buying, selling, offering, seeing offers, seeing sales, seeing other players, etc... The trading system should be fully accessible through the chat system, basically commands administrating a hyden inventory to auction.

Chat commands are more useful than in-game user interface because commands can be used via APIs by external websites or apps.

I like wmarket.com but I hate market speculation because there is an incentive for multiple accounts, market speculation exists because DE doesn't care about the real value of the game, the time played by the average player.

 

On 2023-11-08 at 11:54 AM, (XBOX)Shodian said:

On 2023-11-08 at 8:29 AM, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

what is the difference that u see in those no-lifers undercutting u in your current state using wfm? exactly the same thing.
additionally, those exact monopolists would actually exaggerate the price in higher value rather than lower so idk y u think it would drop to 1plat.
cause of the exact reason u told, they would straight away buy out anyone who tries to undercut them and just post it at a higher price. 

Thats my problem with it. You'll see both buy up the smaller platinum pieces and try to sell it for an extremely high amount. So no, this game doesn't need that.

Or make Platinum untradeable. 

@(XBOX)Shodian I do exactly what you are saying but I care about the beginner player.

the most valuable thing in any game and in real life is time, time cannot be calculated and this current trading system is stealing and devaluing the life time of many players, most of these players are beginners and are giving up of the game when realizing the time cost of this journey.

I buy countless pieces of 15 ducatos but do you know how much each 15 ducato piece is worth? are worth 3 minutes of the farmer player's life, so I buy 6 pieces of 15 ducates for 20 platinum, do you know how much 6 pieces of 15 ducats are worth? 12 minutes in the life of the farmer player.

realize we're not talking about 100 ducats pieces, we're not talking about platinums we're talking about lifetime and real world people... I just bought 6 pieces for 20 platinums, do you know how much 20 platinums are worth? 3 minutes, exactly that, 20 platinum are worth the same 3 minutes of life as the veteran player in any relic opening mission, but the veteran player is focused on taking 20, 30, 40 minutes of life from a beginner player through a single trade. .

I didn't add other factors to the game such as 5-minute missions, credit rate, loading screens, exchanging Aya for relics and more loading screens, market speculation, etc... and all these factors I can buy for 20 platinum because the auction house doesn't exist...

the game needs active players and the current market system scares away players forever, Warframe Story Pack is ridiculous but it shows how the game needs new active players, players embedded in the game's story. Warframe Story Pack is the worst way to attract and keep new players active as the game's progression needs to be enjoyed and experienced but is strangled by slot purchasing systems for equipment and essential resources, all of which are purchased for platinum.

 

Edited November 9, 2023 by Famecans

[(PSN)FirmBizkit]

11 hours ago, Famecans said:

ok let's talk about bots, look at the screenshots below, on left you see organic listings and right buying bots:

  Hide contents

Note that there is someone using multiple bots to make listings in sequence, while ordinary players are limited to 30 daily trades, slow screen loading and an extremely exhaustive and problematic trading system.

I hate invitation disputes, everyone wants to avoid loadings, most sellers/buyers are robotic and have no conversational personality, I think there are other places in the game to make friends.

you mention the market collapse without understanding supply and demand, without understanding speculative value and without realizing that there is an external website destroying the value of platinum.

The trading system is essential for account progress and needs urgent rework. be honest, you don't want to see the common player evolve in the market, that's why you don't support auction houses.

You say I don’t understand supply and demand… an auction house dramatically increases available supply while demand remains largely the same. Right now it’s limited to an external manually operated market or trade chat that both of which requires players to actively partake in face to face trades whereas an auction house is an entirely automated process. 
 

I don’t see how you don’t see that would lead to the vast majority of items selling for 1p - which is even worse for new players than the current system. 

 

Edited November 9, 2023 by (PSN)FirmBizkit

[PollexMessier]

13 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

please don't forget that it's not like other games where their trade currency is the main currency such as gold in most of them

we have plat that can be only obtained via real money or trade 

we can't get it from mobs like in all those games u think. hence the price difference and better economy

Yes and no. It doesn't really matter that it's not technically an infinitely available resource in the game. When this happens, prices skyrocket to a point where pretty much the only way to ever earn that amount of currency is by participating in the market, and farming it outside of the market is no longer viable. Think walking around town picking up loose change to try and buy a house. It's just not going to happen.

In addition to that. This sort of easily accessible market puts platinum just one step removed from being a mob drop/mission reward anyways. Since any remotely desirable item you pick up can be sold on the market with little to no effort to convert it into platinum. This is why common items would rapidly devalue to 1 platinum almost overnight. And those are the biggest thing making healthy amounts of platinum available to new players right now. They would become almost immediately worthless and near impossible to sell as the market is instantly flooded with the hundreds of thousands of copies of these things in end game player's inventories that were previously just too much effort to bother selling before. It would immediately destroy New players' ability to earn reasonable amounts of platinum to get the stuff they sorely need it for.

The idea that platinum being a limited resource would prevent costs of rarer items from escalating too far out of control, because it only enters the player market through cash purchases, makes some intuitive sense. But that's not what would happen, because whales would just buy more platinum to get the stuff they want. It would create a feedback loop of prices rising, whales buying more plat to compensate because it's pennies to them, plat devaluing as more enters the market, prices raise higher, whales buy more plat, exct. And the raising prices would cause people to start buying stuff up they don't need, to capitalize on it. Making the price or rare and desirable goods inflate faster as anything of the sort being sold for cheap gets snatched up and hoarded by people soley wanting to flip it for profit. Which puts this stuff entirely out of reach of ftp players, Or even just non-whales at that point, that can't farm for it. Which is particularly troublesome for vaulted primes.

It would get out of hand really fast.

Edited November 10, 2023 by PollexMessier

[jibbahjabbah]

10 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

being unable to fix a door for 10 years is not lazy? dropping all previous expansions is not being lazy? not finishing half of the implemented things is not being lazy? not being able to buy servers and still using players as hosts (when they do have the money and ability to do so) is not being lazy?
interesting, how am i trying to bully them into making `wat i want` and not just speaking the overall view of players on a company?

Homie, you're trying to turn this into a debate about whether or not DE is lazy and it isn't that, never was, and as far as my part in this goes, never will be. Reread my reply to you and notice how I never claimed anything in regard to whether or not they are lazy. To me, pointing out someone is lazy is like pointing out that they're breathing. There's no point to it. You don't need to convince me DE is lazy, I know. Just like you, me, and every other person out there. Doubt that? Just consider that there's always a limited amount of things we do and an infinite amount of things that we don't do. Oh wow, you found a thing they didn't do in a sea of infinite things they could have done but didn't, whoopty-freakin-do, here's a metaphorical cookie for ya.

For your own mental well-being I hope you weren't expecting to get anything more than that for making those arguments because I feel like that's about it. In fact, I hope you weren't even expecting that much because really, how many guys are out there handing out metaphorical cookies to people who point out obvious things? Considering I can't recall coming across any, I don't think it can be all too many. 

But, you're not actually trying to convince people DE is lazy here, you're trying to convince people that you were justified in making your claim and as such, were not trying to bully them into giving you what you want. In this regard, I believe there is a distinction here you are failing to make. Bullying isn't about what's being claimed, it's about what's being ignored and, ultimately, why it's being ignored. In your classic schoolyard bully scenario, what's being ignored by the bully are the emotional and/or physical well-being of their victim and the reason why is because they are distracting themselves and others from their own insecurities, typically speaking. 

I said you were "essentially" bullying people (I did say DE in my original reply but I'm retconning that because, realistically speaking, you're not talking to DE, you're not trying to convince DE, it's not DE that is suffering your ignorance. DE gets 100's of millions of examples each and every year showing them that they're right and the players that disagree with them are wrong... man, what I wouldn't give for an echo-chamber full of money instead of the ones full of broke-ass people plagued by bitterness the rest of us get stuck with. How nice that must be.) by disregarding the points they made when you all said in response to them was "they r lazy cuz they don't by servers". The why you did this is because you got in over your head and lacked the humility to own up to that. Instead of chomping down on a serving of humble pie, you decided to double down. This is you protecting yourself from the insecurity that maybe you don't actually know what you're talking about, that maybe you're wrong and maybe there are legitimate reasons for why DE didn't do the thing you wish they did. Don't worry bud, happens to the best of us. It's why the behavior is recognizable in the first place. 

You don't know what to do with servers after you've bought them, you don't understand the actual process the term "game development" describes, and you aren't speaking on behalf of the overall player base. These are assumptions that I, and I'm assuming the rest of the people who choose to dogpile on your blatant ignorance, feel safe in making. So far everything you've said only reinforces that sense of safety. Like, you're defense of "being unable to fix a door for 10 years is not lazy?" isn't convincing anybody that you actually know what you're talking about here. You provided zero insight into what it is you're taking into consideration when making your claims with your lazy attempts to convince people you've actually considered the things that were said to you. 

You're making a statement when you ignore something. The statement being that it isn't worth your consideration. Apply that to situations relating to working with people and that will "result in people not wanting to work with you". Oh hey, look at that, another thing you ignored in my reply to you.. a reply that consisted of only four whole sentences. That was the final sentence. Given the only thing I quoted from you, it was clearly the only point of me making my reply to you. If you don't care enough about that point to even acknowledge it, then why bother replying to me at all?.. Because your spiraling out of control. Got yourself backed into a corner and instead of allowing yourself a way out by being reasonable, you wildly attack anything that comes close like some feral beast. Nothing more pitiful than a feral beast. A living being in desperate need of help but is unable to receive it because of how they perceive the act.

Moral of the story, people say things for reasons. If you can't take the things they say and the reasons they say it seriously then you can't rightfully expect others to take you seriously. So, instead of meaningful conversation, what you get are people with nothing better to do other than to amuse themselves by spewing verbal diarrhea in your general direction. I mean, why wouldn't they, you already did it to them. Ofcourse, now not only is everyone full of crap but we're all covered in it too so that's cool. Not pleasant, but feels more complete ya know? 

Well, that's one half of a day down. Spose I'll go fire up Warframe to kill off the other half.

 

 

[Famecans]

On 2023-11-09 at 11:25 PM, (PSN)FirmBizkit said:

I don’t see how you don’t see that would lead to the vast majority of items selling for 1p - which is even worse for new players than the current system. 

Market settlement stimulates liquidity and the real value of products and the real value is derived from this same liquidity, the more items are being sold in the more liquid and more explicit the value of each item in the market will be. It doesn't matter if item X Y or Z is worth 1 platinum, the merchant will liquidate his stock to invest in multiple niches, further stimulating the market.

Spoiler

I redesigned this image below to exemplify how any market works.

All game items/resources should be tradable, should be a coin and the auction house would make this liquidity flow the market.
Market liquidity is so accurate that it can be used by developers to identify farming abuses and bugs.

 

On 2023-11-09 at 11:54 PM, PollexMessier said:

Whales would just buy more platinum to get the stuff they want. It would create a feedback loop of prices rising, whales buying more plat to compensate because it's pennies to them, plat devaluing as more enters the market, prices raise higher, whales buy more plat, exct. And the raising prices would cause people to start buying stuff up they don't need, to capitalize on it.

The current market system does not encourage healthy liquidity, the current system traps beginning players and is affected by speculation stimulated through external markets. I am not against wmarket.com, this site is not to blame for the market problem. Market whales exist because the market is more fluid outside the game, the real player is not outside the game, the real player is inside the game while market whales are outside the game using anti-game strategies such as multiple accounts, market research players, market speculation, research bots... all these tricks are not within the game but are destroying the beginner player's progress.

There is no infinite platinum on the market, we have players taking advantage of market speculation to extort beginner players, if this problem is stopped the beginner player's progression will be strangled by the merchants. most merchants cannot see the horizon and are not to blame as they believe that the platinum on the market is infinite, not even the DE can see this problem, the platinum on the market was bought by players on the warframe website and all this platinum will be liquidated naturally for non-refundable consumables and cosmetics in the orbiter store, these are the only two ways to fill and empty the liquid cycle of the platinum market.

All the game's platinum is sold in cosmetics in the orbital store, we can have hundreds of players exchanging parts for 1 platinum, but the endgame results in buying cosmetics and more cosmetics for 900 platinum in the orbital market, but this is not being payable because These 900 plats cost the game time of countless players, beginner players who are in the rat race exchanging 6 pieces of 12~30-minute missions for just 20 platinum with the aim of purchasing 1 single warframe slots or form packs.

To the developer reading this thread:
If Regal Aya was created to fill the warframe's economic revenue it means that platinum is gradually going bankrupt, no one wants to buy platinum but if Regal Aya was created solely to simplify the vault parts market, ignore everything I wrote in the last few posts.

thanks for reading.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Famecans

[(PSN)FirmBizkit]

8 hours ago, Famecans said:

Market settlement stimulates liquidity and the real value of products and the real value is derived from this same liquidity, the more items are being sold in the more liquid and more explicit the value of each item in the market will be. It doesn't matter if item X Y or Z is worth 1 platinum, the merchant will liquidate his stock to invest in multiple niches, further stimulating the market.

  Reveal hidden contents

I redesigned this image below to exemplify how any market works.

All game items/resources should be tradable, should be a coin and the auction house would make this liquidity flow the market.
Market liquidity is so accurate that it can be used by developers to identify farming abuses and bugs.

You keep saying in your other posts that everything is about caring about new players. Literally the market would be flooded with hundreds of thousands of items that have been deemed not worthwhile to veteran players to sell - the exact same items new players will be selling.

Honestly to me it seems like this whole new player concern is just trolling and you just want to easily offload a bunch of junk you don’t want to take the time to sell.

At this point I have to assume you’re lying.

Edited November 10, 2023 by (PSN)FirmBizkit

[Famecans]

17 hours ago, (PSN)FirmBizkit said:

You keep saying in your other posts that everything is about caring about new players. Literally the market would be flooded with hundreds of thousands of items that have been deemed not worthwhile to veteran players to sell - the exact same items new players will be selling.

The way you wrote almost makes me believe that RNG does not exist, you ignore the point solely to be supported and supporte the market hungry guys, even insinuate that I am hungry for the market, understand that I am not a layman. I do not need to prove anything to you in the same way that I don't need your proof or answers filled with superficial factors.🤷‍♂️

17 hours ago, (PSN)FirmBizkit said:

Honestly to me it seems like this whole new player concern is just trolling and you just want to easily offload a bunch of junk you don’t want to take the time to sell.

At this point I have to assume you’re lying.

I'm going to join in on your joke and say "Wow, I have countless rubbish 100 ducatos and I need to sell them as quickly as possible bla bla bla..." that doesn't change the fact that platinum is devalued because the DE has no control over the market speculation, the DE has no control in reducing RNG because "all" pieces traded on the market are in fact "currencies" which devalue any number of RNG piece.

Edited November 11, 2023 by Famecans

[(XBOX)IronJames235]

I would be 100 percent behind this, I only see upsides to it make it like wows auction house a centralized location on a relay with a in game menu and use the mail system that's already in place to deliver the goods to the buyer and the platinum to the seller.

[--iNTRoVeRT--]

On 2023-11-09 at 11:25 PM, (PSN)FirmBizkit said:

I don’t see how you don’t see that would lead to the vast majority of items selling for 1p - which is even worse for new players than the current system. 

Items cant and wont be sold for 1 plat due to simple reason. It’s not profitable. Making the process easy does not alter the supply and demand aspect of it. It’s like buying wood from a lumberjack or from a website. Price is the same with the same demand and its supply regardless the ease of actual trade.
 

 

On 2023-11-09 at 11:54 PM, PollexMessier said:

point where pretty much the only way to ever earn that amount of currency is by participating in the market, and farming it outside of the market is no longer viable. Think walking around town picking up loose change to try and buy a house. It's just not going to happen.

This doesn’t really make sense cause there is still legit no other way to get plat but by trade or buying it for real money… 

 

On 2023-11-09 at 11:54 PM, PollexMessier said:

Since any remotely desirable item you pick up can be sold on the market with little to no effort to convert it into platinum. This is why common items would rapidly devalue to 1 platinum almost overnight

So u say in 2 different paragraphs that cause of change the price would skyrocket and now u say they would drop to 1 plat? So which one is it?
 

 

On 2023-11-09 at 11:54 PM, PollexMessier said:

It would immediately destroy New players' ability to earn reasonable amounts of platinum to get the stuff they sorely need it for.

No one ever got their plat from common mods. Even as a new player. The fact that u use this example makes sry but little to no sense cause of 1 simple fact. Common items always cost nothing. Especially if we go into consideration of how easy its to get a mod or how profitable its to current state plat per trade value.
 

 

On 2023-11-09 at 11:54 PM, PollexMessier said:

The idea that platinum being a limited resource would prevent costs of rarer items from escalating too far out of control, because it only enters the player market through cash purchases, makes some intuitive sense. But that's not what would happen, because whales would just buy more platinum to get the stuff they want. It would create a feedback loop of prices rising, whales buying more plat to compensate because it's pennies to them, plat devaluing as more enters the market, prices raise higher, whales buy more plat, exct

Some good thought with not much of consideration…
the price cant go up to absurd amounts as no one simply would buy it. For simple and good example iPhones. If they could they would have sold them for 10k. But they know no one would buy em such ludicrous amount, hence the price range. Simple marketing. Especially with constant supply chain.

 

On 2023-11-10 at 2:03 AM, jibbahjabbah said:

Homie, you're trying to turn this into a debate about whether or not DE is lazy and it isn't that

Homie, they asked i answered, i didnt try turning into anything but a ask from de to consider adding auction
 

 

On 2023-11-10 at 3:40 PM, (PSN)FirmBizkit said:

Honestly to me it seems like this whole new player concern is just trolling and you just want to easily offload a bunch of junk you don’t want to take the time to sell.

That would be impossible simply of again wat u said ur self. Too much of this junk. So who would buy it? New players? U said it ur self they r the 1s that try selling it. Old players? Y they need it if they better sell it for endo?

[sjunkeys]

I would prefer DE keep trades as it is bc so huge part as ingame market only be long time problem for everyone, players and developers. Don't touch what working.

But I'd don't mind slightly QoL changes, like remove dojo from trades requirements, lets invite people to your orbiter! This change not only save some time for players to trade, bc of time of loading might be shorter, but also motivate people to decorate their orbiters. So there might be some interest and opportunity for DE to add orbiter's skins and stuff to sell. 

[SpicyDinosaur]

no, prices for everything would bottom out, use search next time to see if something has been posted (about a thousand times) before. Also, warframe.market, riven.market.

[MicheIangeIo]

Minecraft is better

[8000john]

В 06.11.2023 в 21:59, SDGDen сказал:

likely because platinum is a currency with "real value", if they facilitate an actual in-game auctionhouse where you can spend what is effectively real money they may be beholden to regulations they'd rather not deal with (although some of those regulations also apply to their normal storefront). 

 

that's only a slightly-educated guess though. 

Looking at other MMORPGs with an auction, there are too few things in Warframe for RMT (because it will ruin the economy). Maybe if they added simple warframes to exchange and resources... but it sounds kind of pointless (after all, a warframe is not really a moorpg)

[8000john]

6 часов назад, SpicyDinosaur сказал:

no, prices for everything would bottom out, use search next time to see if something has been posted (about a thousand times) before. Also, warframe.market, riven.market.

you constantly say that prices for everything will fall, read other posts... and what prevents the DEs themselves from controlling the economy?

[Tsukinoki]

13 hours ago, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

Making the process easy does not alter the supply and demand aspect of it.

Actually it quite literally does alter it.

By making the process of listing items so easy that you can just go to a menu and list items you are massively increasing the supply in the market because everyone who can't be bothered to sit in trade now has an easy way to just dump their entire stock in the market.

And they'll want to sell so they'll undercut what's already there.

 

You are massively increasing supply, but the demand won't go up nearly as much as the supply will.
And market forces dictate that if you increase supply far more than demand then prices start going down and down until they completely bottom out because everyone is just trying to dump their items.

 

Further you're completely disregarding one simple fact: Nearly everything in warframe is a "one-and-done".
Once you get one of something you never need to get it again in the vast, vast, vast  majority of cases.
You build Ember Prime?  Good job, you never need more ember prime pieces!

We simply don't have any sinks for the items, and ducats don't do much because again the items from Baro are essentially "one-and-done" for the most part meaning you eventually catch up to Baro, relatively easily as well if you do the yearly tennocon relay where he has all his items.

What this all means is that every customer is a one-time customer.  They won't need to come back over and over again.
There isn't anything you can farm and trade that people would need constant supplies of.

This is opposed to pretty much every other MMORPG that has an auction/trading house where there are tons of consumables and mats being sold back and forth because you constantly needs more consumables and mats because you are using them up all the time to make more stuff to sell or use.  Further unlike most other MMORPGs you don't need to train your crafting skill by buying a ton of mats to make 50 woolen bags just so you can make the next item in the crafting tier list, or craft 100 wool into 50 yarn into 25 of the next thing and so on to move higher in the crafting tiers
In warframe the economy simply doesn't exist like that as we accumulate vast quantities of everything with literally nothing to use it on.  You get something and then you are simply out of the market and never need or want another of it again as long as you're playing with the only use for extras being to dump on the market.

 

And because of how fissures work the supply of the items are constantly increasing, meanwhile the demand is constantly decreasing.  After all every time someone buys or finds that item that is one customer permanently out of the market for said item.  And if they ever manage to get that item through random fissures then its just another competing seller.

 

You're trying to hawk an auction house in a game where there is ever increasing supply and ever dwindling demand, and your idea would be a massive shot in the arm for supply but not nearly as much for demand.

Edited November 13, 2023 by Tsukinoki

[SpicyDinosaur]

9 hours ago, 8000john said:

you constantly say that prices for everything will fall, read other posts... and what prevents the DEs themselves from controlling the economy?

How is DE going to control the economy? Why would they do that? And yes I do say that when people post this all over again because I've played a lot of MMOs and I've seen it happen countless times. Personally, I earn my plat by selling stuff, and I want to be able to afford cosmetics with it.

[jibbahjabbah]

On 2023-11-12 at 4:21 PM, --iNTRoVeRT-- said:

Homie, they asked i answered, i didnt try turning into anything but a ask from de to consider adding auction
 

You're like "Yo, got a good idea, here's why.". They're like "Nah, not really, here's why". And you're like "Stop being dumb and buy servers". I don't know how to tell you this, but, nobody asked.. what do you know, turns out I do know how to tell you that.

It should be alarming how easily duped you are by your own bias' revisionist's history. 

[Stafelund]

For those who are complaining about prices, and revenues I don't get what they're saying. Unless there's an arbitrary price decided by the game to be followed for each items (that would be a bad idea overall), that shouldn't be an issue since we have evidence of Warframe Market with cheap prices already, which I think just depends on how reasonably obtainable the items are.

I think WF having its own ingame market would be a good substitute for trading, you can add the trading limits we have per day too, and I think that won't be an issue. Besides fraudulent platinum, the aspect of having players chat with you to get what they want is offputting for me. If the players want to haggle or to set up a deal, that can and should be an option too at the seller and buyer's discretion and send a direct message with a dedicated messaging UI so the messages can be tracked. 

Last but not least, the traditional way of trading by going to dojos or Maroo's bazaar shouldn't completely go away for that purpose, and if players want a different avenue of selling and buying.

I've played a generic chinese MMORPG that has this system, and the only difference is the sellers are anonymous, and there's no messaging and IIRC you can't set up your own kind of pricing; the game dictates the market fully. WF can do the whole market without those shenanigans.

Pretty much, yeah, Warframe should have its native eBay-esque selling platform.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Stafelund
just woke up, i ended up having grammar issues