DE Needs to Regulate the Market

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

Ok, this is me posting a complaint about the majority of the in-game community market-place trades. I’m Sick and Tired of the massive amount of scammers and free-loaders flowing around inside the community servers whether PS/XB/PC. DE, you NEED TO REGULATE THE MARKET PRICES, this is unacceptable, especially with RIVENS!!! The amount of times I’ve been bullied and harassed by people trying to scam in-game currency trades is INSANE!!! Either, you need to set limits on Riven prices or in-game items; or you need to make rivens for specific weapons easier to get for players/give another way to get them/re-roll them. Another option is to get rid of rivens from the market and make them un-tradable. Now that I’ve played this game for nearly 2000hrs I can’t handle this anymore. Get your S*** together DE, or I’m done supporting this game. I’ve tried to keep myself calm about this subject for a while but, I can’t handle it anymore. I’ve been beat up too many times mentally to keep this post constructive any longer. This is my first post on the forums too. This is the only reason why I took the time to type this up, because I was content until now. Please DE, do something about it. Don’t just brush it off that it doesn’t exist because it makes the company boat-loads of cash. It’s no different than people scamming real-world goods or livelihoods from people. 

[Chewarette]

You seem awfully affected by a non-problem.

1. Free market is free. I can sell a garbage riven for 50.000  or a godlike riven for a meta weapon for 2   if I feel I want to, and neither you or DE has a word in this.

2. I hate Riven, my solution is to not use the system (or limitedly). No one forces you to involve yourself in something that put you in such state of anger.

3. How the hell can you be bullied and harassed in a game with a block function - no clue

Anyway, the conclusions to that are :

Warframe is a game

If you can't stand something, don't

Don't post on the forums when you're angry, it just ends in an unreadable and unconstructive rant that will be ignored by everyone (especially by the guys who you want they read your very message - DE)

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

So, I don’t have the right to be angry? By the way, they do have the right to, it’s their game, they can do whatever they want with it. That first point of yours also says you’re part of the problem (you’re one of them), which means you’ve proved my points already. If you haven’t seen the majority of MMO’s with in-game shops, you have no idea the severity of this problem. You can’t just ignore a major feature of a game that includes min-maxing, it’s human nature to find the fastest route or quickest way of finishing a mission. The third point, have you ever seen the responses you get right away before you’ve been able to ignore the person? They also purposefully aggravate you for the sake of aggravation/trolling.

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

Also, all I did was say poop, and I even censored it myself.

[Zakkhar]

You have right to be angry, but maybe calm yourself and think about what you are proposing.

1. It is impossible to do - ther is no way even god can control the prices of stuff in trade chat (sell listings, buy listings), warframe market (site not affiliated with DE) and DMs.

2. It is impossible to evaluate and control every trade that happens in game. It is in the logs so it can be traced if needs to be (plat purchase from stolen credit card). But that only is meant for flagged trades.

3. Even if it was possible, you really do not want this. It is worse than 1984. It is total control. I happen to be from a country which had been in its history ruled by totalitarian goverment, and believe me - it is not an utopia.

Even in other MMOs which have much better trading systems (WoW Auction house) there are still gold sellers, bots, scammers, all the illegal grey stuff.

So is IRL. And even more.

• See the scam? Just comment on it in public or ignore it completely (scammers are like hydra, you cut one head and there are two more).
• Being harassed? Ticket report the person with evidence  and block them.
• Want to avoid being scammed? Educate yourself.
• Want others to not be scammed? Educate them.

Free market is free. Anyone can  TRY to sell or buy anything at ANY price. You got tools that tell you whether this price is close to market price or far. If it is too good to be true it is most likely a scam. 

13 minutes ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

They also purposefully aggravate you for the sake of aggravation/trolling.

You seem to be perfectly capable of aggravating yourself without any outside help.

Edited February 15 by Zakkhar

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

26 minutes ago, Chewarette said:

You seem awfully affected by a non-problem.

1. Free market is free. I can sell a garbage riven for 50.000  or a godlike riven for a meta weapon for 2   if I feel I want to, and neither you or DE has a word in this.

2. I hate Riven, my solution is to not use the system (or limitedly). No one forces you to involve yourself in something that put you in such state of anger.

3. How the hell can you be bullied and harassed in a game with a block function - no clue

Anyway, the conclusions to that are :

Warframe is a game

If you can't stand something, don't

Don't post on the forums when you're angry, it just ends in an unreadable and unconstructive rant that will be ignored by everyone (especially by the guys who you want they read your very message - DE)

Step 1. You Ignore it exists                    Step 2. You say you can do anything with their mechanics/game in whatever you please. I never said I had the right too. YOU put that in my mouth.                                             Step 3. You don’t have a thorough understanding of how online communities in video-games work.            Step 4. Usually the conversations start being nice, and then after that that’s when the harassment begins. I don’t shut people out right away because I believe it’s impolite and rude. Also, that’s just the way that I function mentally. Everyone is different in the way they handle conversations.                                                   Step 5. When you invest in product you should expect it to deliver the bare minimum at least. Especially when it involves real world currency. As soon as you invest in a video-game that expects you to play long-term it becomes more than just a video-game; it’s a product to be consumed by the public. Fossil fuels is an example that isn’t regulated, hence they become billionaires off of peoples backs and hard earned money except, instead it’s the community using the cracks in the system DE built to take advantage of, which in-turn fuels the boilers of deception/greed in the community; which makes them richer and people addicted to their game even more.                                                             Step 6. Why do I even bother writing this?

[Chewarette]

34 minutes ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

So, I don’t have the right to be angry? By the way, they do have the right to, it’s their game, they can do whatever they want with it. That first point of yours also says you’re part of the problem (you’re one of them), which means you’ve proved my points already. If you haven’t seen the majority of MMO’s with in-game shops, you have no idea the severity of this problem. You can’t just ignore a major feature of a game that includes min-maxing, it’s human nature to find the fastest route or quickest way of finishing a mission. The third point, have you ever seen the responses you get right away before you’ve been able to ignore the person? They also purposefully aggravate you for the sake of aggravation/trolling.

You have the right to be angry. I'm just telling that posting a rant leads nowhere. A well structured, reasoned feedback is listened to. A rant like "do something you uneducated morons or I leave this game now !" will just be eyerolled away (if not outright closed for "non constructive feedback").

It's their game yes, but regulating a market, how exactly ? They could do by giving a fixed value to standard items (e.g. a Rhino Prime Blueprint at 15  or whatever). For Rivens with randomized stats ? How on earth ?

Free market regulates itself and doesn't need outside intervention. My first point, which was merely an example and not a proof I'm "part of that theoretical group", was part of it : If I want to sell a garbage riven for 50k plats, I can. No one will buy, so I'll lower the price until it sells. If it sells for 200 plats : it's its value. If it sells for 2000 plats : it's its value. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Too expensive for you ? Don't buy. Too cheap for you ? Don't sell. You feel like it's the good price ? Cool, buy it. Someone insults you ? Block (+report depending on the gravity of the insult), move on.

[waiora]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

Ok, this is me posting a complaint about the majority of the in-game community market-place trades. I’m Sick and Tired of the massive amount of scammers and free-loaders flowing around inside the community servers whether PS/XB/PC. DE, you NEED TO REGULATE THE MARKET PRICES, this is unacceptable, especially with RIVENS!!! The amount of times I’ve been bullied and harassed by people trying to scam in-game currency trades is INSANE!!! Either, you need to set limits on Riven prices or in-game items; or you need to make rivens for specific weapons easier to get for players/give another way to get them/re-roll them. Another option is to get rid of rivens from the market and make them un-tradable. Now that I’ve played this game for nearly 2000hrs I can’t handle this anymore. Get your S*** together DE, or I’m done supporting this game. I’ve tried to keep myself calm about this subject for a while but, I can’t handle it anymore. I’ve been beat up too many times mentally to keep this post constructive any longer. This is my first post on the forums too. This is the only reason why I took the time to type this up, because I was content until now. Please DE, do something about it. Don’t just brush it off that it doesn’t exist because it makes the company boat-loads of cash. It’s no different than people scamming real-world goods or livelihoods from people. 

DE doesnt need to regulate anything. If you want to buy from trade chat dont complain about being scammed.

Warframe market exists, supply/demand self regulates prices.

ANYTHING is only worth what someone is willing to pay.

At the end of the day I honestly don't care if other people get themself scammed, less competition for me on the market because they will always be short on plat. This game is in no short supply of people who cant think for themselves, even about some of the most basic things like not spamming hydroid tentacles on a defense mission. There is always going to be scammers because of the abundance of easy victims.
 

Edited February 15 by waiora

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

So I don't disagree with some of what you wrote. I actually quite strongly agree with certain points. 

Here is the issue though, you are conflating several issues, and then potentially taking some a bit more seriously than the people who make the game, may want you to, or that you necessarily need to be. Like terms like scammers and free-loaders can be quite subjective, because to some, what they consider is legit behaviour, isn't by others, and vice versa. You also can't use individual feelings, and experiences, like how much you have played, or spent, as an argument or leverage to demand a business... ignore one of its primary goals, and motivations... in making profit/sustaining itself... to accommodate your preferences.

If you feel that way, you should give me all your money, because I want it, and the other day I picked up some litter, and I need my self interests prioritised. Don't brush this off, just because you think the premise is silly. Now I know that what I just said, is snarky, but no offence is intended, I am just using that as an example. I am using this as an example, because like I said, I agree with some of your points, and because I agree, I think we need to make better arguments to give credit and weight to our arguments, points, perspectives etc. Except the main issue here, isn't so much DE making money, but other Warframe fans engaging with the system in a way, which gives DE incentive to support that system. People often like to frame issues, as "us, the real fans and supporters of the game" vs "the greedy business just wanting to make money", but the issue is more complicated because its the conflict between different types of players habits, behaviours and attitudes and preferences. 

Enough do engage in the system, that a massive change is unlikely. Like more regulations, would require more resources effort and time from DE in order to enforce or accomodate those regulations. Then who would decide the nature of such regulations. Which fans/players will be accommodated. Is it actually possible for 100% of players to be happy, content and satisfied if they were? Which ones to prioritise. 

At the moment, the best way someone with issues towards the Market/Rivens, that gets them angry, heated or that frustrated... is to just not engage with it. Its an optional system. Though if you feel like it isn't and its also ruining the game for you, then... maybe thats just it. Maybe the game doesn't deserve your time, effort, energy anymore? Its totally totally up to you, but that sort of argument or tactic isn't effective as far as getting a game to change. Forums routinely see fed up, angry, discontent people making posts about something in the game that is really annoying them... and as far as expressions of feelings? I think totally valid, but often people try to leverage that, as if, doing so, is a good enough reason that DE should change something, to make them less annoyed. It never leads anyway (unless, its a numbers and percentages thing, like hundreds of people across multiple websites all agree in large numbers over some certain issue). 

Wanting change or improvement? Also legit, but again, you want to try and carefully identify the issues, generally in more literal, straight forward sincere terms. Like actually describe what a scammer is doing, and also considering whether existing safeguards were ineffective or effective. Like I see people in trade that seem dubious. I have never been scammed though. Like there is some player responsibility and agency that needs to be considered too. Again, though, I actually do think it should be regulated, because even though I have never been scammed, I do think since real money can be involved, some people can take it way too seriously, and some people can be unaware of that, and creates certain issues.... Arguably my issue there is more directed at basic educational systems in many countries as opposed to a games developer, but yeah. 

Forgive me for assuming, but did you have some bad experiences in trading with others? Again, I sympathise with the frustration. I wish the market was improved in several ways, with better options for players. Its a bit of a mess, just its also a working mess, that many players engage with, so there seemingly isn't much incentive for DE to try mess around with that too much. Its also not something I personally engage with a lot, because of my criticisms, because I can disengage with it quite easily, and it doesn't negatively affect my experience with the game. Not that I am saying others should follow suit, just that it helps to know yourself and what you want, and what will likely change, and what will likely not change, and then identifying how to deal with that. To put it another way, whilst I personally would like better regulation for the Market... imagine if DE resources had to be used on that instead of the next update, which would get delayed by 6 months? Or what if DE had to make the game a subscription service to help pay for additional resources? Just as hypotheticals. Well personally I would like those options even less, so... 

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

8 minutes ago, waiora said:

DE doesnt need to regulate anything. If you want to buy from trade chat dont complain about being scammed.

Warframe market exists, supply/demand self regulates prices.

ANYTHING is only worth what someone is willing to pay.

That’s similar to saying, everything is fine (as it burns newer players and annoys long-term enjoyers who aren’t ignorant). I buy from trade chat because it’s usually cheaper to buy weapon parts/sets from other players. Usually those are reasonable prices because they have a set price originally in DE’s market which you can go off of. It’s when it comes to rivens is when it has gotten out of hand. You know other players can over-inflate prices purposefully right? People can group up and start making people think something is worth more than it actually is? Players are the ones that regulate the system, not the system itself. Other video-games have done the free market much better. Yes, you’ll never get away from gold sellers, but they are blatantly easy to see. In Warframe’s free market it can be anyone. There is no where to check what the base price of a riven is that’s supported directly by DE. Heck it could even be myself by accident because someone put it in my head it was worth more. It’s not that difficult to manipulate someone if you know what you’re doing (I’m not saying that I have, I’ve just been bullied in real life which gives me experience). You can believe me or not with the experience.

[Mazifet]

52 minutes ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

Step 1. You Ignore it exists                    Step 2. You say you can do anything with their mechanics/game in whatever you please. I never said I had the right too. YOU put that in my mouth.                                             Step 3. You don’t have a thorough understanding of how online communities in video-games work.            Step 4. Usually the conversations start being nice, and then after that that’s when the harassment begins. I don’t shut people out right away because I believe it’s impolite and rude. Also, that’s just the way that I function mentally. Everyone is different in the way they handle conversations.                                                   Step 5. When you invest in product you should expect it to deliver the bare minimum at least. Especially when it involves real world currency. As soon as you invest in a video-game that expects you to play long-term it becomes more than just a video-game; it’s a product to be consumed by the public. Fossil fuels is an example that isn’t regulated, hence they become billionaires off of peoples backs and hard earned money except, instead it’s the community using the cracks in the system DE built to take advantage of, which in-turn fuels the boilers of deception/greed in the community; which makes them richer and people addicted to their game even more.                                                             Step 6. Why do I even bother writing this?

step 1. format badly

step 2. ???

step 3. profit

[Waeleto]

The entire riven system needs to change and i'm tired of pretending it's okay 

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

22 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

So I don't disagree with some of what you wrote. I actually quite strongly agree with certain points. 

Here is the issue though, you are conflating several issues, and then potentially taking some a bit more seriously than the people who make the game, may want you to, or that you necessarily need to be. Like terms like scammers and free-loaders can be quite subjective, because to some, what they consider is legit behaviour, isn't by others, and vice versa. You also can't use individual feelings, and experiences, like how much you have played, or spent, as an argument or leverage to demand a business... ignore one of its primary goals, and motivations... in making profit/sustaining itself... to accommodate your preferences.

If you feel that way, you should give me all your money, because I want it, and the other day I picked up some litter, and I need my self interests prioritised. Don't brush this off, just because you think the premise is silly. Now I know that what I just said, is snarky, but no offence is intended, I am just using that as an example. I am using this as an example, because like I said, I agree with some of your points, and because I agree, I think we need to make better arguments to give credit and weight to our arguments, points, perspectives etc. Except the main issue here, isn't so much DE making money, but other Warframe fans engaging with the system in a way, which gives DE incentive to support that system. People often like to frame issues, as "us, the real fans and supporters of the game" vs "the greedy business just wanting to make money", but the issue is more complicated because its the conflict between different types of players habits, behaviours and attitudes and preferences. 

Enough do engage in the system, that a massive change is unlikely. Like more regulations, would require more resources effort and time from DE in order to enforce or accomodate those regulations. Then who would decide the nature of such regulations. Which fans/players will be accommodated. Is it actually possible for 100% of players to be happy, content and satisfied if they were? Which ones to prioritise. 

At the moment, the best way someone with issues towards the Market/Rivens, that gets them angry, heated or that frustrated... is to just not engage with it. Its an optional system. Though if you feel like it isn't and its also ruining the game for you, then... maybe thats just it. Maybe the game doesn't deserve your time, effort, energy anymore? Its totally totally up to you, but that sort of argument or tactic isn't effective as far as getting a game to change. Forums routinely see fed up, angry, discontent people making posts about something in the game that is really annoying them... and as far as expressions of feelings? I think totally valid, but often people try to leverage that, as if, doing so, is a good enough reason that DE should change something, to make them less annoyed. It never leads anyway (unless, its a numbers and percentages thing, like hundreds of people across multiple websites all agree in large numbers over some certain issue). 

Wanting change or improvement? Also legit, but again, you want to try and carefully identify the issues, generally in more literal, straight forward sincere terms. Like actually describe what a scammer is doing, and also considering whether existing safeguards were ineffective or effective. Like I see people in trade that seem dubious. I have never been scammed though. Like there is some player responsibility and agency that needs to be considered too. Again, though, I actually do think it should be regulated, because even though I have never been scammed, I do think since real money can be involved, some people can take it way too seriously, and some people can be unaware of that, and creates certain issues.... Arguably my issue there is more directed at basic educational systems in many countries as opposed to a games developer, but yeah. 

Forgive me for assuming, but did you have some bad experiences in trading with others? Again, I sympathise with the frustration. I wish the market was improved in several ways, with better options for players. It’s a bit of a mess, just it’s also a working mess, that many players engage with, so there seemingly isn't much incentive for DE to try mess around with that too much. It’s also not something I personally engage with a lot, because of my criticisms, because I can disengage with it quite easily, and it doesn't negatively affect my experience with the game. Not that I am saying others should follow suit, just that it helps to know yourself and what you want, and what will likely change, and what will likely not change, and then identifying how to deal with that. To put it another way, whilst I personally would like better regulation for the Market... imagine if DE resources had to be used on that instead of the next update, which would get delayed by 6 months? Or what if DE had to make the game a subscription service to help pay for additional resources? Just as hypotheticals. Well personally I would like those options even less, so... 

Yes, thank you for at least validating it’s a problem. It just seems the only way to get large video-game companies to do the bare minimum is to yell up top the mountain and burst your lungs in doing so☹️😖😬 nowadays. They don’t listen unless it involves burning holes in their pockets long-term. To be honest, I wish they would just shut it down and just lower the prices in the DE marketplace/ make the rivens for each specific weapon purchasable with in-game materials or credits because I’m tired of the in-game roulette rivens and challenges. It needs another way of acquiring them. The only reason in my opinion why they don’t, is because it’s very profitable to not do so. It’s just a cycle in my eyes of, barter, harassment, manipulation, scam, then DE makes $$$ off of it in the process of bad behavior that they instigated. I would rather the game have a subscription based model. At least then, this debacle of riven selling madness would end. This rivens process being so tedious is just to make a profit in a way that just irks me… I’m totally fine with the other paid for features of the game. It’s just a downright BAD monetization/time waster that’s hidden underneath the chewy yummy parts. Once you reach it, it’s just mind blowing they don’t throw it in your face (like it’s on purpose…).

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

1 minute ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

Yes, thank you for at least validating it’s a problem. It just seems the only way to get large video-game companies to do the bare minimum is to yell up top the mountain and burst your lungs in doing so☹️😖😬 nowadays. They don’t listen unless it involves burning holes in their pockets long-term. To be honest, I wish they would just shut it down and just lower the prices in the DE marketplace/ make the rivens for each specific weapon purchasable with in-game materials or credits because I’m tired of the in-game roulette rivens and challenges. It needs another way of acquiring them. The only reason in my opinion why they don’t, is because it’s very profitable to not do so. It’s just a cycle in my eyes of, barter, harassment, manipulation, scam, then DE makes $$$ off of it in the process of bad behavior that they instigated. I would rather the game have a subscription based model. At least then, this debacle of riven selling madness would end. This rivens process being so tedious is just to make a profit in a way that just irks me… I’m totally fine with the other paid for features of the game. It’s just a downright BAD monetization/time waster that’s hidden underneath the chewy yummy parts. Once you reach it, it’s just mind blowing they don’t throw it in your face (like it’s on purpose…).

Dam it, it’s gambling on steroids😑😫🤬😱☹️. I hate gambling too. Just that one more pull…one more pull…

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

Well, I guess I’ve gotten what fun there was out of it, I just wish there was more, ya know…Game could be amazing (so close, yet so far). Content has been great. It’s just the old system of the rivens hasn’t been changed, what since, the release of the game? I’ve only played for a year so, what do I know?

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

It must be just like the railjack game mode they gave up on; left in the dust and forgotten.

[NeDesitVirtus]

2 hours ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

I’m Sick and Tired of the massive amount of scammers and free-loaders flowing around inside the community servers whether PS/XB/PC. DE, you NEED TO REGULATE THE MARKET PRICES, this is unacceptable, especially with RIVENS!!! The amount of times I’ve been bullied and harassed by people trying to scam in-game currency trades is INSANE!!

This is why warframe.market exists.

Using tradechat is like going to Darvo or in-game Market to buy a Stugg for 200 plat. Regarding demand for certain rivens, they are good on certain weapons, and they bring other weapons up to being usable in Steel Path. That being said there are ways to mitigate your plat cost. 

1. Buy unrolled and roll your own stats - you can get up to 320k Kuva per week just from Zariman, Iron Wake, and Teshin.
2. Look for cheap rivens, I rarely pay more than 20-30pl for an unveiled riven. Some can cost 300-400pl but avoid those 10k plat rivens, that's ridiculous in my opinion whether or not I have the plat to buy them. 
3. Don't use bought platinum from coupons for rivens, instead sell mods, primed sets, and other tradeables to bring up your plat balance. 

Also, before you buy a CC/CD/MS riven (or keep a certain roll) for some stupid about of plat, use tools like overframe.gg to prebuild so you can see what the damage output might be in various configurations. I've seen some of these Darvo Tenno try to sell a CC/CD/MS riven on a Sporothrix (1% CC innate), a Glaive Riven with CC/CD/Damage -Slash (slash being the major stat which carries the Glaive Prime), or some other combination that the negative turns the whole Riven into a useless or near useless Purple Card.

The point is, do your diligence and research - if you don't someone will take advantage of your naivete. Sadly, this is how the world works, though many of us don't condone it.  I try to be fair and help other Tenno especially new players (who we should want to encourage to play the game - being understanding and generous within our means and ability) and try to make the experience a friendly transaction. I would suggest you ignore belligerent or demanding players, you deserve to be respected.   

[KIREEK]

If you can't afford a riven that you want to buy, then you can't buy it. Players are free to set the values they see fit (this includes you), if one user is unhappy with the price or budget the trade will not happen.

A quick reminder that scams, (the act of deceiving another user with the trade details or by missusing the systems in the game) aren't allowed to be done, if you believe a scam is trully being done, submit a ticket.
The case you mentioned no rule violations are being done, players are trading as intended, the trading system has been implemented more than half a decade ago and as such, the trades being done today are no different than the ones done back then.

Edited February 15 by KIREEK
formating

[(PSN)Jurassic_Might]

24 minutes ago, Mazifet said:

step 1. format badly

step 2. ???

step 3. profit

Yes, it’s formatted badly, I’m writing this in the very early morning because this problem irked me so hard that it kept me awake. Yes, it’s all over the place (give me a break man, I’m writing full paragraphs while extremely tired) Yes, exactly, profit beyond belief, on the backs of many a player, and some don’t even know it. It’s like some bad game show gone wrong, betting on people’s morals/interactions to see what would happen while we gasp for air lol. While they greedily munch on $$$ in a bowl of cereal. Yummy…😖

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

29 minutes ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

Yes, thank you for at least validating it’s a problem. It just seems the only way to get large video-game companies to do the bare minimum is to yell up top the mountain and burst your lungs in doing so☹️😖😬 nowadays. They don’t listen unless it involves burning holes in their pockets long-term. To be honest, I wish they would just shut it down and just lower the prices in the DE marketplace/ make the rivens for each specific weapon purchasable with in-game materials or credits because I’m tired of the in-game roulette rivens and challenges. It needs another way of acquiring them. The only reason in my opinion why they don’t, is because it’s very profitable to not do so. It’s just a cycle in my eyes of, barter, harassment, manipulation, scam, then DE makes $$$ off of it in the process of bad behavior that they instigated. I would rather the game have a subscription based model. At least then, this debacle of riven selling madness would end. This rivens process being so tedious is just to make a profit in a way that just irks me… I’m totally fine with the other paid for features of the game. It’s just a downright BAD monetization/time waster that’s hidden underneath the chewy yummy parts. Once you reach it, it’s just mind blowing they don’t throw it in your face (like it’s on purpose…).

 

No worries. Like I said, I sympathise with your concerns overall, and we likely agree on more stuff than disagree (and the latter may just be semantics). 

I don't necessarily blame DE too much for how they operate in this sense, because many of the issues that exist, are the same issues that exist in far larger, and more vital economic systems. That still exist and haven't really been addressed or solved (to what extents depending on the country). Different peoples circumstances are different, as are their preferences, lifestyles, perspectives. You might have one player who makes a very comfortable living, and they play Warframe for a few hours every few months, but they also buy each Prime Access, and have a surplus of Platinum they don't really use. Then you might have one player who is FTP, who spends multiple hours a day grinding as if Warframe is there second job, and then they get enough Rivens and Kuva, to sell a "perfect Riven" to the first guy for 1000 Platinum. For those two players, they might find that fair. Is there anything wrong here? Well... again, depends who you are, I would personally be a bit critical, but not necessarily at the two individuals, but a lot of systems that frame the entire exchange, including questioning whether its healthy that someone treat Warframe, like its a job... Some of these criticisms and forces are beyond the game though, and tap into economic systems and different players lives. 

Then for every player who might be like you or I, there are possibly many many more who are just fine with the system, and engage in it. It might mot necessarily be enough, if the same amount of players object... Consider really expensive designer handbags right? You'd probably have many many people overall who think a small handbag being sold for 3 thousand dollars is silly... but as long as that designer store has a small minority who is willing to pay that much... That might be more valuable to them, than selling cheaper handbags and appealing to a larger amount of people. Though likely, they'd probably have a parent company who has their toes dipping in both markets. Thats also a DE thing too. Since the game is a FTP model, they try to monetise many many things, under the idea, at least one of those systems will motivate a player to spend real currency. Like if they don't get you with the Forma, its the fashion and cool skins, Deluxe, Tennogen... if not that, then its speeding up the foundry for new stuff... or its getting Plat to trade to get Vaulted Prime Warframe... or hey you want to be MR30? Well grind... or buy some weapons to make it easier... that Protea farm hard? Why not buy her... hey you like Rivens? Maybe you need some extra Plat to trade a bit... what about Drifter cosmetics? What about Ship Decorations, what about... so much. For some people, they really hate how DE does Forma. Its one of the threads that gets created the most often, about being a 23 hour timer... and all the reasons that should change, and many of them are valid... just it won't likely happen, because Forma is one of the most reliable and consistent Plat purchases people make, and therefor is super valuable for DE as far as a somewhat consistent and routine cashflow for them. That sort of consistency is probably quite valuable to them, and so might not be wise to mess around with.  

Then like I mentioned, its not necessarily just the business being greedy, but many many and players/consumers also wanting that and engaging with it and endorsing it and so on. For some, they see a flawed system, that only has a net negative, and creates the conditions for most people to end up with negative experiences, and then you have some people that see a situation where they gain, and as long as they gain, its fine, and the others should just do better to gain, like them. So for me, DE is generally better than most game developers, generally... I also do not engage in much trading, I usually sell low, and buy high, just because I am fortunate enough to be in a position to do so (I generally like helping out newer or struggling players, and I avoid situations that seem like people trying to take Warframe trading as serious as real life trading/job stuffs). 

Either way is a very potentially frustrating aspect of the game. 

 

[Zakkhar]

Seems like Kengineer is mind reading the OP:

 

[Aldain]

Honestly I'd rather they just make a separate trade chat exclusively for Riven mods and make them not able to be linked in the standard Trade Chat.

That way I could disable the Riven chat tab and go on with my life.

[waiora]

3 hours ago, (PSN)Jurassic_Might said:

Players are the ones that regulate the system, not the system itself.

What is your point? I literally said something is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. If a player cant think for himself and wants to pay 500p for something that is junk. Who cares. He will learn eventually to check prices and do his research before buying. Players like that swipe to win, they keep the game free to play for the rest of us.

Edited February 15 by waiora

[Voltage]

2 hours ago, Aldain said:

Honestly I'd rather they just make a separate trade chat exclusively for Riven mods and make them not able to be linked in the standard Trade Chat.

That way I could disable the Riven chat tab and go on with my life.

Why don't you just create filters to remove all Riven Mods?

[Aldain]

1 hour ago, Voltage said:

Why don't you just create filters to remove all Riven Mods?

For one, that's a comical amount of filters and a huge pain in the arse.

For two...it literally gets in the way of any and all postings with the sheer volume of spam.

If Riven mod trading is so important, why shouldn't it get its own section of chat? Wouldn't it facilitate better trading for them by them not getting pushed out of the way by people wanting to buy Prime parts or Non-Riven mods?

Basically I'm just looking for a separation of a Farmer's Market from a Stock Exchange more or less.

Edited February 15 by Aldain