Specters of the Rail: U2.1 - Nekros Changes

[RealPandemonium]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)salovel1991 said:

I have a build for this. I've experimented with at least 10 builds. Efficiency was alright but I had to cast SotD way more and got annoyed with it. Even though I had a p continuity on. I tried no Despoil /Zenurik but max efficiency and ran out of energy in two minutes because I couldn't maintain myself. 

Try running a medium-rank NM and Stretch (and/or Constitution) alongside that Primed Continuity.  Energy Siphon and Desecrate should be sufficient to sustain you.

Edited August 31, 2016 by RealPandemonium

[(PSN)salovel1991]

Just now, RealPandemonium said:

Try running a medium-rank NM and Stretch alongside that Primed Continuity.  Energy Siphon and Desecrate should be sufficient to sustain you.

You speak blasphemy. That would murder my ocd. 

[BulletsforTeeth]

14 minutes ago, RealPandemonium said:

Try running a medium-rank NM and Stretch (and/or Constitution) alongside that Primed Continuity.  Energy Siphon and Desecrate should be sufficient to sustain you.

Aaaaand back to the derelict I go.

[(PSN)AllOrNothinDays]

I personally wish their health wasn't a factor, just leaving it up to a timer took a lot of busywork out of it and if you're using it in combination with shield of shadows there's just too much you have to keep watch of to make it any fun to play with, at least that's how it goes for me. 

[RealPandemonium]

5 minutes ago, zehne said:

I'm saying that it has it's own niche, and it fullfills that niche very effectively.  Other warframes and their abilities don't even come close to what SoTD can do when maxxed out.

Buff SoTD sure, but don't revert it.  Being able to teleport/heal/prioritize heavy units >>> than more shadows that are disposed of when the clock strikes 12.

That's an overstatement.  Objectives can decay rapidly even with shadows around, and those odds go up with only 7 [weak] shadows in the mix.  

Half the time I don't even want the "heavy" units that new SotD chooses for me, and with the old SotD I would be getting them anyway, plus 13 other units.  Teleportation can be useful, but that's it.  With enough power strength, shadows could mostly pay for themselves in terms of kills for the next cast.  

Shadows' damage output has been gutted, aggro coverage reduced, health decay nerfed their durability, and we have even less control over what shadows we get.  Pretty much all nerf; very little buff to be seen here. 

 

[(PSN)Lord_Gremlin]

52 minutes ago, (PS4)AllOrNothinDays said:

I personally wish their health wasn't a factor, just leaving it up to a timer took a lot of busywork out of it and if you're using it in combination with shield of shadows there's just too much you have to keep watch of to make it any fun to play with, at least that's how it goes for me. 

So if they have health decay aka duration they need to be immune to damage. 

Honestly I don't consider any changes positive. Desecrate as a toggle removed ability to choose when you need to intensify it. You know, when you finally found that rare enemy and cut into 4 pieces. Shadows having priority removes my ability to summon certain useful utility weak units. 

Today I've done final test. Shadows are now useless, loot from desecrate is nothing. There's one niche left. I've tried solo survival with fully decked out desecrate focused build.

I had to activate capsules. That does it. Nekros goes on a shelf and hydroid replaces him in my farming loadouts. 

[(PSN)Lei-Lei_23]

7 hours ago, (PS4)Asdeft said:

I see everyone using Equilibrium, is it really any good? Zenurik covers most energy problems for me and getting health from energy is inconsequential. There has to be something I am missing there, since I use Streamline over it and I am wondering if it is better. 

Personally I've been playing around with Arcane Pulse and Energize sets, and they pretty much free up the mod slot for Equilibrium for something else. Imho, if you can't fit a Primed Flow in your build, Equilibrium is a great mod to use with a Despoil Nekros.

Edited September 1, 2016 by (PS4)Lei-Lei_23

[Xebov]

The fact that Nekros cant get bodies for his army from Eximus Units becomes a real issue in Eximus Stronghold missions. Besides some units at the beginning there are nearly no normal units spawning, which renders the skill unusable and there is nothing players can do about it.

 

To fix this problem i would suggest to either have a minimum % value of units in Eximus Stronghold missions be normal units, or give Nekros a normal version body of the Eximus unit he kills.

[GinKenshin]

why can't we spawn eximus in the first place? how OP can that be? 

[.Fire_Fly.]

yeah i hated that , it really messes with a player

i ran nekros thinking it would be a great idea, the plan flopped just because i couldnt use SOTD

[R34LM]

It can be fixed by not bringing a Nekros, but that is a very close minded solution for those who actually enjoy playing as him.

Otherwise yeah, we should be able to spawn eximus units. It won't be overpowered at all, especially since some things don't even work on use, like energy leech

[o.0-]

I was hoping that was addressed when Nekros got his pass recently.

I had a thread mentioning that back towards the end of May exploring some QoL tweaks and a synergy between Soul Punch and SotD.

Hopefully the devs could sneak in a tweak for the Eximus issue in the future.

[-TSA-voodoo]

Aaah this was the reason. Thought my Skills bugged out and restarted the Mission twice :P

 

DE please let us SotD Eximus units please.

 

btw. I love the Necros Rework. So many possibilitys. Keep this level of quality/diversity up.

[IRVoidGuru]

Id like to start by saying i love everything about the new shadows update other then my build's loss of 11 shadows ( 18-7) but all in all Great Rework DE!

And with this change and the prime access video my friend came up with an idea too nice to not post. So lets start with shadows are now limited to 7 and choosing your shadows is no longer possible with the new rework ( witch i kinda didn't mind ). But as a thought what if Soul Punch saved a permanent copy of an enemy type by casting it on that enemy saving it for your next Shadows of the Dead. And have that copy scale to the mission's lvl when casting them through shadows of the dead, allowing you to choose the army of 7 you want !

After much thought into this we came up with ideas and limiters and id like any ideas or feedback on all of this if you can !

 

Casting Soul Punch on an enemy saves a Soul imprint of that enemy, example: using soul punch on a Heavy Gunner will save that enemy for your Next cast 

Only a total of 7 Soul imprints can be saved, with no more then 2 of any enemy type ( cant have 3 heavy gunners or 7 ancient healers ect.)

Add a Minor Shield damage and HP increase to shadows created from Soul imprints, we figured that the energy used from soul punch should be re payed by a stat bonus. during the debate another comment  made was that the imprint itself would be the payback your getting for that energy used.

It was debated about weather the shadow imprints would be used on casting shadows of the Dead or if they would remain as permanent imprints for Each Cast. and if the imprints would remain there would obviously be some farther additions witch include imprint scaling to match the lvl of the mission ( for endless missions mainly ) 

Making a new imprint beyond the 7th will destroy your least recently made shadow imprint. allowing for army customization

Dying in mission will cause the loss of ALL Shadow imprints

It was debated weather nullifyers would take away shadow imprints saved or not. and if not, why?. the Reason stated for losing them was that the Souls would be saved on Nekros himself, holding that soul is a void power that would be diminished on contact to a nullifyer

Creating imprints of Eximus Enemies will create a non-eximus version imprint for Shadows of the Dead, allowing nekros to be useful again in Eximus stronghold missions.

Players should be able to Cast (and hold) soul punch on a shadow they own to Remove that shadow from life or replace it with a heavy Unit or a shadow Imprint.

Casting Shadows Using Imprints does NOT require the original Target to be Dead, only imprinted.

If any one from DE actually reads this we would also like you to consider allowing ONE eximus Unit per Shadows of the dead aloud in the army 

Id like to make it Clear that these are in addition to the current change not instead of, meaning if you save 0 imprints you still get a full 7 shadows. imprinted shadows summon first then the remaining summon as randomized enemy types as normally intended. example: i have 2 heavy gunners saved as imprints and that's all, the remaining 5 out of 7 shadows will randomize into any enemy killed in mission)

any feedback on this would be awesome and ty for your time in reading this and posting to it. have a good day !

Edited September 3, 2016 by (PS4)IrSchm33

[o.0-]

Yeah, I had similar ideas for a synergy between Soul Punch and SotD.

I'd like to see this for Nekros, plus at least having Eximus give normal copies too, if not Eximus Shadows.

[aerosoul1337]

The shadows Nekros Prime raises will appear more grotesque, like a rotting corpse, as opposed to the normal ethereal like shadows.

But the ethereal version is easier to identify when there are a lot of enemies. Because their entire body are colored with your energy based color.

Prime versions' shadows only have some blink effects outside of the body, quite confusing if Shield of the shadow augment is not equipped.

Is it possible to make it more highlighted with your energy color, like the ethereal version?

[-Kalysto-]

Wow, I must be the only person who literally doesn't see a difference between Nekros and Nekros Prime's shadows.

Edited September 1, 2016 by BarryPierce

[Raniu]

54 minutes ago, aerosoul1337 said:

Prime versions' shadows only have some blink effects outside of the body, quite confusing if Shield of the shadow augment is not equipped.

Good point. Let's merge the augment into the SotD.

[Cash4Cookies]

tbh, i would rather not see those shadows at all.

 

i dread the moment i see a nekros appear in my squad now.

 

not only do the obscure my view, making it hard to place my shots (especially in narrow hallways) but also they distract enemies from going where i want them to go (not always an issue, but it can be troublesome on maps like akkad)

 

 

[(PSN)salovel1991]

58 minutes ago, Cash4Cookies said:

tbh, i would rather not see those shadows at all.

 

i dread the moment i see a nekros appear in my squad now.

 

not only do the obscure my view, making it hard to place my shots (especially in narrow hallways) but also they distract enemies from going where i want them to go (not always an issue, but it can be troublesome on maps like akkad)

 

 

You'll see less of him when the prime hype dies down. Especially if they don't hot fix or take any issues into they created into consideration. 

[Cash4Cookies]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)salovel1991 said:

You'll see less of him when the prime hype dies down. Especially if they don't hot fix or take any issues into they created into consideration. 

not like its just an issue with nekros. all minions are horrible in this game.

 

i recently ran akkad and had a nekros and an atlas in there, both with their minions out.

and i was lvling ash. even got me a fatal teleport cuz i didnt wanna bladestorm....well obviously 90% of my teleports ended up on minions or teammates instead of enemies.

[Soju.]

16 hours ago, NightmareT12 said:

Then what in the name of the Void am I doing? I'm asking DE to cut down the decay by 1%, which should be more than enough already. Or add a build up. Or 10 seconds without decay. I don't know, all I see here is "This is nerfed" "bring back duration" "remove health decay".

Where are the alternatives? All I'm seeing is people pulling their hairs off, calling other people stuff, calling the staff stuff, etc.

Frost's Snowglobe is a stationary bubble, which you actually want to have Strength, Armor and Range. It's got a fix health value, doesn't scale off enemy damage, nor it deals damage scaling off your enemy. Also, you recast the Snowglobe to heal it.

I know they didn't touch the multipliers. I was bummed about it. I'm bummed about it. But I can only guess it would have been ridicolous to make it too much. I already stated on the megathread that if DE actually decreased the Health drain by one single percentage, we would have shadows that should actually last the same or more than before. I even added a second point "If we still see the Shadows don't make it, we can amplify the multipliers a tad further".

That build is terrible, and is a symptom that something's wrong. I don't use it. Hell, I don't even usually use augments at all. Equilibrium just synergizes too well with someone who spawns free extra orbs and is using constantly energy and has such low armor. Even if we had not that much recasting going on, I'd still run it.

And I know that. The mistake here is the lack of communication regarding the change. Because first Scott and Rebecca say there's no duration, and then something must happen, and in the end we're given the Health Decay without any kind of inbetween communication explaining why it's here. This reminds me horribly of what happened when The Dark Sectors got to the release week... Or rather, it didn't.

Perhaps, but they still do considerable damage that scales, remind you. This is touchy because it's the biggest collateral damage off removing shadows, less canons appointing at the same enemy.

This health decay and reduced Shadows is their 'alternative', and it sucks &#!. And no one is calling anyone 'stuff'. As long as Shadows still have health decay, it still would mean a shorter duration because as I said, losing health while taking damage from another 10+ mobs is just a dying wish for each and every Shadow.

 

I don't know why you would bring Snowglobe here, but you could actually increase its armor and hitpoints by stacking them, thus increases its durability, Nekros doesn't have that kind of flexibility.

Nekros already has little before and already needed a rework or buff, but he had more than this, now we just have less of everything.

Edited September 1, 2016 by AlphaWolf003

[Kai]

I can usually hold up to 10-11 Shadows in certain situations... namely against Infested enemies. Those carrier-duo that has a mutalist osprey and a crawler counts as 2 if you manage to kill both of them at once.

[Soju.]

Just now, Harowing said:

I can usually hold up to 10-11 Shadows in certain situations... namely against Infested enemies. Those carrier-duo that has a mutalist osprey and a crawler counts as 2 if you manage to kill both of them at once.

........................................................................................................................................

I hope you're joking if that excuses this nerf lol.

[Kai]

Just now, AlphaWolf003 said:

........................................................................................................................................

I hope you're joking if that excuses this nerf lol.

Indeed it was a joke. But look at it this way, Quality over Quantity. I'm enjoying Nekros right now, he can solo very well.