Nyx Assimilate fix is a massive nerf

[Pogonop]

I do find it a nerf, there is no incentive in charging up absorb besides leaving the Nyx dry. Nyx's absorb barely deals damage, If only it took the damage and multiplied it when it is exploded then that would be worth while. Why take damage to just output a fraction of it? It's suppose to be a nuke but all it is is just exploding soap bubbles on the enemies eyes forcing them to be knocked out. 

I found assimilate useful, defending teammates and using it as a way to protect yourself when things get hairy. She was penalized enough when she had the augment on. You could barely move and you still have a drain including that from receiving damage from enemies which gets harder to keep as the enemies themselves scale up to stronger ones.. She was not a God that was ubiquitous, she was a slow moving tank. 

Edited March 14, 2017 by MysticBat
Add on top of reason.

[Roxxarus]

3 hours ago, (PS4)SageHeed said:

I haven't used the fixed Assimilate yet, but I'm all for the fix. Invulnerability isn't any kind of fun, there has to be some trade-off.

Maybe there should be some damage/energy gating, but I don't know.

Honestly, I suspect this whole issue highlights the "Miragulor problem" more than any problems with Assimilate.

The issues highlights any strong weapon in close proximity of a Nyx. I've had problems with the classic Simulor, Tonkor, and Ignis, but I've seen countless times where people have been affected by fallen allies using secondaries, misfires with weapons such as the Tigris or Hek, and even bullet-hose weapons like the Supra or Soma do some serious damage to energy pools.

It would be completely irrational for DE to nerf every single strong/AoE/secondary weapon just to accommodate for Assimilate taking friendly fire. Rather, just fix Assimilate taking friendly fire.

[Treebiter]

It's powers as much as weapons. Had real issues running with a Valkyr yesterday, and as soon as I'm matched with a Nova I know things aren't going to go my way.

As days go by it's becoming apparant that reviving is now the most perilous thing an Assimilate Nyx can do. More often than not I'll end up on the floor next to my team mate after their covering fire has stripped away my protection.

I'm hoping we get a response from DE soon, as we've head nothing from them since Rebecca's initial response.

 

[Cat__Nap]

I wasn't even someone who mainly played Nyx (I prefer Banshee/Chroma/Saryn for most things), but I used her in certain high level missions and had fun doing it. Trying to make us use her Absorb for damage when it's probably the worst damage AoE in the game (maybe Zephyr's Tornado is worse...but at least that's a lengthy CC with a low cast time - and anyone who plays this game knows how pitiful birdframe's ulti is, so that's saying something) is beyond ridiculous. If they didn't want us having an invuln with downsides, they shouldn't have given us an invuln in the first place. Literally killed this frame for me, and probably many other people.

At least Valkyr is still usable for Hysteria even after she was gutted - it's just not possible to keep up 24/7. Which is fine, I find the compromise fair. But there is no compromise in this. You took a balanced invulnerability and made it unusable. It lasts seconds at most in a lot of parties. That makes the augment worthless, considering the ability isn't useful at all now. With increased energy drain, at least we could use it in bursts like Valk's Hysteria. Use it for a couple waves of defense before resetting the energy drain, use it to reliably res someone in a high level sortie when 3 bombards are eyeing your downed partymates, use it to help get people out of Sapping Osprey mines. Except no, you didn't let us do that. You neutered the ability, made it 100% unreliable, and now any time an Assimilate Nyx tries to res a teammate in a sortie, they're going to be sitting there wondering "is my bubble going to explode before I get them up?" while watching their teammates drain energy as they try to help by shooting mobs.

Seriously, one of the most thoughtless changes I've seen made to a frame since I started playing several years ago. The Valkyr change almost went too far, but she's still usable. This went so far past where it should have, I doubt I'll be touching my Nyx any time soon. If I want survivability to help save teammates in sorties now, the frame you guys already nerfed is miles ahead of Nyx now with her Hysteria. Loki's better for CC (and has been, if we're being honest - Assimilate was just really fun so a lot of people used her instead), and any tankframe will work better for what people used Assimilate for. She's officially dead as-is.

[OmniXVII]

I'm going to continue posting my gripes in this thread until the change is reworked or reverted.

1. Any mechanic that allows players to troll one another should never be in the game at all.

2. The new change gives Nyx players incentive to NOT revive their fallen allies. Using assimilate while saving an ally while downed will absorb all the fire they are shooting with their secondary and drain Nyx's energy.

3. After testing out the change in regular missions, my energy passively reduces by a significant margin to AOE weapons and misfires by allies. I have been trolled once already since this change.

Friendly fire example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ac4NkqVyC4Q

Change discussion and my worries for Nyx:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGVMm36dEFo

 

[Cyberhazard]

Done few missions earlier, I wanted to continue the tries on my Nyx, it was my mistakes, out of 12 missions, 3 of them were ruined by actives trolls, trying their best to pop out my orb as soon as I used my 4.  few of them were messy because of the miss fires/people not knowing it used my energy, and the rest was completly ruined by AoE weapons such as Telos Boltace, Simulors, Ignis.

I reduced my range to 40% to make the bubble as small as possible to avoid the miss fires. under 70% range, it doesn't shrink, it's capped.  Colored it in the darkest black color to make it less visible to allies that would want to troll,  it doesn't helped.  and the size was not helpfull with AoE weapons neither.

 

Even my clan mate said "Well, tell me when you'll play Nyx, I'll take out all my favorites weapons and Nova so you can play" but well, it won't help with the common issue.

 

Oh, and yeah, Reviving people is forbidden as Nyx in high level missions now.

[Roxxarus]

3 hours ago, OmniXVII said:

*snip of stuff and videos*

I still can't get over the fact that it took a matter of 7 seconds and 1 Tonkor to drain HALF of the energy pool, and a Tigris Prime (which is a very reasonable, common choice for players to bring to ANY mission) drained ALL of it and almost crashed your game. My computer is not strong or particularly good at all, what the hell are lower-end PCs (or perhaps consoles, if they see the change themselves) gonna go through?

I was recently playing with a public lobby where someone who was too scared to bring Nyx in the Sortie today. All 3 of us guaranteed him that we would honestly try our best to avoid him and not shoot him in Assimilate mode, but he ended up bringing a Nidus instead because he didn't want to risk it anyway. Does that sit well with anyone reading this? Like, come on.

[KosmicKnight]

5 minutes ago, Roxxarus said:

I still can't get over the fact that it took a matter of 7 seconds and 1 Tonkor to drain HALF of the energy pool, and a Tigris Prime (which is a very reasonable, common choice for players to bring to ANY mission) drained ALL of it and almost crashed your game. My computer is not strong or particularly good at all, what the hell are lower-end PCs (or perhaps consoles, if they see the change themselves) gonna go through?

I was recently playing with a public lobby where someone who was too scared to bring Nyx in the Sortie today. All 3 of us guaranteed him that we would honestly try our best to avoid him and not shoot him in Assimilate mode, but he ended up bringing a Nidus instead because he didn't want to risk it anyway. Does that sit well with anyone reading this? Like, come on.

Does not sit well at all. More like jumping up and down unhappily. Unable to sit still. Do not get me wrong, like this game a great deal, otherwise I would not be so passionate about this particular issue affecting me and so many others.

[Vivian]

On 3/10/2017 at 9:45 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Luckily I hadn't finished the Sortie yet and there is a Defense mission up - this sets the field for one of my favourite Nyx Assimilate strategies. Hopping in a Defense Shotgun-Only Sortie with my 'Terminator Nyx' to protect the Ally after this change was the perfect testing ground for me - especially in Public matchmaking where you're never sure what others will bring to the table.

I'm conflicted about what I found - I expected to see the sky falling, especially with a full Public team with Shotguns! With my Assimilate build, I was still able to maintain Godmode Assimilate for each wave, stopping in between to hustle for drops and stock up on energy. I only removed my '4' in combat once to run to a fallen Squad mate to quickly reactivate it.

When the final Wave hit things got a little hairy - as they should - and I had to adapt with quick movements and Energy restock, only losing my Absorb once.

Is more testing necessary? Absolutely - that goes for everyone in this thread who has claimed we've ruined something that they themselves have not tried out.

It has been a while since Nyx has gone under any serious discussion so we'll see how far we can open this door based on the constructive feedback that takes place.

An excuse to play even more Nyx though? Sign me up.


 

Do you test stuff as you or under cover? Also, sortie defenses are protecting 1 moving target. You can easily fit that guy in and walk with him in your bubble. IMO better tests would be sortie survivals or even assassinate where you can kite NPC around with Guardian Derision. 

I spent around 500p just to make a tanky Nyx. This update hit 3 days later and I can only use her efficiently when I'm solo or doing it duo. It's a bit annoying as duo too but you only duo stuff with special people. So it's fine. 

I only used Nyx for Guardian derision + Berserker + tempo Royale on a Galatine prime. Yeah.... Try it... 

VERDICT : Irrespective of it being a nerf. Nyx isn't as well designed as Nidus. She's a bit limited when it comes to having fun, being more of a utilitarian frame. Now with the update it's more of an MR fodder than a friendly frame if Multi player is your thing. She's quite good with solos. I just spent too much on MR fodder. 

[Landpaddle]

Although I've already commented on this issue earlier in the thread, I read a comment on one of the WF reddit threads regarding the issue from user tgdm that got me thinking:

Quote

It's a relic of an older system. Nyx used to benefit from EV and Team Energy Restores while using Absorb, so DE wanted to prohibit AFK usage of the ability. Between not being able to benefit from EV/Team Restores and the AFK timer, it's probably about time they remove the increased energy drain.

However, just going AFK for extended periods of time is no longer feasible with this kind of ability between energy leech eximuses, damage absorbed from enemies draining your reserves pretty quickly even with maxed efficiency, and now far more severe incoming ally damage that drains even more than hostile fire.

For instance, I was recently hit with a charged Antimatter Drop from a Nova that took 200 (!) energy away instantly, which didn't even put a dent in the level ~36 Napalm directly next to the person I was in Assimilate to revive. If 200 energy for an ability isn't enough to noticeably damage a single mid-30s enemy on a team with two+ Corrosive Projections, then maybe the damage side of that ability is not worth considering--only the knockdown is scalingly useful, which thankfully doesn't need to be charged by ally fire.

Edited March 15, 2017 by Landpaddle

[(PSN)yumiko1630]

Who da hell thought about this beeing a good idea?  I really liked nyx but i nearly never use her, because it is so frustrating to use her, and now you completly ruined her Best ability Assimilate, why? That is much worse than the Valkyr nerf and trust me i really cried vor valkitty (mostly for the 1.15 x Sprint speed multiplier) I mean nyx always was a weaker frame, and you nerf her? But Rhino, wukong, etc can continiue to be op as hell? Not that i would like them to be nerfed, shure it would be satisfying to hear all the crying, but it wouldnt be nice.

Anyways i suggest 2 things: just unfix nyx and pretend it never happend,  or remove the increased energy drain  from damage, this would be the strong, Overall buff, That nyx needs, and After that you can rework ash, Valkyr, trinity and and and aigan. 

[(PSN)Onyxflamegod]

Is there any word or even acknowledgement of this yet? I'm seriously hoping they revert this before consoles update gets sent for cert like the vacuum change was.

[Treebiter]

59 minutes ago, (PS4)Onyxflamegod said:

Is there any word or even acknowledgement of this yet? I'm seriously hoping they revert this before consoles update gets sent for cert like the vacuum change was.

Not yet. I'm surprised it's been so long tbh, especially after Rebecca's comment last Friday.

If another patch drops without a revert or at the very least a DE response, it'll appear like they're avoiding engagement with the community. Hopefully it won't come to that...

[Fluffysbeans]

31 minutes ago, Treebiter said:

Not yet. I'm surprised it's been so long tbh, especially after Rebecca's comment last Friday.

If another patch drops without a revert or at the very least a DE response, it'll appear like they're avoiding engagement with the community. Hopefully it won't come to that...

The DE team was at PAX last week, so that's at least a reason for the inaction.

But yeah, if it's not addressed in the next patch, I'm pretty scared. I'm still suffering from flashbacks to Saryn's flippy-skirt.

 

[(PSN)Lei-Lei_23]

58 minutes ago, Treebiter said:

Not yet. I'm surprised it's been so long tbh, especially after Rebecca's comment last Friday.

If another patch drops without a revert or at the very least a DE response, it'll appear like they're avoiding engagement with the community. Hopefully it won't come to that...

It's patchfix Wednesday on PC Warframe, correct? There should be word today, if not we'll be sure to keep an eye on their comments until midnight EST tonight. 

Otherwise... I fear there will be riots after today.

[PsiWarp]

No Update this week because of Octavia's Anthem soon. Hotfixes only on emergency basis, so either this isn't a game-breaking emergency or something is on the way.

[nanicow]

i know that DE wont change or even balance it.

so i think i'll just accept this nerf and throw the assimilate augment away

 

now, if they REALLY want to fix nyx bugs, i suggest starting from de dumb and buggy AI of Mind Controled targets.....

then i would actually use Mind Freak

[Roxxarus]

2 hours ago, nanicow said:

i know that DE wont change or even balance it.

so i think i'll just accept this nerf and throw the assimilate augment away

No, do NOT just accept it without proper acknowledgement from DE. We need vital communication between them and us, and simply saying "ok do whatever u wanna do DE" will be the ruin of this game and community. It may sound like we're complaining (which we kinda are), but it's vital for them as they need feedback to further improve not only our experience, but THEIR experience and game as well. Negligence is not a proper solution—it never is. Think of all the things that were just thrown away, and how much we want to fix them. Do you really just want to add Assimilate to that pile? I genuinely want to enjoy Archwing, Focus schools, clan cooperation and research requirements, and even basic missions like the gamemode and farming for Nidus; however, that is not and will not be possible if we just leave it as they were initially released.

Assimilate and possibly other Warframe abilities/augments is just one more example of something we WANT to enjoy, but can't due to some of the things DE does. I'm not going to say if they're bad or good, irrational or rational, and/or negligible or notable. Those are subjective values that we place unto what DE does; however, it's undeniable that DE did, has done, and will do many things that the community may or may not find generally unfavorable. It's up to us to give them suggestions, feedback, and criticisms for the game that we all want to see come to fruition and success.

(Note: In no way do I have an intention to rag on, hate, or undermine DE and what they've done. I just want to play and enjoy the game and all that it has to offer, with Warframe augments such as Nyx's Assimilate being one of them. If something happens to something I like, I think it'd be logical to speak out against or for it, depending on the action)

[(PSN)LastDoomKnight]

#makenyxgreatagain

[OmniXVII]

Gonna keep posting in this thread until it is reverted. 

23 minutes ago, (PS4)LastDoomKnight said:

#makenyxgreatagain

 

[DatDarkOne]

59 minutes ago, Roxxarus said:

No, do NOT just accept it without proper acknowledgement from DE. We need vital communication between them and us, and simply saying "ok do whatever u wanna do DE" will be the ruin of this game and community. It may sound like we're complaining (which we kinda are), but it's vital for them as they need feedback to further improve not only our experience, but THEIR experience and game as well. Negligence is not a proper solution—it never is. Think of all the things that were just thrown away, and how much we want to fix them. Do you really just want to add Assimilate to that pile? I genuinely want to enjoy Archwing, Focus schools, clan cooperation and research requirements, and even basic missions like the gamemode and farming for Nidus; however, that is not and will not be possible if we just leave it as they were initially released.

Assimilate and possibly other Warframe abilities/augments is just one more example of something we WANT to enjoy, but can't due to some of the things DE does. I'm not going to say if they're bad or good, irrational or rational, and/or negligible or notable. Those are subjective values that we place unto what DE does; however, it's undeniable that DE did, has done, and will do many things that the community may or may not find generally unfavorable. It's up to us to give them suggestions, feedback, and criticisms for the game that we all want to see come to fruition and success.

(Note: In no way do I have an intention to rag on, hate, or undermine DE and what they've done. I just want to play and enjoy the game and all that it has to offer, with Warframe augments such as Nyx's Assimilate being one of them. If something happens to something I like, I think it'd be logical to speak out against or for it, depending on the action)

I love this post.  I wish I could up vote you more than once. 

[(PSN)Lei-Lei_23]

Me too, great post @Roxxarus.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

3 hours ago, Roxxarus said:

No, do NOT just accept it without proper acknowledgement from DE. We need vital communication between them and us, and simply saying "ok do whatever u wanna do DE" will be the ruin of this game and community. It may sound like we're complaining (which we kinda are), but it's vital for them as they need feedback to further improve not only our experience, but THEIR experience and game as well. Negligence is not a proper solution—it never is. Think of all the things that were just thrown away, and how much we want to fix them. Do you really just want to add Assimilate to that pile? I genuinely want to enjoy Archwing, Focus schools, clan cooperation and research requirements, and even basic missions like the gamemode and farming for Nidus; however, that is not and will not be possible if we just leave it as they were initially released.

Assimilate and possibly other Warframe abilities/augments is just one more example of something we WANT to enjoy, but can't due to some of the things DE does. I'm not going to say if they're bad or good, irrational or rational, and/or negligible or notable. Those are subjective values that we place unto what DE does; however, it's undeniable that DE did, has done, and will do many things that the community may or may not find generally unfavorable. It's up to us to give them suggestions, feedback, and criticisms for the game that we all want to see come to fruition and success.

(Note: In no way do I have an intention to rag on, hate, or undermine DE and what they've done. I just want to play and enjoy the game and all that it has to offer, with Warframe augments such as Nyx's Assimilate being one of them. If something happens to something I like, I think it'd be logical to speak out against or for it, depending on the action)

 

[(PSN)TertulSee]

For Consoles, this patch has not come out yet. In fact, I didn't even know this bug existed (and now I feel bad because some of my squadmates wasted Ammo on me). I've gone and tested the Assimilate build and found it useful especially on high level defense. The problem is that on high level defense, Nyx without the augment is not very survivable mostly because if you're near the defense objective, people will hit you whether or not they are trolling. This is especially a problem for people who bring the Soma Prime! The Soma Prime can leave Nyx without energy really fast. That's not even touching on the Tigris Varients. It's doing Nyx a disservice to just leave this. 

[OmniXVII]

Are we past the point of no return where DE will ignore this topic?

I would at least appreciate an official response on the matter as to why they haven't reverted this yet or why they are choosing to keep it the way it is.