Weapon Buffs & Nerfs, But...

[GSDAkatsuki]

So DE is finally buffing and nerfing weapons, so what was the point of Rivens again? And does this mean DE will take a year or 2 to rebalance rivens as well if weapons are being changed from good to bad/bad to good?

Edited March 23, 2017 by GSDAkatsuki

[Xgomme]

Rivens don't change base stats, so even with the best/worst rivens some weapons are useless or OP

[IceColdHawk]

The point of rivens was not to get rid of buffs and nerfs but to add an "endgame" incentive to keep playing and upgrading weapons. The weaker and less used weapons gain more benefits in order to not throw the balance between weapon tiers completely out of the window.

Edited March 23, 2017 by IceColdHawk

[Doomsknightmare]

Small buff for these outdated weapons still wont make them as OP as pre-patch Tonkor/Simulor, but if u had a good riven then many of these old weapons will be high-level viable with these small buff.

[AEP8FlyBoy]

Rivens won't get touched. ('cept for some minor changes to dispo on weapons.)

I'm just glad the Tonkor is finally getting what it deserves. Nothing against peeps who use it though.
Super glad for these changes. Might make players branch out a bit.

Edited March 23, 2017 by AEP8FlyBoy

[VentiGlondi]

To answer your question, I had a Paracyst mod that quadrupled its damage and removed recoil, and the weapon still was below average.

It struggled against level 50 grineer.

[ashrah]

that why i  dont investe in rivens..u pay 2500p god tier riven for simulor and next day u simulor.. is pretty much.. in line with buzzlok what i was read so yeah

[(PSN)robotwars7]

18 minutes ago, AEP8FlyBoy said:

Rivens won't get touched

Rivens themselves won't, but dispositions on the other hand... those have already been tweaked numerous times.

I welcome all the changes, though I think they should have hit the Synoid Simulor harder, there'll still be plenty Mirage users running around with it., but hopefully I'll be having too much fun with my Attica to notice.

[Madway7]

43 minutes ago, Xgomme said:

Rivens don't change base stats, so even with the best/worst rivens some weapons are useless or OP

I think the point op is trying to make is if these weapons can be made good with buffs and the point of rivens is to make bad weapons good, then what's the point in rivens?

It's too late to remove them, but it does seem like DE could have just taken a hard look at weapon stats instead of introducing the rng slot machine mods we know as rivens.

[Gravitus123]

5 minutes ago, Madway7 said:

I think the point op is trying to make is if these weapons can be made good with buffs and the point of rivens is to make bad weapons good, then what's the point in rivens?

It's too late to remove them, but it does seem like DE could have just taken a hard look at weapon stats instead of introducing the rng slot machine mods we know as rivens.

Their probably didnt want to put in the actual effort of buffing weaker weapons and just decided hey lets make a system that does it for us but randomly and at the same time give the players something to rage at when it doesnt drop.

.Also is it just me or is the synoid simulor dead like completely dead its damage has been nerfed so hard.I mean the tonkor can still be used even though it lost 10% crit chance which i think was unnecessary should have just made it deal self damage and done.

[YUNoJump]

18 minutes ago, Gravitus123 said:

Also is it just me or is the synoid simulor dead like completely dead its damage has been nerfed so hard

But they buffed the detonate damage to the same amount as the combine damage was previously. It's got about the same damage as it did previously (maybe a BIT less) but now you have to actually do stuff with it as opposed to w+m1 with optional Mirage cheese.

[Gravitus123]

12 minutes ago, YUNoJump said:

But they buffed the detonate damage to the same amount as the combine damage was previously. It's got about the same damage as it did previously (maybe a BIT less) but now you have to actually do stuff with it as opposed to w+m1 with optional Mirage cheese.

Detonate damage?As in when the stacked orbs blow up or you use the alt fire?Huh i dunno guess ill have to test it when the change comes out

[YUNoJump]

1 minute ago, Gravitus123 said:

Detonate damage?As in when the stacked orbs blow up or you use the alt fire?Huh i dunno guess ill have to test it when the change comes out

When you alt fire, the damage is now 200/250 (normal/synoid respectively), which is the about the same as the max damage output of the orbs combining pre-nerf. The damage from the orbs combining has been reduced to what the alt fire used to be.

There's also the increased status chance, and the fact that the alt fire deals Electricity damage, not magnetic, so a Status build could be quite powerful.

[Xgomme]

1 hour ago, Madway7 said:

I think the point op is trying to make is if these weapons can be made good with buffs and the point of rivens is to make bad weapons good, then what's the point in rivens?

It's too late to remove them, but it does seem like DE could have just taken a hard look at weapon stats instead of introducing the rng slot machine mods we know as rivens.

The point is to still have a progression in the weapon efficiency while you upgrade your MR, but with your riven mod you can make your MR5 locked weapon reach MR15+ weapons.

So you'll not cheese the game after 2h of gameplay with a Furis, but endgame players will. It still needs some balancing but the idea is nice because everything should be endgame viable, but the game still need and "efficiency" progression (Or people would just stop farming after 2-3 weapons), with this we have both progression and end game viable content

[KentuckyKid_69]

Can someone explain me why so many hate towards the Tonkor, Simulor or Telos Boltace? It seems to me that if a lot of people starts playing with the same weapon it will get nerfed. Is this maybe becoming a thing every time people are getting comfortable with a weapon and others complaining about it? I hope not!

 

To buff weapons in order to give new players more weapons to choose is a good thing but I still think most of the more veteran players already have their favorites.

[Obviousclone]

4 minutes ago, T150MPH said:

Can someone explain me why so many hate towards the Tonkor, Simulor or Telos Boltace? It seems to me that if a lot of people starts playing with the same weapon it will get nerfed. Is this maybe becoming a thing every time people are getting comfortable with a weapon and others complaining about it? I hope not!

 

 

 

To buff weapons in order to give new players more weapons to choose is a good thing but I still think most of the more veteran players already have their favorites.

yes buff pls, never nerf, only buff

 

 

[YUNoJump]

6 minutes ago, T150MPH said:

It seems to me that if a lot of people starts playing with the same weapon it will get nerfed.

This is one of the reasons, yes, because if a lot of people are using one weapon, then a lot of other weapons are being sidelined. Diversity in loadouts is better for the game. Additionally, the fact that the hated weapons in question can outpace other weapons and strategies just with nuking power, making missions less fun for non-op weapon users.

As for why things are nerfed and not buffed, well it's easier to nerf one thing into line than to buff 299 things into line.

[KentuckyKid_69]

2 minutes ago, YUNoJump said:

This is one of the reasons, yes, because if a lot of people are using one weapon, then a lot of other weapons are being sidelined. Diversity in loadouts is better for the game.

 

Yes diversity is better for sure but for example the Telos Boltace became a thing the week the Acolytes came back. I never saw so many people asking for that weapon in trade chat before. Newer players get mixed up with higher level players and of course they see how much damage that weapon can do, it will happen again with other weapons.

I just don't like the fact that people can and will complain about certain weapons just because they think these are Op. But for sure they want their favorite weapon as strong and powerful as possible. I mean it kind of sucks to build your weapon and put time and resources into it just to see how it got nerfed. And by the way I don't use any of these so not an issue for me but maybe the next one could be.

[Volinus7]

They heard you like balances so they put a balancing system on top of items that were already under balancing job and hope that these double balances will not interfere each other.

[Hypernaut1]

I think there is room for both Rivens and balance passes.

 

[YUNoJump]

47 minutes ago, T150MPH said:

Yes diversity is better for sure but for example the Telos Boltace became a thing the week the Acolytes came back. I never saw so many people asking for that weapon in trade chat before. Newer players get mixed up with higher level players and of course they see how much damage that weapon can do, it will happen again with other weapons.

Well that would be because of Maiming Strike, adding a flat 90% crit chance to spin attacks rather than 90% of the base like every other mod, is dumb enough on its own, but on the TBoltace it was just ridiculous. It was stupidly OP so it was very popular, but that sort of scenario doesn't happen too often. Honestly I think they should change Maiming Strike so that its +90% of base not flat 90% increase, but that's not the point. Overall, the TBoltace scenario isn't going to happen very often, most OP things are OP with standard builds, not super mods, and most OP things still aren't as OP as Maiming TBoltace with macros.

47 minutes ago, T150MPH said:

I mean it kind of sucks to build your weapon and put time and resources into it just to see how it got nerfed.

True, but the main reason that it's so annoying in Warframe is because the devs don't balance weapons frequently enough. The Tonkor has existed (and been OP) for years but only now is receiving any balancing. If the devs did more balancing passes then the climate of "nerfs aren't fair because I worked on this" would go away, because people would be able to reliably foresee that their OP weapon will be nerfed. It's not hard to tell that something is OP after all. At least the devs are compensating people.

[Noabettiet]

1 hour ago, Obviousclone said:

yes buff pls, never nerf, only buff

 

 

It is specially funny that you show that up, considering warframe had a system, old in fact, that directly counters power creep: mastery rank.

now if only it worked as intended. 

[KentuckyKid_69]

6 hours ago, YUNoJump said:

Well that would be because of Maiming Strike,

That's it, the problem is not the weapon. I want to believe that DE did some serious research and those weapons had some testing before releasing it officially but they can't try these weapons with all available mods to see if they get Op or not. And godly Rivens will do the same damage to certain weapons but this time not everybody will have those so you end up seeing Op weapons but different ones instead. I find it really funny because the more high level players are which you see running sorties with the Symulor because those are the players with enough resources to get the mods to make that weapon Op.

In the end it is the players choice and everybody is looking for the strongest weapon you can get in order to kill more and get more out of it.

 

But you are right if so many people are asking for more balanced weapons they should do a complete rework instead because this will just lead to more and more people getting pi**** off because of their weapon got nerfed.

[(XBOX)QUIRON52]

Stop Nerfing weapons and warframes and try to do things well or right from the begging..... besides you gonna give us back all the formas that we used??? ,,,, Every update it has something good and bad..... it could be only good if you pay attention to the community and gamers....

[(XBOX)QUIRON52]

And I am not initiate I am rank 17 silver Eagle ..... arrange your bugs....

 

 

Edited March 26, 2017 by (XB1)QUIRON52