Is Onslaught and Khora Blueprints Acquisition DE's worst move yet?

[SneakyErvin]

5 minutes ago, Saratheia said:

But none of this justifies repeating the same painful process again and again in quick succession. Especially if you're an unlucky player of onslaught.

Yes, you have to repeat the process for the other difficult frames, but you don't have to completely do the same annoying thing again and again within the span of about 20 minutes. I just find rather hypocritical that DE have stated they're trying to move away from annoying grind fests and then they go and implement this for a whole brand new frame.

I'd like to point you towards Atlas, Equinox, Ivara, Mesa and Octavia. One piece of Octavia took me roughly as long to get as the whole Khora set with several repeated 20min survival runs. And that was "only" around 30 survival runs in total. Adding in the time for the quest on that aswell as the puzzle part you have a few more hours.

Ivara may not have been so drudgy long per run, but having to re-run spy over and over isnt more mindnumbing that 8 zones of onlaught. And dont get me started on Atlas. Long long long long fight becuase you simply didnt give a crap about archwing, so you have crap for gear to fight the golem. That fight is even more tedious than anything else.

Then there are frames you simply cannot farm efficiently, like Ash. Or you have the ones like Titania that requires you to go and pick flowers several times over.

I mean none of them are really awful to farm imo except Atlas. When it comes to the rest that you can actually farm, Khora is pretty spot on out of a balanced aquisition perspective.

In my opinion atleast. 

[NocheLuz]

If you want her and want to support DE. There are Market for you to go to her and buy her out right. You can have Khora+Slot+Potatoes already installed. You also help DE with your money (or another person money if you get Plat my trading). I see no point in this thread. If you adore DE, like DE... Why don't you support them?

Also, I've got system in the first run. On second run I got both Chassis and Neuroptics... Then her BP is not drop for me for about 20 run after that (got like 4 system lol). I got very impatient. It's already 2 days and I still can't get her BP. But I stop. Stop the game. Stop the run. It shown me no point in running any further since I've max out daily Focus. So, Iwait till the Focus limit reset and said to myself, "I'll only play till Focus limit then end the game for the day". Next morning (It's morning for the Focus reset time in my timezone), in the first run... Khora BP is drop for me. I'm very delighted. This had told me that sometime... Patient is the key.

[Deimorne]

2 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

I'd like to point you towards Atlas, Equinox, Ivara, Mesa and Octavia. One piece of Octavia took me roughly as long to get as the whole Khora set with several repeated 20min survival runs. And that was "only" around 30 survival runs in total. Adding in the time for the quest on that aswell as the puzzle part you have a few more hours.

Ivara may not have been so drudgy long per run, but having to re-run spy over and over isnt more mindnumbing that 8 zones of onlaught. And dont get me started on Atlas. Long long long long fight becuase you simply didnt give a crap about archwing, so you have crap for gear to fight the golem. That fight is even more tedious than anything else.

Then there are frames you simply cannot farm efficiently, like Ash. Or you have the ones like Titania that requires you to go and pick flowers several times over.

I mean none of them are really awful to farm imo except Atlas. When it comes to the rest that you can actually farm, Khora is pretty spot on out of a balanced aquisition perspective.

In my opinion atleast. 

I respect your opinion and appreciate you offering it.

 

But I still see an issue. And since it's clear DE has other frames that are, as claimed to be, harder to farm than Khora, this is something I'm surprised at. I still feel this is an unintentional method of pressuring players into buying frames instead of farming them.

[Deimorne]

1 minute ago, NocheLuz said:

If you want her and want to support DE. There are Market for you to go to her and buy her out right. You can have Khora+Slot+Potatoes already installed. You also help DE with your money (or another person money if you get Plat my trading). I see no point in this thread. If you adore DE, like DE... Why don't you support them?

Also, I've got system in the first run. On second run I got both Chassis and Neuroptics... Then her BP is not drop for me for about 20 run after that (got like 4 system lol). I got very impatient. It's already 2 days and I still can't get her BP. But I stop. Stop the game. Stop the run. It shown me no point in running any further since I've max out daily Focus. So, Iwait till the Focus limit reset and said to myself, "I'll only play till Focus limit then end the game for the day". Next morning (It's morning for the Focus reset time in my timezone), in the first run... Khora BP is drop for me. I'm very delighted. This had told me that sometime... Patient is the key.

I understand that, but I think it's clear you didn't read my whole original post. I have farmed Khora for a whole week. Repeated hours of the same miserable onslaught, one after another, and all I have is two chassis prints. I think if anything would show I have patience, it's that. I can tolerate grinding, but a whole week straight with doing nothing but giving me rewards I don't want or need? I feel insulted as a player.

[NocheLuz]

1 minute ago, Saratheia said:

I understand that, but I think it's clear you didn't read my whole original post. I have farmed Khora for a whole week. Repeated hours of the same miserable onslaught, one after another, and all I have is two chassis prints. I think if anything would show I have patience, it's that. I can tolerate grinding, but a whole week straight with doing nothing but giving me rewards I don't want or need? I feel insulted as a player.

No, by patient I mean 'No matter what'. But didn't you lose your patient in making this thread?

I'll tell you a story of how 'Me' and my 'Sibling' is playing the Warframe. For me, I don't want to spend even a single platinum on something you can gain in the game. Which mean I only use my platimun for 'Slot' and... some other stuffs... This also mean all Warframes I've got are from my years of grinding. I'll say to you this. I've got all Octavia and Harrow parts. But without their Blueprint I can't build them... this is because I still didn't done those quest (lol). Now for my 'Sibling'. They have play time more then me. I've like 30 days and they have like 50 days (in the profiles). My sibling will buy any Warframe they deem 'Hard to get'. As far as I know, they've brought 'Ivara' and 'Harrow'. Khora still debatable, but I have them grinding the 'Nidus' parts with me but they seem want to buy it too.

So, get back to topic. You feel insulted because you got reward you don't need? I'm feeling that if you get rewards you needed everytime. You'll still make a thread about how easy it is to get something in this game. And it's have no point in buying her from the Market. Isn't that right?

[Deimorne]

2 minutes ago, NocheLuz said:

No, by patient I mean 'No matter what'. But didn't you lose your patient in making this thread?

I'll tell you a story of how 'Me' and my 'Sibling' is playing the Warframe. For me, I don't want to spend even a single platinum on something you can gain in the game. Which mean I only use my platimun for 'Slot' and... some other stuffs... This also mean all Warframes I've got are from my years of grinding. I'll say to you this. I've got all Octavia and Harrow parts. But without their Blueprint I can't build them... this is because I still didn't done those quest (lol). Now for my 'Sibling'. They have play time more then me. I've like 30 days and they have like 50 days (in the profiles). My sibling will buy any Warframe they deem 'Hard to get'. As far as I know, they've brought 'Ivara' and 'Harrow'. Khora still debatable, but I have them grinding the 'Nidus' parts with me but they seem want to buy it too.

So, get back to topic. You feel insulted because you got reward you don't need? I'm feeling that if you get rewards you needed everytime. You'll still make a thread about how easy it is to get something in this game. And it's have no point in buying her from the Market. Isn't that right?

Actually, quite the opposite. If I get what I'm after, I have no quarrel with anyone or anything. Why would I? I've achieved what I've set out to do. And I understand and appreciate what you've told me, but it was rather pointless. I'm not you or your sibling, and I don't play like you. I save my plat which I don't get all too often save for a little here and there from the coupons I get from log in rewards and the occasional I get from trading, but like you, I use my plat for what I feel I need. Slots, the occasional orokin catalyst, maybe a forma if I really need one.

I've played Warframe from year one. Literally, I joined probably three months after it first went live. So, I'm not a founder, but I am borderline one. In all the years I've played warframe, I've never had to grind one thing for a whole week straight. This is why I made this thread. Because for the first time in my years of playing warframe, I found myself doing somethign I hated in the game. Which isn't what I want from the game. I love Warframe, I even adored it's spiritual predecessor, Dark Sector. It's why I truly call Warframe my one true MMO game. Some have Warcraft, others Guild Wars 2, me? It's Warframe. Anyone would bring up issues they have gripe with in any online game they love playing.

[NocheLuz]

1 minute ago, Saratheia said:

I've played Warframe from year one. Literally, I joined probably three months after it first went live.

Oh, wow. I'm just look at your profiles and I've join after you like 3-4 months!!. We literally play after each other (lol).

If you don't want to accepted the drop rate... It's your call... In the end if DE increase the drop rate. What would the person who run non-stop since the Khora patch open get? I mean they're running more run then yours. Wasting time more then yours. Those who got all the part (like me) would say 'No problem' because it's in the past and cannot get back anyway. But... If DE did increase the drop rate. Those who still run to get Khora parts will seriously think. 'Why would I run like crazy till now?'. You who run significantly less then them would think 'It's a good thing' and start the run normally.

Also, you just said if you got that you want. You wouldn't quarrel with anyone or anything... So, it is fine as long as you got the drop without consider other feelings?? For the one who still run to get Khora still now?? For the person who just got all Khora parts?? It is hard to tell you how they feel. You would think 'Wasn't it good thing if the drop rate is higher?'. Then can you say that to who run Elite SO and got a lot of Khora parts and demanded her out of Elite SO?? I've seen a lot of complain on they want the Vandal not Khora. Now, won't you think it is unfair to those who run like crazy and got all the Khora part if they increase the drop rate? No? As long as you got the part you won't complain?? oh, ok...

[TARINunit9]

3 hours ago, Saratheia said:

And the biggest problem is that people in the end will feel pressured to just buy her with plat if they really want to play her but have suffered a hell of a long grind in trying and failing to get her prints.

Welcome to the world of free-to-play games

That pressure is no accident. That pressure is how they make their money. That pressure is something you agreed to when you played this game; you get to play the game for free in exchange for the pressure

The only reason we are mad (let's be clear here, I am also a little mad about it too) is because Khora has much, MUCH more pressure than most frames before her. Ember? Kill a boss over and over, you're guaranteed parts. Volt? Grind some resources, then wait three days until he finishes researching. Contrast that with frames like Ivara, Harrow, and Khora; the pressure really built up after they ran out of easy places to put new frames

So is this really the worst thing Warframe has ever done? Balls no. The Hema research costs were by far the worst thing DE had ever done, followed closely by the Grineer Broken Lights trap and the boring annoying frustrating False Profit event. But is Khora the most frustrating frame to get? Very quite possibly

[Travka-]

it about RNG if you got her all her parts in few hours you still complaning about this ? nope i don't  think so
you need to repeat get in mission and get out that how you play warframe " Patient is a Key "

Just keep it up you will get what you want 

[Deimorne]

5 minutes ago, Travka- said:

it about RNG if you got her all her parts in few hours you still complaning about this ? nope i don't  think so
you need to repeat get in mission and get out that how you play warframe " Patient is a Key "

Just keep it up you will get what you want 

It seems people are failing to notice that I've said several times I've been grinding for a week with only two Chassis BP's to show for it. I've literally lost my drive to keep going and have become depressed over it after hearing Cephalon Simaris talk his miserable speeches again, again, again and again.

 

The main problem in this point of view is that just trying to get one frame is making me and likely others hate playing Warframe

[Travka-]

1 minute ago, Saratheia said:

It seems people are failing to notice that I've said several times I've been grinding for a week with only two Chassis BP's to show for it. I've literally lost my drive to keep going and have become depressed over it after hearing Cephalon Simaris talk his miserable speeches again, again, again and again.

 

The main problem in this point of view is that just trying to get one frame is making me and likely others hate playing Warframe

see it called RNG  just keep it up , " patient is key " that all i can say about this game who know you might get her tomorrow

 

[Deimorne]

2 hours ago, Travka- said:

see it called RNG  just keep it up , " patient is key " that all i can say about this game who know you might get her tomorrow

 

Yes, that won't happen. I've decided I'm just not doing this. I can't do something I despise doing just for a frame.

[Saturmorn_Carvilli]

I got everything for Khora last weekend.  I was pretty lucky in that I was ahead of the probability (I think it only took about dozen runs) as well as getting a decent squad that wanted extract the moment we got the C rotation stuff (blueprint and Systems) which is the hard bits.  In fact, I believe I have a couple/few Chasis and/or Neuroptics during the farming.  I do think that her parts drop chance to could be bumped up a bit to 8-10%.  That is still some 20 runs up to Zone 8 to get everything probably.  I am not even bothering with the Vandal parts due to their low drop rate (I don't even try with less than 5% drop chances).  Especially, since I dislike Onslaught so much, I have a hard time believing anyone would like it as it is basically a single map tile survival run.

I only glanced through this thread, but I haven't seen the usual dilution of other rewards argument.  Let me cut that off at the pass.  Regular Onslaught doesn't have any rewards that a player would want to farm long term anyways that they couldn't get elsewhere.  Lith relics are only worth it if you only go to Zone 2 or 4 in which you would be better served to go Elite and get the Radiant ones anyway.  Meso relics are on the border of efficiency again provided you only go to Zone 6, but I think it would be easier to just farm them at Helene or Io.  Neo relics are not worth the time and effort no matter how you slice it.  

[Reifnir]

Started farming Khora when she released. 

So far, I'm sitting on a pile of every single Khora part, except her BP. I think I have 5 or 6 systems already, and now I have to spend 20 minutes of my time, getting literally NOTHING (I have maxed out all focus trees long before Onslaught was even released) and worst of all - with no way to speed it up. 

At least when running endless Defense you can gather a good squad and nuke through waves faster. 

In Onslaught you just have to wait and nuke from time to time. It's boring, DEAD boring. 

Once I get Khora and (if I have the patience) Vandals, I don't want to come back to this mode. Ever. 

Edited April 28, 2018 by Reifnir

[Deimorne]

19 minutes ago, Reifnir said:

Started farming Khora when she released. 

So far, I'm sitting on a pile of every single Khora part, except her BP. I think I have 5 or 6 systems already, and now I have to spend 20 minutes of my time, getting literally NOTHING (I have maxed out all focus trees long before Onslaught was even released) and worst of all - with no way to speed it up. 

At least when running endless Defense you can gather a good squad and nuke through waves faster. 

In Onslaught you just have to wait and nuke from time to time. It's boring, DEAD boring. 

Once I get Khora and (if I have the patience) Vandals, I don't want to come back to this mode. Ever. 

That I can agree with. This onslaught mode, unless they do something to make it really worthwhile, I never want anything to do with it ever again.

[ElocFreidon]

When content comes out where the new thing's drop chance is so low that farming fissures makes you plat fast enough to just buy the rewards from other players, DE ought to know they messed up with the loot tables.

[LupisV0lk]

No, no it is not. I'm surprised by how triggered people are about how to acquire her and yet nary a peep about Ivara.

[Deimorne]

18 minutes ago, LupisV0lk said:

No, no it is not. I'm surprised by how triggered people are about how to acquire her and yet nary a peep about Ivara.

Actually, there was a bit of an uproar about Ivara. But it quietened down quickly. This time though, I feel they're just making it crazy hard and frustrating for no real reason.

[LupisV0lk]

2 minutes ago, Saratheia said:

Actually, there was a bit of an uproar about Ivara. But it quietened down quickly. This time though, I feel they're just making it crazy hard and frustrating for no real reason.

But it's not. You just have to simply play Onslaught. Unlike Ivara where you had to be a god at 100%, no alerting spy missions just to get a slightly higher chance of a part of her dropping.

[BlueFalcon13]

So, I finally got my last Khora part drop today. This is awesome for a couple reasons:

 

1. I never have to do regular onslaught again. Elite mode only.

2. The relic drops from elite mode are already upgraded. Hello new relic farm place...

3. Regular onslaught is boring AF. People bring their soundquake banshees or their equinox and it turns into a giant snoozefest.

So, when I need to cap some focus, it will be in elite mode now. When I need relics, it will be in elite mode. I'm ok with that 😁

 

[Buff00n]

I did some math, just looking at the time commitment required to obtain Khora as compared to the other often-cited "heavy grind" frames.  I looked at the average number of runs required to obtain all parts, and the number of runs required for 90% confidence.  The math is wicked complicated when you have a single drop table with multiple rewards that you want (It's a Negative Multinomial distribution, if you want to dive down a Wikipedia hole).  It's actually easier and quicker to just run a simulation a few million times and look at the results, which is what I did.

On average it will take a player 27 runs, or 9 hours of regular Onslaught, to obtain Khora.  For 90% confidence it will take 51+ runs, or 17+ hours.  10% of players who decide to grind it out will spend more than 17 hours on it.  As far as non-prime frames go, this time commitment is in a league by itself.

On average it will take a player 22 runs to obtain Equinox, and for 90% confidence you need 33+ runs.  This is less than the 27-51+ runs Khora requires, and each run takes far less than 20 minutes.

Atlas, along with most of the "regular" boss-obtained frames, will take just 6-10+ runs.  It doesn't take 90 minutes to kill Jordas no matter how garbage your AW equipment is.  This is also something you can easily get help on to make the mission go faster.  I've personally done that for people quite a few times.

Nekros is 6-9+ runs.  The added step of getting Lephantis nav beacons and the hour time gate for building the key makes putting a number on this difficult, but unless you sit there for an hour staring at your foundry waiting for a key every time, and never share keys, it's not going to come close to a 90 minute commitment per run. 

Trinity and Saryn require 6-10+ runs.  Each run consumes 20 Animo Beacons or 50 Justice Points, which do not take an hour and a half to obtain.

Octavia's Neuroptics requires 5-10+ runs of ODS, or 2-4+ hours.

Harrow's Systems requires 9-20+ runs of Defection.  It's hard to put a time on Defection's rotation C because it speeds up during the mission, but it's much less than 20 minutes unless you go AFK on the healing pod, and you still need far fewer than Khora's 27-51+ runs.

Nidus requires 13-22+ runs of Infested Salvage.  Four rounds can take 20 minutes if your team isn't that great, but it's still fewer runs than 27-51+.  

Gara requires a combined 14-28+ bounty runs.  These can take around 15-20 mins each, but the numbers are still far short of Khora's 27-51+ runs.

There might be a case for Mesa, which only requires 6-10+ runs, but obtaining the key can require a lot of time in ODD/ODS (if you don't watch for invasions).  However, the key is sharable and, last I checked, the key and its components are tradable, dulling any RNG woes.

There might be a better case for Ivara, which requires a combined 45-95+ runs on various spy missions.  But with enough practice you can do each of those in five minutes (ten if you're doing Lua spy), and you will get a lot of practice.  Even if you hate Spy, on average you will spend less time on it than people who hate regular Onslaught will spend on Khora.

I don't think Ash, Oberon, and Vauban count, since you can't really "farm" those.  Did I miss any others?  Titania is annoying but short if you know where to find the stupid plants.  Inaros is annoying but short if you know where the wiki is 🙂

 

So when you actually run the numbers, Khora requires by far the largest time commitment to obtain a regular frame.  The last time a warframe part required that kind of time commitment was in the old void key days with ~5% drop rates on Defense/Survival rotation C.  But those were prime parts, and trading was available as a check on RNG.

I'm usually the first one to say you should just play the game and you will get things eventually.  But everyone here knows that's not how a large number of players think.  Players will burn out on this and there is nothing other players can do to help them save time, short of gifting.

If Khora is your goal then it may literally be more efficient to spend your time doing Eidolon runs and sell 325p worth of Arcanes.

Update: Now you can do the math as well.

Edited October 22, 2018 by Buff00n
RNG Simulator link

[Deimorne]

6 minutes ago, Buff00n said:

I did some math, just looking at the time commitment required to obtain Khora as compared to the other often-cited "heavy grind" frames.  I looked at the average number of runs required to obtain all parts, and the number of runs required for 90% confidence.  The math is wicked complicated when you have a single drop table with multiple rewards that you want (It's a Negative Multinomial distribution, if you want to dive down a Wikipedia hole).  It's actually easier and quicker to just run a simulation a few million times and look at the results, which is what I did.

On average it will take a player 27 runs, or 9 hours of regular Onslaught, to obtain Khora.  For 90% confidence it will take 51+ runs, or 17+ hours.  10% of players who decide to grind it out will spend more than 17 hours on it.  As far as non-prime frames go, this time commitment is in a league by itself.

On average it will take a player 22 runs to obtain Equinox, and for 90% confidence you need 33+ runs.  This is less than the 27-51+ runs Khora requires, and each run takes far less than 20 minutes.

Atlas, along with most of the "regular" boss-obtained frames, will take just 6-10+ runs.  It doesn't take 90 minutes to kill Jordas no matter how garbage your AW equipment is.  This is also something you can easily get help on to make the mission go faster.  I've personally done that for people quite a few times.

Nekros is 6-9+ runs.  The added step of getting Lephantis nav beacons and the hour time gate for building the key makes putting a number on this difficult, but unless you sit there for an hour staring at your foundry waiting for a key every time, and never share keys, it's not going to come close to a 90 minute commitment per run. 

Trinity and Saryn require 6-10+ runs.  Each run consumes 20 Animo Beacons or 50 Justice Points, which do not take an hour and a half to obtain.

Octavia's Neuroptics requires 5-10+ runs of ODS, or 2-4+ hours.

Harrow's Systems requires 9-20+ runs of Defection.  It's hard to put a time on Defection's rotation C because it speeds up during the mission, but it's much less than 20 minutes unless you go AFK on the healing pod, and you still need far fewer than Khora's 27-51+ runs.

Nidus requires 13-22+ runs of Infested Salvage.  Four rounds can take 20 minutes if your team isn't that great, but it's still fewer runs than 27-51+.  

Gara requires a combined 14-28+ bounty runs.  These can take around 15-20 mins each, but the numbers are still far short of Khora's 27-51+ runs.

There might be a case for Mesa, which only requires 6-10+ runs, but obtaining the key can require a lot of time in ODD/ODS (if you don't watch for invasions).  However, the key is sharable and, last I checked, the key and its components are tradable, dulling any RNG woes.

There might be a better case for Ivara, which requires a combined 45-95+ runs on various spy missions.  But with enough practice you can do each of those in five minutes (ten if you're doing Lua spy), and you will get a lot of practice.  Even if you hate Spy, on average you will spend less time on it than people who hate regular Onslaught will spend on Khora.

I don't think Ash, Oberon, and Vauban count, since you can't really "farm" those.  Did I miss any others?  Titania is annoying but short if you know where to find the stupid plants.  Inaros is annoying but short if you know where the wiki is :)

 

So when you actually run the numbers, Khora requires by far the largest time commitment to obtain a regular frame.  The last time a warframe part required that kind of time commitment was in the old void key days with ~5% drop rates on Defense/Survival rotation C.  But those were prime parts, and trading was available as a check on RNG.

I'm usually the first one to say you should just play the game and you will get things eventually.  But everyone here knows that's not how a large number of players think.  Players will burn out on this and there is nothing other players can do to help them save time, short of gifting.

If Khora is your goal then it may literally be more efficient to spend your time doing Eidolon runs and sell 325p worth of Arcanes.

I don't know what impresses me more...

 

The fact that you did all that math, or the fact that you actually found a legit bit of proof for the side of the debate against the grind.

Honestly, it's both, really.

Thank you for this. It's actually on a serious note very interesting to see the heavy details. I had a feeling the Khora was going to be a high commitment, but from the way others were talking, I was getting the impression others, such as Ivara, were more difficult. Yet, there's the evidence showing Khora is the worst.

 

Perhaps I really should cave and just buy the plat... Or maybe just Eidolon hunt like you said for Arcanes.

[GSDAkatsuki]

5 hours ago, Reifnir said:

Started farming Khora when she released. 

So far, I'm sitting on a pile of every single Khora part, except her BP. I think I have 5 or 6 systems already, and now I have to spend 20 minutes of my time, getting literally NOTHING (I have maxed out all focus trees long before Onslaught was even released) and worst of all - with no way to speed it up. 

At least when running endless Defense you can gather a good squad and nuke through waves faster. 

In Onslaught you just have to wait and nuke from time to time. It's boring, DEAD boring. 

Once I get Khora and (if I have the patience) Vandals, I don't want to come back to this mode. Ever. 

I'd love to trade my 4 BPs for one of your systems. The fact that BP and System are in C together makes this cancerous, Simaris needs to allow us to exchange one for the other with him. In the past BPs were gotten through just completing a quest or purchased in market. So far Inaros is how these things should be done, interesting lore quests and by completing you get the frame.

Edited April 29, 2018 by GSDAkatsuki

[Orblit]

In a world, where you have to spend 15 minutes previously to get a slim shot at khora systems...once..

[sleepychewbacca]

I spent a day on Warframe. 10 hours just running ESO back to back. I had pretty much everything in the game prior to that, so I was quite keen on the idea of new junk to mess about it. 

About the 9th hour, I finally completed the Vandals and Khora. Built them, sold some prime junk and rushed the build with plat. 

It was a huge mistake. In hindsight, I should have just casually grinded it for the focus and relics, and if something dropped, hey, there we go. Literally burnout prime. I've not logged in for the last 3 days, and I'll probably have to play something else before I feel like touching Warframe again. 

So I guess I'm trying to say too much of a chance to get something might be a bad thing. But it could definitely use a tweak to the drop chances.