Melee: Present and Future goals!

[(PSN)Lowk721]

9 hours ago, TwoWolves said:

That is exactly my concern. Yes, it's a fast-paced shooter/slasher game like Warframe. However, they could replace the lasers of snipers, or any other enemy type for that matter, with a directional red arrow in the UI that flashes and tells you the direction it came from, a la Battlefield and COD. 

They already have that. The thing is you are dealing with several types of enemies while running around with those markers popping up and nothing to distinguish who is what. The Laser adds a distinctive visual element to differentiate between scores of regular shooters and a sniper. It makes it so you are at least aware of the particular danger because they do much more damage then the others. It'd be like making a bombard a hitscan enemy and giving you know warning it's coming. 

Sniper do more damage then normal targets. It would be 

9 hours ago, TwoWolves said:

This is the exact concern I have, which you have so eloquently, and unintendedly, provided. Messing with the melee system now feels like they're trying to turn that arcade game-feel into Mortal Kombat with button combos and a heavy attack bar.

No it doesn't.  It feels like they are trying to pull the combos out of the janky melee system. Combos are currently locked behind weird control inputs like holding back which depending on your control options can either A. Slow you down or B.point you in the wrong direction. 

Also I don't even know how you are making the mortal kombat connection when even the video demonstration has more in common with typical hacknslash game. They are kind of stapes of the genre's combat. 

Some are for flair but other combos have utility like AoE and stunning as shown in the beginning. Warframe has stuff similar but the method to currently getting to them is just stupid. Adding another button to the melee system opens up for simpler ways to reach them not make. It could even allow from more sets of combo with varying effects since you aren't only reliant on just pauses anymore.

Maybe one day they figure out a way to incorporate powers into the combo system like most of the others do. We already have the magic bar for it. C'mon DE, let me be the sword summoning and slash dashing Vergil with Excalibur and Nikana. Don't play like thats not where you got the idea for current slash dash. I remember that stream. Vaguely, but I rememeber it.

 

9 hours ago, TwoWolves said:

I wouldn't mind it leaning in the other direction, towards realism, but it would be nice to have missions besides assassination or extermination where the goal is to take your time and pick your way through enemies using your head instead of running in and killing everything you can while trying to minimize the damage you take--if you would be able to fly through the room quickly, why wouldn't you? Me, I will kill everything and go back and look at, of all things, just the background environments because I enjoy the visual feast of Grineer and Corpus ships.

This would only really work under certain situations like story or plain style missions where the environment's layout is more controlled. Regular missions shift stuff around too much. They could also add some repercussions or bonuses for that kind of gameplay similar to spy. They don't really incentivize that sort of gameplay in the first place to make it worth it.

9 hours ago, TwoWolves said:

My big thing has always been that rolling as a defense is absolute garbage. Rolling sucks. Period. Why you would force us to use it more when it doesn't work when you're surrounded the way Spin Attack does? Seriously, rolling does NOT remove you from the area when you're surrounded by Toxic Ancients mollywhopping your ass. "Oh, I'm going to roll away--right into this other Toxic Ancient standing next to the one I want to get away from! Gee, I'm so glad DE forced me to use roll now that Spin Attack is gone and I can no longer spin my way out of a corner! Thanks, DE!"

It still works for dodging incoming attacks. It removes sticky grenades, tiny energy/health leeches some drones fire, removes the swarm thing, provides a damage reduction (which should probably be higher than 75%), as well as make you immune to knockdowns. I know because every time I see that giant wall of fire spread I panic flip through it fine(Same with laser doors). Personally, I think it should also help you recover from being knockdown or being harpooned instead of being a mod. But I guess I'll just have to live with blocking for that stuff.

Blocking and Dodging can help with most of methods used against you. I've backflipped from and blocked groundpounds and it felt satisfying. And I'm getting a little bit better as the rolls/flips with parkour. Mostly course correction stuff. nothing that'd help in combat. Though that aimed ground slam might change that.

I don't think they said they were taking away spin attack. There only problem was people spin attack through walls with whips. Which they already corrected. Also Bullet jump. Lot better for when surrounded. Knocks back anyone near you. You can also jump and slide mid-air to kick anything things in your way down without stopping. Dodge rolling is more for when you actually have space to evade and dealing with an attack you see coming.

Status effect? That another can of worms that can be annoyiny regardless of maneuvers.

[martin19735]

My most important concern about melee now, is that, aside from some stances like tempo royale, mobility cannot be integrated to combos and it makes short weapons very incomfortable to use. An auto-target grab-dash system would be very usefull to diversify weaponry and not just force to use maiming strike and polearme zaws. Because multi-target and mobility is the key in warframe.

(some rng-diversified combos would be very neat too)

[TwoWolves]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Lowk721 said:

They already have that. The thing is you are dealing with several types of enemies while running around with those markers popping up and nothing to distinguish who is what. The Laser adds a distinctive visual element to differentiate between scores of regular shooters and a sniper. It makes it so you are at least aware of the particular danger because they do much more damage then the others. It'd be like making a bombard a hitscan enemy and giving you know warning it's coming. 

Sniper do more damage then normal targets. It would be 

It feels like they are trying to pull the combos out of the janky melee system. Combos are currently locked behind weird control inputs like holding back which depending on your control options can either A. Slow you down or B.point you in the wrong direction. 

 

First, if they have it, then it's getting lost in the visual jumble on screen when in the heat of battle. Taking away that warning would make the game more punishing of mistakes. There's a sniper? Yeah, run for cover, kill off the ones following you, then duck behind something and slow-pan. However, this would require the enemies actually being broken up so it's not continuous, which they probably already do, but it doesn't feel like it. The increased difficulty is what I was aiming at. Need to find them? Pull out your scanner. Make the laser flash (the time it's on screen) shorter by a few tenths of a second--even that would incrementally make the game a bit more difficult and realistic without going overboard.

Also, I don't use combos for that reason. Switching them to multiple buttons means I have to learn the button configuration all over again. What are they going to change the Switch Weapon default to? What about the Activate button default? Or the Jump default? Any combo they come up with is going to be fraught with just as much difficulty as this current configuration, it's just going to involve multiple buttons.

1 hour ago, (PS4)Lowk721 said:

Also I don't even know how you are making the mortal kombat connection when even the video demonstration has more in common with typical hacknslash game. They are kind of stapes of the genre's combat. 

Some are for flair but other combos have utility like AoE and stunning as shown in the beginning. Warframe has stuff similar but the method to currently getting to them is just stupid. Adding another button to the melee system opens up for simpler ways to reach them not make. It could even allow from more sets of combo with varying effects since you aren't only reliant on just pauses anymore.

Maybe one day they figure out a way to incorporate powers into the combo system like most of the others do. We already have the magic bar for it. C'mon DE, let me be the sword summoning and slash dashing Vergil with Excalibur and Nikana. Don't play like thats not where you got the idea for current slash dash. I remember that stream. Vaguely, but I rememeber it.

 

Mortal Kombat had ridiculous button combos you had to remember. And then there were button combos for Fatalities. And Babe-alities. And there were multiples of each for each character. How is that not complicated? This is what I am referring to.

Same thing with both Force Unleashed games. Complicated button combinations for pulling off Sith combos. Here's the problem with all these combinations that intersect with human psychology: People will learn one or two that they like and work really well most of the time, and generally stick to them. Why do we need multiples of combos, when at most, three or four generally suffice? 

Collecting energy cells are one thing. A bar growing from melee strikes is another. Maybe if they made a small icon that would flash in the battle UI, and then you could hold down one key to see four options and press a button based on that, like how our powers work, then maybe it wouldn't be so terrible...because I do agree that the combo system right now is pretty much unused, or not really noticed, by me. 

I would like to see the mission style/type palette broadened a bit. They have these elaborate and over the top environments that are ridiculously detailed with greeblies and rooms that to gamers such as myself are crying out for exploration. The environments are what keeps me coming back, I think.

Bullet-jump is okay, when it works. The problem is that all the melee weapons have baked-in melee strike combos that are ridiculous. When I want a single strike, I'm stuck with a 1-2-3 combo? One of the reasons I don't like using daggers. Infested have a tendency to swarm, and jumping through them does no good if there's more behind them and there's nowhere to go. I thought it only knocked prone the target you had on your cursor, not surrounding enemies. Roll is fine out in the open when you're not cornered or swarmed and monkey piled. I'll have to try the bullet jump next time. 

[martin19735]

I think all stances should have built-in mobility(auto-dashing to an ennemy when attacking it while running)

And killing thousands of ennemies with no more than 6 combos is a bit annoying. Combos are made to kill ennemies, they should not ignore them but interact with them, for some fun and usefulness. I don't know, if you have a puncture-based polearm, you would want to stab ennemy chest or, with a blade and whip, pull a powerful foe and dismember it.

Some warframe powers, like said by others could fit in combos, with some kinds of QTE, for example, nekros, with a whip could make his grab-combo, then, when he pulls the ennemy to him, he soulpunches him and does a fancy, efficient and neat combo, i honestly think it wouldn't be hard if every stance had the same kinds of combos with some difference between each one:

for example, you hold left mouse button while attacking to do your one-ennemy grab attack, with bleeding willow, it would impale the ennemy and crowd controle it while opening to finishers and with twirling spire, it would hit the ennemy's feet to make hime fall, with a greater slash/impact focused damage, i think this is what we want melee to become

[TwoWolves]

I'd still say do a wheel like we have for our powers, only have them numbered and have a separate UI panel to assign combos just like in the Arsenal with Gear. Boom. Done. That gives you up to 8. Keep in mind, those eight would look different each time, depending upon environmental variables. Yes, there should be some interaction with the environment, but too much and it eats into processing power on the server side. People gravitate towards what is simple and effective. And in the case of Warframe...lethal.

[martin19735]

Impaling and dismembering are very lethal 

[martin19735]

What i say sounds complex, but i honestly think it could work, the grab and the power combos aren't nescessary, but the in-built mobility is essential

[martin19735]

Complex interactions are not nescessary but more fun

[TwoWolves]

See, that's where having something familiar--the combo wheel--would be handy. It's familiar, so players intuitively know how to use it. It also offers up to eight basic combo choices that could be "flavored" by each frame, offering unlimited possibilities. 

There's your combos. Hot-keyed combos on a combo wheel.

I can appreciate the fun of mastering a combo, but...I dunno...I still like the idea of being able to use them like powers.

[MuscleBob]

I just don't like how all your combo points will go to heavies...

Like some people have said, it messes up the "blood rush + body count" combo and it makes really fun, high crit chance weapons (like Venka Prime) a lot less satisfying, even if the base damage goes up. I just love seeing those yellow crits go to orange, orange to red, then seeing everyone die.

The power man, I literally never use heavy attacks. I get that DE is trying to find a balance between heavy attacks and actually make people use them, butI don't think that's the best way to do it. It'll kill melee at it is. 

[(PSN)Lowk721]

37 minutes ago, TwoWolves said:

First, if they have it, then it's getting lost in the visual jumble on screen when in the heat of battle.

Funny enough I don't think it is. It's just subtle. Like a weird subliminal thing, I don't realize I'm using unless I'm actually looking for. It's a blue arc with a point. Kind of vivid against most backgrounds. I saw it even in the simulacrum which has similar light tones. 

42 minutes ago, TwoWolves said:

There's a sniper? Yeah, run for cover, kill off the ones following you, then duck behind something and slow-pan. However, this would require the enemies actually being broken up so it's not continuous, which they probably already do, but it doesn't feel like it. The increased difficulty is what I was aiming at. Need to find them? Pull out your scanner. Make the laser flash (the time it's on screen) shorter by a few tenths of a second--even that would incrementally make the game a bit more difficult and realistic without going overboard.

 

You are describing something that doesn't work in the confines of what the game is. Thats Metal gear solid or Dark Sector level of stealth and cover system based gameplay. That's not difficult here. It is just slowing the pace down which is counter to both the game's design and the story of what Warframes are. It is meant to be a fast-paced action game where mobility and space magic take precedence because Warframe are meant to be ridiculous super-powered ninja wizards. That is why bullet jumping, wall-run/hopping, and dodging all have mechanics to either reduce damage or make lessen accuracy against you. Why they have defensive powers. 

Shortening, however, makes much more sense. The warning is there for a reason. Most high-powered attacks need some kind of warning otherwise you killing off the player without ever giving them a decent chance. Otherwise is just cheap fake difficulty. That why I think some eximus are BS. The fire one is fine. That presents an obstacle one you can overcome with timing. You see a threat you react or you get floored. Energy leech and weapon leeching is just annoying. You don't know they are there until it's too late. Even the toxic ones are better because at least you can see the aura in surrounding enemies to warn you they are around.

1 hour ago, TwoWolves said:

Also, I don't use combos for that reason. Switching them to multiple buttons means I have to learn the button configuration all over again. What are they going to change the Switch Weapon default to? What about the Activate button default? Or the Jump default? Any combo they come up with is going to be fraught with just as much difficulty as this current configuration, it's just going to involve multiple buttons.

1 hour ago, TwoWolves said:

Mortal Kombat had ridiculous button combos you had to remember. And then there were button combos for Fatalities. And Babe-alities. And there were multiples of each for each character. How is that not complicated? This is what I am referring to.

Same thing with both Force Unleashed games. Complicated button combinations for pulling off Sith combos. Here's the problem with all these combinations that intersect with human psychology: People will learn one or two that they like and work really well most of the time, and generally stick to them. Why do we need multiples of combos, when at most, three or four generally suffice? 

Pretty sure it's just two buttons, they aren't changing the entire control layout. All they mentioned they were doing was replace channeling button to make room for a heavy attack. Like pretty much every standard beat'em up.

1 hour ago, TwoWolves said:

Infested have a tendency to swarm, and jumping through them does no good if there's more behind them and there's nowhere to go. I thought it only knocked prone the target you had on your cursor, not surrounding enemies. Roll is fine out in the open when you're not cornered or swarmed and monkey piled. I'll have to try the bullet jump next time. 

Could've sworn I knocked over two guys in front of me with the the divekick. I'll try and test it out later.

Bullet jump does blast damage in a radius. So if they are close enough it should knock them down.

[ganjou234]

I'm very concerned on the way channeling will go.

• Blocking/Timed Parrying should be available in "Primary" weapon and "Secondary" weapon modes, block/quick-parry anytime, channel only when in melee mode. Quick melee on another button.
• Channeled blocking should not be combined with blocking, it will make the Blocking% of weapons useless.
• Channeling mechanics as of now is good, you channel and get a boost at the cost of energy. However the mods and effects are quite subpar (exempting Lifestrike since it's good even when only at rank 1).
  • Buff channeling mods (ex. Killing Blow, Focused Defence..etc).
    • Focused Defence can be useful by giving a flat addition to armor when channeling (maybe +600 armor just like Arcane Guardian).
      • Make this a flat modifier give 100/200/400/600 armor on levels 0/1/2/3 to make it worth taking on low armor warframes.
    • Mods like True Punishment, Enduring Strike, and Corrupt Charge need to be a flat additive amount (just like Shattering Justice, EntropyBurst, and Cat's Eyes).
      • This will help both low-crit/low-status weapons and high-crit/high-status weapons.
    • Related mods like Energy Channel need to have it's damage caps removed and limited to Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attacks, the 200 damage cap is severely limiting..
    • Mods like Parry and Reflection need to add to the combo counter or have a different effect.
      • Parry - Explode in a 5m radius inflicting a blast proc and dealing 300 blast damage when successfully parrying a melee strike or a knock-back/knockdown effect.
      • Reflection - Gain +1 to the combo counter for each enemy hit by a reflected attack.
  • Make a whole separate mod page for channeling.
  • Buff the base channeling multipliers of weapons.
  • Create a Channeling mod that increases the reach of melee weapons. (200% reach on-channeled melee).

However if you're committed in removing the channeling button then an easy implementation of "channeling" is by the use of the Combo Counter + (Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop Attack).

• Consume 1x level from the combo counter and X amount of energy to gain the bonus effects of channeling by performing a Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack.
  • example: Combo Counter = 2x, Energy Drain = 10.
    • Result: 1 Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack will perform a "channeled strike" consuming 1x level from the 2x combo counter and 10 energy from the Warframe.
    • Channeled Strikes will gain bonuses from the Channeling Mods in the Channeling Modpage and + Melee Weapon Mods + Previous Combo Counter (ex. 2x). 
• Perform a regular Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack at 0 combo counter.
• Gain a full Combo level (+1x) to the Combo Counter by successfully performing a complete melee combo on an enemy. Each Quick Melee and Melee hits still add +1 per successful strike.
• Gain +1 combo when blocking attacks, and +1X level to the combo counter when quick parrying knockdowns/melee strikes.

[(PSN)WeeMalk5]

I am one of those piayers that just use quick melee lets say noob style. For me combos and watching combo meter is not important or necessary.

But somehow now and then i pull off combos by accident which is fun and most important is the combo counter is still stacking in the background gives great satisfaction as I see damage numbers ramp up.

Basically I play simple style, I do nothing higher than sorties, but melee is very strong currently and imo its brilliant. I dont have the need to focus on combo counter or even see it, its just there.

Making all melee weapons stronger out of the box is a bit of a concern, I feel others weapons will be used a lot less. Hopefully not to the point of semi redundancy. Risky transaction there.

Plus simple quick melee style players, which can also apply to many new players will have to pay some attention to combo count and understand when and where to expend your stack in the proposed new mechanic. Something that has never needed any learning before. 

To give this perspective I played probably over years without even knowing there were combos or a combo counter or chanelling. Either info wasnt in game or I missed it or didnt understand it.

Perhaps it will be in the common form of many other games when you are notifed that your 'super is full', good, but not that warframe uniqueness.

Just saying from a simple dudes or noobs perspective. Main melee system is solid currently, perhaps only combos and channeling be looked at.

[ganjou234]

10 hours ago, TheKianL said:

I just don't like how all your combo points will go to heavies...

Like some people have said, it messes up the "blood rush + body count" combo and it makes really fun, high crit chance weapons (like Venka Prime) a lot less satisfying, even if the base damage goes up. I just love seeing those yellow crits go to orange, orange to red, then seeing everyone die.

The power man, I literally never use heavy attacks. I get that DE is trying to find a balance between heavy attacks and actually make people use them, butI don't think that's the best way to do it. It'll kill melee at it is. 

I agree, the combo points should affect normal attacks too and not be limited to heavy attacks.

But to avoid spam I think it would be best to make Heavy/Slide/Wall/Slam attacks consume 1 level from the combo counter.

Since I think their planning to remove the channeling button, but keeping channeling as a mechanic - then an easy implementation of "channeling" is by the use of the Combo Counter + (Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop Attack).

• Consume 1x level from the combo counter and X amount of energy to gain the bonus effects of channeling by performing a Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack.
  • example: Combo Counter = 2x, Energy Drain = 10.
    • Result: 1 Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack will perform a "channeled strike" consuming 1x level from the 2x combo counter and 10 energy from the Warframe.
    • Channeled Strikes will gain bonuses from the Channeling Mods in the Channeling Modpage and + Melee Weapon Mods + Previous Combo Counter (ex. 2x). heavy attacks already have a 3x multiplier too.
  • Perform a regular Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack at 0 combo counter. Regular Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attacks add +1 to combo counter.
• Gain a full Combo level (+1x) to the Combo Counter by successfully performing a complete melee combo on an enemy. Each Quick Melee and Melee hits still add +1 per successful strike.
• Gain +1 combo when blocking attacks, and +1X level to the combo counter when quick parrying knockdowns/melee strikes.
• Make a whole separate mod page for channeling.
• Buff the base channeling multipliers of weapons.
• Create a Channeling mod that increases the reach of melee weapons. (200% reach on-channeled strike).

With this if you're at 3x combo and you decide to spam  spin attacks you'll do more damage due to the channeling effects but if you spin three times then you'll lose all the accumulated combo. (1st spin will do 3x overall damage + Channeling Effects, 2nd spin will do 2x + channeling effects, 3rd spin will do 1.5x + channeling effects).

[TwoWolves]

lol I play it for zero of those reasons, pure and simple. Warframe for me, first and foremost, is an operatic sci-fi Skyrim for me to explore. That's the main reason I follow the storyline. I like seeing and exploring new enviornment configurations; this is the key to why Warframe isn't boring while grinding, I'm convinced, because it was the same way in SkyForge. 

However, reading the last few posts has been enlightening, and I have a suggestion for my idea of making combos a basic form for everyone that is "flavored" stylistically by each frame in a unique fashion. For instance, Nezha brings fire to the table; his combos, therefore, would be expected to have fire-based damage and effects. Put them on a wheel of eight instead of four as the powers go, tie it to the L2 button, tie sprinting to the degree of angle on the left stick instead of a button to sprint (so you can sprint if you push it all the way forward) and, if you have to, use the L3 button to tie a sprint-toggle to. 

Bam, problem solved. No complicated button possibilities, just fairly easy to fire off combos when the meter hits the end. That way, the mods can be tweaked independently after the combos are nailed down, allowing for even greater variation of combos in an incremental fashion.

[MuscleBob]

On ‎2018‎-‎06‎-‎25 at 9:30 PM, ganjou234 said:

I agree, the combo points should affect normal attacks too and not be limited to heavy attacks.

But to avoid spam I think it would be best to make Heavy/Slide/Wall/Slam attacks consume 1 level from the combo counter.

Since I think their planning to remove the channeling button, but keeping channeling as a mechanic - then an easy implementation of "channeling" is by the use of the Combo Counter + (Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop Attack).

• Consume 1x level from the combo counter and X amount of energy to gain the bonus effects of channeling by performing a Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack.
  • example: Combo Counter = 2x, Energy Drain = 10.
    • Result: 1 Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack will perform a "channeled strike" consuming 1x level from the 2x combo counter and 10 energy from the Warframe.
    • Channeled Strikes will gain bonuses from the Channeling Mods in the Channeling Modpage and + Melee Weapon Mods + Previous Combo Counter (ex. 2x). heavy attacks already have a 3x multiplier too.
  • Perform a regular Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attack at 0 combo counter. Regular Heavy/Spin/Wall/Drop attacks add +1 to combo counter.
• Gain a full Combo level (+1x) to the Combo Counter by successfully performing a complete melee combo on an enemy. Each Quick Melee and Melee hits still add +1 per successful strike.
• Gain +1 combo when blocking attacks, and +1X level to the combo counter when quick parrying knockdowns/melee strikes.
• Make a whole separate mod page for channeling.
• Buff the base channeling multipliers of weapons.
• Create a Channeling mod that increases the reach of melee weapons. (200% reach on-channeled strike).

With this if you're at 3x combo and you decide to spam  spin attacks you'll do more damage due to the channeling effects but if you spin three times then you'll lose all the accumulated combo. (1st spin will do 3x overall damage + Channeling Effects, 2nd spin will do 2x + channeling effects, 3rd spin will do 1.5x + channeling effects).

I can't say much else other than: Damn, that's a good idea.

[Gebunator]

What I also want to see is more freedom of movement when attacking. With most (especially heavy weapons) weapons and stances, the warframe moves forward while attacking, so it makes feel it clunky to fight with those said weapons.

Nikana's tranquil fury stance is good example of freedom of movement while attacking as you can seamlessly move around during the combos, even the lunge attack, or the forward motion can be denied by moving. Something like that for all weapons, though with heavy blades, the movement should be slower or not as fluid.. But still, giving us navigation room to keep positioning better would be nice.

Also, while at it.. switching weapons oughta be alotta faster by default and on that.. I come to another suggestion

 

Only small weapons would have a "quick melee" when you are wielding firearm(s) that require both hands, daggers and such would be quick to employ so quick melee would use the daggers.. But with rifles and akimbo guns, it'll be pistol whipping and buttstroking. Meleeing with firearms wouldn't be as effective as with real melee weapons, but would have somesort of knockbacking and knockdowing to get some distance. Hey, maybe even open up a possibility for buttstroking mods. I can see it..
 Mod that gives increased damage or other effect after succesful buttsroking.. Leading to smacking a grineer with Tigris' stock and then blasting him and his buddies away with empowered shots

 

Also, more type of canceling. Like if heavy attack button is introduced, one could cancel light attack spam into a block and maybe get a counter-attack finisher out of it to reward timing and skill. Canceling combos with rolls, movement abilities of warframes and whatnot. Could even go DMC route and have "style" meter to replace combo counter, the more varied and more cancely your string of attacks are, the more damage you end up doing or something?

[TwoWolves]

And also, hand grenades.

Because I want to be able to beat a grineer to a fraction of his life, then finish him by shoving a grenade at him and laughing as I slide away. Plus, a whole new frame could be developed around the idea of using sticky hand-grenades and demolition in general. Why don't we get to fire rocket launchers?

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

18 hours ago, TwoWolves said:

And also, hand grenades.

Because I want to be able to beat a grineer to a fraction of his life, then finish him by shoving a grenade at him and laughing as I slide away. Plus, a whole new frame could be developed around the idea of using sticky hand-grenades and demolition in general. Why don't we get to fire rocket launchers?

Vauban has grenades.

We do have rocket launcher... Ogris.

[Zavenosk]

Thought: What if there was a channeling mod for a "lock-on" attack akin to what currently exists on archwing, perhaps with a damage boost for the initial rushing attack.  It'd be neat to combine with blood-rush-esque builds, zooming from enemy to enemy. 

On a related note: Acolyte Mods in general need to be looked at, the melee meta in general is pretty much built around them (and condition overload), which is bad enough before you consider that they're limited time* mods.

*terms and conditionz

[TwoWolves]

25 minutes ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

Vauban has grenades.

We do have rocket launcher... Ogris.

Why only vauban? Every single grineer and corpus type can throw them, so why shouldn't every single frame?

Any Corpus equivalent of the ogris?

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

31 minutes ago, TwoWolves said:

Why only vauban? Every single grineer and corpus type can throw them, so why shouldn't every single frame?

Any Corpus equivalent of the ogris?

Can every corpus and grineer use powers?

 

Cirpus equivalent.... Opticor

[SteveCutler]

I'm all for adjusting the mechanics, but please for the love of everything consider how the combo counter changes will affect Atlas's Landslide (and other similar abilities). Please either make them continue to benefit from the combo counter, or buff them up to compensate.

[CuteFoxyFox]

So these changes are really interesting!

I was never a melee-type-of-a-person but still I like to use Nikana sometimes. But as a player for 4 years I would like to add something from me too.

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Stances

So What are we exacly aiming in stances? Are combos gonna be made E-Mouse-E-E? Or are we still goin to have Hold E or Pause?

Personally I really really really hate Hold E and E pause. Usually melee is just here to cut through tons of enemies and feel like a boss.

But those Holds E etc are usually clunky and honestly I didnt seen anyone using it (I might be wrong).

Would be happy to see them replaced with new possiblities you are creating!

E-Mouse-E-E-Jump E

E-E-Block-E

Forward-E-E-Jump-E

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Slam Attacks/Diving attacks

I always loved to use slam attacks and was really happy to see new change for them.

Being able to aim and fly to the location is sick! But my question is:

Are stance actually goin to use any of these? Are we going to get a stance with combo like:

E-E-Jump-E-E

2 melee atacks, jump, slam and stance combo still goin after slam attack

Would be cool to see it in a new Polearm stances since they have tons of range!

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Blocking/Channeling
So I think we could introduce more Parry mods here. Only few players know you can Parry an enemy with Channeling block.

How about we add it as a full and usefull feature? Maybe we could parry about 20 enemies in once and weapons could have something like

area finishers? Just a idea to give more options via melee!

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Mid Air Combat

How about any weapon that is able of dual-wealding could have a combo which knocks up enemies and keeps them in air for maybe 1-2 sec.

This would led to epic combos like "Knock up 20 enemies and shoot-em down" We could get a bonus from Headshots on mid-air enemies

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Options!

So here is what would be my dream to see after some mechanics I proposed

- You can go for Finisher damage and parry - This could let to more parry mods and more finisher mods like "After a finisher ..." - "Finishers gives a buff ..."

- You could go for slam attacks-combos from stances. More mods which do some effects on slam like Bullet jump mods or Sibear slam effect could be introduced here.

- You can go for Dual-wealding and score some mid-air headshots with secondary weapons. Could get mods "If enemy was killed mid-air ..."

 

- One of the most important thing is to see some interesting combos for each weapon type! Polearms could have more slams in their Stances or Combos after spin attacks!

- Throwable weapons could have more mechanics like throwing on heavy attack - weapon stays in enemy's body, we need to take it and without it we fight with fists

- About sparring weapons they should have more mechanics with blocking which is imortant in boxing 😉

- Nikanas could have more dashes, Nikanas are Samurais' swords after all 😛

- Heavy swords could use more spinning or more areal attack to cut enemies around you

- Stafs should have area attacks, go for spins and finishers

- Machetes Could use faster stances and maybe some Jump-E combos also knock ups for some trick with secondaries

- Scythes more attacks that pulls enemies to you

- Warfrans maybe some throwing, some finishers and no useless emotes at the end of the combo (im sorry >_>)

- Gunblades - Maybe combos Jump-E and shooting from air with some slam attacks

- Shields and swords - More blocking mechanics, these weapons should 100% go with parry mods and have more mechanics with blocking!

- Dual swords - Dashes, Jumps, Slams - Just make them as dynamic as you can!

- Whips - Pulling enemies to you and finishes? More range? Defenietly combos from spins "Slide - E - E - Jump - E - Slide"

- Rapiers - Stances should give them special dodges, a bit like limbo ones but smaller also Parry mechanics like on Shield and sword? Core here

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Cant wait to see some epic Melee changes from you in the future

DE ❤️

 

[hooperinius]

Grenades would be fun.

If they are going to force us to perform combos to get combo points (thereby upping our crit chance) then combos need to be reworked. Right now I'd say maybe 1/3rd of all melee combos in stances are actually functional in the "Real" game. There are too many that don't work properly with berserker or when your character is moving and there are plenty which are so complicated that they look like the Konami Code.