Dev Workshop: Virtual Cursor Action Plan

[(XBOX)qOkiwiiOp]

Or

PUT THOSE THINGS BACK WHERE THEY WERE OR SO HELP ME-

Edited June 8, 2018 by (XB1)ItsKiweh

[(PSN)carrey23]

Why do i have to click every single relic to see the rewards and why do we get this changes it was fine how it was.

THIS CHANGES ARE POINTLESS, NO ONE ASKED FOR THIS.

Edited June 8, 2018 by (PS4)carrey23

[(PSN)Vexx757]

I'm sorry but the person that came up with this for consoles is r e t a r d e d at this point. They can see people want it back to the way it was but instead trying to fix the damn problem with hot damn fixes! From here on out everyone should say they want it back the way it was. (and frig it i'm not sorry)

Edited June 8, 2018 by (PS4)Vexx757

[(PSN)fallencomets27]

ugh

Edited June 8, 2018 by (PS4)fallencomets27

[(PSN)IRaQiFiRE]

With 700+h Im so sad to say that today's the last time for me playing warframe.

you destroyed the game and i've waited or WE have waited long time to fix the main problem which is the NEW Virtual Cursor and YOU fixing side problems that come up when you decided  to change a thing that already work perfectly.

 

WE ARE NOT PC USERS!
WE ARE NOT BETA TESTERS !

WE ARE NOT HAPPY AT ALL WITH THE NEW UI!

[(PSN)jacknkh]

There are a few points that I would say about the current condition of the hotfix. 

1) The d-pad is not functional in star chart, which is a big drawback due to the difficulties in selecting the missions in the tabs. (Major)
2) The is one time that I literally cannot switch to any of other warframes even though i selected multiple times. But can be temporary bypassed by exiting the arsenal and re-enter again. (Minor)

2.1 Might be related to the very same feature implemented.While it is good to implement the combination of d-pad and analog sticks in navigating items in arsenal/foundry, For now it is not very smooth in transition between d-pad to analog sticks because players tend to use dpad all the way to browse slowly and analog to browse faster. Current state is the dpad will only reach until the bottom of the shown page, and you need to drag your analog stick down further in order for the d-pad to be "useful" again. 

3) It is much more tedious to retreat from squad now due to the d-pad not functioning well and had to use cursor to leave the squad (Minor)

4) Mod selections is not intuitive enough and needs to use cursor to click and drop to the respectively mods slots. And due to the usage of cursor, it is harder to remove the mods at times, because the focus is at the bottom panel of the mods selection. For now, this part is too clunky to be really helpful to players, in my opinion (Major). 

[(PSN)Ishimura_Elite]

I really wish they'd stop trying to save the new UI and just revert it back to the way it was. But they probably won't, because they think they know better than we do.

[(PSN)jac1jac2]

can we get a button to switch off the virtual cursors on console because it's not able to pick mods and apply them to my build's. I have more than enough points to put them on it just wont let me pick them.

[(PSN)Solenkrios]

Still being forced to use awkward cursor to click on tiny buttons, for example Leave Squad in the Menu. Please allow dpad input to scroll up to that. It did it before, and was semi-intuitive. Currently it is just awkward and can too easily result in not leaving public groups fast enough, who will force start mission timers for the next mission they select, dragging you into a mission. It isn’t that this is common but if it can happen at all, due to a frustrating UI, that’s not good.

 

Please go over void fissure reward screens with a fine toothed comb. I tried one after the changes and the menu did not let me change the reward, it was stuck on the prime part my relic brought. I could move the selection to other players’ relics but not select them. As we only have a few seconds to select rewards and cannot exit and re-enter the menu to fix bugs, this is really bad. If I miss out on a rare prime part due to the UI messing up...well let me be frank this is a deal breaker, even if it only happens once in a blue moon. I’ll add that the old UI never did this.

 

Overall, this is still a very clumsy and short sighted change. If this was intended to go with a brand new UI revamp, it should not have been forced before that revamp appeared. As it was executed this way, I now have much less faith UI 2.0 will be anything but more of the same mess.

Edited June 9, 2018 by (PS4)Solenkrios
Clarification

[(PSN)RWalls91]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Solenkrios said:

If this was intended to go with a brand new UI revamp, it should not have been forced before that revamp appeared. As it was executed this way, I now have much less faith UI 2.0 will be anything but more of the same mess. 

I think a lot of people are in that same boat with you. This impending UI at this point might as well be considered 'make or break' for console players.

Considering the last couple days I think I should start a swear jar. Think I would have been at nearly triple figures by now.

[(PSN)GrottanGo]

On 2018-06-06 at 11:27 PM, (PS4)azul86sapphire said:

Thank you. You have proven once more to be a developer team worthy of acknowledgement. You are a team that listens to your communuty, and I, for one, am greatly appreciative of it.

or... they simply realized just how bad this rework was. It's amazing how it could even pass the "thought" stage, lol. it's just... terrible.

[(XBOX)DS Monkfish]

Chat issues with this cursor thing: links are unreliable. I can usually click on one link successfully, but then have to exit and re-enter chat to get another link to work.

Clicking on a name in the main chat panel brings up the usual options (talk, invite, etc) but it's tricky getting the cursor to land on the correct option, especially if you increase the cursor speed to make it less painful. And if you do manage to select the desired option, it doesn't work. Instead, you need to select the name from the name panel. Same issue with getting that horrible cursor onto the right option.

The alphabet panel... sure, you can use the d-pad to select the letter you want to jump to, but it does nothing unless you carefully maneuver the cursor over the letter. 

This is fiddly enough on my large TV,  god knows what it's like on a small screen.

Ugh.

[(XBOX)CANADA PR1ME]

Since not everyone enjoys this new cursor update, I think that there should be an option to choose to use it or use the old way.

 

[(PSN)Solenkrios]

13 minutes ago, (XB1)Brice1969 said:

Since not everyone enjoys this new cursor update, I think that there should be an option to choose to use it or use the old way.

 

As someone mentioned a few posts ago, this whole issue is a make or break issue for console players, at least it is for me. And this bit right here is it in a nutshell. Either we get a toggle to the old version that is 100% unchanged, or the whole new thing gets dumped and we just have the old style. The new one is infested(haha) with far too many problems that will cause lasting frustration from even a short play session. I straight up do not accept it.

Edited June 9, 2018 by (PS4)Solenkrios

[(PSN)dennezu0424]

 

i don't want to play warframe with this terrible new-cursor-style UI

in fact, the number of booting warframe became very fewer since they added this

many people are confusing and complaining too in our japanese warframe community, so please REMOVE THAT CURSOR UI AND STOP TO CARE ABOUT IT

i am so sad to HATE this game and DE for the first time

https://imgur.com/a/Oxy5xye

[(PSN)willitical]

all i really want is to be able to use the dpad to navigate again, right now it can only navigate what's on the screen, and when trading, we have to select there name, then hit square to trade, used to be just 1 button, once we get that i think we will have everything we want, also the cursor is a bit slow, so maybe a cursor speed setting? now there is something i just realized recently, we can now hover over ppls names in the chat window and select talk, so now when trading we don't have to find them in the player list anymore, im super exited about that

[(PSN)jedion]

1. Trying to close a window (PM) is a bit hard since we're not use to a cursor, and aiming it to the X to close the window with your LEFT thumb is even harder. Trying to leave a team you cant just go up with your dpad like before, you need a cursor after you reach navigation because from there it wont go up any higher >.<

2. Have you tried modding your weapon? christ! its a mess!!!!!

    sometimes L1/R1 works, sometimes it doesnt, sometimes it works for the mods below, and sometimes it doesnt, sometimes it works for the configuration (builds) above and sometimes it doesnt. some times it doesnt work at all, and no matter how much your spam L1/R1 nothing works.. I tried to rewrite the names of my builds and the option is no longer there under R3, they put it on the top right a tiny icon >.< . ohh and not to mention the REMOVE ALL MOD button that you thought was just to remove 1 mod, be careful you'll end up removing all your mods and nuke your build. we never had remove all mods options before and because of that triangle is always just remove that one mod and they put the option on the same button >.< not very wise. its like having a reset button next to the button that is highly used when modding.

Sometimes the triangle (remove) doesnt show up at all... im trying to remove a mod but the option to take it out isnt there... so my only choice was to drag it and find an open slot >.< the Modding option for frames and weapon is a Hit and Miss slot machine

DE at this point its a waste of time trying to fix it, just put back the old settings we are fine with it this new ui is just not for consoles, its meant to be played on PC. no matter how hard you push a square shape into a circle they just dont fit

Edited June 10, 2018 by (PS4)jedion

[(XBOX)Chuss The Red]

The cursor works well and i am looking forward to the UI overhaul shown in all these recent Devstreams.

 

Huh, didn't take long before people started attacking. "championing it like it was a piece of inspired genius." Apparently i'm a white knight now too because i have no issue with something that hardly changed the game at all because some people are struggling to adapt to it.

Edited June 11, 2018 by (XB1)Chuss The Red

[(PSN)Ishimura_Elite]

9 hours ago, (XB1)Chuss The Red said:

The cursor works well and i am looking forward to the UI overhaul shown in all these recent Devstreams.

Can't tell if trolling...

[Blakrana]

On 2018-06-06 at 10:07 PM, [DE]Danielle said:

That said, the following is a list of priority changes (based largely on your feedback) that we’ve started working on implementing:  

• Restoring button shortcuts in the Arsenal. 
• Adding content preview on hover in Relic selection screens (choosing a Relic is done by selecting it). 
• Changing “preview” and “select” to be independent of one another in the Arsenal item selection (separate bindings displayed in bottom right of screen in Arsenal).
• Right Trigger will rotate your Warframe in the Arsenal while browsing item grid. 
• Removing the need to hold down X (PS4) / A (XB1) + drag in order to select a Mod in the Modding UI. Instead, selecting a Mod will make it stick to your cursor like it used to, allowing you to move it with cursor control or D-Pad. Additionally, hitting “back” will deselect the Mod from your cursor without exiting the screen. 
• Fixing D-Pad landing on invisible items on the bottom of grids (long term goal as requires a lot of testing for a global change).

Whilst it's useful to see the restoration/intended restoration of functionality that was there before these changes...I want to point something out on the immediate level; according to Steam Big Picture mode, Warframe is treating the Right Stick as a Joystick Mouse input, which is likely responsible for the severe sensitivity of the Y axis I noticed regardless of efforts to remedy it in game. Furthermore, whilst Steam Big Picture thankfully has provided me the means to rectify this (Manage Game - Configure Controller - change Right Stick to register as Joystick Move), along with rebinding my controller to my own preferences, this is not helpful to those who don't play Warframe through the Steam service; it's not possible to rebind the controls in game at present, which is a severe oversight in efforts to do...whatever it is is you're aiming at doing with the UI.

I sincerely implore you to sit down and play the game with a controller as it is currently, however. The cursor does not improve controller access of menus, as we were mostly alright navigating with the Dpad or Left stick and our face button shortcuts; Y/Triangle for Upgrades, X/Square for Appearance, RT for abilities (that seems to still work, at least). Having to hover over what used to be a simple shortcut? That's a regression, hence why you're going to be restoring it as it's not improving the matter. Please, if he's not involved already, get @[DE]Jim to look things over and point out what's not feasible, going to work, or helpful for a controller user, seeing as he's been the guy on controller related issues. Though apologies if putting too much spotlight on you Jim; it comes from appreciation of the help in the past, not proverbial bus tossing.

God Eater Resurrection and Rage Burst. Dragon's Dogma: Dark Arisen. Dust: An Elysian Tail. Transistor. Middle Earth: Shadow of Mordor. Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky. Sanctum 2. Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning.

If you're not sure how to address controller friendly UI that also works with Keyboard and Mouse input, especially on the fly, the above games are those I find good personal examples to that issue. Play, test, make notes on what's good and functional, and what's not. Do the same with Warframe with a controller on PC, Xbox One and PS4, noting where there's problems on Menus, where there's issues with consistency as some sliders don't have a way to manipulate them without trying to manually slide with the cursor...so either add in arrows such as found in the Appearance tabs for Regalia positions, or make it possible to select these options and increase/decrease with the bumpers like with Syndicate offerings.

Aesthetic improvements are nice and all...but so long as we sacrifice functionality for an aesthetic, we're worse off than before. We can make a pretty cast for a broken limb, but a broken limb is still a broken limb regardless. The planned restorations are just an example of what's been lost in this effort. If you're really determined to have this cursor be omnipresent, I guess a compromise could be that it serves as a highlighter when using a controller/Arrow key inputs.

Should you go that route, make it adapt to the highlighted object as, for example, actually being able to see which cell is being selected in colour palettes is somewhat difficult currently as it covers the desired colour and its neighbours; as a colourblind player, this doesn't help as I use my DIY colour chart to figure out what I'm looking at, hence needing to see each individual cell to narrow it down, not guess roughly what is what underneath a big, obnoxious rhombus (also, if this UI work could lead to some labelling as found in the Dojo colouring options, that'd be swell, being long overdue at this point).

Having to fight a cursor, with an input that is not intended for such inputs, isn't conducive to good Controller friendly UI experiences. Brainstorm around the notion that a controller is limited in relative options and doesn't benefit from being treated as a "faux mouse" in fixing those limitations. Simulating a mouse is more hassle than it's worth, even if you want things to look the same regardless of input methods; sometimes, compromise or surrender are the better options in design. That, and controllers don't really need to be forced to "double click" through menus, as you're certainly not forcing it on Mice users last I heard. It's slow and pointless.

Also...a general note. In the past, when you've introduced new mechanics and such within quests, you've failed to verify that they work with controller until after at least a week post launch; Second Dream, War Within, Chains of Harrow...not the best track record I'm afraid. If you're going to claim Full Controller Support on your Steam Page, if you're going to tell us here that these changes are intended to make things better for Controller users in some way...Actually test things with a controller. In the long run, having both K&M and Controller functional at launches of new updates means you can get the input on what's going wrong despite that at the same time, rather than the loop of "Controller doesn't work at all, patch, then wait for the rest of the problems to come in" you've constantly fallen into in the past, ultimately resulting in delays for the Console teams to the feedback most pertinent to them.

Steve describes what you're trying to do as opening Pandora's box, but I'd disagree; what you've done is opened and closed Pandora's box, and you now need to open it again to remedy what you've done. Putting a pretty picture on it isn't going to suffice so long as we've functionality locked away from us as it stands.

Any event, apologies for going on, as always.

Edited June 11, 2018 by Blakrana
Slight grammer

[Ham_Grenabe]

5 hours ago, (PS4)Ishimura_Elite said:

Can't tell if trolling...

Variation of Skarka's Law: for every bad idea, there's always someone out there championing it like it was a piece of inspired genius.

[(PSN)VoidWalkerPrime]

On June 6, 2018 at 5:07 PM, [DE]Danielle said:

It’s been over 24 hours since we launched the UI and virtual cursor changes in Update 22.20.6 on PS4 and Xbox One, and we’ve been closely reading your feedback (Forums, Twitter, in-game chat, etc.) and furiously taking notes as it continues to roll in in droves. Coinciding feedback points from our PC Controller users have also been included in our readings, as the goal of unifying controls across all Platforms was our intention from the start within the future greater UI overhaul scheme.  

But we do feel we missed the mark on this first attempt. So, while we are keeping to our original goal, we understand that in order to fully meet it improvements are needed. 

That said, the following is a list of priority changes (based largely on your feedback) that we’ve started working on implementing:  

• Restoring button shortcuts in the Arsenal. 
• Adding content preview on hover in Relic selection screens (choosing a Relic is done by selecting it). 
• Changing “preview” and “select” to be independent of one another in the Arsenal item selection (separate bindings displayed in bottom right of screen in Arsenal).
• Right Trigger will rotate your Warframe in the Arsenal while browsing item grid. 
• Removing the need to hold down X (PS4) / A (XB1) + drag in order to select a Mod in the Modding UI. Instead, selecting a Mod will make it stick to your cursor like it used to, allowing you to move it with cursor control or D-Pad. Additionally, hitting “back” will deselect the Mod from your cursor without exiting the screen. 
• Fixing D-Pad landing on invisible items on the bottom of grids (long term goal as requires a lot of testing for a global change).

This is just the start of what you can expect in terms of changes. We’ve been hard at work to get these launched on console as soon as possible (in a hotfix tonight!), while some changes may come in later hotfixes/updates as they require more time to implement and test. PC Tenno, you can expect these changes in a future update (along with the D-Pad support originally announced in the dedicated Dev Workshop). We will be watching for your feedback on the above changes as well.

We do also want to thank you tremendously for your patience as we continue to work on changes. There’s no denying this was a rocky start with the original launch, but we’re hopeful that with some time and care, we can get it to a much better place for all of you.

5:22 PM ET Edit: Hotfixes have been deployed on PS4 and XB1!

Update has side affects in mod section. Mods vanish while selecting or scrolling and can only reappear by exiting arsenal and reentering 

[(XBOX)War Captain]

Please also bring back the colors for the button icons. 

[(PSN)VoidWalkerPrime]

On June 6, 2018 at 5:07 PM, [DE]Danielle said:

It’s been over 24 hours since we launched the UI and virtual cursor changes in Update 22.20.6 on PS4 and Xbox One, and we’ve been closely reading your feedback (Forums, Twitter, in-game chat, etc.) and furiously taking notes as it continues to roll in in droves. Coinciding feedback points from our PC Controller users have also been included in our readings, as the goal of unifying controls across all Platforms was our intention from the start within the future greater UI overhaul scheme.  

But we do feel we missed the mark on this first attempt. So, while we are keeping to our original goal, we understand that in order to fully meet it improvements are needed. 

That said, the following is a list of priority changes (based largely on your feedback) that we’ve started working on implementing:  

• Restoring button shortcuts in the Arsenal. 
• Adding content preview on hover in Relic selection screens (choosing a Relic is done by selecting it). 
• Changing “preview” and “select” to be independent of one another in the Arsenal item selection (separate bindings displayed in bottom right of screen in Arsenal).
• Right Trigger will rotate your Warframe in the Arsenal while browsing item grid. 
• Removing the need to hold down X (PS4) / A (XB1) + drag in order to select a Mod in the Modding UI. Instead, selecting a Mod will make it stick to your cursor like it used to, allowing you to move it with cursor control or D-Pad. Additionally, hitting “back” will deselect the Mod from your cursor without exiting the screen. 
• Fixing D-Pad landing on invisible items on the bottom of grids (long term goal as requires a lot of testing for a global change).

This is just the start of what you can expect in terms of changes. We’ve been hard at work to get these launched on console as soon as possible (in a hotfix tonight!), while some changes may come in later hotfixes/updates as they require more time to implement and test. PC Tenno, you can expect these changes in a future update (along with the D-Pad support originally announced in the dedicated Dev Workshop). We will be watching for your feedback on the above changes as well.

We do also want to thank you tremendously for your patience as we continue to work on changes. There’s no denying this was a rocky start with the original launch, but we’re hopeful that with some time and care, we can get it to a much better place for all of you.

5:22 PM ET Edit: Hotfixes have been deployed on PS4 and XB1!

Stay updated on fixes/changes in the official feedback megathread: 

 

Not even sure how to explain this but was jus modding a frame and deselected a mod and my entire build vanished, Jus POOF

Couldnt do anything but exit arsenal then my WARFRAME vanished

[(PSN)Sr_Zoltan]

The new cursor controlled UI on console is awesome! I really love it! Though it took some hours to get used to it, to override the muscle-memory, but it's really good. And after those hotfixes that brought back the buttons shortcuts and some other tweaking, well it's really changed for the better. Some more little tweaks/fixes are still necessary to be perfect, but anyways: Good job DE! It's faster and more convenient then the previous setup.

Thank you!

I've started to use this the moment it came out and almost immediately realized that it supports now full keyboard/mouse control even in the missions, which is awesome! Well, we cannot change the layout yet (the "defaults" are configured), which is a real setback and doesn't make this way of control viable over the controller, but it's very promising and I cannot wait for the further changes that make this option a real alternative.

Once again: thank you for these awesome changes and keep up the good work! 🙂

Edited June 12, 2018 by (PS4)Sr_Zoltan