Helicoptering : Why Is It Still In The Game? O_O

[Kestral9999]

I completely agree with everything OP said.

Good for you, you're one of the 50%ers.

[RealPandemonium]

Yeah I've put in 1400 hours or so, and played before wall running existed.  I agree it is more fun and often more useful than coptering, but sometimes coptering just makes it pointless.  Fun aside, people rely on coptering though because wall running, except for shortcuts and vaulting (which is another admitted bug), is not faster than coptering.  And because of stamina drain.

 

However, some of the arguments for keeping coptering are that people actually like it.  So any system to remove it and replace it with wall running, even if it's ultimately more effective, will feel like a nerf and a slowdown to them.  So what I'd really like is to see

 

1.) regular movement made more worthwhile - give me less of a reason to copter

2.) alternatives to coptering that look more fluid and offer more control and are less finger contortion simulator 2013

3.) remove a lot of the hidden map hangups that make movement fail for no good reason (like grabbing a hold of a random spike or being unable to jump when next to a ledge, or landing on the 1 inch wide ledge above a doorway instead of sliding down into it or triggering the vault animation on a two inch obstacle (for those who haven't turned that crap off)

4.) normalize melee jumping so that the reason to pick a weapon isn't how well you can jump with it (and often the logic of which weapons are better just isn't there)

5.) improve parkour so that you have greater control and you are rewarded for mastering it (let's hope parkour 2.0 isn't a let down)

 

i'd be fine with coptering even staying in for posterity if those 5 things are met.  If people still want to use it, fine, but they should have better options.

 

One of the most fun things to me about moving in this game is when things work out and you can blaze through stuff.  Your wall runs all work, your jumps don't get stopped by a two-inch ledge, you don't get stopped cold by a door jamb, etc.  After so long of dealing with the random non-fluid glitches (like watch Megan's run on the last devstream, you can see she gets messed up a few times by it), I'm just worn out on it.

To clarify, I want coptering to stay (and I don't doubt your movement capabilities either,) but to suggest that we are reduced to a snail's pace when we can't copter is to be dishonest.

Edited March 31, 2015 by RealPandemonium

[-SLX-J3tAc3]

 

 

 

You'll always get people with differing playstyles in coop games. Nerfing the one you don't like is not the answer.

There will always be people who raise objections to playstyles they don't feel fits into the game - telling them not to give feedback is not the answer.

[BloodForTheBloodGods]

 

The problem isn't with coptering. It's with the movement system as a whole.

 

Also, don't bother trying to give suggestions based on what ninjas would do. As far as common idea is concerned, ninjas also wouldn't tear through hordes on enemies using massive battleaxes, laser cannons and space magic.

 

To answer your title; it's still in the game because like slide jump launching, it's a sort of 'exploit' to the movement system that has wormed its way into core gameplay. Contrary to popular belief, coptering is not solely or even mostly used as a means of transport only.

 

You'll always get people with differing playstyles in coop games. Nerfing the one you don't like is not the answer.

 

There will always be people who raise objections to playstyles they don't feel fits into the game - telling them not to give feedback is not the answer.

 

 

Telling people what's not the answer, is never the answer.

[Pizzarugi]

4. It makes Warframe a racing game, not a co-op game..

How do you think frost and rhino players feel when they're teamed with loki and other faster frames? Take away coptoring, and fast frames will be yelling at you to move your &#! because you're so slow. Good luck maining slow frames and farming bosses for resources, when everyone has started the extraction timer while you're still trying to reach the boss room and collect the drops.

Coptoring should only be removed if all frames have the same movement speed, players shouldn't be forced to bring sprint boosting mods just to compensate for having a slow frame.

[Swailwort]

Personally, I don't like coptering, and I find ot silly. Yet, i do that while fighting.

it breaks immersion, to be fair. Imagine Assassin's Creed with Coptering and Directional Melee.... No point to parkour at all.

I use my Zephyr when playing with other people, just so i can keep up. And i am one of those players that want to kill everything, and look for every secret in almost any game mode.

#RemoveCoptering2015.

[SIDESTRE4M]

The true master can combine coptering, directional melee and parkouring. However my gripe is that a huge chunk of parkouring can be just skipped with very little effort and thus make it nearly meaningless.

 

The other point is that the gap between coptering weapons and non-copter weapons is way bigger than between Loki and Thrax Rhino and to a point where it can be seen digital. Copter yes/quite or just no.

 

I think Warframe ridicules itself with the existence of coptering. On the other hand I can understand that grind can get tedious and removing coptering hits for the most part the rather poor tenno.

 

Beats me... Coptering is a problem of many interconnectied problems and the discussion is both emotional and rational.

 

Some people see it as a tool to save time, others see fun in it, another one's immersion is broken because of the glitchy movement.

 

I'm looking forward to the upcoming parkouring rework. At this point I'm rather interested in a quality game and that includes quality visual representation and proper mechanics.

Edited April 13, 2015 by SIDESTRE4M

[digritz]

Helicoptering is the worst thing to happen to Warframe. It is the most annoying thing ever. And here is why.

 

1. It gives people a way to get though the levels without doing anything.

 

2. It takes away from actual game play.

 

3. It makes it very hard to PLAY the game if someone is helicoptering in Capture or Spy missions. You load in, and they have already done half the mission, and are finished it before you can work out whats going on.

 

4. It makes Warframe a racing game, not a co-op game.

 

I don't care if you think helicoptering is cool because it makes you get to the end faster. It takes away from the game FAR FAR more than what it adds, and I hope that with Parkor 2.0, this abomination is removed.

 

When I play the game, I want to PLAY the game, not have to keep up with some rushing !. If I wanted to play a game that was over in 5 seconds, I would go play no other game ever, because that's just stupid. It really dose not help new players, it dose not make the game fun, and it most deftly dose not make it a co-op game.

 

Ninjas are not fast. They are slow, and methodical. They are stealthy. They do not run past every single enemy going 'NA NA, CAN'T CATCH ME'.

 

Please DE, can you fix this anti-social behavior in your game so we can get back to actually having to use teamwork....

It's sure is nice of you to give everyone else who plays this game a voice and letting DE know we want coptering removed so we can all get back to enjoying the game exactly the way you....I mean we want to play it. In case you may not realize it but everything you said could easily be turned around and an argument could be made for the exact opposite.

 

Ho, please. Its not a play-style. Its an exploit, plain and simple.

 

 

That needs a nerf too. :P

By the way is was an exploit but not anymore. It's a part of the game now and DE has said as much. And just like any other skill in a game you need to learn and practice it. No different then if it had been a part of the game since day one of the development. Though I do understand it can be frustrating before you learn it but with a bit of creativity it's simple to macro it to a single keystroke and all trouble is removed from it. Also those that said it's not the only way to get around fast are correct. In fact coptering alone has 5 different methods all giving slightly different results and at varying degrees of difficulty so it's not hard to learn the skill.

[Yorinar]

How do you think frost and rhino players feel when they're teamed with loki and other faster frames? Take away coptoring, and fast frames will be yelling at you to move your ! because you're so slow. Good luck maining slow frames and farming bosses for resources, when everyone has started the extraction timer while you're still trying to reach the boss room and collect the drops.

Coptoring should only be removed if all frames have the same movement speed, players shouldn't be forced to bring sprint boosting mods just to compensate for having a slow frame.

 

To me this is a symptom of how bad regular movement is.  Coptering shouldn't be necessary just to keep up.  I don't think run speed should be frame specific - the mechanism just makes it a matter of who is going to be left behind.  Now some frames might be able to dodge or maneuver better than others, but in terms of pure getting across a map speed, that should be constant.  The fact that slow frames *have* to do finger gymnastics just to keep up is bad design.

[WarKonZ]

I dont understand your cries about coptering. The only thing that is noticeable with this method is capture and well... this mission isnt that cooperative in the first place: kill (easyv)targets--> extract. I would say a change to that mission to make it more challenging instead of removing coptering.

Edited April 13, 2015 by WarKonZ

[-SLX-J3tAc3]

Telling people what's not the answer, is never the answer.

An utterly useless post that's inherently wrong and does nothing to advance the conversation. Go back to playing Dark Souls in your dark room, alright? We're trying to find answers here

Edited April 13, 2015 by -SLX-J3tAc3

[Liverslices]

An utterly useless post that's inherently wrong and does nothing to advance the conversation. Go back to playing Dark Souls in your dark room, alright? We're trying to find answers here

You have failed to recognize one of the oldest arguments in the world my friend. Read up brother.

[Tekka_Croe]

 

I don't mind coptering being available as an avenue of movement.

 

Personally, I tend to play in a slow and methodical manner (and therefore, Solo).  I've spent a lot of time exploring.  I've learned the tiles well.

 

When playing solo, I happily parkour it up.  When playing with pugs, I'll copter if I have to to keep up with the team.

 

Allow others to use their preferred method of movement, and adapt accordingly.  If coptering really rustles your jimmies so severely, then you shouldn't be doing random matchmaking.  Use the recruiting channel, it's there specifically so you can find people you'll enjoy playing with.

[Orbister]

"Back in the day we had to walk to the grocery store! and only sometimes our dads would give us a penny to buy some tapioca candy! Kids these day! all they do is HELICOPTERING AROUND! like they are headless crazy chickens! back in the day we rode bicycles to school! crazy kids with their crazy helicoptering!"

[087SE-Miykhail]

Gotta love how many of you guys are completly ignoring all valid facts against coptering,

ignoring all the points about how it makes many things of the game meaningless,

 

did you guys ever use rush,or some other movement mod,probably not,huh ?

decided to go fast,and picked a frame with high movement speed for it,or one with good abilities to do so,probably not,huh ?

learning maps so you are able to wallrun on certain spots and such to increase your speed,probably not,huh?

ect,ect...  dont wanna repeat myself spinning in circles.

 

but all you guys are basicly saying is,

screw all that content that is in this game,

and the things that i, and some others mentioned earlier,

because: copter!

 

and the funniest thing is,

you are even trying to make it look like it is hard to do ! LOL

making it look like you are incredibly proud that you mastered the highly complicated, fine art, of coptering,

and refuse to let go for whatever content is getting pointless because of it,

you only make it look like you cant go as fast without it.

 

a few of you dont even know that it IS a bug!

Probably cry on another Thread that you want some other Bug fixed,

but threatening DE to leave the game if the Copter BUG gets a fix,

telling some people directly or indirectly to go Copter or play alone with some other ''nubcakes''

things like that show how much you actually care for the Game,and the community,among some other statements.

 

Also,did you know that DE-Scott (i think) openly said that he want Coptering to be gone,

that DE was on it once to have it removed, but people were going crazy about it,

makes it seem like DE actually DO want it to be gone,no?

 

And then theres PvP,

you guys like? yes?

you probably never even had a look at it i guess,

so,screw that content too along with many other things,huh?

Just RoflCopter all over the place in hopes to randomly hit somebody on accident on your way,

makes the PvP super awesome,nothing like a sad,bad,joke at all. lol

 

Rushing,can be done as fast without it,

a tool,a gap closer,it would be still all of that when it would cost stamina,2 copters,no stamina,gotta wait,

or if it would be replaced with an evasion-move,

and even beside that,you guys said it yourself,directional mellee would do the same,and its intentional,so why even keep Coptering at all then?

 

But god forbid Gunplay would become viable in PvP,and you would have to pick and mod a Frame for Speed,learning maps,ect,

there never should be a tradeoff for going really fast,and there never should be a time to improve and learn new things,because... Copter! lol

You probably dont know we are in a grind game, where grinding missions a tousand times make you forget about how cool the jump animation or wall running is and you just want to go to extraction because you need to farm the same mission more 10 times, and SURE you will just cheat about not having coptering, making volt and zephyr into a new level of grind frames, overpopulating the hole game whit volt primes and zephyrs using builds focused on jet stream, duration and power, because NO PROBLEM WE CAN STILL RUN ALL THE WAY TO THE FINAL AS FAST AS COPTER USERS BECAUSE WE ARE SMART.

Man if you want to remove coptering from this game, just think about what will replace it, and think how melee will be more useless them before :)

 

Go on a Ceres mission whitout a warframe that haves an good defensive habilities and try to walk slow and time aim all enemies,

Second state, PVP limitations and balances are there for a reason. They can just remove or slow down coptering on PVP to balance it.

Dont act like we are wrong, its like say now we need to stop using weapons because of the violence on the world, se we need a pacific game where we use magical rainbow powers to turn our enemies into flowers and bees.

This is a ninja game, its made to be fast, ninjas cheats, they are masters on taking advantages on anything. 

[BluelitHalo]

I really hope Parkour 2.0 really buffs the base movement mechanics (i.e. much faster sprint speed, the innate Super Jump that was mentioned on devstreams, less sticky wallrunning that preserves initial momentum, better walljumping, etc.). It gets really tiring coptering and butt-scooting all over the map in order to not move at turtle speed, like picking between two poisons.

Edited April 19, 2015 by Sonitorum

[Orbister]

I really hope Parkour 2.0 really buffs the base movement mechanics (i.e. much faster sprint speed, the innate Super Jump that was mentioned on devstreams, less sticky wallrunning that preserves initial momentum, better walljumping, etc.). It gets really tiring coptering and butt-scooting all over the map in order to not move at turtle speed, like picking between two poisons.

I agree, some maps are ridiculously big for our sprint speed, i also think all frames should have the same speed, having different speed for different frames serves no purpose, it's awkward and brings nothing to the table strategy-wise.

[THND3RZ]

i DISLIKE coptering aswell.It doesn't fit and i don't get how we can do it with 0 stamina.I hope it would be modified to make it a fast attack move but not a way to travel.Parkour should help us to go faster not this...

[Pro3Display]

You load in, and they have already done half the mission, and are finished it before you can work out whats going on.

 

guy recieves end-mission reward on a plate and unhappy about it, jeez

 

Please DE, can you fix this anti-social behavior in your game so we can get back to actually having to use teamwork....

 

what is anti-social here is highly subjective:

going faster than everyone else - anti-social or having a ferrari while others use their ford focus?

forcing everyone to play the game by your rules and not by the rules that the game offers - anti-social or poker?

 

the problem is that poker is pvp that needs you to not only cling to rng but fool your opponent that rng gods favors you instead of him.

even warfame pvp is not poker and rng gods favor the whole squad the same so poker is a wrong answer to the question above

 

it will be there while its there and if its gone something else will come in its place

[Impact6]

First of all, I copter very often. It makes me a lazy person. I like it, I don't have to take the stairs anymore to reach the top quickly. 

Secondly, maybe because the wallrunning itself which was meant to "ignore the stairs" ,  is so slow and clunky is the reason I keep coptering.

Thirdly (I don't know if that's a word), I'm anxious to see Parkour 2.0 , if it will ever come. Because currently, some warframes meant for mobility are just getting  " ***-slapped by copter- pro's ". Take Zephyr for example, THE flying warframe. Her powers are either too slow/inefficient to beat copterers at the moment in my OPINION.

 

 

 

You'll always get people with differing playstyles in coop games. Nerfing the one you don't like is not the answer.

 

But a playstyle that changes the entire pace of the game then? Should you not at least consider something?

Camping is a playstyle. How about exploiting?

 

 

4. It makes Warframe a racing game, not a co-op game.

 

 

That is partly the result of the massive grindfestivities which are i believe encouraged nowadays.

 

The same goes for coptering, deal with it, and please, for the love all that is good, do not start another topic like this again.  It's been done and I'm tired of rehashing the same arguments.

 

Yet if not everybody agrees with your arguments you should make new ones, because the forum is meant for discussion right? So topics will come back if not solved.

 

 

In my opinion, I 'd like to see coptering go aswell (or at least severely nerfed), but with the implementation of a better parkour system.

[087SE-Miykhail]

guy recieves end-mission reward on a plate and unhappy about it, jeez

 

 

what is anti-social here is highly subjective:

going faster than everyone else - anti-social or having a ferrari while others use their ford focus?

forcing everyone to play the game by your rules and not by the rules that the game offers - anti-social or poker?

 

the problem is that poker is pvp that needs you to not only cling to rng but fool your opponent that rng gods favors you instead of him.

even warfame pvp is not poker and rng gods favor the whole squad the same so poker is a wrong answer to the question above

 

it will be there while its there and if its gone something else will come in its place

Players still forget this is a grind game, its all about how fast you can repeat a mission.

Want an slow and harder run? Go nightmare missions, if you run too much, enemies can just kill you punishing rushers.

Or want to remove coptering? Them give better rewards end mission, so we spend like 3x-4x more time in a mission for a huge reward.

[Pro3Display]

Players still forget this is a grind game, its all about how fast you can repeat a mission.

Want an slow and harder run? Go nightmare missions, if you run too much, enemies can just kill you punishing rushers.

Or want to remove coptering? Them give better rewards end mission, so we spend like 3x-4x more time in a mission for a huge reward.

y i know, was playing wf few hours every day to 600in-game hours(i dont remeber tbh), now after about 4 month break i'm here playing 2-4 days a week

[Thalahssalyst]

Players still forget this is a grind game, its all about how fast you can repeat a mission.

Want an slow and harder run? Go nightmare missions, if you run too much, enemies can just kill you punishing rushers.

Or want to remove coptering? Them give better rewards end mission, so we spend like 3x-4x more time in a mission for a huge reward.

Thats have no sense.

[(PSN)OkiroBenihime_]

So because people want to run missions in a timely manner, you want DE to nerf or remove anything that can enable people to complete missions in a timely manner?

Sorry but that's just childish and selfish.

Edited April 24, 2015 by (PS4)BENIHIME32

[Pacheon]

Talking about a Coop game, while joining random people...

 

~Laughing