Six Points of Interest from Dark Sector (2008) to Consider for Warframe

[Mikhael222]

1. The Infested Visuals.

The overall visuals of Dark Sector were incredible, in the sense that they genuinely feel horrifying. While having some minor variations in tints of brown and blue, the overall color shading of the plague is a dark gray. The growths are also very twisted and web-like with egg-like sacs.

But in Warframe, the infestation visuals are perhaps a bit too colorful…..as though a child ate some skittles and then vomited. Maybe if DE ever does a rework on the infestation, the visual style would be something to consider bringing back from the past.

 

2. Show the “Stages” of the Infestation

Aside from the visuals, the other element of Dark Sector’s infestation that Warframe lacks is the development of the infestation, from starting host to final monster.

Dark Sector’s horrifying story progression where we slowly see humans transforming into these beasts over time made the game feel that much more real. Maybe in a future update, you could add chargers and runners in stages of less “infestedness” where they still look mostly Corpus or Grineer, but have lost their minds to the infested. The idle animations where partially-infested humans were eating other humans, and the fight animations where they limped their way toward you were also well done.

Not that I’m an expert in DE’s software, but it doesn’t seem like any major programming changes to the AI would be needed. It would mostly be a visual addition with new variety of 3D models and animations of currently-existing enemy types.

 

3. Edit: Deleted Due to Point Made in First Comment.

 

4. Infested Bosses/Mini-Bosses

Again, I am amazed that monsters like the ones you fight in this game have not yet been added in Warframe. Maybe some day?  These were fantastic.

 

5. Grineer Enemy Units

A Grineer with armor like a Nox, but who carried a devasting machine gun like the one in Dark Sector would be cool (sorry for the bad picture).  Additionally, the shield units were much more effective in Dark Sector than they are in Warframe. Maybe beef them up some?

 

6. Grineer Tanks

Last, but not the least, the quadruped tanks in Dark Sector were interesting as well. Perhaps what the raknoids and the jackals are to the Corpus, these walking tanks could be to the Grineer? And yes I know these tanks were called “Jackals” in Dark Sector, but their visuals in DS look more Grineer.

I feel like the Corpus seriously outrank the Grineer right now in regards to firepower. If the Corpus brought the Profit-takers and the raknoids to the Plains, the Tusk Grineer wouldn’t stand a chance. To "keep the balance," it seems like the Grineer should have equivalent heavy units to combat the heavy Corpus units. Something that looks and behaves like these tanks would be perfect.

Edited January 16, 2019 by Mikhael222

[TARINunit9]

4 minutes ago, Mikhael222 said:

1. The Infested Visuals.

2. Show the “Stages” of the Infestation

3. The Ability to Throw Glaives Like a Boomerang

4. Infested Bosses/Mini-Bosses

1. If they wanted to (or were legally allowed to; they don't actually own darkSector anymore) they would have. They don't want to (or can't), so they didn't

2. While this is a good idea, it seems like DE have decided to go the other direction. Ever lose a Kavor in a Defection mission? It takes less than 20 seconds to fully turn into a full-fledged Infested. Then again, the occasional half-dead Corpus you can find in Eris tilesets are still in the middle of turning, so maybe DE is open to it

3. Please elaborate, I have no idea what you're saying. Either you don't know you CAN throw glaives (just hold the melee button), or you're talking about some gameplay patent that DE don't own anymore

4. That picture you showed looked a lot like Phorid and Lephantis, they're already in the game. But I do agree that we need more Infested bosses

[Mikhael222]

9 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

1. If they wanted to (or were legally allowed to; they don't actually own darkSector anymore) they would have. They don't want to (or can't), so they didn't

2. While this is a good idea, it seems like DE have decided to go the other direction. Ever lose a Kavor in a Defection mission? It takes less than 20 seconds to fully turn into a full-fledged Infested. Then again, the occasional half-dead Corpus you can find in Eris tilesets are still in the middle of turning, so maybe DE is open to it

3. Please elaborate, I have no idea what you're saying. Either you don't know you CAN throw glaives (just hold the melee button), or you're talking about some gameplay patent that DE don't own anymore

4. That picture you showed looked a lot like Phorid and Lephantis, they're already in the game. But I do agree that we need more Infested bosses

1. Woah.  I didn't know that.  But still.....They made it.  Why wouldn't it be legal?  Who'd they sell rights to?

3. My previous knowledge was that the little glaive throw was just a move in the melee combo stance.  I didn't know you could aim and throw it like in Dark Sector......Thanks I'll delete that point.

4. If you've actually played the game, the first one looks nothing like Phorid XD He's on all fours in the picture, but he can walk on two legs as well.  The last one looks a little bit like Lephantis.

Edited January 16, 2019 by Mikhael222

[peterc3]

25 minutes ago, Mikhael222 said:

1. The Infested Visuals.

Taking an existing faction and changing the dominant color scheme for the entire thing is, to me, fully out of the question. Your example screenshot does not sell the idea, at all.

29 minutes ago, Mikhael222 said:

These were fantastic.

Actually state what made them good. Most people have not played Dark Sector and have no idea what you are referring to. You are talking to everyone on the forum, not just DE.

31 minutes ago, Mikhael222 said:

Maybe beef them up some?

How would you "beef up" Shield Lancers without making some equipment choices mandatory?

33 minutes ago, Mikhael222 said:

but their visuals in DS look more Grineer.

The feet and the state of repair say Corpus over Grinner for me. If not Corpus, then it looks close to what the Tenno produce.

The Grineer don't need something just because another faction has it.

[TARINunit9]

6 minutes ago, Mikhael222 said:

1. Woah.  I didn't know that.  But still.....They made it.  Why wouldn't it be legal?  Who'd they sell rights to?

Let me try to summarize what I know as best as possible...

When DE first set out to make "Dark Sectors", the version they WANTED to make looked a lot more like the Warframe we have today. It was in space, and had Grineer marines. They worked for four years but couldn't get anywhere without a publisher. Eventually they hooked up with D3 Publisher Inc. The story I've been told was, D3 threw out almost all of DE's lore and forced them to set it in the modern day. The result was darkSector, a game DE really doesn't like very much. DE then ended their partnership with D3 after darkSector was published

Now, when a developer leaves a publishing partnership, the publisher almost always keeps some of the rights. The situation going on right now with Activision and Bungie -- where Bungie gets to keep all of Destiny -- is incredibly rare. This is likely why the words "technocyte virus" have never actually been used in the actual Warframe script, just a single line in the nano-spore entry and replaced with the generic "infested spore" in all instances thereafter

[Mikhael222]

19 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

[statements that suggest a very negative and discouraged mind]

Cheer up, friend.

1. It's a game, not a religion or political stance. 

2. I only stated ways which I believe the game could improve.  If your opinion differs, then arguing about it is as pointless as arguing favorite colors.

3. I didn't personally insult you or the developers, so can you not respond as though I did?  Thanks.

Edited January 16, 2019 by Mikhael222

[DeMonkey]

1 hour ago, TARINunit9 said:

Let me try to summarize what I know as best as possible...

When DE first set out to make "Dark Sectors", the version they WANTED to make looked a lot more like the Warframe we have today. It was in space, and had Grineer marines. They worked for four years but couldn't get anywhere without a publisher. Eventually they hooked up with D3 Publisher Inc. The story I've been told was, D3 threw out almost all of DE's lore and forced them to set it in the modern day. The result was darkSector, a game DE really doesn't like very much. DE then ended their partnership with D3 after darkSector was published

Now, when a developer leaves a publishing partnership, the publisher almost always keeps some of the rights. The situation going on right now with Activision and Bungie -- where Bungie gets to keep all of Destiny -- is incredibly rare. This is likely why the words "technocyte virus" have never actually been used in the actual Warframe script, just a single line in the nano-spore entry and replaced with the generic "infested spore" in all instances thereafter

I don't know how relevant this is.

Not only do we have the Proto Armour/Glaive and Nemesis skin, but (as seen in the screenshots) the Lotus symbol is used. A jackal can also be found within the game, and iirc is named as such.

If DE were able to use these things, some of which are direct rips, what is stopping them from using other things? Is the publisher overly selective about what they can and can't use, and if so, why let them use something like the Proto skin, which is iconic and they could have charged for.

I'm sure it's not all black and white, but I don't know how relevant DE not owning Dark Sector is.

[peterc3]

58 minutes ago, Mikhael222 said:

2. I only stated ways which I believe the game could improve.  If your opinion differs, then arguing about it is as pointless as arguing favorite colors.

You pointed to another game and said that was a good example of what you want.

Most people have not played Dark Sector. Those people will have 0 clue what you mean by taking anything from DS and bringing it into Warframe. What, exactly, do you like? What elements would be better if they were brought into Warframe?

How did the boss fights go in DS? Why would those bosses be good in Warframe?

1 hour ago, Mikhael222 said:

 3. I didn't personally insult you or the developers, so can you not respond as though I did?  Thanks.

Your first point was to turn the Infested dark gray. Not sure how to say this is a bad idea without saying it's a bad idea. It has no connection to Warframe's Infested and is near featureless at a glance. It just blends into dark gray.

You like ideas from Dark Sector but don't actually explain what that would look like for anyone who didn't play Dark Sector.

[TARINunit9]

54 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

I don't know how relevant this is.

Not only do we have the Proto Armour/Glaive and Nemesis skin, but (as seen in the screenshots) the Lotus symbol is used. A jackal can also be found within the game, and iirc is named as such.

If DE were able to use these things, some of which are direct rips, what is stopping them from using other things? Is the publisher overly selective about what they can and can't use, and if so, why let them use something like the Proto skin, which is iconic and they could have charged for.

I'm sure it's not all black and white, but I don't know how relevant DE not owning Dark Sector is.

I genuinely don't know. I don't know the legal situation. Legal IP rights get WEIRD. For example, Marvel can add Spiderman to the MCU as much as they want, they can have him in all the movies, because it's a joint ownership with Sony. But they can't use Venom at all, that one is solely Sony's property. So who knows what the darkSector legal minefield looks like

On an educated guess, Proto-Excalibur is an asset DE owned before striking a deal with D3 (after all, a greyscale version was featured in the "Dark Sectors" tech demo)

You are correct that it's not all black and white (especially when you factor in D3 is Japanese, DE is Canadian, and the Warframe EULA and trademarks are joint-registered in the United States) but I do think it's still POTENTIALLY relevant. After all, if my story is correct, DE don't like darkSector very much anyway -- they're removed it from Warframe canon twice by my recollection

[Falconer777]

1 час назад, TARINunit9 сказал:

After all, if my story is correct, DE don't like darkSector very much anyway -- they're removed it from Warframe canon twice by my recollection

And you do not confuse, by chance, the Dark Sector and the Dark Sectors? These are different games. The rights to the Dark Sector, in my opinion, still belong to the DE.

[Falconer777]

2 часа назад, DeMonkey сказал:

I don't know how relevant this is.

Not only do we have the Proto Armour/Glaive and Nemesis skin, but (as seen in the screenshots) the Lotus symbol is used. A jackal can also be found within the game, and iirc is named as such.

If DE were able to use these things, some of which are direct rips, what is stopping them from using other things? Is the publisher overly selective about what they can and can't use, and if so, why let them use something like the Proto skin, which is iconic and they could have charged for.

I'm sure it's not all black and white, but I don't know how relevant DE not owning Dark Sector is.

Logically, I thought the same thing.

[TARINunit9]

12 minutes ago, Falconer777 said:

And you do not confuse, by chance, the Dark Sector and the Dark Sectors? These are different games. The rights to the Dark Sector, in my opinion, still belong to the DE.

I did not. Reread mu post, I make a clear delineation between the Dark Sectors (two words) tech demo and the darkSector (one word) released video game

[Falconer777]

4 часа назад, Mikhael222 сказал:

1. The Infested Visuals.

................

 

I played in the Dark Sector, and the game made a very good impression on me, both with its interesting gameplay and plot.

I agree with all your suggestions, except for the color of infection. Black will look a bit boring in Warframe.

[Falconer777]

8 минут назад, TARINunit9 сказал:

I did not. Reread mu post, I make a clear delineation between the Dark Sectors (two words) tech demo and the darkSector (one word) released video game

Yes, now I understand. But all the same, the question remains relevant: if DE is currently using quite a lot of things from the Dark Sector design, what prevents them from introducing another pair or three things? Or modify them a bit to avoid possible legal disputes with the D3 Publisher. 

However, I strongly doubt that such disputes may even arise)

[iLightning13]

4 hours ago, peterc3 said:

Taking an existing faction and changing the dominant color scheme for the entire thing is, to me, fully out of the question. Your example screenshot does not sell the idea, at all.

Isn't the main colour of the infested basically anything that looks like it came out of the rear end of a dog?

In all seriousness though, they've completely reworked the aesthetic of the Corpus in Venus and (soonTM) the gas city, so I would quite like to see a few updates to the Infested's visuals, especially just how colourful the super space AIDS is.

Edited January 16, 2019 by iLightning13

[TARINunit9]

1 hour ago, Falconer777 said:

Yes, now I understand. But all the same, the question remains relevant: if DE is currently using quite a lot of things from the Dark Sector design, what prevents them from introducing another pair or three things? Or modify them a bit to avoid possible legal disputes with the D3 Publisher. 

However, I strongly doubt that such disputes may even arise)

My first instinct is to agree with you. I highly doubt D3 cares, since with that "change a few things" defense you're pretty much golden (in American lawsuits you can argue that you were inspired by yourself perfectly fine)...

However, DE previously announced plans for that Proto-Lex skin based on the Tenka 9mm and the Proto-Bronco based on the Spectre, both guns from darkSector. They were fully modeled, fully realized in game, shown off in a devstream... then never released

I'm not going to say that DE's lawyers panicked and told the devs not to release those guns as if I know exactly that happened, but it's a possible conclusion I find very plausible

[Falconer777]

11 минут назад, TARINunit9 сказал:

My first instinct is to agree with you. I highly doubt D3 cares, since with that "change a few things" defense you're pretty much golden (in American lawsuits you can argue that you were inspired by yourself perfectly fine)...

Precisely!

Цитата

However, DE previously announced plans for that Proto-Lex skin based on the Tenka 9mm and the Proto-Bronco based on the Spectre, both guns from darkSector. They were fully modeled, fully realized in game, shown off in a devstream... then never released

I'm not going to say that DE's lawyers panicked and told the devs not to release those guns as if I know exactly that happened, but it's a possible conclusion I find very plausible

Yes, here we are entering the realm of speculation. The option of caution lawyers certainly is not excluded, but it is possible that the DE just decided not to add it to the game for reasons of design or gameplay.
In any case, I personally liked the proposals of the OP)

[MJ12]

15 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

My first instinct is to agree with you. I highly doubt D3 cares, since with that "change a few things" defense you're pretty much golden (in American lawsuits you can argue that you were inspired by yourself perfectly fine)...

However, DE previously announced plans for that Proto-Lex skin based on the Tenka 9mm and the Proto-Bronco based on the Spectre, both guns from darkSector. They were fully modeled, fully realized in game, shown off in a devstream... then never released

I'm not going to say that DE's lawyers panicked and told the devs not to release those guns as if I know exactly that happened, but it's a possible conclusion I find very plausible

Most companies' operating procedure would be to check with legal first if there's a possible issue of infringement, before starting any work on something that raises those issues (and it would generally be fairly obvious if something potentially raised those issues). Additionally, the Tekna 9mm and Spectre were based off of real life weapons, so it wouldn't be D3Publisher who would have the infringement claim-it'd be the actual makers of those weapons (and generally speaking, the most that would mean is that you wouldn't be able to use the real life name, so your work didn't mislead people into thinking it was actually officially endorsed by Glock GmbH or Smith & Wesson or whatever).

DE might have just put it on a backburner, not had a good time to release it yet, or just gotten distracted by other things. It's not the first time content has been forgotten about.

[TARINunit9]

58 minutes ago, MJ12 said:

Most companies' operating procedure would be to check with legal first if there's a possible issue of infringement, before starting any work on something that raises those issues (and it would generally be fairly obvious if something potentially raised those issues).

That's proper legal etiquette anyway. As we know, companies don't always abide by proper legal etiquette

[AzureTerra]

If there were any "points" to consider from a game they made i'd say they would have made them by now and also have moved on with bigger and better idea's

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

On 2019-01-16 at 4:32 AM, iLightning13 said:

Isn't the main colour of the infested basically anything that looks like it came out of the rear end of a dog?

Friend, there is something very, very wrong with your dog. 

[(PSN)Zero_029]

Wow...having only played a demo of Dark Sector seeing those screenshots really phones in just how much a Spiritual Successor Warframe is.

The Infestation is nearly ripped from that game. Just recolored & slightly altered.

I will admit, I would not mind a much more horrific Infested faction. Make then genuinely look horrifying, more so than those enemies in Dark Sector.

I want enemies that rival Necromorphs.

The darker palette is nice, but Warframe's base lighting is probably why the Infestated growths don't look as scary. No amount of recolor will fix that. Warframe is a "brighter" game.

But I do agree on the Bosses.

Warframe's bosses need dramatic reworks, & to avoid nerfing Players/Mods/Weapons. They will need mechanics.

I keep thinking of Dead Space 2's wonderfully designed (not sarcasm) bosses.