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Coming Soon: Devstream #166


[DE]Megan
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Give he Ignis Wraith back it's 800 ammo since looking at the patch notes that wasn't even mentioned at all so the reduce in ammo shouldn't have been a thing since you never mentioned it would be in the patch notes.

Second give the Merciless Gun Arcanes it's ammo buff back that is kinda of unfair with how you have to grind steel path for that stuff.

I don't see any reason to give us back self-damage if you already took ammo away from us in the first place.

It is like a slap in the face to an already bad nerf it is okay to keep that nerf on the guns that where the problem but when you put it on the every gun that is just straight up unfair to everyone.

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Twitch drops just won't work (connected acount and everything, but watching stream gives no progress and actual drop won't show up in inventory). Warframe is the only twitch link that keeps on having problems and i just don't have the energy to keep on trying to make it work. Sucks to lose an umbral forma but it just isn't worth the stress and work

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2 hours ago, (NSW)SuperLuigi1025 said:

Give he Ignis Wraith back it's 800 ammo since looking at the patch notes that wasn't even mentioned at all so the reduce in ammo shouldn't have been a thing since you never mentioned it would be in the patch notes.

explain how you're running out of ammo

2 hours ago, (NSW)SuperLuigi1025 said:

I don't see any reason to give us back self-damage if you already took ammo away from us in the first place.

https://overframe.gg/build/386857/inaros-prime/self-damage-bypass-meta-build/

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2 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

explain how you're running out of ammo

Because it only has 200 ammo now instead of 800..... on the normal star map where you can sneeze and kill an enemy this is fine,  you get plenty of ammo drops, but on higher tier content the lower amount of ammo drops due to slower killing speed can be an issue.

Personally I still see the ammo nerf as too severe and still feel that DE completely missed the reason why AoE was popular in a game where we killed mobs instead of single targets.... as much as I like my rifles they're not exactly great against mobs of enemies 🙄

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22 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Because it only has 200 ammo now instead of 800..... on the normal star map where you can sneeze and kill an enemy this is fine,  you get plenty of ammo drops, but on higher tier content the lower amount of ammo drops due to slower killing speed can be an issue.

if you cant kill enemies even on steel path your build sucks

use this one https://overframe.gg/build/393933/

shreds all three factions. literally cant run out of ammo.

34 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Personally I still see the ammo nerf as too severe and still feel that DE completely missed the reason why AoE was popular in a game where we killed mobs instead of single targets.... as much as I like my rifles they're not exactly great against mobs of enemies 🙄

try gas snipers

https://overframe.gg/build/393826/vectis-prime/snipers-make-gas-a-viable-element/

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3 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

 

Oh yes the common blind defender of this stuff.

It is always the build's fault not the nerf.

Let's see I critical Delay on to lower my fire rate, Primed Ammo Mutation and Rifle Scavenger yet I still find myself running out of ammo due to the lack of ammo drops from enemies half the time.

Also my point wasn't that I don't want self-damage back it was the fact that we have a nerf that already did enough damage as it made sure ammo is not easy to get anymore and went as far to effected an arcane you can only get in Steel Path then now getting another nerf that can do even more damage on top of that by letting kill yourself if your not careful with your aiming.

What I was saying is they should give is 1 or the other not both as I can see this backfiring in their face big time if it angers enough people.
 

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3 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

if you cant kill enemies even on steel path your build sucks

use this one https://overframe.gg/build/393933/

shreds all three factions. literally cant run out of ammo.

 

Please, don't try to fool any newbie. Those build were useless against Robotic Corpus and Ancient Infested in Steel Path.

Edited by Bedull
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9 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

if you cant kill enemies even on steel path your build sucks

use this one https://overframe.gg/build/393933/

shreds all three factions. literally cant run out of ammo.

But that can run out of ammo.....especially when running solo.

I bet you class slinging down ammo pizza or running with an ability/companion that refills ammo (restricting options/band aid fix) is acceptable/normal.

9 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

A single shot weapon in a mob game that also requires a pretty high end riven ..... face palm.

It can have gas on it all you like but a sniper is never going to be as effective as AoE or even rifles when it comes to a horde of enemies.

 

9 hours ago, (NSW)SuperLuigi1025 said:

What I was saying is they should give is 1 or the other not both as I can see this backfiring in their face big time if it angers enough people.

What we'll likely see is people going back to melee only builds with 'tanks' and 'AoE' frames/builds.... basically going back to before the primary weapon buffs....

In many ways 'choice' is going to be restricted again, just in a different way.

We've been here before and until DE takes notice of and fixes the underlying reasons that people resort to the most efficient builds we'll continue to go round in circles.  The problem is DE are so far down the rabbit hole they likely can't fix it without doing a whole new game.... (cough soulframe...)

 

Essentially while warframe is primarily based around (poor random) rng via grind in a horde game players will ALWAYS gravitate towards killing stuff as fast as possible... DE needs to embrace this rather than fight it in the hope of increasing plat sales. 

 

Edited by LSG501
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1 hour ago, Mazifet said:

Okay i've used a supra vandal with primed shred with full gauss buffs WITH WISP MOTES holding m1 and  never had an issue with ammo. So i don't know how you are having an ammo issue with ignis wraith.

Same, I'm using tenet diplos with about 200% fire rate from mods and just using it as a beam weapon (not letting go of the trigger) and still don't run out of ammo. At most i have to move a few meters close to the enemies to pick up the ammo drops.

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10 hours ago, LSG501 said:

But that can run out of ammo.....especially when running solo.

I bet you class slinging down ammo pizza or running with an ability/companion that refills ammo (restricting options/band aid fix) is acceptable/normal.

on star chart enemies die fast enough for you to kill a good 50 of them before reloading and in steel path i was back at max ammo before i even used a third of the magazine. 

and ive never even built any pizzas before and never switch off my moa unless im levelling, so it was just the base ammo economy

11 hours ago, LSG501 said:

A single shot weapon in a mob game

 

it one shots anything on a headshot and if you proc gas basically everything around what you shot will die. even has innate punch through and high status so shoot into a group and you're almost guaranteed a gas proc, maybe two.

11 hours ago, LSG501 said:

that also requires a pretty high end riven ..... face palm.

riven does help but it isnt needed

11 hours ago, LSG501 said:

It can have gas on it all you like but a sniper is never going to be as effective as AoE or even rifles when it comes to a horde of enemies.

i've gotten around 50-90% of the kills and did at least 80% of the damage in both steel path incursions and fissures with my vectis. teammate's aoe weapons doesnt really affect it because my vectis will one shot literally any enemy and kills anything around it because of the gas proc. if anything i get around the same kills as aoe spam. pretty much the only time i dont get most of the kills is in fissures when theres a titania nuking everything.

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11 hours ago, LSG501 said:

It can have gas on it all you like but a sniper is never going to be as effective as AoE or even rifles when it comes to a horde of enemies.

Probably not -as- effective for similar set up, investment, etc.  But a good gas ST weapon build with grouping and armor strip can be very competitive.  And snipers are among the most ideal for this.

 

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To introduce a little nuance... I run out of ammo sometimes with certain weapons. Not in a way I would consider it a huge issue necessarily though, but some minor fine tuning/tweaking could be beneficial and hot a sweeter spot... The same way such changes happen in the first place, frequently, eventually, anyway... For example, I often run solo Steel Path Relics. I think most weapons can do fine, great even. Depends though.. I for example, can one shot a lot of enemies in aforementioned with certain snipers, like Rubico Prime, especially once I have certain conditional buffs up and running (Galvanised Mods, Arcanes etc) so... I have a tendency to agree with those people who say builds are important and that you should be finding good/best builds viable, for most weapons, even those off meta, or with certain limitations (not being aoe, slow reload, not a bullet hose etc).

That being said... if you have three Corrupted Nullifiers, with a few Eximus etc a Rubico will struggle... and may run out of Ammo. They can do this thing called shield dancing (a term I am borrowing from Overwatch) - the bubbles they create, can overlap, and if you damage one, it will shrink, but the others will then be first point of contact... giving the original a chance to regen... if enemies are inside or around them... Thats actually a pretty tricky situation. Not impossible. Obviously you have several options, like say having a Secondary, a Melee, and Operator/Drifter powers and Amp, to rely on. Plus Warframe powers/abilities. Sometimes those options may also be limited too (like if Secondary isn't a fast firing weapon, it runs into the same problem... if you are running a squishy Warframe that relies on CC or a power for survival, then situation is also going to be extra tricky. If your Operator amp is more for close range, and the enemies down a long corridor... etc etc 

Thats a pretty highly specific situation though, its also Steel Path Fissures, solo!! Running out of ammo for there made sense. Have run out in other situations too less specific, usually with other issues. I personally don't consider it a problem, but I can see why some might want further adjustments. I'm also a super flexible player who constantly rotates my equipment. Some players prefer sticking to certain gear a bit more, so there will always be potential for disagreement based off differences in experiences. 

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On 2022-11-23 at 4:07 PM, (PSN)Vexx757 said:

I really hope you will put the ability for the operators to wear warframe armour in this update. This should of come at the same time as when the drifter got it like you said it would.

It looks like it didn't happen, well I hope you add it before or in the Duviri Paradox update.

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