Why Kubrows Are Fine, And Why You're Probably Wrong

[DJ_Redwire]

I understand that the developers are capable people, but they can fail at times (after all, we are human, not gods). So why not cooperate and make a game where almost everyone can enjoy? Is that not what a game should be?

 

You misunderstand the context. The OP is saying that a significant amount of feedback that is being given to DE should be thrown out because of X, Y, and Z. Last time I checked, it was DE's place to decide what feedback to adhere to and what to shelf.

[Renegade343]

You misunderstand the context. The OP is saying that a significant amount of feedback that is being given to DE should be thrown out because of X, Y, and Z. Last time I checked, it was DE's place to decide what feedback to adhere to and what to shelf.

I see. Sorry. 

[Ionus]

It is also noteworthy that DE has made owning a Kubrow more of a hassle than owning a real dog.

[DemiKiev]

"Though many of your points are valid, I completely disagree with you on point #1.  I don't care if it's 100,000 for 6 stabilizers or 100 for 600 stabilizers, the game is punishing you simply for having a Kubrow.  And I don't care how much it's punishing you, it's the concept that it's punishing you at all for getting your dog that's just...unreasonable.  I can get 100,000 credits in 12 days easy, sure, but I would much prefer to spend them on something other than just keeping my dog alive because apparently they die over time for some indiscriminate reason."

 

 

I totally agree on this point. Of course it's possible to get 100k in such lapse of time but really, some people out there only play few hours per week or are already trying to get money for other things. Not everyone does no-life on Warframe... And this is why this system is quite discriminating : you don't spend your days on the game, you don't get a dog. I know, "stasis". But there again, you have to wait 3 hours before the kubrow gets available. Now what if you can only play 3 evenings per week and that you dont spend hours on it each time because on studies/job/family issues/pc issues/whatever issues ? Then your dog dies out OR you never play with it because you never have time to wait for the 3 hours timer to complete. "No one is forcing you to use a kubrow", but what if I want to and I simply don't have enough time to be spent on the game to do so... This should be changed. People already complained about such thing during some events which also required the players to no-life in order to complete them and I think some real attention should be given to this point because it concerns a big part of the community... I know it's a F2P but it shoudln't discriminate people who are ABLE to spend a lot of time on it with people you aren't for that kind of things. 

[Feallike]

1.  Yes it is punishing, it would be punishing if it was 1 credit per 1000 days.  The numbers don't matter.  There is an upkeep on your Kubrow aside from what you already did to get it, and that's unfair.  That's like saying, "hey, you spent all this time and effort to make this beautiful glass sculpture that you made with your own hands and tools?  Wonderful!  Now you have to pay 100 bucks a week to keep it, or we take it away forever!"  And I know what you're gonna say.  "Oh that's completely different, because you don't just get 100 bucks everyday like you do in Warframe!"  But even if you did, would you want to spend it just to keep the thing you already worked towards making?  No, of course you wouldn't.  It's absurd.

 

2.  So you have to have friends who already may or may not have gotten the kind of Kubrow you want, or pay someone else for them?  Again, it's up to chance, even if your chances are increased somewhat.  And regardless of the outcome, whether you choose to keep grinding for the Kubrow egg to finally hatch into something you like, or grinding to get plat to buy an imprint you need off of some random, you're still grinding because RNG didn't favor you, which isn't your fault; it's the game's fault.

 

1. i get your point, but still, if you have the funds to keep that icesculpture then by joe, do it, though when theres a cheaper Icesculpture that doesn't cost anything to maintain, for those who don't have the funds. Then you can't really complain.

 

If the DE made sentinals Useless then i would probably be with you, because then there forcing you to pay for a companion that is usable. Though sentinals are still very useful, while some kubrows may do the jobs better, its not really a huge deelbreaker when you look at the differences.

 

I mean, Carrier still does 2k damage, they didn't nerf that. It still always procs Corrosive, its still very useful highlevel and brings loot toward you easily.

 

I agree its tedius, but the fact that you don't have to join in and only be at a disadvantige that doesn't effect your stats just the stats of your companions, is passable to me.

 

I mean TBH Carrier is more useful then Sahasa, Dijnn is still very useful since it stuns with a shorter range, unlike Raksa who has a bigger range but makes the enemies run.

 

 

I agree that its a little unfair, but its passable since you can get a companion who is only slightly less effective then it, for no effort whatsoever.

 

2. Trade is 

a $#*(@.

Edited July 27, 2014 by Feallike

[SmokinDevil]

Again, new players can get a Kubrow. New player Kubrow will NOT be as good as someone who actually have the funds to take care of it. You are just burdening yourself more because you have to spend more. 

 

Also, wtf? Natural disaster? Do you guys have plans for every naturally disaster then? Or are we just arguing for arguments sake?

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Let me stop you there. I came when credits weren't such a luxury. When getting 2K credits a mission was a blessing.

 

 

See what happens when you use personal anecdotes as sources of information?

I only started playing in earnest relatively recently.  At MR1, it was simple to make 100k.  It doesn't matter if everyone does or not because I showed that it was possible, at least under the newer versions of the game.

 

Payouts being anemic back then is irrelevant anyway because Kubro didn't exist either.

[Buzkyl]

Again, new players can get a Kubrow. New player Kubrow will NOT be as good as someone who actually have the funds to take care of it. You are just burdening yourself more because you have to spend more. 

 

Also, wtf? Natural disaster? Do you guys have plans for every naturally disaster then? Or are we just arguing for arguments sake?

 

 

Aside form the modding and the grinding to build it, fine. It is to be expected. But how does a new player upkeep 100K when they're just getting the hang of the game and crafting frames and weapons.

 

 

I only started playing in earnest relatively recently.  At MR1, it was simple to make 100k.  It doesn't matter if everyone does or not because I showed that it was possible, at least under the newer versions of the game.

 

Payouts being anemic back then is irrelevant anyway because Kubro didn't exist either.

 

But at MR1 could you  maintain that 100K minimum for stabilizers whilst i assuming crafting weapons weapons and frames. When the average cost of crafting a frame is 70K. And weapons are usually 15K.

 

 

Assuming you don't just have someone taxi you to sechura.

Edited July 27, 2014 by cozzi21

[Metalarcher]

I totally agree on this point. Of course it's possible to get 100k in such lapse of time but really, some people out there only play few hours per week or are already trying to get money for other things. Not everyone does no-life on Warframe... And this is why this system is quite discriminating : you don't spend your days on the game, you don't get a dog. I know, "stasis". But there again, you have to wait 3 hours before the kubrow gets available. Now what if you can only play 3 evenings per week and that you dont spend hours on it each time because on studies/job/family issues/pc issues/whatever issues ? Then your dog dies out OR you never play with it because you never have time to wait for the 3 hours timer to complete. "No one is forcing you to use a kubrow", but what if I want to and I simply don't have enough time to be spent on the game to do so... This should be changed. People already complained about such thing during some events which also required the players to no-life in order to complete them and I think some real attention should be given to this point because it concerns a big part of the community... I know it's a F2P but it shoudln't discriminate people who are ABLE to spend a lot of time on it with people you aren't for that kind of things. 

 

It's not even just that though.  Even if you do "no-life" Warframe and can get 100,000 credits in, let's say, an hour, I would assume you would want those credits to go towards something that allows you to gain something, not arbitrary upkeep of a companion you could ditch in favor of one that does not require upkeep.

[ReiganCross]

It is also noteworthy that DE has made owning a Kubrow more of a hassle than owning a real dog.

 

Hardly an apt analogy.

 

See, if i'm to own a dog, i normally have a chance to choose the dog. At most, the dog was chosen by someone that was hoping i'd like it. Kubrows are chosen by a computer that rolled a die to choose the dog for me. I hate 2 of my 3 Kubrows because they were RNG'ed to be Gunmetal Grey and Realistic Brown, the 2 colors of Battlefield and Call of Duty. I wouldn't chose to take care of it as my own and yet they are forced into my face without any chance of my opting out of owning the most boring pair of Huras Kubrow in existance!

Edited July 27, 2014 by ReiganCross

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Hardly an apt analogy.

 

See, if i'm to own a dog, i normally have a chance to choose the dog. At most, the dog was chosen by someone that was hoping i'd like it.

If your dog has puppies irl you get RNGed too. Same as if you hatch an egg irl.

[Feallike]

OK.

 

1. Stasis shouldn't have the timer, but your kubrow still loses 20% DNA integrity after a daily reward if you take it out. ( that only stacks once, so you can just break the system by putting the Kubrow into stasis, but doesn't really hurt you other then losing 20% hp when you come back after your vacai.

 

2. After being Logged out for X amount of days lets when your Kubrow reaches -60% Integrity, your Kubrow will stop losing DNA Integrity, (so you won't lose your Kubrow for being AFK or Errors, you will just be at -60% HP) (this is only in effect when your Loggedout, once you log back it goes back to the normal 20% lost a day.

 

3. Give Kubrow quest a MR requirement of atleast 5.

 

4. Make DNA stabalizers heal 100% of your Kubrows HP (not all of it just 100% of it) so thats 1 DNA Stabalizer every 5 days.

 

There the system is still the same, its just more casual friendly. :/

Edited July 27, 2014 by Feallike

[fishworshipper]

It is also noteworthy that DE has made owning a Kubrow more of a hassle than owning a real dog.

I'm not sure if you've never owned a real dog, or if you're just talking out your &#! massively exaggerating.

[ReiganCross]

If your dog has puppies irl you get RNGed too. Same as if you hatch an egg irl.

 

And do you keep all the puppies your dog birth? Normally (if you get to that point at all) you start handing out the puppies in the hopes of someone out there actually liking the little buggers. And hey, at least you had about 7 years to love the mother, so you grow attatched to the little loudmouths as if they were your own. Hardly what happens when a computer decides that you'll love the most boring Kubrow in existence.

Edited July 27, 2014 by ReiganCross

[Brynslustafir]

I won't be satisfied with Kubrows until DE gets rid of the stupid Stasis recovery delay. 

[fishworshipper]

But at MR1 could you  maintain that 100K minimum for stabilizers whilst i assuming crafting weapons weapons and frames. When the average cost of crafting a frame is 70K. And weapons are usually 15K.

8.3k per day isn't hard to make, by any standards.

[Metalarcher]

1. i get your point, but still, if you have the funds to keep that icesculpture then by joe, do it, though when theres a cheaper Icesculpture that doesn't cost anything to maintain, for those who don't have the funds. Then you can't really complain.

 

If the DE made sentinals Useless then i would probably be with you, because then there forcing you to pay for a companion that is usable. Though sentinals are still very useful, while some kubrows may do the jobs better, its not really a huge deelbreaker when you look at the differences.

 

I mean, Carrier still does 2k damage, they didn't nerf that. It still always procs Corrosive, its still very useful highlevel and brings loot toward you easily.

 

I agree its tedius, but the fact that you don't have to join in and only be at a disadvantige that doesn't effect your stats just the stats of your companions, is passable to me.

 

I mean TBH Carrier is more useful then Sahasa, Dijnn is still very useful since it stuns with a shorter range, unlike Raksa who has a bigger range but makes the enemies run.

 

 

I agree that its a little unfair, but its passable since you can get a companion who is only slightly less effective then it, for no effort whatsoever.

 

2. Trade is 

a $#*(@.

 

So what you just said is "it's an unfair mechanic but it's okay because it's not that unfair."

 

All the Kubrow breeds are not equivalent to Sentinels in ability.  In potency perhaps, but that doesn't mean anything here.  It means if I like a Huras Kubrow and think it would fit my play style well, I have to spend 100,000 credits whenever his max health is low, whereas a guy who likes Dethcube the best doesn't have to pay a single credit for upkeep.

 

If you like Kubrows, you have to pay.  If you like Sentinels, you don't.  The game treats you differently depending on your preference in a way that either provides an arbitrary inconvenience, or doesn't.  All just because you like one thing more than another.

 

If you agree that there is a problem, however slight, does it not mean, by definition, it should be solved?

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

And do you keep all the puppies your dog birth? Normally (if you get to that point at all) you start handing out the puppies in the hopes of someone out there actually liking the little buggers. And hey, at least you had about 7 years to love the mother, so you grow attatched to the little loudmouths as if they were your own. Hardly what happens when a computer decides that you'll love the most boring Kubrow in existence.

Or you could just love them unconditionally.  Or are you saying you toss the ugly puppies, that your dog just had, into the rubbish bin?

[Renegade343]

Or you could just love them unconditionally.  Or are you saying you toss the ugly puppies, that your dog just had, into the rubbish bin?

Donate them, maybe? That sounds a bit extreme. 

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

So what you just said is "it's an unfair mechanic but it's okay because it's not that unfair."

 

All the Kubrow breeds are not equivalent to Sentinels in ability.  In potency perhaps, but that doesn't mean anything here.  It means if I like a Huras Kubrow and think it would fit my play style well, I have to spend 100,000 credits whenever his max health is low, whereas a guy who likes Dethcube the best doesn't have to pay a single credit for upkeep.

 

If you like Kubrows, you have to pay.  If you like Sentinels, you don't.  The game treats you differently depending on your preference in a way that either provides an arbitrary inconvenience, or doesn't.  All just because you like one thing more than another.

 

If you agree that there is a problem, however slight, does it not mean, by definition, it should be solved?

Kubro system is a pet simulator.  Sentinels are not.  If you want a virtual pet then go kubro.  If you don't want to be bothered with upkeep then go sentinel. Both parties have an option that appeals to them.

[Hayzemet]

#hour changing kubrow is not nice, its evil, one hour is more understandable, your logic is whiteknightish, 2 days to hatch 2 days to grow, and no simultaneous operations, that is way too much, and only if you found the egg, and have a spare 100k creds... pls

[UFOLoche]

Actually, I am using a completely legit analogy.

 

Noooooooot really, but hey, you're free to think what you want, I guess.

[Ptylerdactyl]

the 'you only have 3 pets a day' thing is a bit dumb, but it doesn't matter if you aren't completely careless with them. the stasis timer could probably be brought down by an hour or so. if you stasis it last time you logged out and want to play with it now, but don't have at least 3 hours to play that day/night, it kind of sucks because then it feels like you'll never be able to actually use it. i myself have at least 3 hours so it's not a big deal for me, but for others i can see that as a downer with the time/credits spent on getting them.

[DemiKiev]

It's not even just that though.  Even if you do "no-life" Warframe and can get 100,000 credits in, let's say, an hour, I would assume you would want those credits to go towards something that allows you to gain something, not arbitrary upkeep of a companion you could ditch in favor of one that does not require upkeep.

Yup, I do agree. That's what I meant by "... or are already trying to get money for other things" My comparison will indeed seem exegerated, but it's like our TPS Warframe turned into some tamagochi thing... The fact is just unfair. They were teasing us with kubrows and now many of us are disapointed because of confines we werent really exepecting. I'm ok with other points in the main post and I do think that introducing the kubrows is cool, but this "no-life needed" thing really disappoints me. 

[Buzkyl]

8.3k per day isn't hard to make, by any standards.

 

 

Of course it isn't, that's 12 days to get that amount on the other hand, ofcourse you can try to farm greater amounts but that's just to feed your Kubrow. And i'm taking this in the sense that lower MR player would be spending their credits on other things other than trying to keep his pet alive.