Parkour 2.0 (U17 Megathread Topic)

[Sci_Ant]

Just having fun with doing a Bullet Jump and then a Double Jump, then aiming down and casting my Decoy while in the air, then spinning around and shooting. It just feels so ninjaaaa!! :D Best flip and cast are the ones near the middle and at the end.

Background song : https://soundcloud.com/jeffrey_sound/jry-x-six-degreez

 

 

Thanks for Parkour 2.0 again DE!

 

EDIT: And yes, I was using all the other moves too throughout the game, not just this one. But this combo with Decoy cast was too much fun. :)

Edited August 6, 2015 by Sci_Ant

[Ophiolith]

This is by far my favorite thread. The tears are delicious. So many people want the return of a glitchy awful weapon based movement system. It's absolutely adorable an reading this thread gets me through my work day

 

This.  Hey, I mean there are still tons of really egregious bugs to be ironed out with Parkour 2.0 (not least of which is that if you're using a controller, power select is totally broken right now), but I'd far rather this than coptering.  As somebody who enjoys immersion in games, it was always frustrating to see that any kind of intended movement system was just totally outclassed by this really dumb looking move that competitive players would abuse constantly.

 

I'm not sure I understand the removal of stamina though.  Juggling stamina depletion and recharging was something I felt was almost part of how movement played out in Warframe.  Trying to maintain enough airtime momentum to recharge stamina as you moved just felt kind of 'right', whereas artificially cancelling sprint as soon as you land in P2.0 feels like a cheap nerf that can be easily worked around.  Most experienced players are going to know just to start sprinting again straight afterwards.  It's totally arbitrary.

But yeah, once the bugs are ironed out in P2.0 I'll be all over it!

[Youre_Waifu]

As somebody who enjoys immersion in games, it was always frustrating to see that any kind of intended movement system was just totally outclassed by this really dumb looking move that competitive players would abuse constantly.

So spinning around in a circle to go slow is more immersive than spinning around in a circle to go fast?

[Ophiolith]

So spinning around in a circle to go slow is more immersive than spinning around in a circle to go fast?

 

Yes.

[d0ekun]

Liked the game as long as I can remember.  Not crazy about the new system.  Some good, some bad.  Biggest gripe?  What would a Tenno's mother say if she saw him/her hopping along (and up) walls instead of running like a bad-&#! ninja should?

 

Nothing.  She'd just punch him in the damn face.

 

 

Space-Ninjas don't hop.

 

 

When the game was in the early stages, I was thrilled when I discovered the ability to run up a wall and grind down it slowly as if I were digging in my metal parts to hang on just a little longer.  Now, I stick.  Whenever (and pretty much wherever) I want.  It just isn't very realistic in terms of momentum and gravity.  If I'm running along and jump through the air, am I really going to just stop and stick?  I'd like to think I'd dig parts of my suit into the wall and shred along while kind of slowing down that way.

 

Before this, I'd never even heard of this coptering crap.  I just played the game and enjoyed the little bit of wall-running there was.  After doing a little research, I can see where people would copter and "float" through a level.  It didn't seem to awful bad before, I guess... but I never did it.  I can tell you that now it doesn't take much for me to jump across large areas of an open level where before, I never really thought it possible.

 

 

--The double-jump - it's pretty cool.  Takes the challenge out of getting to higher places though.

--The aim-glide & bullet-jump - I get it... if I wanted to use it, I should hold the right-mouse button but for some reason, it works ALL THE TIME in a sense with this so-called bullet-jump.  Going from a slide to a flip/jump doesn't engage the glide, but the bullet-jump is there enough to slow down what was quick before.  Previously, you could run and quickly tap <toggle-crouch> and then jump very quickly to execute a flip/jump.  This is gone and now feels slower.  If animations were boring, let me do a double flip out of this type of jump or a slide-to-jump.

--The zip-line - This?  Hmmmmm... It seems cool.  Except for one small thing that I've not quite figured out:  Why is it that when I'm running along, full-speed, and the hit a zip-line, I basically stop?  I mean, RUN-->SLIDE-->JUMP(w/flip)-->TAP "X" (or whatever)-->MOMENTUM STOPS-->START RUNNING ALONG ZIP-LINE AGAIN.

 

Sorry if I'm way off base here, but I'm 50/50.  I think there could be some improvements to the new system and I am confident that this team is the one to deliver.  Of all the games out there, this game has given a lot since the beginning.  In an industry hell-bent on delivering crappy products, making you pay for "early access" for a game that probably will never be finished, Warframe has continued to be a great FREE game at it's roots.

 

There is no other game I've played that offers you great graphics, sound, and an overall fun experience for FREE, and then the team behind it continues to make improvements.

 

Really, I can't ask for much more than that.  I've played this free title for a while and all I can do as a consumer is offer some suggestions and feedback.

 

 

Later

 

 

PS - Seriously.  Space-Ninjas aren't really frogs... or even gazelles.

[Raven_Face]

Tenno also aren't whatever you -want- them to be. I'd take multi-directional wall mounting over stamina-based wall running any day. Besides, it makes zero sense that Tenno, for whatever shoes they have, can run a perfect 90-degree horizontal line on walls, but cannot travel upwards for more than 4 metres.

[-Kimyona-]

I don't like it very much. I didn't like coptering and I'm glad it is finally over but changing one bad with another doesn't make it any good. These are my thoughts about the new "parkour".

 

1. why is it even called parkour?! it is more like flying, gliding, sliding in the air. it floats like zaphyr in low gravity NM mode mission. why just don't give us archwing to fly trough the levels?!? heck even archwings have more "weight" than this.

2. i also don't see how it is easy to execute either, which was the design goal if I'm not mistaken. arguably my negative experience with the so called parkour 2.0 is because i still suck at it and it can get only better with practice but it doesn't replace the fact that it requires way too many inputs like a kind of piano virtuoso level of inputs.

3. including the gliding in the movement combos has the disadvantage that you are constantly zooming in and out when you are moving and even if you are very mlg level fast it still creates some shakiness in the camera. it destroys my eyes and gives me headaches. it is like accelerating on the highway and than pull brakes every few seconds.

4. yes, you have more control, and more access to hard to reach places like treasure rooms. but sometimes more is less. ask yourself why they even bother put these "hard to reach places" in the first place?!

i see however generally positive reactions from the community which means either the people tend to neglect the flows after it replaced arguably even more flowed version of movement or they simply enjoy flying. i certainly hope it will be improved from here and not left with the all the exploits for another 2 years.

 

i've played WF for more than 2,5 years now....

 

before Parkour 2.0 was introduced, one had to use skill and sometimes crazy maneuvers to reach certain places... that was challenging and fun (at least for me)

and now... hop hop hop (or just fly), and you are there.

WF is getting to easy, it changes more and more into something like "CasualFrame"...

 

Wall-running is now Wall-Hopping... imprecise like hell, a short wall-grab doesn't gives you momentum anymore... aso...

 

I never thought, that i ever would say something like this, but Parkour 2.0 is going to kill my interest in WF (and i really loved/enjoyed WF!).

Edited August 6, 2015 by -Kimyona-

[Bugagai]

Developers promised us a parkour - https://youtu.be/pIXecxcjWOM
And we got totally different. And I must say that the new parkour is full of S#&amp;&#036;. Now, with the new system of parkour players looked like a snail with springs instead of legs! 
Really it was impossible to combine the old with the new elements of parkour, instead of breaking something that worked so well? О_о 

[-InV-igo95862]

- More boring gameplay

 

Sure, running around without being able to kill opponents is so fun. /s

[Victorovich]

- More boring gameplay

Cause jumping around for half a match with no kills is so fun.

[Feyangol]

Sure, running around without being able to kill opponents is so fun. /s

 

Cause jumping around for half a match with no kills is so fun.

Na, it's your problem, if you can't kill your opponent.

Also, turtle frames are better in your opinion ;) ?

[EdBazokatone]

Please DE look at this thread, many people already seeing it as the solution to the imprecise wall system we have now.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/502328-parkour-21-the-perfect-remix/

 

The idea of the quick jumps is good but the implementation was not so good, imho.

[Sci_Ant]

Please DE look at this thread, many people already seeing it as the solution to the imprecise wall system we have now.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/502328-parkour-21-the-perfect-remix/

 

The idea of the quick jumps is good but the implementation was not so good, imho.

 

Approve of this idea, it's actually great! :)

[Wakeoflove]

Right, so since everyone is talking about the parkour itself, I'd like to speak about the other element that parkour 2.0's removal of stamina affected.

 

Blocking is now percentage based, the percentage is far too low for me to consider blocking normally anymore so I'd channel-block. However, as I equip life-strike on my melee, this increases my channeling consumption to a point where I cannot stand through a barrage for longer than 2 seconds sometimes without depleting all my 425 energy.

 

The mods affected by the changes to blocking are reflex guard and reflection. Reflex Guard is now a rare 10 rank, 14 mod point convenience that enables you to not hold down guard 55% of the time. It does nothing more.

 

Reflection does not reflect damage on regular guard, but I'm not sure if it's working as intended. If it isn't and this is fixed in future updates, it means that Reflection is now more useful than Reflex Guard as you can keep your guard up forever without any additional issue besides the percentage of damage that hits you through your guard. This means that a 5 rank common is now more useful than a 10 rank rare.

 

Unfortunately, this turns me away from any sort of blocking at all for survivability, mobility is the only option for any kind of substantial damage negation. This update is upsetting in that it actually took away one of my favourite playstyles(the sword wielding, parrying samurai kind) in the game, not from adding strictness to the method but by reducing the effectiveness(almost absolutely) of a feature in this game.

 

My warframe's mods have become substantially more generic in build instead of having a specialised melee oriented mod setup. As a result, there is actually less of an inclination to use melee for any purpose besides one channeled hit for lifestrike.

I am curious what the weapons block percentages are supposed to be. I found some chart somewhere on the warframe wiki that gives a block percentage for general categories like "hammer" and "nikana" and "sword and shield" but I don't know where tonfa are supposed to fit into or several other weapons...  but I don't know if it is parkour 2.0 accurate and I haven't been able to find anything in the UI that displays a weapon's native block percentage. Considering Steve said he hoped weapon choices would be based off of something other than mobility using the example of block percentage, it'd be really freaking helpful if the game actually told us what that block percentage is on each weapon.

[Wakeoflove]

Time to add my two cents:

 

The Good:

Bullet Jump has me crossing uneven terrain faster than ever, even with the loss of Coptering(being able to run infinitely offsets the loss for me, especially with the faster frames)

Gliding and such is neat, even if I admittedly don't utilize it fully.

Wall Clinging is fine too, though I have occasional trouble springing directly away from the clung wall.

 

The Bad:

The Hoppy new Wallrunning, you took a simple mechanic(the old wallrunning) and made it more nitpicky and complicated to control, especially on some of the old Spy segments designed to facilitate the old wallrunning.  It doesn't look good, it's janky and granular and not a smooth motion.  I understand the desire for verticality, but with the addition of wall cling, couldn't you have used that to 'transition' between running up and running sideways?  As it is, I practically never wall run unless I have to now, as I find I am often flung in directions I entirely do not wish to go.

I agree, I have adapted to much of new parkour 2.0, but the wallrunning is just difficult to control. I feel like I'm in a constant battle to stay on the wall because my character hasn't actually attached to the wall as in old "on a train track" wallrun. I also have not found that this new method of wall running has made it easier to go over uneven wall terrain as whenever i come to a surface, for example, in the dojo where one wall sticks out about a foot, perhaps 2, my character does not traverse along that corner seamlessly but rather wants to try to climb that mini wall/simply falls off.

 

I don't mind the hoping so much except it does feel at times like I'm going "too fast" along the wall now, or rather there's far less incrimental control as I must go a full hop distance before being able to stop, and controlling it feels like a nightmare. I too would only run along the walls now if I HAVE TO. This may be alleviated to some extent if they removed the "new stamina" on wall cling/aimglide but I'm not certain of that. I think it certainly is worth revisiting the attempt at making the train track wall run more versatile/controllable, and giving letting us essentially "live on the walls" as they had demonstrated in dev streams.

 

The old pace was the entire point of Warframe.  coming soon: removal of sprint.

 

They basically already have removed sprint for me, I had to switch my sprint (shift) with crouch (ctrl) to make new parkour work for me, so I basically never sprint anymore, which I think is stupid. I really feel that bulletjump should be attached to sprint instead of crouch so that all the high mobility assets are tied to the high mobility key and not split up so that it is now a chore to sprint/roll to the point that I no longer do either of those things.

[Wakeoflove]

Developers promised us a parkour - https://youtu.be/pIXecxcjWOM

And we got totally different. And I must say that the new parkour is full of S#&$. Now, with the new system of parkour players looked like a snail with springs instead of legs! 

Really it was impossible to combine the old with the new elements of parkour, instead of breaking something that worked so well? О_о 

Yus, I want this wallrunning. The new wallrun is terribad.

[ntyd1s]

* Please remove zoom from aim glide, using it to maneuver while holding sniper rifle is neither fun nor useful

* Please get rid of the hideous, slow, imprecise wallhop completely, even vertical wallrun backflip is more useful and way cooler if used creatively

* Kinetic momentum during ledge grabbing should have been removed, imagine reaching the top of thin wall and overflipping pass it - -"

 

I miss shooting during wall running :(

Edited August 6, 2015 by ntyd1s

[Raven_Face]

...WHY does almost everyone complain about the 'Aim' part of 'Aim Glide' ?? You'd rather your own character blocking up your aiming view? I use aim on the ground and in the air and that really helps me lining up the shots. Maybe you should just drop the capes and syandanas.

[Bugagai]

D.E just do a survey on the subject of how much people like the new parkour, and you will see that the people who did not like it much more than those whom he liked.

[SavageShulk]

D.E just do a survey on the subject of how much people like the new parkour, and you will see that the people who did not like it much more than those whom he liked.

Which they can then promptly ignore because they themselves didn't like t and it's their game.

[StonedMakak]

...WHY does almost everyone complain about the 'Aim' part of 'Aim Glide' ?? You'd rather your own character blocking up your aiming view? I use aim on the ground and in the air and that really helps me lining up the shots. Maybe you should just drop the capes and syandanas.

 

So, a player should be arbitrarily punished for using cosmetics? Really? And what about people who find the FOV change unnecessary and obtrusive, as well as straining for the eyes? 

 

Besides, try aim gliding and wall latching in the dojo. No zoom there and it offers better (and cleaner) overview of area. At the very least there should be a toggle in the options menu. 

[KoblasterTM]

"Coptering is superior."

 

Moving around using coptering is FAST. You can get to the end of almost any tile easily without hassle in a blink of an eye. Parkour 2.0's equivalent of that would be the Bullet Jump + Double Jump or Bullet Jump + Double Jump + Air Glide. Those maneuvers are indubitably slower than coptering and much more tedious.

 

That being said, that's the only advantage Coptering has to Parkour 2.0; it's easier to move from one end of the room to another with a simple air slide attack.

 

While being able to fly fast and far is its own advantage, coptering has a disadvantages too. Coptering restrics melee weapon variety for one. The Staves, the Dual Swords and the Polearms were always the top weapons being used because other melee weapons had a hard time doing both coptering and being a melee weapon at the same time. An example would be the Scindo. While the scindo does exceptional melee DPS and fun to use, it's difficult to go around the map and closing in on enemies without coptering since it attacks slow. Parkour 2.0 allows you to bring around any of the slower weapons in the game with ease. One will be able to close in on far away targets with a Jat Kittag or get in a good position with the Glaive. Thanks to Parkour 2.0, you don't have to use a specific set of weapons just so you can do runs fast.

 

Side Comment: People say we look like rabbits now. I'd rather look like a Jumping Ninja Rabbit than a Top. That's just me.

 

 

[egypt]

...WHY does almost everyone complain about the 'Aim' part of 'Aim Glide' ?? You'd rather your own character blocking up your aiming view? I use aim on the ground and in the air and that really helps me lining up the shots. Maybe you should just drop the capes and syandanas.

look, aim gliding is very cool. for shooting stuff and has this "john woo" feel is great. aim gliding is also not a new thing in the warframe arsenal. it was existing before but now it reduces your falling speed and makes this air shots that much easier to land, which is even more great.

what is not great however is that in the new meta aim glide is required to go fast. and lets face it, we are accustomed to this "going fast" set of mind. so now in the new meta, in order to go the fastest, you need to incorporate the aim gliding in your moving combo, which causes your camera to zoom in and out constantly while flying trough the level, which is annoying as hell.

i'm cool with aim gliding if it was only incorporated for shooting but it should kills your momentum hard when you are using it and not adds to it, so it is used only for those cool shots and nothing else.

Edited August 6, 2015 by egypt

[Skeks]

Everyone keeps referring to coptoring just for its movement potential, but what about those of us who just miss having it for combat. The new spin is absolutely terrible as is the air melee. Even the hitbox on the things feels toned down. Weapon speed be damned I miss my galatines old spin, and it had no problems moving fast using a combination of forward flips and air melee. Anyone who says we were limited only to "certain weapons" never got creative. The only real limitations were that some weapons were just bad (aka. Nami Solo) or had purely better counterparts. Never even bothered making a Tonbo. Take my Atterax any day. 

Edited August 6, 2015 by Skeks

[mkah_mvet]

I'm lumping the melee nerf in with this terrible system. (If parkour 2.0 is smoother for you, you sucked at warframe, that's all there is to it. It more than doubles the button mashing, forcing you to focus on mashing instead of getting to your destination in the fastest most graceful way possible.)

 

With the melee nerf, there is reduced choice in effective weapons, not increased. This stated development goal is a failure. Pre-nerf, my preferred weapon was tonbo, though sometimes I'd go with amphis. Tonbo had better mobility than tipedo and better damage, but sometimes a staff would be appropriate for the particular mission and was satisfying. Whips were pretty cool to use too, though all weapon categories were *fun*. Even weapons like obex were satisfying and fun even if it wasn't as effective over the course of a whole level. I never liked any of the swords that much because they always fail at applying their damage to the targets (which the melee nerf also functions as a damage application nerf, making them even worse now.)

 

Now it's not a question of fun. Now it's a matter of Scindo Prime is best. Period. My spreadsheet says so. There's no point in picking a weapon that can only hit a limited number of targets per strike. Especially in a slide attack. It is always preferable to kill a cluster of targets with 1 slow powerful strike (+1 free strike if you have the one good stance) than it is to work through the targets one at a time. Scindo prime has the highest damage per strike, and it can apply that damage to the most targets in the least amount of time. Slide attack nerf exacerbates this even more... now there's no point in using slide attack with any weapon without the longest reach in the game.

 

Fewer criteria for choosing a weapon means fewer niches for different weapons means less diversity in weapon selection.

Edited August 7, 2015 by mkah_mvet