Is there Counter-Play to Shock Eximus?

[Katinka]

Telling people to just keep their distance doesn't really work when Corpus love to spawn inside tiny cupboards and with their aura in range of us.  How am I supposed to keep my distance from something that doesn't exist until it is within range?  (I've been using Enemy Radar for ages so I know these cupboards are spawning enemies at close range.  No blips on map at 30m, 5 blips appear just as I get to the door.)

Edited March 6, 2016 by Katinka

[Rawbeard]

2 hours ago, Katinka said:

-snip-

I think the "constructive" answer is "git gud". yeah.

[Omnimorph]

14 hours ago, (PS4)Lord_Gremlin said:

Your efficiency should always be 175% or 160% minimum. And flow and primed flow are objectively useless trash outside of being battery carrier in Law of Retribution. 

Losing 100% of energy shouldn't be an issue. With zenurik especially. 

Yeah the problem with that is that it's likely to lead to less build diversity.  A Flow/low eff build is viable in a team with a Trinity, for example, and it's viable for other types of frames circumstantially.  But if everything is going to go high eff, that makes Blind Rage problematic. 

The problem isn't the mob type itself - it's cool to have a mob that drains.  The problem is it's not always possible to know when one is around. 

I would favour a "proximity warning" - as if the frame's electronics can tell the Tenno that there's a Shock Eximus on the tileset, that would lead to the player needing to be on their toes, and thus lead to an "adjusting to Shock Eximuses" situation WITHOUT everyone having to go the same high eff build route.

Generally I would favour more interactivity in general like "proximity warnings".  Either that or redesign Shock Eximuses to be more visually distinct (like the Corpus guys are with their tallness and funny hats).  In the heat of battle, the mobs in Warframe aren't always easy to distinguish from each other (not a bad thing as such, I love the art design).   When mobs aren't all that easy to distinguish, if you're going to have some mobs (that look fairly similar from a distance) having things like super-duper drain powers, then you either need proximity warnings or you need to visually re-design the mobs somewhat.

[KIREEK]

12 hours ago, Icy_Ymir said:

A very nice tactic. Unless you're playing as Valkyr. Or Saryn. Or... well, any melee-focused warframe.

I mostly use ranged weapons and very rarely go into melee, but i still can understand the pain of melee players, this will ruin their gameplay entirely. You should be able to understand that too.

I also like to use invisibility as a CC ability

I also use guns to do stealth missions

In short, you guys pick up the worst things and then complain on the forums, please recheck game mechanics and use a different aproach to these enemies, if you honestly believe a single ability should be used against all types of enemies then you should play a bit more warframe because that feature is present in all abilities.

Nullifiers exist and you can't use certain abilities inside

Edited March 6, 2016 by KIREEKPSO

[Katinka]

Locking out powers for the duration of the proc would have a similar effect without having to strip all energy.  That way the high energy capacity builds will still recover when the proc ends without having to resort to gear etc.  It would function similar to a nullifier bubble except that once the proc triggerd you have to wait for it to pass instead of just getting out of the area/killing the source.  I'm just surprised this has returned without change after it was removed for a reason.  Did someone at DE forget that it was deliberately removed and just suddenly think 'Hey, why's that not doing anything?' without anyone saying 'Because we disabled it while we tried to come up with something less ridiculous.'?

[Guardian_Legion]

6 hours ago, Sanctusfortis said:

Energy restores my friend energy restores

which are useless for the five or so seconds after the proc hits you. Shock eximus spawned at the 65min mark of my solo t3surv yesterday. Scariest thing ever because he spawned just as elemental ward and vex armor went down so i could reapply them, and i just freaking bailed. I knew that i had no chance of recovering from that without going down. Thankfully I was 2 rooms away from extract and had just cleared the path through the first room before the hellspawn spawned literally right in front of me.

Also how the hell am I supposed to counter these A******s if they spawn literally in range with their aura? What then?

[SquireAngel]

14 minutes ago, Legionofone said:

which are useless for the five or so seconds after the proc hits you. Shock eximus spawned at the 65min mark of my solo t3surv yesterday. Scariest thing ever because he spawned just as elemental ward and vex armor went down so i could reapply them, and i just freaking bailed. I knew that i had no chance of recovering from that without going down. Thankfully I was 2 rooms away from extract and had just cleared the path through the first room before the hellspawn spawned literally right in front of me.

Also how the hell am I supposed to counter these A******s if they spawn literally in range with their aura? What then?

So, you couldn't have gotten a room, over, dropped a pad, and THEN reapplied Vex? You act as if DE isn't allowed to force your hand by having something catch you off guard. Is it a *@##$ to lose all your energy? Sure, but hey, not the end of the world. There are LOTS of areas to hide away for a second and recuperate in the void, so I don't really see what your issue was.

[Kontrollo]

Oberon's Hallowed Ground gives proc immunity, and maybe Nezha's Fire Walker too. Not sure about the latter giving immunity, but it does remove the Magnetic proc effect.

[Sloan441]

16 hours ago, (PS4)Lord_Gremlin said:

 And flow and primed flow are objectively useless trash outside of being battery carrier in Law of Retribution. 

 

...and this is why you don't do sorties in PuGs: too many of the community have no idea what they're talking about and just repeat stupid crap they're read on the forums somewhere else.

Flow and Primed Flow always have a place in particular circumstances. You might use flow mods for several reasons. To wit:

1) You essentially have unlimited energy. This works better with a large energy pool. If you have access to EV or Zenurik, you don't need efficiency particularly and can use a larger pool to offset activation costs.

2) Quick Thinking. This shouldn't need expostulation.

3) Related to #1, you might not want to deal with the loss of duration concomitant with FE. Using Flow or Primed Flow in place of FE gives you more build options.

Now the shock exwhowhatstis. Yeah, they're annoying, especially if you're stupid. If you get hit with the aura this is a clue to get the hell out of Dodge and review the situation at a safe distance. Duh. Drop restores when able and re-approach the fight using tactics not predicated on going in full retard. This does wonders for one's survivability. Who knew?

[Kontrollo]

19 minutes ago, Kontrollo said:

Oberon's Hallowed Ground gives proc immunity, and maybe Nezha's Fire Walker too. Not sure about the latter giving immunity, but it does remove the Magnetic proc effect.

Just tested it in the Simulacrum; Hallowed Ground works fine, Nezha's Fire Walker doesn't help at all. It gets deactivated immediately. I really think it should grant immunity now, too, so I created a request:

 

[(PSN)horridhal]

A lot of people defending a bad mechanic in this thread.  Wow.

For those of you saying prioritize : Feel free to try saying that when you've been in a T4 for 60 minutes+.

For those saying it is a "Challenge" : Cheapness is not the same as challenging.  Being able to fully drain my shields, energy, and futz up my hud simply because something got close to me is excessive.  Nullifiers and Scrambus units are indicative of challenges.  Shock Eximus with this proc are cheap.  The two are not interchangeable.

[Guardian_Legion]

1 hour ago, SquireAngel said:

So, you couldn't have gotten a room, over, dropped a pad, and THEN reapplied Vex? You act as if DE isn't allowed to force your hand by having something catch you off guard. Is it a *@##$ to lose all your energy? Sure, but hey, not the end of the world. There are LOTS of areas to hide away for a second and recuperate in the void, so I don't really see what your issue was.

So i should be forced to carry consumables? And hate to break it to you but at 65mins I didn't particularly like the idea of randomly having to deal with enemies that disable me completely BY SPAWNING CLOSE TO ME. I used my example to show that these enemies are broken. Yes, you can use consumables to recover after escaping, but that should not be required. There is no preventative measure to deal with a proximity based enemy, if they spawn literally 5 in game meters away from me.

Yes i could have continued, running away and hiding every time they do that, but how am i going to continue to maintain life support if i have to run and hide every few minutes? How am i going to deal with them if i can't kill them before they bum-rush me( because at that level with a shotgun, they are definitely getting into range)? what happens when an ancient pulls me into their aura ( because we all know there are times where ancients hit with hooks that clearly should not have hit) I don't mind having an enemy that can hit me with magnetic, I mind having an enemy with no real options for counterplay.

[DeathTheLegendary1]

15 hours ago, Lorthos_Mornin said:

I really do hate this unit.  There is absolutely no counter play to it.  Nullifiers are arguably too strong but they have a giant shield and are really squishy.  Combas and Scrabii can be headshot to remove their ability if you can manage to find them in the giant crowd of enemies they're in and the Sapper Ospreys projectile can be destroyed if you can manage to shoot it.  All of these enemies have at least some counter play you can make against them.  Shock eximi as they currently are have zip.  I'm really surprised they don't have a shock version of the arson eximi ability.   Shouldn't they release a shock nova like volt?  I mean seriously, and I know I'm reiterating here, how did something named SHOCK end up with MAGNETIC.

Well now we have Electric Eximus Nullifiers so... YAAAAAAY!!!. Now i enter a field where i cant use my abilities even after i kill the bastard.

[-Temp0-]

17 hours ago, LunarTemplar said:

BTW, the line about them 'only being Corpus, is total bull. I've been hitting Eris for Plastids and Nano Spores, guess what Ancient  Eximus I ran into.

Just met a couple today in sortie surv. And today it was actually grineer fs someone will be reading it later. Yep, for all the defenders of this bs, the faction we figh the most. I actually wanted to make a screenshot or something because people were dying left and right, not a single minute without reviving someone. Folks all were above mr 15 for the record. I mean yes, it was combined with a rad hazard but imagine all the possibilities... Cause we all tknow taht rad hazard is not the only and by far not the worst condition we encouter in sortie.

Edited March 6, 2016 by Nomen_Nescio

[-Temp0-]

19 hours ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

top tips for killing Shock Eximus Enemies.

 

Real tip: just accept you have no control over situation WHATSOEVER. Especially if you play high lvl or sortie. Accept that you willl be dying a lot now because someone who doesn't even play the game just decided to add a random enemy that can fck you up in any time and you can't prevent it at all. Also, don't even think about soloing anything now, especially, again, something like sortie's surv. 

Edited March 6, 2016 by Nomen_Nescio

[(PSN)Lord_Gremlin]

8 hours ago, Omnimorph said:

Yeah the problem with that is that it's likely to lead to less build diversity.  A Flow/low eff build is viable in a team with a Trinity, for example, and it's viable for other types of frames circumstantially.  But if everything is going to go high eff, that makes Blind Rage problematic. 

The problem isn't the mob type itself - it's cool to have a mob that drains.  The problem is it's not always possible to know when one is around. 

I would favour a "proximity warning" - as if the frame's electronics can tell the Tenno that there's a Shock Eximus on the tileset, that would lead to the player needing to be on their toes, and thus lead to an "adjusting to Shock Eximuses" situation WITHOUT everyone having to go the same high eff build route.

Generally I would favour more interactivity in general like "proximity warnings".  Either that or redesign Shock Eximuses to be more visually distinct (like the Corpus guys are with their tallness and funny hats).  In the heat of battle, the mobs in Warframe aren't always easy to distinguish from each other (not a bad thing as such, I love the art design).   When mobs aren't all that easy to distinguish, if you're going to have some mobs (that look fairly similar from a distance) having things like super-duper drain powers, then you either need proximity warnings or you need to visually re-design the mobs somewhat.

Blind rage was and is a trap mod. It's useful for only a few abilities and even then. Spoiled strike has same issue. Shock eximus is actually kinda good because it prevents cheesing the game like going past 60 minutes in T4 survival. It should be impossible. 

[xubile]

On 3/6/2016 at 8:29 AM, Venomzz0 said:

Except his post is wrong, because shock eximus only spawn on corpus missions.

i can confirm that those guys also spawn as corrupted crewman, usually spawns after 30 mins on t3 void survivals 

[Murderfini]

And the melee goes right back into garbage with hydroid.

[-Temp0-]

11 hours ago, (PS4)Lord_Gremlin said:

because it prevents cheesing the game like going past 60 minutes in T4 survival. It should be impossible. 

It's not even the devs that's the main problem here. It's people like you. Because the devs at least don't play the game, how the f staying for 60 minutes in a mission that goes on and on forever till you can handle it is "cheesing" for f sake?! By that *** logic completing the third sortie stage should also be impossible, but guess what, sortie is considered to be only somewhat challenging thing and rewards for it proves that since they're mediocre at best. Rewards in the void also don't reaIly 'scale' with the level so wth is your problem here. Won't even mention things like raids, especially nightmare ones. Which shouldn't be possible to complete yet again judging by this genius logic and yet they're here for players to do. And they don't even have levels of difficulty. You either handle them as they are or die.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Nomen_Nescio

[-CdG-Zilchy]

Nyx Mindfreak would probably work. Personally if I see my energy dropping rapidly it's not real hard to glance around and kill the problem.

[-Temp0-]

Nyx Mindfreak would probably work. Personally if I see my energy dropping rapidly it's not real hard to glance around and kill the problem.

Seems like you've never done sortie. With the number of enemies spawning in surv it's nearly impossible, especially since enemy can be god knows where by the time your energy hits 0. Plus, like it was already mentioned 1000 times, you can't tell them apart from any other eximus unit if you didn't read their names above their head. And if you don't know about those changes (and many people don't because there are many players that started playing after they were removed) you won't even know what hit you. Even tho I knew about such enemies (not shock variation tho), before that only happened in infested areas, couldn't figured for dear life why for the love of god grineer also have something like this before I've read the forum. Though it was a bug at first.

That's not to mention frames like Valkyr, Wukong and some other like Equinox (which just freaking only got her peaceful provocation augment that made night form playable for once) are now useless trash. You have no energy while your 4, 2 or 3 active for them - you're a corpse in a second. Nothing will save you. 

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Moving on over to General Feedback, as this thread seems to have evolved into a feedback thread and some naughty Tenno were using the downvote feature to minimize visibility of posts they don't agree with.

[izzatuw]

On 06/03/2016 at 11:58 AM, LukEduBR said:

1 minute ago, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

Moving on over to General Feedback, as this thread seems to have evolved into a feedback thread and some naughty Tenno were using the downvote feature to minimize visibility of posts they don't agree with.

The mobile forums is weird e-e

Why do we have the downvote option anyway?

[hukurokuju5]

its hard to keep distance if you have to mouse over to read every damn eximus description ....

[RX-3DR]

The logic doesn't really add up when the complaint is about how this limits your playstyle when the playstyle in question, is about limiting one to a single melee weapon/ability. It's like serving people soup in a metal bowl but the customers are getting angry from burning their hands because they cannot use chopsticks to drink the soup even if they were given a full set of cutlery.

Hard counters have happened before. Shield Dargyns renders all but 2 ranged weapon almost useless but it seems a lot of people were fine with it. Does DE have to put the old loadout system back where you are forced to equip a Primary, Secondary and Melee at all times to drive the point?

They are not immune to Warframe abilities. You can use abilities to slow down the fight and buy yourself time to pick your targets better. If your frame doesn't have that ability, then tough luck, not every frame is supposed to handle every situation equally.