Anyone else feel burned by the riven 15 mod limit

[dashashou]

Well  got burned by this new mod cap  - i traded to get to that 15 (Obviously )  , and i figure it was like that kubrow eggs if u get one in mission/alert  you can go over the cap . Turns out  NO  , you have to burn a riven mod ; the out rage that i felt was just well the words "why do i even play this game " came out of my mouth . SO now i guess i have to store these mods on a clanner i trust   and i'm not sure if storing these mods on a alt breaks the rules or not . I do know that alot of people are making alts  to farm these mods  .

But we shouldn't have to cheat to  make this system  partially functional . I know DE - Reb said that DE put the limit in place so players would be more creative but Alt-ing  can't be what they intended.  

At this point i'm wondering why  i bother . with the new end game being rng on rng and a 15 max limit it's rage inducing to care .  

Edited November 18, 2016 by Ravel7

[Noobverest]

I can't be creative if there's a limit on my creativity.

[(XBOX)Vaktalor]

Just now, Noobverest said:

I can't be creative if there's a limit on my creativity.

i couldn't agree more 

[SenorClipClop]

5 minutes ago, Ravel7 said:

Well  got burned by this new mod cap  - i traded to get to that 15 (Obviously )  , and i figure it was like that kubrow eggs if u get one in mission/alert  you can go over the cap . Turns out  NO  , you have to burn a riven mod ; the out rage that i felt was just well the words why do i even play this game " came out of my mouth . SO now i guess i have to store these mods on a clanner i trust   and i'm not sure if storing these mods on a alt breaks the rules or not . I do know that alot of people are making alts  to farm these mods  .

But we shouldn't have to cheat to  make this system  partially functional . I know DE - Reb said that DE put the limit in place so players would be more creative but Alt-ing  can't be what they intended.  

At this point i'm wondering why  i bother . with the new end game being rng on rng and a 15 max limit it's rage inducing to care .  

This new feature has been out for less than a week. I think you need to chill on the grinding a bit, at least until they figure out what to do with this highly experimental new beta element.

[Neonir]

3 minutes ago, Noobverest said:

I can't be creative if there's a limit on my creativity.

Okay I am all for neutrality on the topic of riven mods, but this is absolute bs.

"I cant be creative if I can only do so many things at a time"

Holy guacamole dude.

No, no having limits forces you to be MORE creative, to find MORE genius ways of doing things, to create in a more unique way.

I can tell you for certain that the artists who said "I am going to use only three colours in this" never turned around and said "it's impossible to be creative if there's a limit on my creativity".

Hell, I can pull up more examples, but this is effectively just whining. What you're really saying is "I cant do everything I want if there's limits on what I can do." Which, yes, is possibly true, but dont try to pin this on them limiting our creativity.

[AXCrusnik]

Uhh... last time I tried getting an egg when I already have one the game didn't let me. Don't think I ever tried with an alert egg though.

 

Also my luck with sorties has been S#&$ (2k endo at least 3 4 days in a row) and I'm not going to buy riven mods with plat if they're still on the table for balancing and major changes.. so the only one I have is the mod I got from the quest... which happens to be for a weapon I despise for it's position in the meta and basically refuse to use.

Edited November 18, 2016 by AXCrusnik

[taiiat]

8 minutes ago, Neonir said:

No, no having limits forces you to be MORE creative, to find MORE genius ways of doing things, to create in a more unique way.

systematically false.

the limit forces Players to choose between keeping Mods for Overpowered Weapons that make the game a walking simulator and making those even more Overpowered, or the fun things they want to do.

forcing that split is a naive mistake. the fun goofy stuff will almost always lose.

 

painting colors is completely irrelevant, because some of those colors don't make your painting automatically worth more money, they're all equal because it's strictly creative.

it's not limiting creativity (if we consider creativity something strictly aesthetic and having no numerical involvement) i guess sure, because one can theorize any Riven Mod for anything, but forcing that choice guarantees the system to backfire.

 

the more you know.

Edited November 18, 2016 by taiiat

[schilds]

On the creativity thing. People are talking about two different things.

 

Creativity requires space to experiment.

Constraints on resources force you to be creative in making use of them.

 

Which one is the Riven mod cap?

[Fionntan]

8 minutes ago, AXCrusnik said:

Uhh... last time I tried getting an egg when I already have one the game didn't let me. Don't think I ever tried with an alert egg though.

 

Also my luck with sorties has been S#&$ (2k endo at least 3 days in a row) and I'm not going to buy riven mods with plat if they're still on the table for balancing and major changes.. so the only one I have is the mod I got from the quest... which happens to be for a weapon I despise for it's position in the meta and basically refuse to use.

Just to answer egg part, I can confirm you can stack kubrow eggs from the the alers; I did a bunch thinking I needed them for Kuvats  (.-.)

Also I'm in the same boat with rng luck, I just got one Riven mod today since it became a thing.... I don't mind endos I get but come on :l

Much rather have endo as compliment then a final reward.... /rant

PS: Just curious, which meta mod weapon you go? I might buy it off if interested or trade for something else. PM for more details and such /off-topic

On topic:

14 minutes ago, SenorClipClop said:

This new feature has been out for less than a week. I think you need to chill on the grinding a bit, at least until they figure out what to do with this highly experimental new beta element.

Pretty much follow this advice ^^

Edited November 18, 2016 by Fionntan

[Zhoyzu]

Are they really all that? i think i have one not sure. i dont see any real need for em.

[AXCrusnik]

17 minutes ago, Fionntan said:

PS: Just curious, which meta mod weapon you go? I might buy it off if interested or trade for something else. /off-topic

Simulor mod, +8.5% Cold , +14.5% Crit chance, +4.7% Damage to corpus, -4% Damage to grineer. MR13 D polarity

Edited November 18, 2016 by AXCrusnik

[Irorone]

Honestly Riven Mods are a half baked concept.

One they aren't always trade off mods, which was the corrupted mod trademark anyway, but when there are they can be CRIPPLING like -100% damage crippling.

Two that you can only equip one on any piece of gear, it's basically an arcane in mod form.

Three the riven limit.  The reason mod 1.0 went the way of the dodo was the variety of rolls would cripple database storage, hence why the riven limit is in place now.  But why give us ANY option of randomized loot if it's gonna come with the handicaps that rivens do?  Blunt answer, to give us something to do.

Four the escalating reroll costs when the only time an escalating cost should come into play is on upgrades.  In it's current state it's just an excuse to grind the new resource after you've already got the four weapons that need it to be built.

Five they offer NO customization in the truest sense, they only offer even bigger values on existing affixes in turn only to bloat the plat price.

Six you can only get more via sorties, which in turn with everything else translates into nothing more than a new way to bloat plat prices.

Seven the player has virtually NO control over the mods they get.  They can be low mr locked making the affixes just bad for something like a riven mod even if you're an mr 22-23 player.  The weapon they are even compatible with is completely random and cannot be altered after getting said riven.  Even the affixes boil down to, will you get the affixes you want before the kuva costs hit stupid levels?  At the end of the day, riven mods are the pinnacle or RNG locked progression in this game right now.

The only excusing factor for Riven Mods right now is you really DON'T need one to be relevant even at extremely high level content.

[SenorClipClop]

19 minutes ago, taiiat said:

forcing that split is a naive mistake. the fun goofy stuff will almost always lose.

This is why they're looking to balance these Mods in the near future, so that all weapons are more likely to potentially be on a level playing field in the late game.

 

[Irorone]

Just now, SenorClipClop said:

This is why they're looking to balance these Mods in the near future, so that all weapons are more likely to potentially be on a level playing field in the late game.

 

Which is another mistake.  If all the riven mods do is level out the "playing field" then Syndrome from the Incredibles stated it best,

"When everyone's super, no one will be"

[Noobverest]

40 minutes ago, Neonir said:

Okay I am all for neutrality on the topic of riven mods, but this is absolute bs.

"I cant be creative if I can only do so many things at a time"

Holy guacamole dude.

No, no having limits forces you to be MORE creative, to find MORE genius ways of doing things, to create in a more unique way.

I can tell you for certain that the artists who said "I am going to use only three colours in this" never turned around and said "it's impossible to be creative if there's a limit on my creativity".

Hell, I can pull up more examples, but this is effectively just whining. What you're really saying is "I cant do everything I want if there's limits on what I can do." Which, yes, is possibly true, but dont try to pin this on them limiting our creativity.

It's totally true.

For example, if the riven mods weren't limited; I could be creative with my favourite weapon.

For example Ignis, I've always wondered what a critical/critical damage build could do for it. I could try a status chance/status duration build for it. I could try a multishot/critical build for it and so on.

With a limited selection, having multiple mods for the same weapon means my chances of trying out something creative for other weapons also shrinks.

hence this is a limit on my creativity, because now I have to make choices on which weapons I should riven, and which weapons would benefit most from a riven mod.

If it was unlimited, I would have unlimited choices, and I could use my creativity to the max. Right now, my creativity is limited to 15 careful considerations, and 15 limited choices.

 

Art and games are different, you can have a wonderful sketch with just one pencil, and shading. You can't be super creative with one riven mod. See? Different.

[SenorClipClop]

9 minutes ago, Irorone said:

Which is another mistake.  If all the riven mods do is level out the "playing field" then Syndrome from the Incredibles stated it best,

"When everyone's super, no one will be"

But we want this. Or I do, anyway. The incredibly dividing tiers of the "weapon meta" in this game make it so that despite the hundreds-deep weapon roster that Warframe has to offer, post-Lvl 30 content sees only about 50 or so of these weapons on a regular basis. That's a whole lot of content nobody uses, and that's not good to have in any game.

Balancing the Riven Mods so that some weapons will still be overpowered in the midgame, but any player can make any weapon into something that can go pound-for-pound with a "god-tier" gun when the late game rolls around. I want to be able to take the Gorgon into a high-level mission, take it seriously and not be thinking about the Soma the whole time. I want to use skill and get results from a Sybaris on par with the Simirage who's blindly chucking damage all over the place, because with balanced Rmods, it would be possible for the Sybaris to deal comparable damage to the Simulor.

Edited November 18, 2016 by SenorClipClop

[Irorone]

3 minutes ago, SenorClipClop said:

But we want this. Or I do, anyway. The incredibly dividing tiers of the "weapon meta" in this game make it so that despite the hundreds-deep weapon roster that Warframe has to offer, post-Lvl 30 content sees only about 50 or so of these weapons on a regular basis. That's a whole lot of content nobody uses, and that's not good to have in any game.

Balancing the Riven Mods so that some weapons will still be overpowered in the midgame, but any player can make any weapon into something that can go pound-for-pound with a "god-tier" gun. I want to be able to take the Gorgon into a high-level mission, take it seriously and not be thinking about the Soma the whole time. I want to use skill and get results from a Sybaris on par with the Simirage who's blindly chucking damage all over the place, because with balanced Rmods, it would be possible for the Sybaris to deal comparable damage to the Simulor.

Then answer me this, if a braton, a karak, and a tethra had the SAME stats as a result of a virtually mandatory riven mod why would you  bother to pick any individual one?

Also a lot of weapons CAN go toe to toe with end level content they just aren't AS optimized for it which is the whole mind numbing argument of PVE weapon balance.

Edited November 18, 2016 by Irorone

[0zryel]

I knew the first time I read how this work I be burn out, so I haven't even bother to not even do the challenge... I know it will get better at some point. SO I decided to wait it off and do other stuff...

Still wish I could get Arcanes from the sorties... How the raids are and me be being casual I just don't see me doing them at any time soon... I guess Im waiting out a couple of things until I can actually do them...as a casual. 

Point is, to me if I know its going to burn me out... I rather just take my time to do it... and enjoy doing it than to punish and force myself to do stuff I hate.

I think this Riven Mods would be welcome in China where players seem to love the endless grind...  I think its a cool idea just need a bit more work and DE love... Im actually very surprise DE put this in... Maybe it was release in China and was a hit and they though it be a love here too?

I guess we need to wait and see... 

[taiiat]

22 minutes ago, SenorClipClop said:

This is why they're looking to balance these Mods in the near future, so that all weapons are more likely to potentially be on a level playing field in the late game.

making an already Overpowered, walk to the finish line Weapon 20% better vs making something that isn't useful comparatively 300% better - the Overpowered one still wins when Players are forced to choose between them.

because 20% for the Overpowered one can easily be the total for that other one with giant stat boosts in total.

 

should they be weighted towards lower end Weapons like they are/likely will do? yes. but that addresses something else, not this. all that does is ensure the Overpowered Weapons get less Powercreep out of Riven. but they still get some.
which means they get picked first, de facto.

 

[ThunderZsolt]

6 hours ago, Irorone said:

Then answer me this, if a braton, a karak, and a tethra had the SAME stats as a result of a virtually mandatory riven mod why would you  bother to pick any individual one?

Also a lot of weapons CAN go toe to toe with end level content they just aren't AS optimized for it which is the whole mind numbing argument of PVE weapon balance.

• I'd pick thethra, because i like corpus weapons (plus, prisma love).
• Others may pick the braton, because it has that special feeling because it is the starter weapon, and it has a prime variant (important because fashion frame)
• Many think that the karak (wraith) is the most beautiful rifle.

Other than aesthetics (prisma vs prime vs wraith) they have different magazine size, reload speed, recoil, weapon sound etc.

I consider myself lucky that the Hek is my favourite weapon, so i can bring my Vaykor baby literally anywhere in the game and do good, but my other favourite is the supra, which just simply kills too slow above lvl80 (even though the augment helps with the 25% status chance) unless i'm playing Mirage.

 

On the OT: I also feel that i'd need multiple riven mods for the same weapon, because they are random. Plus, we can't do anything when we get riven mods for trash weapons. I don't want to use them. I don't want to keep them because of the 15 limit. I can't trade them, because nobody wants them. Dissolving it to endo makes it basically worthless (compared to the 4k-4k endo what you can get from sorties)

 

EDIT: there are 26 unique rifles (not counting sentinel weapons) and you can have 15 riven mods max, which is again, BS

Edited November 18, 2016 by Krumplifej

[(PSN)A_SimpleName]

My opinion on the 15 capacity limit is so that the game forces you to farm Kuva for re-rolls. This translate to a guarantee usage of the new mechanic that DE had worked so hard to develop. 

You want me to use under-used weapons by limiting the amount of mods that help under-used weapons? What if I want to try out 16 under-used weapons? Does this mean that 16th place don't get any love? Doesn't that completely make the 16th place NOT use; therefore, still remain under-used?

[pauli133]

If players are forced to pick and choose (which is the purpose of the riven mod limit), then good weapons with mediocre mods are always going to win out over mediocre weapons with good mods.

I like riven mods, I like handicapping them to encourage weapon choice diversity, but the riven capacity limit is ill-conceived and counter to this purpose and to player choice.

[----Fenrir----]

The limit is bad. And it makes getting a riven mod for a sentinel weapon even worse since being limited to only 15 basically means that those will always directly go into the digital trash can.

[Tesseract7777]

Taiiat is absolutely right. 

You can say all you want about how theoretically limits can lead to creativity, but this isn't a theoretical vacuum. 

This is real life. And in real life, people who play video games and have a limit on how many mods they can choose, are just going to stack up the most OP of the mods the vast majority of the time. That means the mods that are more quirky, creative, fun, interesting or oddball are going to be tossed because "gotta have space for the good stuff". 

[Vesiga]

I dont have an issue cause I only got 3.
and if any of you read, there was a part of the riven mod page of "Cephalon Modeus" saying he was just giving us 15 limit to start.

So the cap will raise once they get riven mods balanced out and more versions out, such as shotgun, pistol, and melee rivens

Edited November 18, 2016 by Vesiga