[Update 20] Octavia Feedback Megathread

[SeaUrchins]

3 minutes ago, aligatorno said:

your opinion is now a fact?

It is fact that both Mallet and Decoy can be used to draw enemy fire, it is fact that Mallet has infinite durability and Decoy doesn't. It is fact that decoy gets one-shot on higher levels, where Mallet can still be successfully used for controlling enemy fire.

Neither of the above is my opinion.

[Coldie93]

2 minutes ago, SeaUrchins said:

It is an invalid argument.

Which does not mean unkillable at all. There are no unkillable frames fyi.

Let see,  Loki's got invisibility which makes enemies unable to target him. He also has Disarm that makes the enemies trade their deadly guns for rubber piss sticks. Adding that Disarm can be improved with an augment that makes your enemies hit each other with their rubber piss sticks. And if for some reason you are still dumb enough to get clobbered by rubber piss sticks,  you can switch with your decoy and not get killed.

Thats unkillable in my definition.

[Ruin_Uranor-er-nelde]

In my opinion, if loki's decoy becomes invulnerable (WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I WANT!!!), he will be perfect (too OP). Cast 2 -> wait for enemies to gather to decoy's place,-> Disarmed -> eat popcorn while watching insufferable bombard hitting decoy with backscratcher!.

Sounds too perfect for me. (I WANT IT!!) :)

Edited April 16, 2017 by Ruin_Uranor-er-nelde

[SeaUrchins]

14 minutes ago, Coldie93 said:

Let see,  Loki's got invisibility which makes enemies unable to target him. He also has Disarm that makes the enemies trade their deadly guns for rubber piss sticks. Adding that Disarm can be improved with an augment that makes your enemies hit each other with their rubber piss sticks. And if for some reason you are still dumb enough to get clobbered by rubber piss sticks,  you can switch with your decoy and not get killed.

Thats unkillable in my definition.

Kek, out of the top of my head I could name you some enemies that can't be disarmed and some that target invisible enemies, but you already showed that your definition of "unkillable" is not unkillable at all.

Edited April 16, 2017 by SeaUrchins

[Leafcoin]

1 hour ago, SeaUrchins said:

Not to me, it is irrelevant to the topic of the thread.

Deployable Mallet that deals damage and can't be killed is superior to a killable decoy that doesn't deal damage when used to draw enemy fire.

If you would like to counter the statement and claim killable decoy is more OP than the invulnerable mallet of doom, you're welcome to provide your arguments.

Nobody can counter your statement and claim killable decoy is more OP than the invulnerable mallet of doom, because nobody uses decoy for drawing enemy fire.

All Loki does in any mission that is not spy is go invisible and chop up victims with an occasional dose of radial disarm.

Edited April 16, 2017 by bichoi909

[Ruin_Uranor-er-nelde]

20 minutes ago, bichoi909 said:

Nobody can counter your statement and claim killable decoy is more OP than the invulnerable mallet of doom, because nobody uses decoy for drawing enemy fire.

All Loki does in any mission that is not spy is go invisible and chop up victims with an occasional dose of radial disarm.

Well, there are people who use Decoy as DECOY (or draw fires away). I can name one or two situations that i will automatically uses decoy to claim the safe spot from enemy fires

 

[Ikusias]

Octavia needs a nerf because its mandachord mechanics are overly abusable: 6x buffs at the same time simply by filling with notes all spaces of the board? are you crazy? also her visual effects are as annoying if not worse that Mirage+symulor... and there were torches and pitchforks for that

[Coldie93]

5 hours ago, SeaUrchins said:

Kek, out of the top of my head I could name you some enemies that can't be disarmed and some that target invisible enemies, but you already showed that your definition of "unkillable" is not unkillable at all.

Bosses are bosses but man you are hung up to this "unkillable" stuff.  I feel that you get what I mean.  Loki as he is now is already hard to kill even when compared to other warframes.  He already has two survivability skills, Invisibility and Disarm.  Switch teleport can also be considered to an extent.  Adding an invulnerable Decoy is really unnessecary at this point.

So it still stands to reason that making decoy invulnerable will make an already OP frame far more OP.

Mallet is more superior than Decoy?  I dont see the problem with that.

Edited April 16, 2017 by Coldie93

[SeaUrchins]

7 hours ago, Coldie93 said:

Bosses are bosses but man you are hung up to this "unkillable" stuff.  I feel that you get what I mean.

I did not mean bosses or field bosses. There are enemies you can't disarm and there enemies that will target and attack invisible frames under certain circumstances, it has nothing to do with bosses. Your assumption that you can disarm anyone is simply false.

Unkillable imples you cannot be killed, if you run away from enemies or hide, you are doing it exactly because you are killable.

Your branding Loki as OP is also outdated. Now when anyone can go invisible with Huras or Naramon, there are no missions where Loki alone would dwarf other frames, but it is no wonder considering how little you know how his toolkit works (he is as OP as unkillable lol).

Edited April 17, 2017 by SeaUrchins

[jfhsanseiIII]

Both have their uses and I'm fine with their current iterations.  My one caveat is Loki's decoy needs to be a little more durable or have the possibility to reappear again a set number of times in a different place. 

[Avynire]

I don't think most of players use decoy for "decoy" purpose (invis) most just use it for switch tele. Indeed loki decoy is very fragile in higher lvl enemy.

[(PSN)Akuma_Asura_]

I agree with the OP but I also agree with whoever who said making lokis decoy invulnerable will make him perfect . So yeah I'd just give it the snow globe changes & right now I believe there are other frames that need qol changes more than Loki 

Edited April 17, 2017 by (PS4)Akuma_Asura_

[PopeUrban]

Give it an invuln phase on cast so it scales bette like snowglobe, but there's no reason to nerf mallet.

Both frames and how they use their abilities are completely different. Loki is a very good frame on the move, octavia's entire kit suffers on the move, as one of the abilities is a giant waste of time (the ball) and the other one is a buff field that is very difficult to use to achieve the same stealth loki gets by pushing a button.

Loki is exceptionally good at what he does already, as is octavia. The difference is that octavia's niche area control, and loki's niche is infiltration. Putting an HP limit on mallet makes it literally incapable of doing its one job. Having an HP limit on decoy does not prevent it from doing its job. Mallet is not a distraction. Mallet is a mechanics focused DPS ability. That's why Mallet has way weaker enemy aggro than decoy. In most cases enemies will completely ignore mallet if there's a player in range to shoot. Not so for decoy.

Both frames can trivialize large portions of content, however that's the nature of stealth in warframe. I'm surprised DE still hasn't added dedicated antistealth units to NPC armies honestly.

Mallet's entire design is as a sentinel. It only works properly if everyone in the room is stealthed or much further away from the enemy. Otherwise it is a massive waste of energy, as it does literally nothing. It is designed to draw all enemy fire in positions where players are not.

Decoy's job is a distraction. It is designed to draw some enemy fire to assist you in a firefight within the same room. It works no matter what, as it has an equal aggro score as a warframe, and draws fire as if it were a player. It could use some more durability, maybe an invuln phase, but for its other uses and augments making it invulnerable would be too much when considering the rest of loki's kit. It is designed to draw some enemy fire in places where players are actively engaged.

[MossyLithophyte]

Can Resonator function as a tap/hold ability where tap releases a Resonator that doesn't pick up Mallet and hold releases the current version that does seek out and pick up Mallet? If that is okay, in addition, could the verson of Resonator that doesn't pick up Mallet possibly bring charmed targets into range of Mallet? That would be wonderfully.

Can Metronome, in addition to granting buffs on perfect synch'ing, grant buffs when partial percentage synch adds up to 100% from repeated attempts to activate buffs? Right now the percentage synch resets everytime you fail to synch properly and doesn't benefit much except to tell you how close you were to perfect synch.

[Currilicious]

On 4/16/2017 at 11:05 PM, SeaUrchins said:

Not to me, it is irrelevant to the topic of the thread.

Deployable Mallet that deals damage and can't be killed is superior to a killable decoy that doesn't deal damage when used to draw enemy fire.

If you would like to counter the statement and claim killable decoy is more OP than the invulnerable mallet of doom, you're welcome to provide your arguments.

There is no need.

I believe I'm not the only one that can see a comparison made between an apple and a lemon. And your whole premise is built upon the lemon being not as sweet as the apple and therefore inferior, discarding that fact that both are factually different in nature.

Since you are so determined to force the issue and conveniently discard every unfavorable angle as "irrelevant", there is no exchange to be had. I would only be wasting my time if I did in fact, engage in such futility.

By posting this now, it would give your thread a bump. I think that was the motivation when you replied to me. Not that I feel it deserves being the top of the pile, but I am a sucker for calling out hypocrisy when I see it.

You have a nice day, buddy.

[SeaUrchins]

16 minutes ago, Currilicious said:

whole premise is built upon the lemon being not as sweet as the apple and therefore

Nope. My point is if we take mallet to distract enemy fire, it is more efficient because it cannot be killed unlike the decoy.

However if we have invulnerable damage dealing mallet, then there's no reason not to give decoy invulnerability as well. It's like Frost's snow globe and Atlas' wall: both have invincibility window.

Edited April 18, 2017 by SeaUrchins

[LuckyCharm]

I don't ever remember the "nerf decoy" threads when lokis decoy used to be immortal. It did used to be great at luring enemies too.. in fact it was the same as Titanias lantern without the whole "shoot it once and it flys into the atmosphere" thing. I miss those days. Now I just use my decoys as free switch tele points, which kinda seems pointless now you cant even do that in most spy sorties

 

[Sulphuros_Samsara]

More of an aesthetic complaint, rather than a mechanic one, but I'm sad Octavia's Resonator is just a roller, and not a pair of speakers on either side of a wheel, kinda looks like this from the side, every inner circle is a deeper part of the speaker.

Edited April 18, 2017 by Nitrolad
Adding descriptive image

[(XBOX)CannyJack]

Can we get an option to "mute" Octavia's visuals too? The amount of visual clutter she throws on the screen is way over the top--mallet or resonator or whatever it is, the pulses on the ground, the EQ bars flickering constantly...

Edited April 19, 2017 by (XB1)CannyJack

[ADRAKATA9]

could there be a way to extend the number of bars? this would be neat to make longer songs.

[Arcticblizzard]

Hey Guys,

I have been playing Octavia for a few days now and there are a few things I have noticed odd. To start with, her "1", "3", and "4" abilities work well together (a little over powered when used with a constant song with the volume turned off). Her "2" ability works great for aggro pulling mobs, and like many have pointed out, the aggro-ed targets stop attacking everything (including the roller ball itself). During a 65 wave ODD run (solo), I only used my melee weapon to finish off the Chaotic Infested units because they seem to have been immune to "1" and "2" dmg, but were still get aggro-ed (thank goodness). Here is the odd part, when the roller ball picked up the mallet, it would start doing only like 10 dmg a tick, but with out being struck by the enemy, it climed linearly (over 10 sec or so) to around 500 dmg X the number of targets within aggro range (10 targets = 5k dmg per tick each target). Due to my song on my Octavia being a constant, mallet would tick for the said dmg about 4 to 5 times a second. So as you could imagine, the only time I had to get out of my tree (or what ever that plant thing is) was to avoid the anti-AFK system from denying the rewards and energy regeneration, and to kill the listed above infested my self. If anyone else has noticed this as well, please do make note of it. If this is how the skill was intended, don't be afraid to correct me, I would like to know. 

Also, a lesser of concern, I noticed that the 1 energy a sec for 30 sec passive would activate from using "5", whether just swapping to operator or using the CD skill part. By double tapping "5", you can keep up the extra energy regeneration as long as you like.

[(XBOX)Demon Intellect]

On 4/16/2017 at 11:41 AM, SeaUrchins said:

.Then why doesn't Octavia's Mallet take any damage?

Oh, and decoy augment doesn't make him unkillable.

Kid you are intentionally dense. This has been explained multiple times, why mallet is invulnerable.

[SeaUrchins]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Demon Intellect said:

This has been explained multiple times, why mallet is invulnerable.

Nope, none of them really explain why it has to be invulnerable, they all boil down to "plz don't nerf it" because people want OP stuff and EZ mode.

[(XBOX)RVN World News]

On 4/15/2017 at 10:22 PM, (PS4)psycofang said:

Yes because she scales and most war frames dont. She doesnt need a nerf the other frames need a boost with their busted/redundant/aged mechanics.

Most people just go straight to nerf when something is designed right with scaling in mind. Instead of thinking, omg fix the other frames to be this way. Don't bother explaining it on these forums. Won't work. 

[TaylorsContraction]

On 04/14/2017 at 11:02 AM, Tacritan said:

You cant just compare ONE of their abilities. Loki has very effective skillset and he is one of the most versatile frames in the game, very mobile and CC heavy with his augmented disarm. IF his decoy would be even stronger then imagine the forum nerf posts spam ( like we dont have them already ).

Octavia has a superior decoy and longer lasting invisibility.  They're on par,  yes Loki has disarm making his utility cc better for now.  Once octavia's augments roll out we can make a better comparison.  In combat she is way stronger than loki because mallet is a beast.

Given her kit I see no reason why loki's decoy can't get some additional health scaling or just be invulnerable.

Edited April 19, 2017 by TaylorsContraction
typos