Heavy Weapon Category: Archwing Weapons

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

Yep. Title says it all. A fourth weapon category in which we can select an Archwing weapon (either a primary or a melee) as a heavy weapon. The catch is, while the weapon is selected, movement speed and maneuvers are limited, serving like a sort of balance for the high damage these guns bring. For Archguns, make a special, rarer ammo drop. This will entice careful management of your reserves. For Archmelee, a stamina bar?

Archwing weapons are very powerful and very appealing to the eye, and I feep they aren't as appreciated as they should be. I have always dreamed of using my Tigris in combat and whipping out a Velocitus to obliterate high-priority targets from afar.

Before anyone says "bUt tHeY arE tOo biG", Warframes have vastly increased physical strength. Ever wonder how can they zipline or bullet jump with something as massive as the Jat Kittag, Arca Titron or Galatine in their hands? 

[peterc3]

Canonically, they are too heavy for use in air.

5 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Before anyone says "bUt tHeY arE tOo biG", Warframes have vastly increased physical strength. Ever wonder how can they zipline or bullet jump with something as massive as the Jat Kittag, Arca Titron or Galatine in their hands? 

DE, the experts on their own game, say they're too heavy.

Why would you use a weapon that restricts movement or resurrects the Stamina bar?

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

3 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

DE, the experts on their own game, say they're too heavy.

Source.

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

3 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

Why would you use a weapon that restricts movement or resurrects the Stamina bar?

For example, if using the Velocitus, I wouldn't be moving much anyways. They aren't meant to be used frequently.

[peterc3]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

For example, if using the Velocitus, I wouldn't be moving much anyways. They aren't meant to be used frequently.

In the time it takes you to get the Velocitus out, I've used literally any other weapon to kill the enemy you were going to snipe.

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

1 minute ago, peterc3 said:

In the time it takes you to get the Velocitus out, I've used literally any other weapon to kill the enemy you were going to snipe.

Congratulations! 

9 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

DE, the experts on their own game, say they're too heavy.

Still waiting on the source for this.

[AgentSkye]

DE did say they're too heavy to lift and move in gravity, and that's why we use our usual non-AW guns in Archwing on the Plains.

This is utter nonsense of course, since space isn't weightless, and you also have no leverage in space, meaning any such difficulties would be far worse in space than on the ground.

And there've been explicit mentions of moving our oversized Archwing weapons using thrusters rather than our own strength and leverage. Which makes the whole thing a moot point because those thrusters work just as well in gravity.

And they almost all fold/retract/otherwise make themselves compact when holstered. And the only Archwing-Guns that are unreasonably large are Fluctus and Grattler. Tusk Heavy Gunners on the Plains already use a slightly smaller Grattler, so we're good there.

Which means it's really just Fluctus and maybe Archwing-Melees. So let's see:

Agkuza's large, but not unreasonably so, we have larger regular melees.

Kaszas is fine, no problem there.

I could totally see our Warframes swinging around a Veritux.

Rathbone does look pretty heavy. But we also know for a fact that we swing it around using jets for thrust...

And so on. Yeah, most AW weapons might be awkward, but half the weapons we already have in normal gameplay are ergonomic nightmares anyway, so meh. And most of them would be too big for you, or for me, but let's remember that we can take a big beefy soldier twice our size and wearing massive heavy armor, and just lift him up over our heads one-handed in a fraction of a second, like it's nothing. And that we also sling around some really very large melee weapons one-handed, even in awkward positions with poor leverage, yet still manage to quickly stop and reverse direction to swing it the other way against inertia. And at least one of these weapons is described as being too heavy for anyone but Tenno to use. So there's that.

 

The real reason for no AW-Guns in PoE was gameplay, and they just didn't feel like having a big talk about it, so they came up with a flimsy hand-wave and left it at that.

They change their minds about things sometimes anyway so even if their given reason made any kind of sense, that doesn't mean we can't talk about it and make suggestions.

Edited September 2, 2018 by AgentSkye
A typo.

[Zi-Sui]

Well I'd just love to use my Fluctus outside archwing too, the melee weapons would be far too slow for me but Fluctus would be very nice against groups. Like Arca Plasmor with MUCH more spread and bit less damage.

[yles9056]

Why not? Who doesn't like oversized weapon?

[(XBOX)RPColten]

They are too big.

Not only that, but how would they be used? What purpose do they serve for the player? How does it compliment the current arsenal loadout system?

Why?

[(PSN)Private_Ventures]

How about instead of doing that, we fix the Spin2Win and SpamAttack issues that melee already has, make it a little more skill base. I'm thinking Dark Souls meets Elder Scrolls.

But I do like the idea of limited heavy weapons. Perhaps instead, we have a special Heavy Weapon category, set in a landing craft station, instead of the arsenal, that is dropped down with limited ammo in an air support charge. Like a Rampart Turret or something.

[(PSN)Lei-Lei_23]

21 hours ago, (XB1)RPColten said:

They are too big.

Not only that, but how would they be used? What purpose do they serve for the player? How does it compliment the current arsenal loadout system?

Why?

As a lover of heavy and oversized weaponry, I respect your insight about keeping weapons small.

So where’s our flatware weaponry? Dinner knife and fork? Spork? I need the right equipment to perfectly slice my ribeye along the bone and cut my meats to bite-sized portions!

[(PSN)Private_Ventures]

6 hours ago, (PS4)Lei-Lei_23 said:

As a lover of heavy and oversized weaponry, I respect your insight about keeping weapons small.

So where’s our flatware weaponry? Dinner knife and fork? Spork? I need the right equipment to perfectly slice my ribeye along the bone and cut my meats to bite-sized portions!

KNIFE AND FORK! That's the weapon class that's missing! Fine dining eatery! In all seriousness, though, there's a merchant guy at Cetus with a mat covered in knives, forks, and spoons, and know that you've said this, I really wish he wasn't just some random NPC, but an actual merchant. 

[Teridax68]

While I wouldn't want to have a fourth weapon slot just for an Archwing weapon (I feel three slots is already more than enough), I do find myself in favor of just integrating Archwing weapons into the player's regular arsenal, and letting the player use whichever weapon they like in whichever mode they like (I'd also support the same for warframes and their abilities, and porting current Archwings to new and existing frames as needed, but that's a matter for another discussion). While I wouldn't necessarily want to make them hamper the player's mobility while out or require a stamina bar, I'd definitely be in favor of making them slower than the average weapon, and perhaps limit the player's movement while fired. Even with that, though, I'd recommend scaling those weapons down in size a little, so that they don't take up massive amounts of visual space.

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

5 minutes ago, Teridax68 said:

porting current Archwings to new and existing frames as needed

Oh my God, I thought I was the only one! I'm dying for an Elytronframe

[Walkampf]

Am 2.9.2018 um 03:07 schrieb (PS4)LoisGordils:

Before anyone says "bUt tHeY arE tOo biG", Warframes have vastly increased physical strength

Naaaa, nobody who has been invested in Warframes development whould say that. Back when Archwing was revealed they basically confirmed that the whole point of Archwing was the abilitiy to whield massive weapons in space, weapons so massive, they'd be to hard to whield under the influence of gravity.

However, this makes Archwing Heavy weapons redundant, since Archwing weapons are already heavy weapons.

Edited September 6, 2018 by Walkampf

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

3 minutes ago, Walkampf said:

However, this makes Archwing Heavy weapons redundant, since Archwing weapons are already heavy weapons.

Can I use them outside of Archwing? 🤔

[Synpai]

I mean... I've been pushing to have them apart of an air support since that became a thing.

Even if we can only use them for a limited time...they're too cool to be limited to archwing IMO.

Edited September 6, 2018 by Synpai

[(PSN)Private_Ventures]

Honestly, I just want Archwing weapons in PoE. I'm having to make do with my scattershot napalm Ogris build and a Kulstar.

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

1 hour ago, Synpai said:

I mean... I've been pushing to have them apart of an air support since that became a thing.

Even if we can only use them for a limited time...they're too cool to be limited to archwing IMO.

My same thoughts

[RumekFuria]

for your information if you didn't noticed heavy gunners on plains use grattlers. if they can carry it on foot why can't a frame on his archwing?

[Autongnosis]

Le 02/09/2018 à 03:25, (PS4)LoisGordils a dit :

Still waiting on the source for this.

It was one of the devstreams leading up the Plains of Eidolon release. Now to find which one is kore tricky. 

That said I'd rather they work on the sentient arm cannons they teased and maybe use that mechanic to introduce actual new heavy weapons than repurpose existing AW weapons for ground use. 

That said, i'd kill a few hundred newborns to use the Fluctus on the ground ❤️

[Teridax68]

From what the latest dev stream has shown, not only is DE doing work to integrate Archwing weapons into the baseline Tenno arsenal, massive size and all, these weapons also seem to have infinite ammo. Effectively, not only was the OP in this thread not being unreasonable with their request, their proposal was actually fairly conservative relative to DE's current in-development implementation. Food for thought...

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

8 minutes ago, Teridax68 said:

From what the latest dev stream has shown, not only is DE doing work to integrate Archwing weapons into the baseline Tenno arsenal, massive size and all, these weapons also seem to have infinite ammo. Effectively, not only was the OP in this thread not being unreasonable with their request, their proposal was actually fairly conservative relative to DE's current in-development implementation. Food for thought...

Thank you, kind sir

[Duality52]

Good thing we get to be on an equal footing with those Tusk Heavy Gunners holding the Grattler against us in the Plains.

Only thing I hope for is that the Archweapon mods get a pass. Some mods are astonishingly weak such as Dual Rounds compared to Split Chamber, needs to be equalized to make Archweapons a viable choice on the ground.