Let's Talk: Content Drought - What DE can learn from this

[(XBOX)ShadowBlood89]

58 minutes ago, -.SP.-G43riel said:

you don't need to know how to sing to know that a person sings bad
you don't need to be a mechanic to understand something is wrong with your car
you don't need to make movies to understand how bad a movie is
you don't need to write books to recognize a bad book...
...list keeps going.... 
...at last you dont need to be a game designer or developer in order to judge or to find problems in a game

yet you complain about new stuff being added into game but yet you know nothing of the process of making said content
you have no idea on how long it takes to make all the content DE does  

[(PSN)nating51]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

And this whole "Content Drought" nonsense really has gotten way out of hand.

Yes, absolutely.

If those well known youtubers would have never made a video about this issue, the whole thing would have been remained in its natural dimension (just saying: "Warframe is in its *usual* lack of contents moment *before* a sensibile update").

I'm not saying it is not a thing to be bored of (I am, of course, as I've alwayis been when it occoured in the past "update cycles"), I'm just saying that these days the whole thing has become pretty oversized. And pathetic, also.

Edited October 6, 2018 by (PS4)nating51

[-.SP.-G43riel]

2 minutes ago, (XB1)ShadowBlood89 said:

you have no idea on how long it takes to make all the content DE does  

it doesnt matter that something takes 10 years to make, if
1- wont meet expectations that you made others have about that
2- isn't actually good
saying that it takes long is not a excuse, i guess you really didnt understand a thing from my last post, but okay

[Autongnosis]

Il y a 17 heures, Firetempest a dit :

Pick one. If they only do WF content they likely ran out of things to show people every other day so now they are selling outrage tell Fortuna.

But that's the problem. It's quite simply not true. I could sti down and track a record or stuff they could show to give content for months. 

The problem is, warframe started as a biweekly/monthly content dump. So people organised their channels like that. 

Now the direction has changed, for better or worse, and thus everyone who's only input to the game was reviews, preview etc, which is the large majority of warframe youtubers, doesn't know what to do. 

To be honest i don't really care. You can delve far deeper into this game's mechanics than any of those people do and keep yourself entertained for far longer. 

You can also do stuff that none of the youtube channels do. The problem is, making a review like the old times take little effort and has good return. Doing more interesting stuff takes way more effort and research, and has less returns. 

Il y a 16 heures, Acos a dit :

Realize that I am speaking very generally, and not necessarily about you. 

Its' one thing to give constructive criticism; Nobody really has an issue with that, and DE generally welcomes it. However, constructive criticism has not been the bulk of my user experience on these forums, and I get some kind of pervasive joy out of arguing with people who are whining about things they largely don't understand for changes they haven't really thought through. I do genuinely like the developers as people, and feel a certain level of kinship towards them after watching devstreams and playing their game for so long. 

I have a general distaste for "doom! threads", of which the internet has too many. The world has too many actual problems for those to ever come off seriously. I've only ever watched one MMO that I cared for actually die, so these tend to be overly dramatic and entirely detached from reality. 

Finally, I know it can be easier for people who aren't being met with applause and admiration to label people who don't agree with them as "white knights", but most of the time it has less to do with someones' blind devotion to a product, and much more for that person to just have genuinely bad ideas. Labels are a crutch for losers; Good ideas will be met with praise. Good ideas won't need to call people names. 

QFT. 

Il y a 16 heures, rune_me a dit :

I will venture a wild assumption.

What if ... stay with me here ... those people aren't actually making excuses for DE? What if they just happen to disagree that the suggestion made would make the game better? 

Not everyone shares your ideas of what would improve the game. That's not making excuses for anyone. That's just disagreeing with you.

QFT n° 2.

I'm not saying this game doesn't have problems, that would be the worst BS in history. 

But the ones these people are talking about lately are mostly baseless, with a sprinkle of "something that makes sense" every once in a while. 

[(PSN)Puckish_Rogue125]

Because video games? At the end of the day if you don't agree with a decision that was made....play something else...video games

[Cuchullin]

Personally I think a part of that attitude is carried over from the missions. For most of the missions on the star chart you can be done in 5 -10 minutes unless your doing an Endurance run and in that there is a sense of speed. Some people have taken this and applied it to content drops which others have taken up as some kind of battle cry or something. Would I like regular / fast content drops, absolutely but I understand that it takes time to do it properly so when I come across content drought posts I find it amusing that people get so salty over it.

[(XBOX)ShadowBlood89]

1 minute ago, -.SP.-G43riel said:

it doesnt matter that something takes 10 years to make, if
1- wont meet expectations that you made others have about that
2- isn't actually good
saying that it takes long is not a excuse, i guess you really didnt understand a thing from my last post, but okay

an your just being a impatient child who thinks that its quite fast an simple to make a game 😄 so how about you go an make a full map, the enemies that are sololy found on the map, put in the weapons an resources that are found in the map, an everything else that is needed for the new content yourself.
As your making it seem like you know some how to tap afew buttons an bam have new content just magically be created.

But yet you clearly know nothing of the work that goes into making something till you actually do it.
saying ti takes a long time is a valid excuse but people like you who know yet nothing about everything that goes into making a video game only know to complain that content isn't coming out fast enought.

Hell i don't know everything that goes into making a game but i still know that it take S#&$ ton of effort that make one an that i am more than happy to wait for the new stuff.
Does that mean i wouldn't mind it coming out faster, ya i want 😄 to enjoy fortuna as its gonna be new content to drown my enjoyment into but yet again i am more than happy to wait

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

6 minutes ago, (PS4)nating51 said:

Yes, absolutely.

If those well known youtubers would have never made a video about this issue, the whole thing would have been remained in its natural dimension (just saying: "Warframe is in its *usual* lack of contents moment *before* a sensibile update").

I'm not saying it is not a thing to be bored of (I am, of course, as I've alwayis been when it occoured in the past "update cycles"), I'm just saying that these days the whole thing has become pretty oversized. And pathetic, also.

Seriously...it's like saying HBO is on Content Drought status because Game of Thrones' latest season hasn't come out yet.  Couldn't be that it's on hiatus while new episodes are filmed ...naw...  /s

This is the same thing.  We have a good "season" of BIG content, and then little updates and reworks the rest of the year until the next big thing, which is already in the works.   How any of that translates to a "Drought", as if the devs are just sitting around staring at the walls, is beyond me.

[(PSN)Puckish_Rogue125]

5 minutes ago, -.SP.-G43riel said:

it doesnt matter that something takes 10 years to make, if
1- wont meet expectations that you made others have about that
2- isn't actually good
saying that it takes long is not a excuse, i guess you really didnt understand a thing from my last post, but okay

Technically unless your gripe is with something aggressively and maliciously anti consumer the experience is entirely subjective and in order to provide valid critique you need to understand the process and also provide a solution. Otherwise you are just complaining and attempting to persuade others your opinion is fact. It is your fault you set your expectations so high based on advertising that is meant to make everything about a product seem like the advent of indoor plumbing. Also "I don't like this thing" is pretty useless from most any point of view.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

4 minutes ago, Cuchullin said:

Personally I think a part of that attitude is carried over from the missions. For most of the missions on the star chart you can be done in 5 -10 minutes unless your doing an Endurance run and in that there is a sense of speed. Some people have taken this and applied it to content drops which others have taken up as some kind of battle cry or something. Would I like regular / fast content drops, absolutely but I understand that it takes time to do it properly so when I come across content drought posts I find it amusing that people get so salty over it.

People are always "in a rush to wait".  Like when you're driving and people speed around you, jumping through lanes dangerously, breaking speed limits, juuuuuuust to hit the same red light as you anyway.   

It's not DE's fault that some players decide to burn through everything in a day.  They've even said "We'd prefer you play in 20 minute bursts, not 8 hr survivals".   People do it anyway, and then wonder why DE isn't moving to suit them.

The other end of things is you can't "rush" a creative process.  Ideas come how they come, and THEN they need to be implemented into a world of rules, codes, and balances.  You can't just "make" an artist paint a masterpiece.  It's not so simple.  Inspiration doesn't come on demand.


Yet I see alot of "DE should just do "more"" posts.   Cool, and y'all should just go and make a million-dollar product.  Go on, just go do it.  I'll wait...

.....I see lots of criticism from people who has no experience or understanding of game development or management.

siiiiiigh.

[Acos]

14 minutes ago, (PS4)nating51 said:

Yes, absolutely.

If those well known youtubers would have never made a video about this issue, the whole thing would have been remained in its natural dimension (just saying: "Warframe is in its *usual* lack of contents moment *before* a sensibile update").

I'm not saying it is not a thing to be bored of (I am, of course, as I've alwayis been when it occoured in the past "update cycles"), I'm just saying that these days the whole thing has become pretty oversized. And pathetic, also.

Ahh, so that's where all this is coming from. 

Well that's easy then, I can just ignore the forum for a week and all these youtube fanboy posers will get distracted and do something else. 

[An8rchy]

22 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

There is no friggin' drought!

DevStream 117 At 9:55 
Steve said : "Can we talk about the elephant in the room? We know we are on a content drought"

So no... we are on a Content Drought

[(PSN)nating51]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

The other end of things is you can't "rush" a creative process.  Ideas come how they come, and THEN they need to be implemented into a world of rules, codes, and balances.  You can't just "make" an artist paint a masterpiece.  It's not so simple.  Inspiration doesn't come on demand.

Agree. ^

[(PSN)nating51]

3 minutes ago, An8rchy said:

DevStream 117 At 9:55 
Steve said : "Can we talk about the elephant in the room? We know we are on a content drought"

So no... we are on a Content Drought

Yes. As we've *alwayis* been when a major update has to be released. Nothing exceptional or out of the norm that justify the whole "warframe is dead" thing...

Edited October 6, 2018 by (PS4)nating51

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

3 minutes ago, An8rchy said:

DevStream 117 At 9:55 
Steve said : "Can we talk about the elephant in the room? We know we are on a content drought"

So no... we are on a Content Drought

Steve was just using the terminology of the playerbase to address us directly, and specifically that very complaint.  Doesn't mean he believes whole-heartedly in it so much as he believes in the impact our "belief" holds on the game, and the damage it would do if left unaddressed.

We have had more updates this year than most previous years I can recall, and there is more than enough to do in-game.  There is no "drought".  

[An8rchy]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Steve was just using the terminology of the playerbase to address us directly, and specifically that very complaint.  Doesn't mean he believes whole-heartedly in it so much as he believes in the impact our "belief" holds on the game, and the damage it would do if left unaddressed.

We have had more updates this year than most previous years I can recall, and there is more than enough to do in-game.  There is no "drought".  

Don't beat around the bush. all i did was fact check what you said about the content drought. A Dev Said it. not a Youtuber, not a Venteran. A Dev

[-.SP.-G43riel]

36 minutes ago, (XB1)ShadowBlood89 said:

-snip-

you're like the best most recent exemple of white knight around this community, you make no sense at all in anything that you're saying and you don't understand that

33 minutes ago, (PS4)thedarkness1962 said:

Technically unless your gripe is with something aggressively and maliciously anti consumer the experience is entirely subjective and in order to provide valid critique you need to understand the process and also provide a solution. Otherwise you are just complaining and attempting to persuade others your opinion is fact. It is your fault you set your expectations so high based on advertising that is meant to make everything about a product seem like the advent of indoor plumbing. Also "I don't like this thing" is pretty useless from most any point of view.

i think you got lost on the whole talk, so lets try to be REALLY CLEAR
what people are complaining are things that the Devs themself acknowledged during recent devstream, that warfarme is having lack of new content for a while
Don't get me wrong here, warframe has plenty of content if you're still a somewhat new player, but there's players which have everything, farmed everything.
It's even a bigger problem that more and more players sooner or later are also reaching that wall of "what there's left to do?"  
Steve and Rebecca said that "it's not a problem to go play other things for a while" a company should never say something like that to clients
So we get back here, around the forums divided into
1- people wanting to discuss ideas of changes and solutions(as you said in your reply) in order to make the game better
2- people who keep saying that everything is fine(which is not as the devs know that), that people should learn to wait, that the game doesnt need changes
 

Edited October 6, 2018 by -.SP.-G43riel

[(PSN)nating51]

12 minutes ago, An8rchy said:

Don't beat around the bush. all i did was fact check what you said about the content drought. A Dev Said it. not a Youtuber, not a Venteran. A Dev

Ok. Fact checking: the bigger the next update, the longer the so-called "content drought" will be....

...as it alwayis have been in the last update cycles in warframe in the last 2 years. 

Edited October 6, 2018 by (PS4)nating51

[Guest]

1 hour ago, (PS4)nating51 said:

Cause they have the the *perception* of content drought...a thing that comes in cycles in Warframe, and I am playing for almost 2 years, mr24...

 Some YouTubers made some (pointless) videos these days about that "issue" (which was there back from the start I've played) and then It has become a thing to debate with rage. We live in the Age Of Complain And Perception. Face It. 😁

That's it?

We've been on a content drought for a good while now but that's just how it is right before a major content drop and it's okay to take a hiatus once in a while. And now all the sudden people are making a song and dance about it?

Apparently some people are utterly incapable of forming their own thoughts and need some clickbaiting Youtuber to tell them what they should think ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edited October 6, 2018 by Guest

[TheErebus.]

2 hours ago, Pent_ said:

Meta complaints are one of my favorite things because they are just as delusional as the baseless complaints of the very people you're trying to counter. You're the opposite end of the spectrum. For every "DE gets nothing done" there is a "DE are game dev gods who can do anything and any criticism can be explained away by their team size/company size/trying their best/etc."

The only issue I have is that DE has a ton to be criticized for. They're doing a lot better than they were in 2017, I will say, but they also still do some really silly things. There are 5 year old bugs that don't get addressed, we still have the worst moderation I've seen in a game of this caliber, they add a lot of really shallow "new" content without expanding on what exist as much.

Yeah, DE's employees are only human, and a lot of my gripes rest with the designers and community managers, and not the programmers and artists who do the more heavy day to day stuff. The people who criticized DE are criticizing the people who make the big decisions. Those people are worthy of criticism, and complaining about the idea of developers you like getting criticized is a dumb complaint. You're caring more than they do I assure you, because no matter how many people call this game S#&$, they're still making a metric #*!% ton of money.

PREACH

[(PSN)nating51]

27 minutes ago, Pr1A said:

That's it?

We've been on a content drought for a good while now but that's just how it is just before a major update and it's okay to take a hiatus once in a while. And now all the sudden people are making a song and dance about it?

Apparently some people are utterly incapable of forming their own thoughts and need some clickbaiting Youtuber to tell them what they should think ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

This. And it's pretty sad to see how complain'n'sensationalist videos from well known youtubers (which have a *huge* responsability for the endless threads on the forum about this pointless debate) can alter the real dimension of an issue like this one. 

As I've said before, a matter of perception. The shadow of the cat on the wall has magically become a monstrous tiger.

 

Edited October 6, 2018 by (PS4)nating51

[Chronometria]

All I know is that a lot of us were waiting for Tennocon and now.....all that waiting is still going on. Getting real tired of seeing K-drives in the devstreams. Even the devstreams are running out of things to show us that haven't been shown months ago.....and still with no further sign that they are arriving for play.

I like DE, but i am very worried at the lack of replayable content that is entering the game. As to reskinning a survival mission (kuva, onslaught), i think that doesn't really count as anything genuinely new either.

[Cuchullin]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

People are always "in a rush to wait".  Like when you're driving and people speed around you, jumping through lanes dangerously, breaking speed limits, juuuuuuust to hit the same red light as you anyway.   

It's not DE's fault that some players decide to burn through everything in a day.  They've even said "We'd prefer you play in 20 minute bursts, not 8 hr survivals".   People do it anyway, and then wonder why DE isn't moving to suit them.

The other end of things is you can't "rush" a creative process.  Ideas come how they come, and THEN they need to be implemented into a world of rules, codes, and balances.  You can't just "make" an artist paint a masterpiece.  It's not so simple.  Inspiration doesn't come on demand.


Yet I see alot of "DE should just do "more"" posts.   Cool, and y'all should just go and make a million-dollar product.  Go on, just go do it.  I'll wait...

.....I see lots of criticism from people who has no experience or understanding of game development or management.

siiiiiigh.

Yeah. That's basically what I was trying to say. With people racing ahead they burn through stuff quick then complain when their isn't more and it's these have their cake and eat it too kind of people who I find funny/annoying cause their essentially the cause of their own impatience.

Edited October 6, 2018 by Cuchullin

[LupisV0lk]

3 hours ago, Pent_ said:

we still have the worst moderation I've seen in a game of this caliber

We have the moderation to match the community.

[-AiLuoLi-]

48 minutes ago, Pr1A said:

Apparently some people are utterly incapable of forming their own thoughts and need some clickbaiting Youtuber to tell them what they should think ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Some youtuber also made a video about interaction between a specific mod mechanic and enemies AI with ZERO evidence to back up other than "It's how the AI works" or "From my experience it works".

People just gobble it up like they're words from god, and when asked for evidence/proof they just go "My experience said it works" or "That youtuber said it works"

What went wrong with humanity?

Edited October 6, 2018 by -AiLuoLi-