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(PS4)LoisGordils

Garuda Feedback and Discussion

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8 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Stop throwing Gara under the bus. Like seriously have you even used her 4s scaling ability? Because I feel like people’s ignorance to that fact is why everyone thinks she’s trash.

Also your ideas aren’t good.

Exactly. Gara is amazing 

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I made a reply talking about adjustments that I would make to her kit. For 4 I thought of making the blade blender do chip damage to allow garuda to use her large raptor claws as exalted weapons. Main things to keep in mind would have to be that the combo for the exalted weapon would need to be graceful, swift, deadly and would need to allow garuda to always stay in a noble stance and strut at a speed walk pace (after every attack she immediately returns to her noble stance). her 4 would also affect her 1, 2 and 3 abilities to make things more gory. I detailed more of my ideas on pg.21 of the thread. It's the one with a bunch of gifs. 

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2 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Exactly. Gara is amazing 

True, she's boring, but her kit and synergies are amazing... Gara doesn't look half as thought through.

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My take on all of this:

That passive is awful. I hate mechanics that go against natural playstyle. If I'm hurt, my first reaction is to heal. Basing a frame around avoiding healing when wounded is counter-intuitive. Get rid of it and the self harm 3 ability.

The blood orb is an awesome concept. I love the idea of storing up blood from slaughtering enemies and using it. However, that shield is boring and looks dumb. No one looks at a blood soaked murder machine like her and thinks 'Wow, I bet she has some sort of gore window!'. Building up for a massive attack or tapping into it to fuel either healing/defense or attack strength temp buff feels much more natural, useful, and cooler. Though not sure it should be tied to a lunge. I'd say the blood orb should just be her passive period.

Her 2 is cool. Very Vlad the Impaler so fits the theme. I'd just make sure that we avoid Limbo issues and let allies attack the stuck enemy. Make it so that damaging it makes it bleed out faster & heal faster?

And the ult is boring like everyone has said. Get rid. I'd say just give us claws as an exalted weapon. Not necessarily her ult, but you can't have such a prominent feature NOT be an exalted weapon. Maybe have it be fueled by the blood orb? Have it increase in damage per death near Garuda? Just spit ballin', but it really needs to happen after failing to do that with Khora and causing so much disappointment with that frame.

I'm still hopeful, but very cautious about this frame considering the past few have been rather lackluster. I know not every frame can be as well designed as Nidus, but I'd like to at least see Harrow quality on her. Fingers crossed.

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Watching Garuda on the devstream got me very excited for a lot of what I saw. The visual effects were great, I love the way her 1 decimates a target and then makes a shield, her 2 and 3 seem good, but I think I and a lot of other people were a little disappointed with her 4. It just seems kind of...  passive compared to the rest of her kit.

So instead of just complaining about her 4th ability I wanted to also share an idea I had for it as well. What if instead of it being a storm of blades where you foat around similar to Revenant's 4 or Inaros's sandstorm, when you activated her 4, she shot out a volley of blades in a radius that impaled enemies to the floor and walls? (Think Hela from Thor: Ragnarok) Maybe she could shoot out the blades from her arms and then replace/reload them, impaling enemies all around so they bleed out and provide another buff similar to her 2.

This is obviously just a suggestion, but my hope is that someone at DE will see it and perhaps consider it since they actually seem pretty good at player feedback compared to most developers.

So uhh... yeah, thank you for your time.

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29 minutes ago, (XB1)WafflyLearner89 said:

I made a reply talking about adjustments that I would make to her kit. For 4 I thought of making the blade blender do chip damage to allow garuda to use her large raptor claws as exalted weapons. Main things to keep in mind would have to be that the combo for the exalted weapon would need to be graceful, swift, deadly and would need to allow garuda to always stay in a noble stance and strut at a speed walk pace (after every attack she immediately returns to her noble stance). her 4 would also affect her 1, 2 and 3 abilities to make things more gory. I detailed more of my ideas on pg.21 of the thread. It's the one with a bunch of gifs. 

I really like this, but my idea is that rather than exalted blade melee, she struts around and can throw blades from her arms that also throw a number of blades from the storm around her. Chip damage close range from the spinning blades, and a ranged bladethrow ability. It makes her interactive, and if she's strutting around it wouldn't be as annoying if her speed is reduced, since she'd look really cool while doing it. No autotarget, so it isn't just Mesa all over again.

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3 minutes ago, LunarRevel said:

I really like this, but my idea is that rather than exalted blade melee, she struts around and can throw blades from her arms that also throw a number of blades from the storm around her. Chip damage close range from the spinning blades, and a ranged bladethrow ability. It makes her interactive, and if she's strutting around it wouldn't be as annoying if her speed is reduced, since she'd look really cool while doing it. No autotarget, so it isn't just Mesa all over again.

Actually this was what I was going to add to her ability 3. I was thinking of taking the health removed by the ability and turning it into 10 blood blades that garuda could throw one by one or 5 at once. If used while ability 4 is active, she gets 100 blood blades and throws 10 each time like a shot gun. She could also throw 50 at once as alternative fire. Still would prefer exalted weapons for her claws to be able to use them as much as possible since they look so cool. I like how we had similar ideas though 

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47 minutes ago, WarBaby2 said:

True, she's boring, but her kit and synergies are amazing... Gara doesn't look half as thought through.

Really? I find her most enjoyable. However, if you're playstyle is to spam Mass Vitrify to refresh and empower Splinter Storm, then I can see why you may find her kit stale

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5 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Really? I find her most enjoyable. However, if you're playstyle is to spam Mass Vitrify to refresh and empower Splinter Storm, then I can see why you may find her kit stale

Nope, but I mostly use her (or Limbo) for point defense, so the rotation is similarly repetitive. 😉

 

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If we're giving ideas for ultimate abilities then I've got one inspired by hela. It's an exalted weapon where she launches her claws one at a time (like hela), they can go through an infinite amount of enemies but they stop at a wall or floor. They'd do high puncture, alright slash and low impact. 2-ish fire rate. You can only launch 8 at time but (this is the part i really want) reloading pulls them all back to her and does damage on the return trip. I think this would work well because it's definitely a lot more interactive than her current ultimate and it's a decently unique exalted weapon as far as I'm aware. First time coming up with an ability (please be gentle).
 

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I'm a jaded veteran Tenno and I only make appearances now whenever there's a new Warframe release.

Now that Khora was underwhelming (and the hilarious post release patch they made to complete her since they rushed her release), I was hoping for Garuda to be cool and strong. Don't get me wrong, I think Khora is pretty good but she definitely is missing so much to feel special and unique. But, whatever the case, Garuda is looking good.

My only 2 things on her is that her passive is really bad and annoying and her pose for her 4th is pretty derpy. I think that if they want to make her an elegantly brutal frame they need to elaborate the motions she makes for her skills to make her look the part instead of ... just standing there or floating like Zenyatta with numb legs.

They would benefit from more blood gameplay and the ultimate truly needs to have a lot more grandeur. Make her rain giant blades and albaresque her way around the battle field. I mean, more flare. More flare!

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Ill get right to the point. From what I can see, Garuda is cooler in concept than she is in design. That is her gore/blood theme has a lot of potential but her current kit doesn't utilize it well. I think DE should take a page out of their own book for this frame and model its kit after an existing, very successful, and well liked frame, Nidus. I've listed my ideas below:

1 - Her first ability would remain the same bar the "shield and orb business". It would do a respectable amount of damage (if it doesn't already) and have some type of (mods scalable) debuff effect such as reduced armor or automatic bleed proc. The abilities damage and possibly also its debuff would scale off how much blood Garuda has collected.

--> Alternatively (and only because I think this is cooler), she would throw/launch one of her 10 (?) claws at an enemy. The damage/debuff effect would be the same, but the added range would be balanced by having to "reload her claws" after 10 uses. Either way, this would function as her primary damage ability.

2 - Garuda summons a ball of blood which floats around/above her. Any killed enemies, either by her or within a certain proximity, will feed the ball and add to her "blood counter". Any bleed procs will also feed it, and "blood" received will scale per strength of the enemy (but not level, i think). You could also have it that her 1 provides a larger percentage of blood if used for a kill, to improve synergy. This blood counter will act as a currency for her 3rd and 4th, and *may* also provide ability buffs. This may or may not have a visual effect of covering her in blood as it grows.

3 - Her 3 is largely the same as well, but has an added function. Keep in mind her passive is still the same. If she is at 26% health or over, this ability will halve her health and provide the passives stat buff. If it did anything else in the stream, then that too. BUT, if she is at below 25% health (subject to change), she will consume some of her blood currency to recover her health, and provide her and her allies additional health (designated by purple numbers, basically an overshields for HP). It should also probably provide armor given how not-scalable HP is. The ability will be channeled, and thus to some degree, give players a choice as to how much "blood" they want to channel into the effect. The more blood they expend, the more armor/HP they give. Then once used, Garuda can just cast her 3 again to get back to low health and get the passive buff. 

4 - If Garuda did indeed have the above kit, I would honestly not mind her 4th staying as is, or being some kind of radial nuke. It would cost "blood" like her 3, and would scale with her amount collected (if we do that). Her synergy would largely be between her 2/3 supported by her 1 at early stages.  Alternatively, you could have her 4 be an enhanced version of her 1 in that it provides a larger percentage of blood from its kills, helping her build the counter faster. 

 

Things to consider:

1) How quickly should the blood counter grow with each kill, for balance.

2) If we choose to have her rising blood currency provide ability buffs, should that replace/reduce her passive. 

3) Her 2 is duration, and 3 is channeled. They can be switched. 

 

Lmk any feedback/criticism. I realize its a little early for a total redesign, but I think its a sick idea. If the communities thoughts on Garuda now persist after her release, Ill probably repost this then as a suggestion. 

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We can all agree that the Garuda 4th ability looks like a re-skinned Revenants. I’m sure that DE could do better. So in this topic suggest what you imagine would make a good Garuda ult. remember to keep in her theme which is ‘Gore’.

This is mine:

Bloodlust: AOE fear/slow/stun around her. Melee kills causes enemies to explode in blood causing damage and bleed (think scaling Acid Shells mod damage) to nearby enemies.

It would be duration based. CC and explosion is affected by range mod. Explosion damage would be scaling with % of enemy health and affected by strength mod (e.g. Base damage = 20% of enemy health -> 60% or more with strength mods).

Come guys I’d like to see what you guys come up with. Maybe DE will see these and take inspiration.

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I love the look and idea of garuda i just feel they missed the mark. She has a very boring non interactive kit. I personally would love to see her adjusted. My idea for her would be:

 

Passive: Every time inflict slash proc you gain energy.

1st power: lunge into the target can be executed up three times. The third lunge will draw out the blood orb which she can then throw in a direction.

2nd power: thrust your claws into a target and hold them as a shield from the front that heals you during the duration. (I would imagine it would look like the concept they showed of her with the corpus in her claws.)

3rd power: aoe damage and 100% chance slash proc.

4th power: she would debuff the enemies causing all bleed affects to deal more damage and last longer while buffing her for a duration. All bleed damage would be absorbed into her giving her slight damage reduction then when the duration expired she would do aoe damage based on the amount of bleeding absorbed.

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En 19/10/2018 a las 15:02, Cohee dijo:

WAS REALLY THINKING SHE'S GOING TO RELEASE HER BLADES AND MAKE IT SUSPEND IN THE ATMOSPHERE AROUND HER, WALK UP TO ENEMIES (or run) AND DIRECT HER BLADES WITH HER FINGERTIPS TO ENEMIES, LACERATING AND MINCING, WHILE SHE GRACEFULLY MOVES LIKE A HIGH CLASS NOBILITY!

For what i've read in this thread, the vast majority was expecting something like that, including myself.

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So Garuda.

I do not understand her kit at all!
She's only a semi-tanky from what has been shown so far so she'll likely take quite a lot of damage from anything above any level 40 enemies.
If we take the passive into account then she should rely on losing health and staying damaged.
She has a defensive option to help mitigate this with a directional shield, which suggests fighting at range since it still leaves her open to flanking, and it's activated by... a gap closer? So the shield won't serve it's purpose until after you've fled the fight you just initiated unless you just killed a lone straggler, and how often do we see those in WF?

Her 2 promotes staying put. Again as a semi-tanky frame mobility is what's likely to keep her alive so the mechanics of this ability works against her base stats unless she's secretly among the tankiest frames. (but since she doesn't seem to have any abilities that actually boost armor or provide damage mitigation that's likely not the case at all)

Her 3 synergies with her passive and otherwise ability spam if she's regenerating health, but it'd likely put the player in a seat of "status bars-manager 2019* juggling to swap high health for energy and high energy for health until she loses energy or health faster than she can make it. But if you do that then her passive kind of just gets pushed to the wayside, in favor of juggling bars with the occasional buff to her power that just happens to be there.

Then her 4 makes her a short range sitting duck that slowly kills itself through suffocation. A semi-tanky frame that doesn't want to stay up close to utilize her shield from her 1 and to stay alive at low health in general. Her best option is to hug the enemy faces with a channeled worse version of Gara's 2nd ability which possibly 1-ups Garudas's 4 in every way since it has; Damage mitigation, can be applied to/defend teammates/defense pods, can be buffed indefinitely & allowing hands and free movement of the frame after the cast.
As mentioned with her 1 & her 2, those abilities do not support a mobile playstyle without being suicidal, and here we are to throw caution to the wind. Either this ability will be so broken the rest of the kit won't be used, or it'll be the least used ability in her kit because it works against her other abilities.
Worth noting is how you deal with channeled abilities, how they heavily restrict energy regeneration and how they slowly drain the energy pool.
So it works against quick thinking, pulls you away from the playstyle that the other abilities seem to promote & their much needed bumps to survivability. In favor of short range damage that kills in AOE (likely line of sight too since you usually frown upon frames that sweep floors with a single ability)

So uh, I want to understand how her kit is supposed to synergize with itself. But all it seems to do IMO is contradict. The way she is now she'll likely struggle against anything that isn't just the starchart, and even then. Any energy leech units (*cough* most infested) are going to be a major hit to her one synergistic survivability option of Quick thinking.

_________

To summarise: Garuda looks like a frame that should likely be played at mid- to long-range, with offensive abilities asking the player to fight at very-close-range instead, without explicit survivability aside from purely healing that will be risky to pull off when the enemies start dealing damage in numbers so big it starts contesting her health bar through her semi-high base armor value.

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Garuda's 4 is just another dance macarabe.

I don't know, maybe similar suggestion was arleady discussed here, but it would be interesting if her 4th ability would work similar to valkyr claws (exalted weapon), but instead of invincibility it would deal damage to garuda's own health, making a synergy with her passive damage increase, Also she will heal herself for each hit. 

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2 hours ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

False.

Mega-false.

Check the Wiki first, please

False like what????!!!!! I should have stated that boost of damage and not health is with Augment but that doesnt make it false just half-truth.... And second thing yeah maximezed strenght on nekros can give more but only with Maxed power strenght and you will never ever see that being played (efficiency, HP,......) so its only on paper so its actually truth...

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Concept: Warframe, Garuda

 

 

From a glance, there is tremendous interest in the upcoming Warframe, "Garuda". Her greatest asset and pitfall seems to be the same: her aesthetic theme. Common concerns are: synergy, uniqueness, gameplay and usability. Below are my suggestions to push her concept forward:

NEW PASSIVE:

  • Use health for abilities and channeling if energy is insufficient. (Allows useful scaling off of negative Power Efficiency)

    • Dump Health using abilities, especially her 4, and gain damage bonuses from her 3 (buffed damage based on missing life). Cycle health and repeat. This collection of skill is useful against crowds and bosses alike.

 

Heartseeker

  • Launch yourself at a targeted direction, grabbing the nearest enemy and tearing them apart to use their blood as a deadly shield.

  • [Mechanics]

    • Teleport to a target, deal X damage and gain a Blood Shield. The Blood Shield absorbs incoming damage dealt to you from the front.

    • Health lost while this ability is active is also added to the shield.

    • Recast this ability to release the shield and deal the absorbed damage to enemies with a bloody sphere.
       

Coup de grace

  • Cull and feed off the weak by impaling a foe on a spike.

  • [Mechanics]

    • Incapacitates a target on a spike, it dealing X damage and instantly killing any target under Y% health.

    • Enemies killed by this ability or sooner after, heal you for X% of your max health instantly and will leave behind a copy of itself at 1 health for Y seconds that cannot be killed but may be damaged. 

      • Allies heal for X% of the copy’s max health the first time they damage the copy.

  • [Augment only?] Damage dealt to the copy is split between surrounding enemies.
     

Bloodbath

  • Draw grotesque and untold power from deep within your own reservoirs.

  • [Mechanics]

    • Lose X Health.

    • Grants the following for X seconds:

      • Gain up to 100% increased damage based on your current missing life and 25% increased damage (max 300%) for each enemy below 76% health.

        • (See enemies below 76% health.)

      • Enemies you kill explode, dealing X percentage of their maximum health to surrounding enemies.

  • [Augment only?] Heal nearby allies for the health lost.

  • [Variants]:

    • Health lost while this ability is active is gained as increased damage.

    • [Major Variant: Summons a Victim]

      •  

        Spoiler

         

        • Lose X Health. 

        • Sacrifice X% Health.

        • Summon a Victim Tribute (extremely high health) that does not attack or move but can be damaged and killed (and subject to effects like Status and Warframe abilities.)

          • Any ally that attacks this Victim Tribute grants the following for X seconds:

            • Gain up to 100% increased damage based on your current missing life and 25% increased damage (max 300%) for each enemy below 76% health.

            • Enemies you kill explode, dealing a % of their maximum health to surrounding enemies within X meters.

          • Attacking the Victim Tribute again will refresh the buffs.

          • Damage dealt to the Victim Tribute is also dealt to surrounding enemy units. (Augment only: Heart Strings?)

          • Can be killed by recasting this ability, or using any of Garuda's other abilities.

          • Heals nearby allies on death.

         


Ace of Blades

  • Garuda's impenetrable ring of blades is a bloody force to be reckoned with.

  • [Mechanics]

    • Summon a ring of 6 blades for X seconds that damages nearby enemies.

    • Using the quick melee button or a melee attack will consume a blade and launch a deadly piercing blade at your cursor; holding the quick melee button or charged melee attacks release all blades at the target direction.

    • Taking X damage within 1 seconds destroys a blade to give you 1 second of Invulnerability (or 50-90%DR).

    • While you have any blades, your health value cannot change except when used to pay the energy cost of an ability or by the effect of one of your abilities.

    • Recasting this ability while it is active, repays the cost to launch all remaining blades and summon 6 more blades.

  • [Augment only?] The blade continues to seek out new targets after impact. (Also, while each launched blade is still active, it can be used to trigger the defensive bonus.)

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I was thinking more her ultimate could involve her being able to freely melee and harvest up to eight blood orbs at a time, and having it work similar to wielding a melee and pistol, melee to harvest the blood balls, then clicking to launch em in your foes faces, just my idea on an ultimate tweak, keep it unique while going with the exhalted weapon build everyone seems to want

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I am like, 75% sure they were going to introduce a new class of melee weapons with 3.0 - Flying blades, and Garuda was going to have that as an exalt. Alas, delays on Melee 3.0 have meant they can't do that so Garuda's ult has been retooled in a short amount of time 😕 Just like how Khora's kit had to be made on the fly because of Damage 3.0 falling through.

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15 minutes ago, butka1998 said:

False like what????!!!!! I should have stated that boost of damage and not health is with Augment but that doesnt make it false just half-truth.... And second thing yeah maximezed strenght on nekros can give more but only with Maxed power strenght and you will never ever see that being played (efficiency, HP,......) so its only on paper so its actually truth...

...it's not true if it is only half truth.

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3 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

...it's not true if it is only half truth.

But its also not false....

 

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2 minutes ago, GenthReborn said:

I am like, 75% sure they were going to introduce a new class of melee weapons with 3.0 - Flying blades, and Garuda was going to have that as an exalt. Alas, delays on Melee 3.0 have meant they can't do that so Garuda's ult has been retooled in a short amount of time 😕 Just like how Khora's kit had to be made on the fly because of Damage 3.0 falling through.

Khora's 4th got completely changed into a different ability. I don't see Garuda's 4th getting changed that much since she's coming with Fortuna and not Melee 3.0 (Highly doubt DE would bring a Frame for Melee 3.0 since that would be a complete Rework to Melee in General). But yeah, they messed up big time with Khora and Damage 3.0 which was a Physical Damage change.

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