Grendel nerfed towards sentients, meanwhile, Limbo is trolling them to death by boredom.

[dwqrf]

I like Grendel, and yes, since the anomaly, he always was even more fun to play with as he was insanely powerfully removing enemies from the battle, sentient included. But Grendel, which isn't too op imo, is being bashed over and over, on his energy consumption, feast mecanic against specifics enemies, and such. The "buff" for his consume is nice enough even if it's still annoying to cycle cast (why ? Just combine the buffs already), but hey, thats already a good step forward.

But this event proved once again the braindeadism required to troll any kind of defense with a single combo from Limbo, transforming this event into a simple patience test. This isn't fair, nor it is fun. I have respect for people trying to play frost, or gara, making it insanely more difficult, because the risks of failing jumping from 0% to x% is actually multiplied by infinity, offering a challenge which doesn't exist when Limbo is pressing a key once every minute.

Of course, I'm not a Limbo player, and I do just wait around grinding this event, when one is in the squad, but this isn't really motivating to participate, as there is really nothing to do. (My main activities were to scan everything from this event, shoot condrix, or support Railjack, but never had I to help defending the Oplinks Limboed)

How fair would it be to make sentient more resilient to stasis ?

 

[--K--Sharkfin]

tbh many frames could be a troll frame when it's on the wrong hand. It's up to you to find a common interest teammate to play with you efficiently.

I guess you are playing ground as you mention condrix.  Making sentients more resilient to stasis wouldn't help much on your situation.  A troll limbo could still troll you.

On a normal run, limbo is needed only when we place op-links so we could move on to the next spawn point right away.

[0_The_F00l]

I really hope DE doesn't Nerf limbo with some stupid decision to let Sentients be unaffected by the rift. 

These events really irk me as it makes an actually good frame everyones go to cause it is super convenient and chhesy and so it stands out to be hammered down the hardest. 

I would much rather there actually be more aspects than an over hyped excavation mission. 

[AndouRaiton]

2 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

I really hope DE doesn't Nerf limbo with some stupid decision to let Sentients be unaffected by the rift.

Some of the sentients attacks can hit you even in the rift. They are the Battlyst's spinning lasers and the Brachiolyst's ground slam. The spinning lasers are the most dangerous as once they start you can't stop it with stasis.

[kapn655321]

Grendel.
I love that frame in theory.. and somewhat in practice, when capable. Index, for instance really highlights the oversight of him not being able to eat folks.
Warframe has some really quirky concepts of balance, which other aspects of the game often do a double take at. "Well, Grendel can't eat in Index, because CC is restricted." *Laughs in Khora/Limbo/Vauban..etc*

Energy is indeed a problem, too. The drain doesn't bother me, but it feels as though there should be a greater way to offset it. For instance: Feast cost should be reduced/refunded in part if no enemy is gathered, and/or Nourish ought to generate energy.. If you're ingesting calories, and calories are energy, it just makes sense to me. The concept behind the energy cost offset (energy orb bonus from nourish) is not only unreliable by design, but does not work often enough or satisfactorily in practice. You need the right enemy, And an orb to spawn, in order to make his kit work right? What/why? Thematically, I get it.. but man that just falls so very short.

[xMarvin732]

To be honest, I don't understand why people wont let other people enjoy playing what they want to play.

The Problem is with this event, that Kill Codes sometimes wont come because of the imbalance of Ground and Space Teams.

 

[PsiWarp]

I'd like Sentients to pose more of a threat to the Rift. Stasis stops everything, it's hard CC on a timer, which equals nothing interesting that can be thrown at you.

I used Hildryn and Aegis Storm for my Condrix runs, and while the Sentients can be stuck in place to make room for a breather, they can later move and attack due to their CC diminishing returns. It was a good breath of fresh air since the game isn't completely set on pause dulling down gameplay to wait-for-your-reward.

Let Sentients move and attack very slowly after being affected by Stasis more than once. The gunfire projectiles and beams they make would saturate the Rift and destablize Stasis over time, making sure you can't lazily freeze everything and not kill them for the whole time.

[Xaero]

6 minutes ago, xMarvin732 said:

To be honest, I don't understand why people wont let other people enjoy playing what they want to play.

Players can't disallow other players to play what they want. Devs can.

[xMarvin732]

4 minutes ago, Xaero said:

Players can't disallow other players to play what they want. Devs can.

Devs can, yeah i know, but you see people crying about wanting Limbo to be nerfed because they don't like which Frame other people like to play because it looks like cheesing.

Everyone has their own way of playing, i for an example take Rhino, Nova or Vauban for the Event.

[Xaero]

3 minutes ago, xMarvin732 said:

Devs can, yeah i know, but you see people crying about wanting Limbo to be nerfed because they don't like which Frame other people like to play because it looks like cheesing.

Everyone has their own way of playing, i for an example take Rhino, Nova or Vauban for the Event.

The point is, as was said above, being able to reduce mission failure chance to 0%. Not with some outstanding skills, but with just two buttons. Do you find it a good game design? I don't.

[xMarvin732]

3 hours ago, Xaero said:

The point is, as was said above, being able to reduce mission failure chance to 0%. Not with some outstanding skills, but with just two buttons. Do you find it a good game design? I don't.

I feel like its a compensation compared to the amount of bugs that happen.

If Limbo gets nerfed, just use Rhino Stomp, or a strong Slow Nova, or a Hydroid, or Khora.

It literally makes no sense.

Edited March 30, 2020 by xMarvin732

[Xaero]

Just now, xMarvin732 said:

I feel like its a compensation compared to the amount of bugs that happen.

If Limbo gets nerfed, just use Vauban and use his 4th, or Rhino Stomp, or a strong Slow Nova, or a Hydroid, or Khora.

It literally makes no sense.

Well, if Sentients had a way to mitigate hard CC, it would definitely help to make RJ missions more challenging.

[vegetosayajin]

The things is limbo was made for these kinds of missions(vauban, frost etc too, but mostly him)
Grendel was made for...what exactly? 
I'll tell you, to have a fat frame and a rolling meatball.
He was a disaster from the beginning and it's still the same now.

 

7 minutes ago, Xaero said:

Well, if Sentients had a way to mitigate hard CC, it would definitely help to make RJ missions more challenging.

No, it will just mean there is gonna be no diversity - everyone will go on squads with 3 mesas(or some heavy nuke frame) and one trin and just destroy everything.
Now I see all kinds of frames inside, all kinds of weapons.

Edited March 30, 2020 by vegetosayajin

[arimanari]

Limbo haters whine about not being able to shoot inside the bubble.
Devs make it possible to shoot inside the bubble.
Limbo haters whine about how this is too easy.
I often take Limbo in such missions and my team mates never ever complained about being bored. They often go out of the bubble and do their own thing. 
 

Quote

I have respect for people trying to play frost, or gara, making it insanely more difficult, because the risks of failing jumping from 0% to x% is actually multiplied by infinity, offering a challenge which doesn't exist when Limbo is pressing a key once every minute.

So you want to purposely make something insanely difficult? No thanks. If you have farmed as much as I have farmed in this game, if you have endured the bugs and the failures of this game as much as I have done through the years, you will be singing a different tune. The event design is poor, don't blame it on frame choice and how efficient they are in what they do. There are dozens of other ways to do this as easily as pressing 2+4 in limbo. All are boring BUT, as I already said  -  extremely efficient.

[xMarvin732]

12 minutes ago, Xaero said:

Well, if Sentients had a way to mitigate hard CC, it would definitely help to make RJ missions more challenging.

Scarlet Spear is already challenging enough, with the waiting for Ground Team to send Codes, and fighting off the enemies on the RJ Ship.

If YOU don't like it, then play the way you want, no need to force other Tennos to play the way you think it is meant to be played.

If you were there, when the Clan Defection Event was, you would understand why Limbo exists.

Edited March 30, 2020 by xMarvin732

[Marine027]

vor 14 Minuten schrieb Xaero:

Well, if Sentients had a way to mitigate hard CC, it would definitely help to make RJ missions more challenging.

Sadly DE only knows complete immunity or CC affected, no middle ground.

Immuntiy means CC frames will be compeltly useless, and msot of the gmae is already overshadowed by damage frames and msot missions focusing on killing, i ignore this event for perosnal reaosn so far but i am kinda glad it is a defense and not just some mindless killing, making you focus on the defense objective instead of just killing all in sight and never worry about anything.

I wish it could had been complete new content mission for the hype it got but, personal opinion.

Anyone remember survial actually troublesome to survive without towers as exampel, now you kill fast enough with any frame and not even need a looter frame for it to keep going on. The onjectives bocme more and more irrelevant, we seen this with Lichs, isntead of unique missiosn connected to them atleast if it is already disconnected of the main game, we got a extermiantion on each mission to spawn a capture target. Instead of atleast lets say let the onjectives give murmurs itself as bonus atleast? Same goes for Relic fissuers, reactents could dorp form objectives also, you know, make people do them actually instead of some farm enemys while one has to do it alone?

This is the main reason we can't have nice things, bad programmign and design from the start and it keeps continue this way.

Don't get me wrong i like this game but variety is dead, eather CC is uselss or overpowered, certain weaposn forgotten and made worse with the Riven bandaid, new frames overshadowign older ones far to good and so on. I mean yes new stuff replaces old, but to this extend? And for a game which barely brings new content to justify new equipment, and the content we get is eather to niche or not relevant, Railjack i love to board ships, as much i hate the mode itself perosnally, but the scalling in it just sucks so hard, same for Plains and Orb Vallis, enemys scale ridillious at times makign certai nframes uselss again, why have enemy level at all by now if the units differ so much by jsut a goddman colour change form grineer as example.

Same problem then applys to this frames and gaemmode, and DE panics and nerfs with reasons that not make sense at all simply. Now we have this dilemma of sme CC to storng while others get nerfed becasue "unbalanced"?

Edit: We need maybe something like GW2 CC Break bar, makign CC not useless but also not OP and keep stunnng or stopping enemys.

vor 9 Stunden schrieb Marine027:

GW2 has the best example in this, having a mechanic making CC still useful, we should have such CC resistance bar simply, scaling differenlty and each CC having a different imapct to lower it, depending on its strength and duration, of course this would need having to check every ability and even some status effects to adjust to it.

This would make CC in higher levels more useful, considering in GW2 breaking the CC bar will also debuff the enemys at times wtih extra damage taken.

They simpley need to find a good middle, complete immunity is crap, and pure damage should also nto the answer, both shoudl be useful in its own way and neather of each should overshadow the other side to much. Combined with the damge resitances and weaknesses on enemys, pure damage and crit will always outshine CC and status effects. The whole damaging system needs a rework.

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Marine027:

It makes alot simply not useless in late game, i see so many games starting to ingore CC because yes it takes to long for people seemingly instead of simply DPS it away,i see this in FFXIV as example, you have the CC abiltiys only for story really , in fight they just exist simply now.

GW2 shows it can be done right and still useable in a good way, something Warframe in my eyes needs aswell, CC is mostly overshadowed by damage, Fire still is more used because of the dot instead of the stun, Saryn and Mesa more liked to be seen then a Nyx or Vauban. On top of them being squishy still even after the armor buff and shield gating.

DE needs to find a good middle simply, instead of full resitance it should work like stacks like the OP said, i simply not want another bulletsponge like the Wolf was, that was so damn bad game design.

Edited March 30, 2020 by Marine027

[vegetosayajin]

5 minutes ago, arimanari said:

Devs make it possible to shoot inside the bubble.

Yea btw I noticed that, when did it occur? (I haven't taken him out of his box for some month or two)

[--K--Sharkfin]

26 minutes ago, Xaero said:

Well, if Sentients had a way to mitigate hard CC, it would definitely help to make RJ missions more challenging.

Might be challenging for people who already have the builds.

But more like impossible for people who just started getting the hang of warframe

Edited March 30, 2020 by SHArK-FiN

[xMarvin732]

10 minutes ago, vegetosayajin said:

Yea btw I noticed that, when did it occur? (I haven't taken him out of his box for some month or two)

It happened when Update 23.0 came out

"To put Limbo's Stasis in a more cooperative position, it has been changed to only stop-time for Enemies. Limbo's gear and all Ally gear will continue to function. But, because complete time-halting for enemies within the Rift is akin to godly power, the duration of the ability has been shortened overall - from base 30 seconds to 15 seconds. This is of course affected by Mods."

[--K--Sharkfin]

1 minute ago, xMarvin732 said:

It happened when Update 23.0 came out

still we can't shoot things in different dimensions. Limbo spamming a not-enough-range bubble would make shooting condrix annoying.

Luckily I find limbo in recruit so at least I know the limbo in my squad could communicate

[(XBOX)MetricDrumgun]

The one use that grendel has is swallowing up everything and spitting it out in one spot. Just like the old days of mags greedy pull hahaha 

[kapn655321]

This conflict and event are a clear and obvious callout to every Defense and CC frame that isn't Limbo.

What game are our other CC and Defense frames made for, if not Warframe and it's new events?

How dare their kits be of a capacity and state that cannot keep up appreciably! How dare DE make engaging content with such oversight in approach, with no provisions to address the inadequacy of kits that should otherwise work, but don't. Having one best answer to the problem flies in the face of the intent to customize anything in the first place. Why can we mod, why have all these frames, or weapons... if they are not to be used in Warframe? When a meta is this clear cut, that should be a Glaring red flag that they designed their enemies wrong, or in obsolescing a kit, there had better be a solution to make up the difference for that kit.

[xMarvin732]

Just now, SHArK-FiN said:

still we can't shoot things in different dimensions. Limbo spamming a not-enough-range bubble would make shooting condrix annoying.

Luckily I find limbo in recruit so at least I know the limbo in my squad could communicate

Yeah thats the problem 😕 When i use Limbo, i always play cooperative, there are some Limbos who are not working together as a team.

[Xaero]

24 minutes ago, vegetosayajin said:

No, it will just mean there is gonna be no diversity - everyone will go on squads with 3 mesas(or some heavy nuke frame) and one trin and just destroy everything.
Now I see all kinds of frames inside, all kinds of weapons.

All shooting at permanently frozen enemies. Or even staying afk because there's no need to kill stuff. If there's no challenge, nothing really matters. Works well for diversity that's for sure. Except that one player in a party who must sacrifice himself and play Limbo.

28 minutes ago, xMarvin732 said:

Scarlet Spear is already challenging enough, with the waiting for Ground Team to send Codes, and fighting off the enemies on the RJ Ship.

Depending on number of squads playing ground missions doesn't contribuite to challenge at all.

31 minutes ago, xMarvin732 said:

If YOU don't like it, then play the way you want, no need to force other Tennos to play the way you think it is meant to be played.

Please tell me how I force you to play the way I want.

31 minutes ago, xMarvin732 said:

If you were there, when the Clan Defection Event was, you would understand why Limbo exists.

And that's really weird of you to mention that because you haven't played it yourself.

28 minutes ago, SHArK-FiN said:

Might be challenging for people who already have the builds.

But more like impossible for people who just started getting the hang of warframe

It's not like Railjack content is intended to be accessible to people who just started getting the hang of the game in the first place.

[xMarvin732]

1 minute ago, Xaero said:

Depending on number of squads playing ground missions doesn't contribuite to challenge at all.

 

It does, because you need to defend the point till you get kill codes and when the Railjack gets attacked, someone needs to stay back in the Ship to defend.

2 minutes ago, Xaero said:

Please tell me how I force you to play the way I want.

 

"The point is, as was said above, being able to reduce mission failure chance to 0%. Not with some outstanding skills, but with just two buttons. Do you find it a good game design? I don't."

You can play it the way you want, i play it the way, not everyone has tons of free time to fight against the enemies and at the same time fighting against the bugs that keep happening, like being stuck in Operator and not being able to get back in Frame because of the "Ability is in use" message.

2 minutes ago, Xaero said:

And that's really weird of you to mention that because you haven't played it yourself.

Hearing the experience from other people, and knowing how annoying Defection is in Sorties, of course i mention it.

Just because i wasn't there for the Event in 2017 due to stopping playing Warframe in 2015, doesn't mean that i cant have my own point of view.