PSA PSA: Heirloom Collection Platinum Changes & Lessons

[Tahocess321]

hace 2 horas, (XBOX)Shodian dijo:

To be honest they did in the first post. I just don't think they want to make a separate pack at the moment.

That barely counts

In all honesty with all the negativity this has generated, at this point I wouldn't get the skins even if they gave them away for free. But I still think they should address it in some way, even if they cannot make more meaningful changes, at least a direct apology. And not some abstract S#&$ like "we missed the mark". They should show that they understand and aknowledge why people are pissed.

[Somnia]

Hi, heirloom owner here.
Didn't someone at DE say in the past that they wouldn't do something with Excal Prime's exclusivity again?

That would mean they went back on their word. This is already a breach of community trust by making it exclusive.

 

Edited September 6, 2023 by Somnia

[(XBOX)Shodian]

11 minutes ago, Somnia said:

Hi, heirloom owner here.
Didn't someone at DE say in the past that they wouldn't do something with Excal Prime's exclusivity again?

That would mean they went back on their word. This is already a breach of community trust by making it exclusive.

 

I'm pretty sure they mean making Warframes/weapons exclusive. Nothing to do with skins.

[Lion]

12 minutes ago, Somnia said:

Hi, heirloom owner here.
Didn't someone at DE say in the past that they wouldn't do something with Excal Prime's exclusivity again?

That would mean they went back on their word. This is already a breach of community trust by making it exclusive.

 

To be fair I think they only meant warframes or gameplay/mastery affecting things, to which end they have not done since. Skins come and go all the time and you never even think twice about it, think of all the twitch/amazon rewards that are completely gone, the Unreal tournament skins, console skins etc.

Edited September 6, 2023 by Lion

[PublikDomain]

Just now, Lion said:

To be fair I think they only meant warframes or gameplay/mastery affecting things, to which end they have not done since. Skins come and go all the time and you never even think twice about it, think of all the twitch/amazon rewards that are completely gone, the Unreal tournament skins.

Deluxe skins have always been permanent plat offerings since 2015.

Twitch/Amazon rewards come back for Regal Aya. You can buy some of the Twitch Prime content right now as permanent offerings from Varzia.

And cosmetics like the Unreal skins, Deimos supporter skins, Itzal armor set, old Tennocon sets, etc. that have disappeared permanently to never come back ever again suck just as much, and are criticized for the same reasons every time there's a new one. Just because something bad happens often doesn't suddenly make it acceptable. It's just more bad stuff that should be dropped for the same reasons.

[Thunderlord_Zinogre]

3 hours ago, Lion said:

Damn imagine hating a part of the community so much.

Imagine thinking you're entitled to love for being complacent in the game getting worse?

 

Van you just accept that people dont like you and stop trying to play victim of the fact that you love to be a contrarian?

 

People don't care what people who spent money think when we literally want you to have some of your money back, you're upset that everyone else cares enough to demand something from the people who owe us their livelihoods.

 

Without us, DE would be nothing and warframe would have been a relic of the past, we do not owe them A THING.

[leadwolf1]

I logged out and in and received everything.

I think the pack should be limited and keep the price, not all but most grind get parts and sell for plat buy what they want without spending money and are now mad they may have to spend. Also only founders received excal prime so why not make special skins that are limited. I would like to even taken one step futher and make a special skin that can be put on any frame a unique skin different than any frame in the game let the artists imagination run wild.

 

[Lion]

2 hours ago, leadwolf1 said:

I logged out and in and received everything.

I think the pack should be limited and keep the price, not all but most grind get parts and sell for plat buy what they want without spending money and are now mad they may have to spend. Also only founders received excal prime so why not make special skins that are limited. I would like to even taken one step futher and make a special skin that can be put on any frame a unique skin different than any frame in the game let the artists imagination run wild.

 

A skin going on any frame would be really cool tbh, like there's certain frames that I like mechanically (Mesa, Saryn, Ivara, Hildryn etc) but hate aesthetically.

 

3 hours ago, Thunderlord_Zinogre said:

Imagine thinking you're entitled to love for being complacent in the game getting worse?

 

Van you just accept that people dont like you and stop trying to play victim of the fact that you love to be a contrarian?

 

People don't care what people who spent money think when we literally want you to have some of your money back, you're upset that everyone else cares enough to demand something from the people who owe us their livelihoods.

 

Without us, DE would be nothing and warframe would have been a relic of the past, we do not owe them A THING.

I don't see how an optional skin pack objectively makes the game worse. Even if this becomes a trend and we see more optional limited time skins, it makes literally no difference to how the game is. Now if we start getting limited time weapons, Warframes, etc, that's something I'll draw the line at. 

 

But a time limited skin? No hair off my back.

 

I'm not saying you need to "love" or that heirloom pack owners are entitled to "love". But righteous indignation and outright harassment? Not acceptable. Same goes for people harassing others who don't have the heirloom pack.

Edited September 6, 2023 by Lion

[Circle_of_Psi]

1 hour ago, Somnia said:

Hi, heirloom owner here.
Didn't someone at DE say in the past that they wouldn't do something with Excal Prime's exclusivity again?

That would mean they went back on their word. This is already a breach of community trust by making it exclusive.

 

They did yes

[PublikDomain]

34 minutes ago, Lion said:

Now if we start getting limited time weapons, Warframes, etc, that's something I'll draw the line at. 

But a time limited skin? No hair off my back.

And Warframe used to have that! And there were many who said "no hair off my back it's just Lato/Braton Vandal/Athodai/Ignis Wraith/etc." And why do you think we don't have this anymore? Because the community pushed for it. You might not care about this latest escalation but plenty of us do. This crosses our lines.

37 minutes ago, leadwolf1 said:

not all but most grind get parts and sell for plat buy what they want without spending money and are now mad they may have to spend.

And all that plat F2P players grind out comes from a cash purchase somewhere down the line. Someone has always spent money on it and there are no ways around that. F2P players also fill a really important role in the game's economy and shouldn't be looked down on or minimized. And I definitely don't think "let's exclude the poors" is a very "we all lift together" way to celebrate the last 10 years nor usher in the next 10 years. If that's the "future of Warframe" DE wants to create then that's kind of concerning.

Nevermind that plenty of people buy plat directly. I do! I've got all the plat and Regal Aya I could ever want because I spend money on the game.

So you're goddamn right I want to spend the premium currencies I've already paid for.

Edited September 6, 2023 by PublikDomain

[CosoMalvadoNG]

A curiosity:
In the Chinese server they eliminated the 2 cheapest packages and the most expensive is cheaper than in the West. 

They can't change the packages here due to a legal problems (some whale cry) but in china they can delete them directly! xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

https://store.wf.qq.com/

PS: this is hilarious for me.

Edited September 6, 2023 by CosoMalvadoNG
Add text

[(XBOX)sinamanthediva]

4 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

And Warframe used to have that! And there were many who said "no hair off my back it's just Lato/Braton Vandal/Athodai/Ignis Wraith/etc." And why do you think we don't have this anymore? Because the community pushed for it. You might not care about this latest escalation but plenty of us do. This crosses our lines.

And all that plat F2P players grind out comes from a cash purchase somewhere down the line. Someone has always spent money on it and there are no ways around that. F2P players also fill a really important role in the game's economy and shouldn't be looked down on or minimized. And I definitely don't think "let's exclude the poors" is a very "we all lift together" way to celebrate the last 10 years nor usher in the next 10 years. If that's the "future of Warframe" DE wants to create then that's kind of concerning.

Nevermind that plenty of people buy plat directly. I do! I've got all the plat and Regal Aya I could ever want because I spend money on the game.

So you're goddamn right I want to spend the premium currencies I've already paid for.

Now I understand your plight as a picture is worth a thousand words!  I would be livid if I just spent $80 so I could buy something from the Market, that up until now, has always been available for Platinum purchase (i.e. Deluxe Skins).  So now the skins you might want to buy are CASH ONLY that includes even MORE PLATINUM that you CAN NOT use to buy the skins, you want to buy!  I mean there really isn't a debate here, it's CLEAR DE has pulled a fast one on you and all the other players who actively buy Platinum in order to go shopping at the same store that now says,  NOPE, sorry, we don't accept Platinum to buy what you really want and you won't be supporting us unless you buy this special pack, for a LIMITED TIME with CASH ONLY.

What do people NOT understand about this situation that DE has created, planned, discussed and IMPLEMENTED knowing exactly the ramifications of their money-grab shenanigans?  Come on people wake up and smell the coffee!!!

Thank you for being clear and succinct with your argument as it cements the SIDE of decency that all players should take and NOT buy the Heirloom Packs to encourage this behavior! 

Have a pleasant tomorrow!

Edited September 6, 2023 by (XBOX)sinamanthediva
grammar correction

[Voltage]

22 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

A curiosity:
In the Chinese server they eliminated the 2 cheapest packages and the most expensive is cheaper than in the West. 

They can't change the packages here due to a legal problems (some whale cry) but in china they can delete them directly! xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

https://store.wf.qq.com/

PS: this is hilarious for me.

There are several obscurities here that you may not have noticed or just didn't mention. The packs offered on this website aren't the same. If you check both Wisp Prime Access and the Top Heirloom Pack, the amount of Platinum given is either lower, or just missing. I'm not sure if the price difference here is due to this difference, regional pricing, or a bit of both. The exclusion of the other package tiers is certainly odd though.

The way the game is handled in that region is not really significant to the global version if I'm being honest. They play by their own rules over there, especially when the bottom of the page clearly states that it is Tencent Corporation who manages that platform.

EDIT: None of these packages seem to have the Accolade either, just the Glyph, Emblem, and Emote.

Edited September 6, 2023 by Voltage

[(XBOX)toughdragon17]

They literally just posted a new brand of coffee by digital extremes instead of addressing our concerns about the herloom pack and us wanting a cheaper 4th bundle without the filler of platinum / regal aya making it 70 to 90 dollars and just having the cosmetics and skins for maby 25 to 30 dollars 

instead they want to start a coffee brand

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 8 minutos, Voltage dijo:

There are several obscurities here that you may not have noticed or just didn't mention. The packs offered on this website aren't the same. If you check both Wisp Prime Access and the Top Heirloom Pack, the amount of Platinum given is either lower, or just missing.

Platinum is what's important here? 

hace 1 minuto, Voltage dijo:

The exclusion of the other package tiers is a bit weird though. The way the game is handled in that region is not really significant to the global release imo.

They eliminated the cheapest packages so that people only buy the most expensive one.  I mean, can they remove packages without legal problems, but they can't add them? Ridiculous.

[Voltage]

2 minutes ago, (XBOX)toughdragon17 said:

They literally just posted a new brand of coffee by digital extremes instead of addressing our concerns about the herloom pack and us wanting a cheaper 4th bundle without the filler of platinum / regal aya making it 70 to 90 dollars and just having the cosmetics and skins for maby 25 to 30 dollars 

instead they want to start a coffee brand

This isn't even correlated. They marketed this coffee before TennoCon: 

Notice the date. The Heirloom collection can only be related to previous situations similar to this bundle in nature which several players (including myself) have pointed out in the other megathreads and this PSA. It's a shame they didn't learn from Regal Aya before this launched the way it did, but that's all there is to it. We can continue discussing and raising concerns, but stuff like their committed marketing campaigns aren't related to this.

1 minute ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

Platinum is what's important here? 

I am just pointing out that it's hard to make a comparison because the packages are not the same. No Accolade and less Platinum. There is a different value comparison here. I'm not saying the packages are any better of a deal, but it's hard to pinpoint why the price is different than the global website.

3 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

They eliminated the cheapest packages so that people only buy the most expensive one.  I mean, can they remove packages without legal problems, but they can't add them? Ridiculous.

"Legal problems" where? This website is operated and owned by Tencent Corporation (scroll to the bottom of the site) in a country where they have their own rules (just like any other country does). They are operating by different rules that global players can only speculate about. It's the same thing with GDPR and the equivalent law in California. DE operates by these rules because they sell their product in the countries where these laws are required. China is no different. Leyou (which is now Tencent) is DE's means for selling Warframe within China, and doing so probably has many hurdles and differences to it. That's why I said this website is likely insignificant to us and this discussion regarding the western counterpart.

[(XBOX)toughdragon17]

8 minutes ago, Voltage said:

This isn't even correlated. They marketed this coffee before TennoCon

 

This is actually the first time I'm seeing or hearing about it

 

Well they really shouldn't be promoting other things until they fix the stuff they already have 

Edited September 6, 2023 by (XBOX)toughdragon17
More elaboration

[Voltage]

11 minutes ago, (XBOX)toughdragon17 said:

This is actually the first time I'm seeing or hearing about it

Well they really shouldn't be promoting other things until they fix the stuff they already have 

There are existing agreements with these collaborations like Trolli x Digital Extremes and this coffee company. Again, I would just ignore it.

I really wish players could know how the Heirloom collection (and similar types of things) came to be in this state, because I just can't picture someone like Rebecca, Steve, Sheldon, Megan, Pablo, or any of the older staff coming up with this idea and thinking it was good to go. As players, we can only feel like things are being mismanaged in a horrendous direction, but what about the details? With how most of the team has behaved over the last decade with players (within text, on stream, in person, or otherwise), they are often extremely considerate. Excalibur Prime and the Founders situation is a perfect example of this. It's been admitted time and time again that the situation was dire then, and even though they knew this wasn't an ideal solution, it made sense to go this way and honor it the way they do. However, when we see things like Riven Mods enter the game, Archon Shards, Supporter Bundles, Regal Aya, and now Heirloom Collections, it raises the question: how does this take place?

We can look at this and just speculate "Ah it's probably greedy Tencent pulling the strings to cash out on DE as a money printer", but I just find it hard to believe that it would go this way with how much passion is behind this game and the studio as a whole. I'm extremely pessimistic myself, and I do buy into that realistic scenario where games like Wayfinder, Heirloom Collections in Warframe, and other issues present are due to Tencent and not solely Digital Extremes.

However, I find it sad and disappointing that I don't think DE is being honest or transparent with players on several occasions because they can't, not because they don't want to. This PSA reads very similar to their original Regal Aya response. It feels hollow and tone-deaf, but reads as if the person posting (Megan in this case) isn't really the one we're talking to. Over the years it's been quite obvious when we are hearing genuine information or reading through them.

That's all I have left to really add to this topic besides commenting on others.

[(XBOX)toughdragon17]

22 minutes ago, Voltage said:

There are existing agreements with these collaborations like Trolli x Digital Extremes and this coffee company. Again, I would just ignore it.

I really wish players could know how the Heirloom collection (and similar types of things) came to be in this state, because I just can't picture someone like Rebecca, Steve, Sheldon, Megan, Pablo, or any of the older staff coming up with this idea and thinking it was good to go. As players, we can only feel like things are being mismanaged in a horrendous direction, but what about the details? With how most of the team has behaved over the last decade with players (within text, on stream, in person, or otherwise), they are often extremely considerate. Excalibur Prime and the Founders situation is a perfect example of this. It's been admitted time and time again that the situation was dire then, and even though they knew this wasn't an ideal solution, it made sense to go this way and honor it the way they do. However, when we see things like Riven Mods enter the game, Archon Shards, Supporter Bundles, Regal Aya, and now Heirloom Collections, it raises the question: how does this take place?

We can look at this and just speculate "Ah it's probably greedy Tencent pulling the strings to cash out on DE as a money printer", but I just find it hard to believe that it would go this way with how much passion is behind this game and the studio as a whole. I'm extremely pessimistic myself, and I do buy into that realistic scenario where games like Wayfinder, Heirloom Collections in Warframe, and other issues present are due to Tencent and not solely Digital Extremes.

However, I find it sad and disappointing that I don't think DE is being honest or transparent with players on several occasions because they can't, not because they don't want to. This PSA reads very similar to their original Regal Aya response. It feels hollow and tone-deaf, but reads as if the person posting (Megan in this case) isn't really the one we're talking to. Over the years it's been quite obvious when we are hearing genuine information or reading through them.

That's all I have left to really add to this topic besides commenting on others.

I do wonder that my self who exactly sits there and seas the stuff they put out there like this is ok and fine when it clearly isn't 

[Lion]

1 hour ago, (XBOX)toughdragon17 said:

They literally just posted a new brand of coffee by digital extremes instead of addressing our concerns about the herloom pack and us wanting a cheaper 4th bundle without the filler of platinum / regal aya making it 70 to 90 dollars and just having the cosmetics and skins for maby 25 to 30 dollars 

instead they want to start a coffee brand

Where is this coffee located? So I can avoid it, of course.

[(XBOX)toughdragon17]

19 minutes ago, Lion said:

Where is this coffee located? So I can avoid it, of course.

Its ordered online apparently just like how jacksepticeyes top of the morning coffee is 

[(XBOX)LadyWinterstorm]

1 hour ago, Voltage said:

I just can't picture someone like Rebecca

I can totally picture the randomizer in Duviri being all Rebecca 😂

The Heirloom pack probably from a mystery behind the scenes person that is not allowed to be named

Edited September 6, 2023 by (XBOX)LadyWinterstorm

[(PSN)KamehamehaIo]

Update: I finally fell for it and went and bought the cheapest pack, because I have no self control. On one hand I am proud, that I didn't buy the expensive ones and don't have any of the meh skins. Which, according to my therapist's advice, should be seen as a smol victory. But on the other hand: Help.

I'm still thinking a lot about this collection atm. As I mentioned before, it kind of destroyed the image I had of the game and suddenly I'm noticing a lot of things and hearing a lot of words I just kind of ignored up until now.

Capitalism 1 : 0 Space Ninjas. The magic is gone. 

 

• Where are the Raids? I never really cared about them, but I know a lot of people who did. Why did they promise us to bring them back (after reworking them or sth), but still haven't done so? (I'm glad they are gone, since they were really stressful for me, but knowing that some founder friends who have literally met the devs personally on past Tennocons feel absolutely lied to, makes me sad for them + Eidolons are stressful as well and I can't handle the light shows - so my problem persists. But I'm happy that some Arcanes are obtainable in other places now. That's cool.).

• Some friends have the feeling everytime players find sth to make the game more efficient/fun, DE keeps on nerfing these things. Which causes certain missions and activities to be even more of a chore. Do they still respect our time? I genuinely can't help but wonder now. After all, they have stopped respecting our finances.

• Why do we still have to wait several days for things to finish building in the foundry? That's a old system to artificially stretch the game. But the game is already HUUUUUGE and Nightwave does the same job. Once again: do they respect our time?

• There's a FoV bug on the PS4 that I have had for like 4 years or sth now. Everytime I start the game, I have to instantly enter the options and set the FoV back to 90 (what I want) or 89. Because the FoV always resets with each start of the game, despite the options still saying that they are on 90/89. Super bothersome with a PS4 controller. With the introduction of the Heirloom Collection,  I suddenly care about this bug again... A bug I successfully ignored for years.

 

Please note that my thoughts are just a depiction of ... Uh... (brain left the chat) thoughts that a collection like this causes in some of your (until now) loyal players. I'm not angry at the devs (maybe a tiny tiny bit disappointed for ignoring us and just not being honest with us) but mostly at Tencent, which I assume is to blame here mostly. My words are coming from a place that has nothing but absolute Love for Warframe and the devs. I don't want to see either go downhill like the rest of the gaming industry. But the Heirloom Collection feels like this is exactly what's going to happen.

 

Once again, sorry for my trash English.

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

36 minutes ago, (XBOX)toughdragon17 said:

I do wonder that my self who exactly sits there and seas the stuff they put out there like this is ok and fine when it clearly isn't 

 

Certain people in certain positions, with certain data, don't necessarily look at situations through the lens of "this is okay and this clearly isn't" because sometimes, data, trends, and other info they may have assorted and been advised on, will model and predict short term and long term negatives and positives, risks and benefits. 

People, on the whole, broadly speaking, can tend to be emotional, fickle, moody, and so on. In many situations, its still worth making a decision that can draw ire, outrage, negativity, if there is reasonable data or prediction models, that indicate a bigger payout. I am being broad because there are so many examples of this, as far as products, and human behaviour. Consider how a lot of semi famous minor celebrities can end up wealthier, more influential and powerful after scandals and controversy and a whole lot of people being critical of them. In five years, how many people in this thread will still think about this issue? I'll probably personally consider it, because I am the type to think about such things in the lens of consumer rights and gaming companies decisions and consequences but... 

This is why whilst frustration, ire, negative emotions are valid and good for creating attention, its also important to have long term memories, more objective and refined criticism, and in general advocate for consumer rights. Why laws need to be updated and refined as well. The stronger consumer rights are in general, the more ways to corral greed. With this situation specifically, whilst a bit hard and vague, could be a real point to DE, that they are trading years of goodwill and positive reputation to become "another EA, or Activision, or countless other companies" because whether an individual believes they are "that bad" or that such companies are "that bad" its arguable that its a selling point for the game, as is the idea of community, and warmth, and we all lift together, and how much they do for charity, and generally being more consumer and fan friendly. Except like I said before, thats. a bit of a vague concept sometimes to put into monetary value. Games like Diablo 4 probably don't need everyone who plays games to think its consumer friendly. Overwatch 1 probably made so much money, Overwatch 2 could fail and stop right now, that several Activision Blizzard higher ups could get additional yachts, summer homes. Why would they care if some "poor people online" are complaining about the games Devs. 

"Clearly isn't okay" isn't necessarily something that certain people need to worry about, when they can think "in two months, most people unhappy will probably not care anymore, and if they do... they were probably already unsatisfied anyway, and we made up the difference in players who are fine and or new anyway". 

To be super clear though, none of above is defending such behaviour, but we as consumers need to understand it to address it, short term and long term. In general, and specifically. Hope that makes sense. Cheers! 

[Voltage]

32 minutes ago, (PSN)Humblemud said:

There's a FoV bug on the PS4 that I have had for like 4 years or sth now. Everytime I start the game, I have to instantly enter the options and set the FoV back to 90 (what I want) or 89. Because the FoV always resets with each start of the game, despite the options still saying that they are on 90/89. Super bothersome with a PS4 controller. With the introduction of the Heirloom Collection,  I suddenly care about this bug again... A bug I successfully ignored for years.

I agree with the rest of your post and gave you an upvote as I feel the same in many ways, but I just wanted to quote you and maybe help you out (even if slightly off topic).

The FOV bug you are experiencing may be the same as the one on PC that you get from logging out and logging back in without closing the game. This is fixed by using Transference in the Orbiter twice (going into Operator/Drifter and then back into your Warframe). It's a very old issue, and if it's the same, maybe I just helped you.

Cheers. (PS: your English is not bad at all).