Warframe Experience Thoughts — Pt. 1 The Good

[(XBOX)psyoniko]

Over 2000 daily logins, currently at 5485 hours played and a total 22,351 missions overall. Not sure how the math all plays out but it's a lot. I probably started playing regularly shortly before the Plains of Eidolon dropped late in 2017 — pretty much the only game I've played since then. This background is meant to support my claim that at this point I'm qualified to hold forth about my perceptions of the Warframe experience.

My inspiration to write a series of posts about this arose earlier this year when I encountered an in-game survey question. The survey asked if I thought Warframe respected my time. My answer was and is "No." In fact, as I've started logging in less an less and ignoring certain objectives, I'm not sure if I want to continue playing at all. There's nothing wrong with that and no one is bothered by it. But there's no doubt that Warframe has taken up a lion's share of my leisure time for over six years, so it is reasonable and fair that I offer my critique here — in case I do go.

I will address each of my serious criticisms in other posts to follow on, but I begin with this post by pointing out what I love about Warframe. Obviously I would not have played so avidly and exclusively all these years if there wasn't much to love about it. It is by far the most interesting and engrossing game I have encountered. My list here is not comprehensive, but these points seem most important to me.

1. Warframe is weird

The art, the warframes, the Operator, the lore — especially the lore — is highly intriguing. The unexpected, persistent weirdness of Warframe stands out above all other aspects as the primary hook into my attention.

2. Movement and combat

The look and feel and sound of Waframe combat is top tier, in my opinion. Rapid switching between primary, secondary, melee combined with abilities, while dashing, rolling, leaping, double jumping, dodging, crouching, even flying, feels seamless when one gets the hang of it. I've played no other game that sports the exhilarating sensation of Warframe melee combat on top of full-featured ranged weaponry.

3. The cycst, the Operator, and the new player experience

As an element of the new player experience, the revolting mystery of the helminth cycst is what really drew me into Warframe weirdness. At that time the only information I could find about it was from outside sources — and that information was very odd. It gave me the sense that I was entering into a labyrinth of mystery, a lore I wanted to know and understand more. This sensation is eventually sent into overdrive with the introduction of the Operator.

4. Art, soundtrack and sound design

Beginning with the warframe designs, the visual aspect of the game is not only top notch but intentionally unsettling — not too smooth or overly baroque, often unexpectedly disproportionate and even grotesque, but also beautiful, intricate and expansive. It sparks in me a curious, engaging tension not found in other games. The execution and presentation continue to be flawless to this day (occasional object clipping aside).

The same goes for the sound design. While some weapon sounds are recycled, overall DE’s attention to sound design is detailed and intentional, producing a rich audio experience, particularly with regard to warframe movement, spatial ambience, enemy taunts and chatter, and other gameplay cues. The sound of a warframe rolling is especially satisfying.

The soundtrack, particularly those songs found in Warframe’s first soundtrack album (which I purchased and keep in rotation), is a one-of-a-kind thrill. With a few notable exceptions (added later) my praise for the mood-setting (and unsettling) soundtrack remains nearly universal. For years I kept “Sentient Tombs” set as my ring tone.

5. Free to play

It’s amazing that after ten years, Warframe only expands, gets weirder, and remains fundamentally free to play. Unlike some other notably similar games, there is no DLC update behind any paywall, and, except for select cosmetics and a few Founder’s exclusives, all items can be earned through gameplay. This aspect is often not immediately understood by new players (perhaps by design), but it is a welcome revelation that drives the grind.

Honorable mentions:

Warframe lore

Archwings, Railjacks, Necramechs and (most of) the expanded missions and environments created for them

Open world maps

The addition of Steel Path tier missions

The Duviri Experience (solo) — with one notable exception I will detail elsewhere

 

I will attempt to follow this tl;dr with more concise and specific negative criticisms which address why I state that Warframe does not respect my time… soon. These posts may be posted under different forum categories, depending on the topic, and if I can I will link back to this post.

Edited November 30, 2023 by (XBOX)psyoniko
My ability to math/recall numbers is sometimes broken

[Kaggelos]

Indeed warframe is one of my top favorite games of all time, the other being all of the Mass Effect Games.

I too started playing warframe towards the end of 2017, basically from 2018 onwards, only occasionally stopping for about two or three weeks at most whenever I want to try out another game. 

There were some rare times where I felt burned out from the grind, or the lack of difficulty in years past, (Something that DE Has started looking into by adding a modicum of challenge here and there which I appreciate greatly) but I've learned since then to pace myself and break it into chunks instead of one fell swoop. This has enabled me to enjoy it even more.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Kaggelos

[(PSN)drollive96]

A very well thought out review, i agree with nearly all of it, well done

[(XBOX)psyoniko]

As promised in my previous post that identifies some of the major positive points of my Warframe experience, I will now enter a series of posts that discuss my most serious complaints in answer to an in-game survey question that asked me if I think Warframe respects my time. As I have already stated, my answer is, "No," and this post is the first of several that will address my thoughts about that answer.

All of my most serious complaints have to do with alternate movement systems that seriously deviate from warframe/operator movement systems in most ordinary mission gameplay, and what I consider to be the unfortunately conceived and executed ideas of tying such secondary movement systems to player advancement/achievement/rewards. As I mentioned in my previous post, one of my primary sources of enjoyment in Waframe is warframe movement. There are several other additional movement systems, such as archwings, the Operator, Railjack, Necramechs, and the Drifter, that I do enjoy — I suppose because they each contain a core sense of momentum and seamless connection with the warframe, and that any game achievement or advancement or rewards tied to them don't require that I master some kind of secondary system of movement that bears no relation to destroying mobs of enemies.

The addition of the K-drive, the Ventkids syndicate, and K-drive races didn't bother me at first, even if I ultimately had no interest in them. In fact, I was initially excited by the K-drives, although movement across the open world maps was still better on archwing, there was some fun involved in doing some tricks and eating dirt. But I didn't enjoy doing the races. I know some players find them fun and easy, and I have no doubt that with enough effort I could "git gud" at K-drive racing and combos. But why? I was not even remotely interested in playing a skateboard game inside Warframe — not even a little bit. Adding the ability to shoot my secondary while riding and perform offensive slams I guess was an improvement, but at the end of the day I have no reason or desire to do that at all.

So when the Waverider quest dropped I was less than enthusiastic. I did the first page, reviewed the requirements for the subsequent pages and said "No thanks." Long story short, I ended up buying Yareli twice (second time to subsume) and her bubble gun with platinum. I'm sure that hurts no one's feelings, but my point is there's no way I was interested enough in K-drive operation to complete that quest. And even after DE nerfed the quest requirements, I looked them over again and weighed that against grinding for incarnon weapons and pathos clamps and upcoming primes and new warframes and farming various resources. (It didn't help that the update erased all the achievements I had made toward the second page.) I couldn't justify the time and frustration involved in completing any combo chains or even one more race. I concede that others may really like it or least not mind it and that there are of course always the players who find it ridiculously easy, but that's not my experience. I could "git gud," yes, but I don't want to. And I don't have to. The very thought of working on it gave me pain.

Within the context of what I enjoy in Warframe, the Waverider quest is just not any fun at all. This is why it is first on my list, since completion of the quest will always be a blurry tile in my codex and so I will have never earned Yareli. My perception of the Waverider quest is that it is a developers' passion project with a secret desire to foist it upon the entire Warframe community. This strikes me as unnecessarily selfish. The fact that they eventually nerfed the quest requirements betrays this.

 

Edited December 11, 2023 by (XBOX)psyoniko
typos correction

[(XBOX)psyoniko]

This post continues my series of posts that discuss my top concerns raised in response to an in-game survey question that asked if I think Warframe respects my time, and my answer, which was and is, "No." The previous post in the series covered my criticism of the Waverider quest. My introductory post in the series covered my favorite aspects of the game.

As with Waverider, this complaint addresses an alternate movement system, unfortunately tied to exclusive advancement/achievement/rewards, that deviates significantly from ordinary warframe/operator movement (which I do thoroughly enjoy, along with most other secondary movement systems — archwing, Railjack, Necramech, and Drifter — that contain a core sense of momentum and seamless connection with the warframe).

Now I'm talking about Kahl.

At least if he could roll, that would be something. Why can't he roll? Instead of rolling, Kahl does this weird, slide shuffle thing — I think people call it a "shoulder tackle," but I just call it lame and it doesn't tackle anything. He rolled when he was introduced in The New War, but now he's an old clone who just can't move like that anymore?

Also as with Waverider, I returned to try Kahl again after reading that they had nerfed up the missions in a recent update, but unfortunately for me the tweak is too subtle for such grossly miscalculated game design.

I'm not opposed to playing a Grineer or other enemy-based character, but Kahl has not been a good gameplay experience for me. I understand there's a jetpack somewhere in there but after shuffling slowly around and listening to him mumbling to himself in the third person, I'm totally uninterested. And that's really it. After playing an amazing character who can zip back and forth across any map, leap and slide hundreds of feet, spin, roll, etc, why would I then want to play some lumbering, hobbled up cannon fodder?

Kahl missions represent the very worst of Warframe grind — a grueling wall of tedium locked behind a drooling moron who can't remember how to roll.

I will grind for hours at a time for things I want. I want the Garrison goodies and of course I want more shards. But I hate playing Kahl so much, I'm willing to forego those rewards forever.

Clem ftw.

Edited January 22 by (XBOX)psyoniko
Forgot one thing, added it.

[Psyoniko]

This post marks a fourth installment of my series of posts in response to an in-game survey question I encountered last year that asked if I thought Warframe respects my time — to which I answered and will still answer: “No.” This doesn’t mean I don’t love Warframe, because I do — it is mostly the only game I have played since 2017 — and in my first post of the series provided evidence of my enthusiasm (hours and missions played, logins counted, Mastery Rank achieved, etc) and I listed some of my favorite aspects of the game. However, my next two posts highlighted alternate movement systems, specifically tied to player advancement and/or specific rewards, that I dislike enough to absolutely refuse to complete those parts of the game. First I dealt with why I won’t finish the Waverider quest, and then I explained why I won’t play Kahl missions. This post is about the flying horsey race and completes the “Bad” portion of my series.

Overall I do like the Duviri Experience. But I don’t think its fair to include a dumb flying horsey race as a completion stage of the Pathos Clamp grind. I admit I’ve completed a few, but just like the K-drive races, any dopamine hit gained does not offset the pain of a tricky course. Since I always solo Duviri, I realize no one else is bothered if I give up at a late stage because someone at DE thought the kaithe was so awesome — but I am bothered by it. And I do give up. I know if I just go back to the beginning five or ten more times I’ll probably beat it, but I’d rather just leave and forego the Pathos Clamps — which is the only reason I’m there — and try again later for a session that doesn’t have a horsey race.

I’m sure there are players who find it easy and/or fun, and I’m sure there metas for more efficient Duviri grinding. But that’s beside my point that the kaithe race is pointless, it includes ridiculous, frustrating, time-wasting mechanics, and should only be just another optional side quest like the banjo quest. It should never be required to reach the Orowyrm fight. If I could trample enemies and swing a melee weapon while riding the horsey, now that would be really cool… but the race would still be stupid.

The good thing about this particular complaint, unlike Waverider and Kahl, is that I can complete my overall Pathos Clamp grind (I'm about halfway done with those) and still avoid this part. It just takes me a lot longer to do. This is why I say that the dumb flying horsey race as a Duviri Experience stage demonstrates that Warframe does not respect my time.

Note: since Cross-Platform Save, I’ve been locked out of my Xbox forums account, which is why I am posting and wrapping up this series from my previously unused PC forums account.

[trst]

Refusing to engage with a mechanic core to a part of the game (yes Kaith mechanics are core to Duviri) doesn't mean the game doesn't respect your time. It means you're arbitrarily choosing to not engage with a system and are blaming the game/devs for that decision.

[Psyoniko]

24 minutes ago, trst said:

Refusing to engage with a mechanic core to a part of the game (yes Kaith mechanics are core to Duviri) doesn't mean the game doesn't respect your time. It means you're arbitrarily choosing to not engage with a system and are blaming the game/devs for that decision.

You're wrong.

[Raarsi]

12 minutes ago, Psyoniko said:

You're wrong.

Hey guys, I think we found the winner for "laziest forum defense ever"!  Congratulations OP!

Okay, joking aside, I see the problem:

1 hour ago, Psyoniko said:

Since I always solo Duviri

Herein lies your biggest mistake.  Warframe is a co-op game, and surprisingly in 2024, it's perfectly acceptable to have friends.  Heck, I've only done Duviri exclusively through pugs, because I know that there will be some parts I'm not as good at while other players will be able to knock out with the greatest of ease.

The same could be said of any content, which makes me think OP that with all these "complaint" you have that you probably just need a break from the game, and that's perfectly okay and a completely normal part of playing any major game.

[Psyoniko]

17 minutes ago, Raarsi said:

Hey guys, I think we found the winner for "laziest forum defense ever"!  Congratulations OP!

Okay, joking aside, I see the problem:

Herein lies your biggest mistake.  Warframe is a co-op game, and surprisingly in 2024, it's perfectly acceptable to have friends.  Heck, I've only done Duviri exclusively through pugs, because I know that there will be some parts I'm not as good at while other players will be able to knock out with the greatest of ease.

The same could be said of any content, which makes me think OP that with all these "complaint" you have that you probably just need a break from the game, and that's perfectly okay and a completely normal part of playing any major game.

You are wrong.

[trst]

55 minutes ago, Psyoniko said:

You're wrong.

Nice rebuttal.

Really by your own logic here one could say that WF doesn't respect their time because they hate the modding system and thus never update their builds because of that. That the system is dumb due to more mods being added that're different from older mods. And the game doesn't respect your time when you need to abort a mission/abandon entire branches of content due to lacking damage/survivability in it.

 

Now mind you it is perfectly fine to not like or enjoy something in any game and it's perfectly fine to choose to avoid those systems. But it's less fine to argue that your own preferences means the game doesn't respect your time just because you don't personally enjoy an aspect of it.

Edited March 9 by trst

[Psyoniko]

2 minutes ago, trst said:

Nice rebuttal.

Really by your own logic here one could say that WF doesn't respect their time because they hate the modding system and thus never update their builds because of that. That the system is dumb due to more mods being added that're different from older mods. And the game doesn't respect your time when you need to abort a mission/abandon entire branches of content due to lacking damage/survivability in it.

 

Now mind you it is perfectly fine to not like or enjoy something in any game and it's perfectly fine to choose to avoid those systems. But it's less fine to argue that your own preferences means the game doesn't respect your time just because you don't personally enjoy an aspect of it.

You are completely wrong again.

[quxier]

 

2 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

I’m sure there are players who find it easy and/or fun, and I’m sure there metas for more efficient Duviri grinding.

2 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

it includes ridiculous, frustrating, time-wasting mechanics

I wonder what's so hard about it. I don't mean your experience isn't valid. It's just so different from mine (to the point you are writing this topic) that I wonder where is problem with it. On normal (non sp) there is enough time to jus slowly complete it & shoot "stuff" to extend time. I end with ~1 minute left without shooting every "stuff". Mind you, I'm not great at it.

ps. I'm on PC (keyboard + mouse).

2 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

It just takes me a lot longer to do. This is why I say that the dumb flying horsey race as a Duviri Experience stage demonstrates that Warframe does not respect my time.

It doesn't respect your time because you don't like it? That's wrong. It may be hard/stupid/frustrating for you. However it's short race. It doesn't artificialy make it longer for no reason. You can make it pretty fast if you are good (e.g. 13 points -> 35 seconds).

There are more stuff that doesn't respect your time (long missions, some without way to speed them. Pathos clams being after beating 6 stages, Circuit giving you weak stuff, next stages (especially later one) takes like 30+ minutes etc). So, no, it respects your time. It may be just not your cup of tea.

1 hour ago, Raarsi said:

2 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

Since I always solo Duviri

Herein lies your biggest mistake.  Warframe is a co-op game, and surprisingly in 2024, it's perfectly acceptable to have friends.  Heck, I've only done Duviri exclusively through pugs, because I know that there will be some parts I'm not as good at while other players will be able to knock out with the greatest of ease.

 

While I can play with others, it's still problem when I cannot beat something alone. Whenever that problem is valid or not it's different talk.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

i don't like the Kaithe races much either. or Kaithes in general. I've never been a horse-lover and I wish DE would stop with the gimmicky vehicles that are only usable in a few places. imagine what else they could've done with the core game if they didn't waste so much time and expense on Archwing, K-Drives and Kaithes.. K-Drives are still the worst, but Kaithes are second to that, because though they can fly, they still feel clunky as hell.

that said, they aren't so much hard as just eye-rollingly boring. I'd rather have more of the Drifter's lethargic combat than kaithe races, at least there's some fun to be had if I have a bunch of decrees on that make it feel more akin to regular warframe combat.

 

[Psyoniko]

55 minutes ago, quxier said:

I wonder what's so hard about it. I don't mean your experience isn't valid. It's just so different from mine (to the point you are writing this topic) that I wonder where is problem with it. On normal (non sp) there is enough time to jus slowly complete it & shoot "stuff" to extend time. I end with ~1 minute left without shooting every "stuff". Mind you, I'm not great at it.

Congratulations.

59 minutes ago, quxier said:

It doesn't respect your time because you don't like it? That's wrong. It may be hard/stupid/frustrating for you. However it's short race. It doesn't artificialy make it longer for no reason. You can make it pretty fast if you are good (e.g. 13 points -> 35 seconds).

There are more stuff that doesn't respect your time (long missions, some without way to speed them. Pathos clams being after beating 6 stages, Circuit giving you weak stuff, next stages (especially later one) takes like 30+ minutes etc). So, no, it respects your time. It may be just not your cup of tea.

I already stated my reasons precisely, but for whatever reason you pretend not to understand. If I thought that other stuff wasted my time I would write about it.

1 hour ago, quxier said:

While I can play with others, it's still problem when I cannot beat something alone. Whenever that problem is valid or not it's different talk.

I didn't say I couldn't beat it. I said I don't care to. The flying horsey race is a dumb waste of time and it's not core to anything except when it's a stage in the grind.

[Psyoniko]

17 minutes ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

i don't like the Kaithe races much either. or Kaithes in general. I've never been a horse-lover and I wish DE would stop with the gimmicky vehicles that are only usable in a few places. imagine what else they could've done with the core game if they didn't waste so much time and expense on Archwing, K-Drives and Kaithes.. K-Drives are still the worst, but Kaithes are second to that, because though they can fly, they still feel clunky as hell.

that said, they aren't so much hard as just eye-rollingly boring. I'd rather have more of the Drifter's lethargic combat than kaithe races, at least there's some fun to be had if I have a bunch of decrees on that make it feel more akin to regular warframe combat.

 

You are correct. Dumb flying horsey race is boring and wastes my time. Drifter combat is way more fun, especially with a bunch of decrees.

[JimothyStevens]

1 hour ago, Psyoniko said:

You are correct. Dumb flying horsey race is boring and wastes my time. Drifter combat is way more fun, especially with a bunch of decrees.

I just dont like that the jump into flying sends you way up above gates with no way to control it down until it's too late sometimes

[Xzorn]

It's true Warframe doesn't respect your time but it has nothing to do with these posts I've looked at.

Warframe doesn't respect your time because DE skews new content to get more playtime out of it then eventually makes it easier. They literally just did it again with Fortuna. They did it 4 or so times with PoE and they'll likely keep doing it even when they say they won't like the Hema farm.

I'm pretty good with the horse flying so it doesn't bother me. Some of those races are actually kinda tricky.
I hate K-Drive and I hate that they tried to force it on the community. Even going far as to almost nerfing Itzal.

But I also hate herding goats. I don't see how this compares to wasting time. They're all still faster than most Undercroft missions.

 

4 hours ago, JimothyStevens said:

I just dont like that the jump into flying sends you way up above gates with no way to control it down until it's too late sometimes

Jump and dodge. Puts you into a glide at your current altitude instead of soaring upwards.

Also good for diving off cliffs into rings and other stuff.

 

Edited March 9 by Xzorn

[RyllusPurple]

You will do the kaithe race and you will have fun.

They should never have nerfed waverider. It was one of the few quests I enjoyed and they watered it down instead of reducing the absurd new war requirements.

And you know what else? they should remove transference on the surface of duviri. I hate when i've having fun playing drifter and some buzzkill turns into mesa and nukes it all. 

Edited March 9 by RyllusPurple

[Psyoniko]

On 2024-03-09 at 8:05 AM, Xzorn said:

It's true Warframe doesn't respect your time but it has nothing to do with these posts I've looked at.

Warframe doesn't respect your time because DE skews new content

You are wrong.

On 2024-03-09 at 8:05 AM, Xzorn said:

I'm pretty good with the horse flying so it doesn't bother me.

Congratulations.

 

On 2024-03-09 at 8:05 AM, Xzorn said:

I hate K-Drive and I hate that they tried to force it on the community. Even going far as to almost nerfing Itzal.

You are correct. They didn't just try. They did force it on the community — it's called the Waverider quest, plus granting XP for K-drive BS. Itzal was totally nerfed and that was a crime.

On 2024-03-09 at 8:05 AM, Xzorn said:

But I also hate herding goats. I don't see how this compares to wasting time.

I'm pretty good at herding the goats so it doesn't bother me.

 

On 2024-03-09 at 2:34 PM, RyllusPurple said:

And you know what else? they should remove transference on the surface of duviri. I hate when i've having fun playing drifter and some buzzkill turns into mesa and nukes it all. 

Simple answer to your issue: solo it.

I only use transference in Duviri when I can't get the horsey to jump onto a tiny ledge in a cave or if I haven't got enough decrees to one-shot Kullervo.

[quxier]

17 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

18 hours ago, quxier said:

While I can play with others, it's still problem when I cannot beat something alone. Whenever that problem is valid or not it's different talk.

I didn't say I couldn't beat it. I said I don't care to. The flying horsey race is a dumb waste of time and it's not core to anything except when it's a stage in the grind.

I haven't said you cannot. It was answer to other poster.

17 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

18 hours ago, quxier said:

It doesn't respect your time because you don't like it? That's wrong. It may be hard/stupid/frustrating for you. However it's short race. It doesn't artificialy make it longer for no reason. You can make it pretty fast if you are good (e.g. 13 points -> 35 seconds).

There are more stuff that doesn't respect your time (long missions, some without way to speed them. Pathos clams being after beating 6 stages, Circuit giving you weak stuff, next stages (especially later one) takes like 30+ minutes etc). So, no, it respects your time. It may be just not your cup of tea.

I already stated my reasons precisely, but for whatever reason you pretend not to understand.

Well... not for me. Here:

21 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

dumb flying horsey race as a completion stage

21 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

ridiculous, frustrating, time-wasting mechanics

are just subjective (without farther explanations) and not true (1-2 minute is hardly time waster).

21 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

pain of a tricky course.

This could be the most precise opinion I can find. However it's still not very precise. I've told you my experience. Instead of comparing both experience you said:

18 hours ago, Psyoniko said:

Congratulations.

If you don't want to discuss then your case is either (or both)

- I don't like it

- I'm very bad at it (hence git gut).

It's fine to have such opinions but talk requires more informations.

[Aerikx]

@quxier

This thread is a bad faith argument thread. Don't take the bait. 

The only opinions that will be labeled as right are ones that agree with the OP's viewpoint. Everything else that doesn't agree, even if had video or undeniable fact will be labeled as wrong. 

Don't waste your time on this drivel.

[UnstarPrime]

I can understand why someone wouldn't enjoy the Kaithe races, as the aerial controls for the Kaithe are already pretty clunky, and that's before taking into account that you're trying to shoot targets between every waypoint.  The result is an experience where you can see the foundation for fun, but the polish just isn't there to get it across the finish line.  I love the K-drive races, so it's a bit sad that Kaithes didn't get the love they needed to make aerial movement feel more fluid and smooth.

All of that said: OP, I humbly recommend reconsidering your approach to engaging with others on these forums.  Your original post was fine, but the way you've decided to reply to others is likely to alienate even the people who might otherwise agree with your points.  The choice is yours, but if you're interested in having any manner of dialogue with anyone, a little shift in your tactics will go a long way.

[Lord_Drod]

The kaithe races are so easy. Get gud!  They take like 30 seconds.  I wish they were more complicated.  And to say drifter combat is more enjoyable is laughable.  The worst stages in duviri are the ones where drifter has to fight.  The combat is terrible and not one of them can be completed faster than a kaithe race.  If you stack decrees, there is no combat.  I am right and you are wrong.

[CrownOfShadows]

Way back when the kaithe races were bugged and not released yet I said that I hoped they wouldn't follow the same gate format as always, and man was I disappointed to find they did. I don't like this race mechanic at all. If they ever do another open world and want to do races again I hope they take a fresh look at the system.

I still maintain that what they should've done is a ground-only race, the 4 of you against like 8 dax riders, just powering over terrain - that woulda been fantastic, it woulda been a real race and played into the whole horse aesthetic nicely. Such a missed opportunity. If it was like that it probably would've been one of my favorite mini-games in Duviri, alas it is my least favorite.

 

(Also I think it's worth noting that I believe kaithe racing is significantly harder when using a controller)