Is Cathode Current Gyre the new Ember but scaling?

[(XBOX)K1jker]

Not having to push buttons with her going endlessly seems so. No backdraws either unless someone walks into nullifiers every minute. 

I use Aquablades on her for even less button pressing.

OP?

[Pakaku]

Sounds balanced by just how awfully boring it is

[Zakkhar]

1 hour ago, (XBOX)K1jker said:

I use Aquablades on her for even less button pressing.

Does it work in SP? I use Pillage on her 1 for a lot of button pressing.

[VibingCat]

Not OP, in the Steel Path her gameplay requires more effort, and it won't handle higher levels easily. She's very fun and strong, though.

[SDGDen]

the passive AOE damage around her is quite low, more similar to equinox in my opinion (a bit higher, but with my current build which includes roar, it only really kills trash up to around level 60 non-steelpath) 

her real strength is being able to turn any weapon into a high-crit AOE weapon due to the chaining electricity, i personally use her with the tenet flux rifle and kuva nukor and it's *absurdly* effective, combine with a damage buff like roar since status effects get affected twice by roar OR run with an armor strip (terrify, pillage etc) for easy steel path grineer. 

sadly her passive that grants crit chance to abilities does NOT work on subsumed abilities, otherwise you'd be able to cause the chaining using abilities that aren't her own (Which would have made blazing pillage INSANE) 

[(XBOX)K1jker]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb Pakaku:

Sounds balanced by just how awfully boring it is

I would say efficient.. but in the end it's the same 😅

 

vor 30 Minuten schrieb Zakkhar:

Does it work in SP? I use Pillage on her 1 for a lot of button pressing.

I don't play steel path, neither did old Ember..

 

vor 18 Minuten schrieb VibingCat:

Not OP, in the Steel Path her gameplay requires more effort, and it won't handle higher levels easily. She's very fun and strong, though.

Idk if steel path should be used in a balance pass.. considering DEs past statements about what steel path is.

But neither was Ember.. the only place she shined was lith level content. And had constant energy consumption in the process. Yet it was considered low effort and changed. I feel like Gyre fits that with the augment. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by (XBOX)K1jker

[SDGDen]

3 minutes ago, (XBOX)K1jker said:

Idk if steel path should be used in a balance pass.. considering DEs past statements about what steel path is.

sadly the community passed that point at least a whole year ago, if not two.

the requests for even higher difficulties have become more frequent and more insane, hell, i've seen requests to simply start the mission at lvl 9999. 

people have started calling steel path "easy" even. 

welcome to warframe balancing, where the only way to balance is through buffing because if DE nerfs anything the community goes mental and sends them actual death threats.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

I run Gyre sometimes in SPC when she pops up, and she's incredibly strong, the downside though is that she's kinda squish and if you take a fall out of the undercroft it resets your abilities: it's a big oof moment when her 3 and 4 are at maximum duration, killing everything and then you get knocked off a cliff or you mess up a jump and have to start over again.. also the cooldown on her 3 if you fail to hit enough enemies. 

I would say it's balanced, in that it rewards those who can get that momentum going, but those who can't or who lose the momentum, have to start over. you have to know how to build for it and be careful not to fall or hit a nully bubble, but everything else gets washed away in a sea of crits, and it's glorious.

 

[Skoomaseller]

yes

subsume pillage over her 1 and build full strength. world on fire ember is back.

[(XBOX)K1jker]

vor 19 Minuten schrieb SDGDen:

sadly the community passed that point at least a whole year ago, if not two.

the requests for even higher difficulties have become more frequent and more insane, hell, i've seen requests to simply start the mission at lvl 9999. 

people have started calling steel path "easy" even. 

welcome to warframe balancing, where the only way to balance is through buffing because if DE nerfs anything the community goes mental and sends them actual death threats.

That's how it goes! 😄

 

vor 19 Minuten schrieb (PSN)robotwars7:

I run Gyre sometimes in SPC when she pops up, and she's incredibly strong, the downside though is that she's kinda squish and if you take a fall out of the undercroft it resets your abilities: it's a big oof moment when her 3 and 4 are at maximum duration, killing everything and then you get knocked off a cliff or you mess up a jump and have to start over again.. also the cooldown on her 3 if you fail to hit enough enemies. 

I would say it's balanced, in that it rewards those who can get that momentum going, but those who can't or who lose the momentum, have to start over. you have to know how to build for it and be careful not to fall or hit a nully bubble, but everything else gets washed away in a sea of crits, and it's glorious.

 

I don't play SP but I'm enjoying her in conjunction survival 80-100, A LOT. But it always irks me that when she gets going, she goes endlessly basically. And tbh it's rather easy to get her back after falling or nullifiers, unless she falls twice 😅

 

vor 16 Minuten schrieb Skoomaseller:

yes

subsume pillage over her 1 and build full strength. world on fire ember is back.

I should try it 😄

[(NSW)jhj82]

2 hours ago, (XBOX)K1jker said:

I don't play steel path, neither did old Ember..

Everything is wet paper on non steel path.

[(XBOX)K1jker]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb (NSW)jhj82:

Everything is wet paper on non steel path.

That's why I'm questioning why Ember needed to go through multiple nerfs until the whole removal of abilities.. 

No one plays her anymore because of it.. 

When we now have way better, easier and scaling ways to do what she did. 

[Hexerin]

2 hours ago, SDGDen said:

people have started calling steel path "easy" even.

That would be because it is. There's no actual challenge on Steel Path, just things that become broken (not in the good way) due to the faulty way the game's scaling works. And because DE doesn't care about players who actually want gameplay that involves actual gameplay, it'll never be fixed.

[Jarriaga]

3 hours ago, VibingCat said:

Not OP, in the Steel Path her gameplay requires more effort, and it won't handle higher levels easily.

The gameplay loop that caused Ember's nerf was at low level, not high level. People are comparing Gyre to pre-rework World on Fire Ember, not current Ember.

In low level you can literally walk around the map and everything dies just by you passing by. I am getting concerned this will lead to a Gyre nerf because DE prioritize what is disruptive to new players in low-level content.

[KitMeHarder]

7 hours ago, (XBOX)K1jker said:

Not having to push buttons with her going endlessly seems so.

• Except World on Fire had a base range of 15m (42m maxed) that went through walls iirc.
• Gyre does nothing passively if enemies aren't within 4m of her (11.2m maxed) and doesn't go through walls.

Edited November 30, 2023 by KitMeHarder

[Zakkhar]

1 hour ago, Hexerin said:

There's no actual challenge on Steel Path, just things that become broken (not in the good way) due to the faulty way the game's scaling works.

I dare you to solo SP Cerberus, or even the dreaded Ropalolyst. There is no actual challenge for a squad. Solo is completely different game.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Zakkhar

[(NSW)jhj82]

37 minutes ago, Zakkhar said:

I dare you to solo SP Cerberus, or even the dreaded Ropalolyst. There is no actual challenge for a squad. Solo is completely different game.

SP Ropo is quite easy with Madurai and your favorite rad sniper

2 hours ago, (XBOX)K1jker said:

That's why I'm questioning why Ember needed to go through multiple nerfs until the whole removal of abilities.. 

No one plays her anymore because of it.. 

When we now have way better, easier and scaling ways to do what she did. 

And yet yesterday I matched with a few Ember Primes doing rando stuff. Ember is very powerful the way her kit works now.

[(XBOX)K1jker]

vor 44 Minuten schrieb (NSW)jhj82:

 

And yet yesterday I matched with a few Ember Primes doing rando stuff. Ember is very powerful the way her kit works now.

That says nothing really.

https://www.warframe.com/2022stats

This however does. I mean before x Warframe rework there were a few x Warframes round and about, because people like to fashion around. 

But seeing her consistently falling shows the rework mostly ruined her. She's good on paper but very unfun to use. 

[Hexerin]

1 hour ago, Zakkhar said:

I dare you to solo SP Cerberus, or even the dreaded Ropalolyst. There is no actual challenge for a squad. Solo is completely different game.

I'm not even going to bother recording Ropalolyst, as it's a complete joke of a fight (once you learn how the fight works, of course). It just takes a long time to kill, because of all the phases that force you to twiddle your thumbs waiting (cutscenes, invulnerability, etc).

Arin Hanson (also known as Egoraptor) has an exceptional segment on his Sequelitus series (Zelda, LTTP vs OOT) that goes over how forced waiting can feel difficult if you fall into the mental trap, but actually isn't if you break it down and look at what is really happening.

As for your challenge for SP Cerberus solo... well, hate to break it to you, but that's also not hard:

 

[Zakkhar]

28 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

As for your challenge for SP Cerberus solo... well, hate to break it to you, but that's also not hard:

Challenge does not need to be hard. It just need to be challenging. Souls are not hard if you are good, but they are still fun because they are still challenging.

You statement was that SP is not challenging, which is not true. It is. You actually need to pick proper frame, understand the mechanics and play well to complete many missions. That IS the definition of challenge. You overcoming it does not dimishing it.

 

Edited November 30, 2023 by Zakkhar

[Hexerin]

18 minutes ago, Zakkhar said:

Challenge does not need to be hard. It just need to be challenging. Souls are not hard if you are good, but they are still fun because they are still challenging.

You statement was that SP is not challenging, which is not true. It is. You actually need to pick proper frame, understand the mechanics and play well to complete many missions. That IS the definition of challenge. You overcoming it does not dimishing it.

 

You must be an uber casual, if you find this level of gameplay "challenging". Nothing wrong with being a casual, but stop acting like you know what you're talking about.

[0_The_F00l]

I don't think it is, gyre is not the old "world on fire " ember , there are multiple things to consider here that separates her.

Firstly gyre aoe damages enemies in only two scenarios 

1) the enemy is very close to you (around 5 meters) 

2) you actively damage the enemy with your weapons and there are enemies around it.

There is also a brief but noticeable cooldown between the charges.

While the old ember was very much a passive damage dealer with a significant range not needing any additional inputs.

Granted old ember was pretty much only doing that in lower levels. And gyre can go slightly further but not by much.

Edited November 30, 2023 by 0_The_F00l

[Zakkhar]

2 hours ago, Hexerin said:

Nothing wrong with being a casual,

Yes, like I stated before in other thread. I am a filthy LR3 casual, who solos most of the content.

Want a challenge? Pick Gyre instead of Slowva (or just anything that is not Slowva or Khora, Slow Equinox counts). And try Ose instead (I meant Ose before)

Edited November 30, 2023 by Zakkhar

[Zakkhar]

2 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Firstly gyre aoe damages enemies in only two scenarios 

1) the enemy is very close to you (around 5 meters) 

2) you actively damage the enemy with your weapons and there are enemies around it.

You forgot the staple, which is this thread title and is pretty much mandatory mod.

3) when you eliminate an enemy, whether it is with weapon or abilities

[Qriist]

9 hours ago, VibingCat said:

Not OP, in the Steel Path her gameplay requires more effort, and it won't handle higher levels easily.

Gyre is a snap pick for me in SP Circuit. Survivability is not an issue.

 

9 hours ago, SDGDen said:

(Which would have made blazing pillage INSANE) 

Blazing Pillage, while equipable on non-Hildryn frames, does not work on them. It requires one of Hildryn's other abilities to function.

 

9 hours ago, Skoomaseller said:

subsume pillage over her 1 and build full strength

I subsumed pillage over her 2 as I found it less useful with my playstyle. Once Molt Augmented is fully online, I have 334 ability strength, which is just above the fullstrip breakpoint when coupled with Corrosive Projection.

 

2 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Firstly gyre aoe damages enemies in only two scenarios 

1) the enemy is very close to you (around 5 meters) 

2) you actively damage the enemy with your weapons and there are enemies around it.

There is also a brief but noticeable cooldown between the charges.

 

With Cathode Current active her discharge can and does chain to enemies around walls. It only requires line of sight between enemies. If that discharge kills that enemy then it will discharge again and go yet further.

 

2 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

And gyre can go slightly further but not by much.

I've taken Gyre into many a lengthy SP Kuva Survivals without falling down once. The key is understand how her kit works, and more importantly, to keep moving.