Atlas' Petrify and the incoming new enemy vulnerability

[AegidiusF]

Atlas' Petrify damage buff works in a very different way as other abilities, as it increases the damage type vulnerability.

With the announced rework of enemy vulnerability, I wonder if Petrify's damage buff is going to be reworked too.

Perhaps Atlas is the warframe Pablo said they were working on...

Edited May 6 by AegidiusF

[Traumtulpe]

Makes no difference, Atlas is terrible anyhow. Damage vulnerability will still be a thing, so Petrify will still work as before; Or rather *would*, if anybody was using it. You can't even use Ore Gaze to get extra loot from Eximus units (because either a) target has Overguard, or b) target is dead). And it's *still* bugged to aim where *Atlas* is looking - not where *you* are aiming (those can be wildly different directions).

Want a 100x worse Whipclaw? Want a 50x worse Strangledome? Want 2 20x worse Venaris? Want a useless piece of rock? No? Thought so.

[-ShadowRadiance-]

Rock boi needs an overhaul..

[Chewarette]

42 minutes ago, Traumtulpe said:

Makes no difference, Atlas is terrible anyhow. Damage vulnerability will still be a thing, so Petrify will still work as before; Or rather *would*, if anybody was using it. You can't even use Ore Gaze to get extra loot from Eximus units (because either a) target has Overguard, or b) target is dead). And it's *still* bugged to aim where *Atlas* is looking - not where *you* are aiming (those can be wildly different directions).

Want a 100x worse Whipclaw? Want a 50x worse Strangledome? Want 2 20x worse Venaris? Want a useless piece of rock? No? Thought so.

I've been using it the last week, it rocks (pun intended). It just shreds everything that goes into its path, is nigh invulnerable and overall pretty fun. I had forgotten until its existence but he's still pretty relevant, i'm impressed.

So yeah, most his abilities are useless except his 1 and whatever you want to subsume on him, but he's fun and wrecks stuff until pretty high level. I've done quite long SP Void Cascade Fissure runs and he has no problem dealing with Thrax for example, and Acolytes are consistently two-shot until level what, 500 ?

I don't know if that's a 100x worse Whipclaw as I don't use Khora, but it's definitely prominent for whatever you want to use it for. I'll try it on EDA next week to see

[(PSN)Pablogamer585]

I don't think Atlas will benefit from tweaks to anything but himself unlike does Frost with the previous and forthcoming cold changes, and the reason is simple;

All of Frost Abilities proc cold, to a degree, so even Freeze and Ice Wave will do something useful by actively contributing to Frost's overall role which is CC & Defence, though Avalanche will still do the exact same thing, in an area, through walls, and removing armour... which really makes you wonder what's the point of those two at all besides popping a Snowglobe and being easily replaceable by helminth abilities. Atlas, however, will still have two rubbish abilities and a lack of identity on his kit due to this.

So while, I hope Pablo^GOD reworks my main to be better eventually, I believe some frames require reworks sooner than Atlas does based on the usage stats of last year, and the brutal lack of attention they've gotten compared to some newer ones. I won't mention who it is but we all know it.
At the end of the day, even if Atlas doesn't get a rework I can still punch enemies for multi-million damage, which is what I always loved about him.

[0_The_F00l]

In a reverse direction I wonder if faction damage will be changing too (just a thought).

As to OP I did have the same thought when they announced the changes , I hope it works out for the better for atlas.

Atlas is ok , I like using him , sure he isn't the best at any specific role , but when you just want to punch things away into a different tileset , Atlas has got your back.

His vulnerability effect was mostly unnoticed majority of the time , but with changes to Armor it may be made on par with other effects that add vulnerability. 

I am curious.

[KitMeHarder]

2 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

Makes no difference, Atlas is terrible anyhow.

What an uninformed statement. I think you need to study up more on Atlas, as he's in the upper echelons of all frames when it comes to mobbing.

[Traumtulpe]

1 hour ago, KitMeHarder said:

I think you need to study up more on Atlas, as he's in the upper echelons of all frames when it comes to mobbing.

Lol.

[Traumtulpe]

You know, I've become kind of fond of these kinds of people. "Atlas is actually the best warframe if you use my hidden secret technique I discovered after playing him for 48 hours straight!" kinda people.

You keep on dreaming, buddy. It's not like DE listens anyhow, so your delusions will do no harm.

[Greysmog]

1 hour ago, KitMeHarder said:

What an uninformed statement. I think you need to study up more on Atlas, as he's in the upper echelons of all frames when it comes to mobbing.

Atlas can hit some real crazy numbers, but he's really hampered by the fact that's kind of the only thing he can do. You are pigeon-holed into maybe two builds as nothing but Landslide and Petrify are actually worth your time. You have builds that buff Landslide, and you have the weird gimmick build with Rumbled. That's literally it.

I love Atlas, but I'm also not going to pretend Khora or Gara aren't better designed Warframes overall (Ash I'll say feels just as bad) with Atlas just having some specific aspects of his kit I enjoy more. His kit feels so one-sided it physically hurts, and he's so negligible to the general player base that they didn't even update Petrify with the recent LoS changes. 

Atlas would be so much more fun if Landslide was just his damage focus and the rest of his kit focused on not just buffing it. Atlas should buff Impact in a unique way by applying new mechanics to it similar to Hydroid as an example, give him a special niche. He should be upgrading his melee in general so it doesn't always feel like you have to spam Landslide, along with stuff like Tectonics completely being gutted and changed. Rumblers also probably need to be omega buffed or just scrapped and replaced altogether.

We don't have a melee Warframe focused on blocking or reflecting attacks as an example, why not try and have Atlas fill that niche as just a stupid tough melee character? There's some fun stuff you can try with him if DE just remembered he even exists.

Edited May 2 by Greysmog

[Traumtulpe]

9 minutes ago, Greysmog said:

Rumblers also probably need to be omega buffed or just scrapped and replaced altogether.

I'm all in favour of making Rumblers Venari 2.0. Those stupid rocks don't have to be crazy powerful, just let me slap some pet mods on it and have it follow me around. Having a proper pet rock sounds way better than anything he's offering currently.

You know what, why don't we just copy/paste the other stuff too? Petrify is now a large, long lasting petrification area and Atlas can have two active at a time (and you don't need 300% strength to match Khora's loot augment at 10% strength!). Landslide doesn't need a target anymore and can both crit, and proc slash without using bugs like Incarnon evolutions applying to abilities.

And I guess the rock wall could grant allies in the area Overguard or something.

Edited May 2 by Traumtulpe

[Greysmog]

9 minutes ago, Traumtulpe said:

I'm all in favour of making Rumblers Venari 2.0. Those stupid rocks don't have to be crazy powerful, just let me slap some pet mods on it and have it follow me around. Having a proper pet rock sounds way better than anything he's offering currently.

It's not a terrible idea, but I feel like you'd have to REALLY overhaul Rumblers (these are suggestions for Ground Pets as well) to be even worth casting in that scenario. If DE wants them to be less impactful then they shouldn't be his 4. Rumblers have a ton of issues like; 

- Awful hit detection for melee (ranged is slightly better), especially with elevation. 

- No control over their attacks or area you can limit them to.

- Pure Impact damage with no inherent scaling, no status chance and no critical chance. 

- Duration and Health based despite healing mechanics and such existing. 

- Count as a physical object in a lot of cases, leading to staggers from AoE and blocking shots. 

- No real synergy with Atlas himself or his kit.

- Ranged attack deals no damage and infuriatingly causes a ragdoll. 

- Melee attacks are PAINFULLY slow with no way to change it.

- Both Augments need some serious damage scaling increases. 

At this point, I would rather just make Rumblers a passive melee boost, and make them focus less on damage and more as another form of Petrification. Like if Petrify was moved to be his 2 to be cheaper for instance, and if Rumblers periodically Petrified nearby enemies or did it immediately when blown up. Have them reduce the decay of Rubble as an example.

[Tiltskillet]

1 hour ago, Greysmog said:

We don't have a melee Warframe focused on blocking or reflecting attacks as an example, why not try and have Atlas fill that niche

Because Dante will ruin your whole day. :P

[Greysmog]

18 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

Because Dante will ruin your whole day. :P

No? Unless Overguard magically stops you getting combo multiplier when blocking I don't see how that would do anything. Blocking and reflect mechanics are based around enemy attacks in a cone or radius around you, not whether you're damaged or not.

Edited May 2 by Greysmog

[Tiltskillet]

11 minutes ago, Greysmog said:

No? Unless Overguard magically stops you getting combo multiplier when blocking I don't see how that would do anything. Blocking and reflect mechanics are based around enemy attacks in a cone or radius around you, not whether you're damaged or not.

That's exactly what happens with blocking, unfortunately.  (I'm not sure about reflects.)

But I was mostly just making a joke.  I'd hope DE would fix that problem if they were creating a frame centered around blocking.

[KitMeHarder]

2 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

You know, I've become kind of fond of these kinds of people. "Atlas is actually the best warframe if you use my hidden secret technique I discovered after playing him for 48 hours straight!" kinda people.

"Want a 100x worse Whipclaw? Want a 50x worse Strangledome? Want 2 20x worse Venaris? Want a useless piece of rock? No? Thought so."

Because this was so constructive in terms of validating and explaining your statement? And besides 2 gripes you have with a single ability, you didn't provide anything else. And I don't overly share because "DE is listening", it's because the community does. And all DE cares about 90% of the time is usage rates.

You didn't even ask for a follow up, so I was right to not give someone obviously stuck in their ways the details off the bat. You're welcome to be ignorant, but don't be surprised when people tell you you're wrong. Atlas has some deadweight in his kit... like 75% of all frames. But he is magnitudes better than "terrible" with the other parts alone.

2 hours ago, Greysmog said:

We don't have a melee Warframe focused on blocking or reflecting attacks as an example, why not try and have Atlas fill that niche as just a stupid tough melee character?

Because reliance on enemy AI is horrible 95-99% of the time. And how would it be any different than something like Defy/Wukong?

[Traumtulpe]

22 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

I was right to not give someone obviously stuck in their ways the details off the bat.

Sorry but the bluff doesn't work when I know you're bluffing.

[Chewarette]

11 hours ago, Greysmog said:

You are pigeon-holed into maybe two builds as nothing but Landslide and Petrify are actually worth your time. You have builds that buff Landslide, and you have the weird gimmick build with Rumbled. That's literally it.

Hmm sorry, which Warframes are not pigeon-holed into two builds ? Not saying there isn't any, but I'm 90% sure most Warframes are pigeon-holed into one build.

[AegidiusF]

Il y a 21 heures, 0_The_F00l a dit :

In a reverse direction I wonder if faction damage will be changing too (just a thought).

As to OP I did have the same thought when they announced the changes , I hope it works out for the better for atlas.

Atlas is ok , I like using him , sure he isn't the best at any specific role , but when you just want to punch things away into a different tileset , Atlas has got your back.

His vulnerability effect was mostly unnoticed majority of the time , but with changes to Armor it may be made on par with other effects that add vulnerability. 

I am curious.

I was asking the same thing : is faction damage going to be changed ?

These changes, armor cap, corrosive changes, enemy vulnerability, can make some kinds of damage and some warframes extremely powerful even without faction Mods.

Atlas vulnerability was mostly unnoticed and it wasn't working consistently for some HP types : that's why I hope things will get a bit better.

Anyway, I'm very curious too 🧐

Il y a 21 heures, Chewarette a dit :

I've been using it the last week, it rocks (pun intended). It just shreds everything that goes into its path, is nigh invulnerable and overall pretty fun. I had forgotten until its existence but he's still pretty relevant, i'm impressed.

So yeah, most his abilities are useless except his 1 and whatever you want to subsume on him, but he's fun and wrecks stuff until pretty high level. I've done quite long SP Void Cascade Fissure runs and he has no problem dealing with Thrax for example, and Acolytes are consistently two-shot until level what, 500 ?

I don't know if that's a 100x worse Whipclaw as I don't use Khora, but it's definitely prominent for whatever you want to use it for. I'll try it on EDA next week to see

Atlas is indeed very powerful, but his ability kit, as everybody knows, is a bit "needy". His 2nd is almost a free Helminth slot, Petrify working with warframe sight (and not player sight) is very annoying, Rumblers are more useful to aggro, but they are too much expensive for just this and the AoE "Petrify" effect is just too limited (very low range). But even with all his problems, I still like him a lot. why ? Because Atlas is fun (not to mention of his passive "Primed Sure Footed" 😋). It's also very funny to think that Atlas ult is hs 1st and cheapest ability😇.

Il y a 19 heures, KitMeHarder a dit :

he's in the upper echelons of all frames when it comes to mobbing.

Indeed. I agree.

[Greysmog]

17 hours ago, Chewarette said:

Hmm sorry, which Warframes are not pigeon-holed into two builds ? Not saying there isn't any, but I'm 90% sure most Warframes are pigeon-holed into one build.

A lot of Warframes have that exact issue as well yes, it's just another point against Atlas specifically. Just because it's a quite common problem doesn't mean it's not a problem in general.

Especially since Atlas is really limited weapon-wise with stat sticks and feeling like you need Helminth to aid his minimally functioning kit, you don't have a lot to make him feel unique as an already generic meleeframe.

Edited May 3 by Greysmog

[Greysmog]

On 2024-05-02 at 1:28 PM, KitMeHarder said:

"Want a 100x worse Whipclaw? Want a 50x worse Strangledome? Want 2 20x worse Venaris? Want a useless piece of rock? No? Thought so."

Because this was so constructive in terms of validating and explaining your statement? And besides 2 gripes you have with a single ability, you didn't provide anything else. And I don't overly share because "DE is listening", it's because the community does. And all DE cares about 90% of the time is usage rates.

You didn't even ask for a follow up, so I was right to not give someone obviously stuck in their ways the details off the bat. You're welcome to be ignorant, but don't be surprised when people tell you you're wrong. Atlas has some deadweight in his kit... like 75% of all frames. But he is magnitudes better than "terrible" with the other parts alone.

Because reliance on enemy AI is horrible 95-99% of the time. And how would it be any different than something like Defy/Wukong?

Blocking and reflecting damage isn't something Wukong does with melee weapons in general, it's just something Defy does, and it obviously functions much differently from the regular blocking and counter-attacking melee weapons do. 

It's mostly just a suggestion to help differentiate Atlas from all the other meleeframes by giving him say an extra wide blocking angle for himself and allies while using Tectonics instead, something no one else does (I'm not sure why you're even bringing up AI as a counterpoint when it's not aggro related). Something like that, or making it so he buffs Impact damage in some way for himself and allies through a new ability to help make Impact more appealing.

Just something unique to him that helps flesh out his niche in an already bloated category. He's a tanky Impact-focused Warframe, so why not lean into that?

Edited May 3 by Greysmog

[TImidObserver]

On 2024-05-02 at 7:40 AM, AegidiusF said:

Atlas' Petrify damage buff works in a very different way as other abilities, as it increases the damage type vulnerability.

With the annoounced rework of enemy vulnerability, I wonder if Petrify's damage buff is going to be reworked too.

Perhaps Atlas is the warframe Pablo said they were working on...

It won't be unless this post gains enough traction to get their attention which it won't because no one plays Atlas. 

[stormy505]

On 2024-05-02 at 7:20 AM, (PSN)Pablogamer585 said:

, I believe some frames require reworks sooner than Atlas

YUP. Like, Atlas issues are, he has some dead abilties, overreliance on ONE specific weapon (Ceramic dagger giving flat crit rate makes him work) as a stat stick to make him work as atlas in SP which obviously nerfs him a bit in Deep Archimedea and nerfs him ALOT in SP circuit. But, these are just roadblocks in specfic game modes, he still does work in SP just fine. Which can't be said about a lot of other frames (I think like, 8-13 depending on who you ask are in a worse position than atlas.)

Edited May 8 by stormy505

[V2lkyr]

26 minutes ago, stormy505 said:

YUP. Like, Atlas issues are, he has some dead abilties, overreliance on ONE specific weapon (Ceramic dagger giving flat crit rate makes him work) as a stat stick to make him work as atlas in SP which obviously nerfs him a bit in Deep Archimedea and nerfs him ALOT in SP circuit. But, these are just roadblocks in specfic game modes, he still does work in SP just fine. Which can't be said about a lot of other frames (I think like, 8-13 depending on who you ask are in a worse position than atlas.)

You can still bring everyone in base SP atleast,higher SP is where the issues start.

[stormy505]

25 minutes ago, V2lkyr said:

You can still bring everyone in base SP atleast,higher SP is where the issues start.

Sorta* there's a few frames who clear basic SP only by using a good weapon and a basic survivability setup and just add very little or nothing at all in terms of value for clearing the mission. And like, at that point is it really the frame clearing base SP? Or is it kuva nukor...